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Author Topic: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660  (Read 2836 times)

Offline lamrith

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #25 on: August 29, 2017, 02:11:05 PM »
Can someone tell me what you are referring to in terms of Escapement?  I have been trying to guess based on comments, but would rather make sure I have it correct.
The amount of bucks that survive hunting season is the escapement.

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Thanks Grundy, that is what I thought, but wanted to make sure.

Offline Harbor_hunter

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #26 on: September 19, 2017, 08:53:43 AM »
Looks like there will be a meeting with the district biologist on this topic Monday, Oct. 2nd at 6:30 at the Elma grange if anyone is interested in attending. 

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #27 on: September 19, 2017, 04:35:40 PM »
I'm gonna try and make that meeting
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Offline bobcat

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2017, 04:46:19 PM »
I will be in Idaho then, otherwise I would've gone.

Offline Sitka_Blacktail

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #29 on: September 19, 2017, 05:26:06 PM »
I argued with the state biologist about this at the hunting expo. I cant see that producing any more trophies than normal in any unit. Limiting access will only help people who dont give a rip about their objectives.  I beleive most areas produce decent bucks if you put some time in.
Precisely, all that new restrictions will do is reduce trophy buck harvest. The last week of october, and extended buck is when the big boys get stupid. Take that away and your chance of harvesting them goes down drastically. Not impossible but greatly reduced. I'd just really like to talk to the biologist who has come up with this and see who is pushing for this??

My guess would be Weyerhauser. They get the state to make it a trophy unit and Weyerhauser can up the price of their access permits. Most of this unit is owned by Weyerhauser and is part of their Aberdeen South access permit.
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Offline Sitka_Blacktail

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #30 on: September 19, 2017, 05:30:58 PM »
660 isn't known for having lots of big bucks or even decent buck numbers.  It does better with elk.

660 has traditionally been a good deer area and a poor elk area. There are still plenty of deer there and some fine bucks and the elk numbers have improved, but I would still call it more of a deer unit than an elk unit. Been hunting that unit since the mid 60s.
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Offline bobcat

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #31 on: September 19, 2017, 06:19:26 PM »
660 isn't known for having lots of big bucks or even decent buck numbers.  It does better with elk.

660 has traditionally been a good deer area and a poor elk area. There are still plenty of deer there and some fine bucks and the elk numbers have improved, but I would still call it more of a deer unit than an elk unit. Been hunting that unit since the mid 60s.

:yeah:


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Offline Elkoholic2

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #32 on: September 19, 2017, 08:16:28 PM »
WDFW Secret Meeting Exposed ~ was Only goin to be a small, invite only meeting. Public meeting place, a public resource. We will pack the room! Mon. Oct 2 Elma Grange at 6:30
« Last Edit: September 24, 2017, 05:00:07 AM by Elkoholic2 »

Offline crowinghen

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #33 on: September 20, 2017, 08:58:02 AM »
i bet it's an idea floated by timber interests to increase permit sales, if i'm not mistaken that area is almost entirely locked up in the weyco twin harbors south unit?

That's exactly what I think/though when i heard about this.

Offline ctwiggs1

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #34 on: September 20, 2017, 09:14:20 AM »
So... the trick on this one will be to not buy a permit for access while it's a 4pt unit.

After the 4pt min is dropped, that year will be the year to take your entire family in to hunt for an incredible harvest year. 

Ask the folks who live in GMU121

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Offline fishnfur

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #35 on: September 21, 2017, 08:43:59 AM »
 :yeah: 

Unfortunate for those who call this unit home.  It seems when WDFW gets a program like this in their heads, they've already decided they're going to do it.  They only ask for comment to placate those hurt by the program. 

Money talks.  If no one buys the Weyco permits for that unit, you'll likely see the program scrapped much earlier than if we continue to fill their pockets for access to a unit that essentially has a reduced opportunity for success. 
“When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.”  - Will Rogers

Offline bobcat

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #36 on: September 21, 2017, 09:03:49 AM »
Actually if the unit does become a 4 point minimum, I'd have to consider purchasing a Weyerhaeuser permit. It would be fun hunting in an area where the deer are allowed to become mature, instead of having the majority shot when they're just little spikes and 2 points. Of course there's also a huge block of state land in the GMU that is open the the public.

Offline ctwiggs1

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #37 on: September 21, 2017, 09:09:24 AM »
Might be fun, but it'll definitely be a killfest when the 4pt restriction is dropped.  I don't think we've ever had a trophy unit last in our state have we?

Offline Harbor_hunter

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #38 on: September 21, 2017, 09:17:04 AM »
While I wouldn't doubt Weyco having their hand in it to try and make more money off those permits, Aberdeen south motorized sold out and sold plenty of walk in's too.  If they just keep cranking the price up like they are doing other places, people are still going to pay in my opinion.   

Offline Curly

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #39 on: September 21, 2017, 09:18:37 AM »
I do wish they made it illegal to shoot spikes.  They are just fairly dumb when they are young and if all those spikes weren't taken, there would be more 4-points around. :twocents:
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Offline WSU

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #40 on: September 21, 2017, 09:27:30 AM »
It wouldn't surprise me if there is more illegal harvest there than legal harvest.

Offline PolarBear

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #41 on: September 23, 2017, 03:03:03 AM »
I do wish they made it illegal to shoot spikes.  They are just fairly dumb when they are young and if all those spikes weren't taken, there would be more 4-points around. :twocents:
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Offline fishnfur

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #42 on: September 23, 2017, 08:49:48 AM »
 :yeah:  Killing spikes is a bit like keeping an eight inch trout.  Yeah, it's legal, but it will hardly feed you, and removes the animal from the population early in it's body growth phase.

This quasi-QDM program could produce some awesome bucks when the entire deer population in an area is managed in that fashion.  The problem: QDM calls for culling bucks that are less genetically gifted in the horn department to geet them out of the breeding population.  A significant portion of the BTs, by nature, are not all genetically programmed to have massive many-pointed racks.

Much like the three point restriction program on Muleys on the dry side, eventually a program like this may select for a population of big/mature and breeding two-point bucks passing on their "inferior" genes.  By nature of the environment and the solitary nature of mature BT bucks, there will certainly be some big four and five points in the mix as well.  I guess time will tell how this all shakes out.
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Offline LEN

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #43 on: September 23, 2017, 09:45:34 AM »
Just another one of the $$$$$$$ getters those with $$$ can hunt. I'll be dead soon so it will be up to the young guy's to do something. Like getting Weco to stop charging or start paying property tax's like the rest of us. Didn't mind supporting Weco when we could use the property for camping, hunting and fishing but now you have to buy the ticket. Soon it will be buy by the unit to hunt, wait it's almost that now.

LEN

Offline bighorn1

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #44 on: September 23, 2017, 10:52:56 AM »
This why a lot of hunters don,t turn in there harvest reports and Gmu that they hunt and just pay the extra ten dollars to keep there hunting area unknown. It's a lot like fishing if you give them the numbers they use it against you. Two many fish wrong kind of fish not  enough fish you give them the numbers they will find a way to use it against you.

Offline blackveltbowhunter

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #45 on: September 23, 2017, 11:37:23 AM »
    Why this unit? That would be my question for WDFW. I have a hard time believing there is some sort of excellent 4 point gene that somehow eludes the rest of western washington. And since on topic of 4 point I would assume they are talking about 3 main points with eyegaurds. Since harvest reports include eyegaurds in total points. Anything that holds true for this unit should hold true for many units. Blocks of state land mixed in with private timber. If there is an issue make it an across the westside change.   

   As far as spikes go, while I would not oppose the idea I dont think its gonna be some sort of magical cure. Oregon has 2 point min, and having hunted it, the number of "mature" bucks ( I use 4.5 years old for reference, although to be fully mature I think 5.5 is more realistic. However, IMO very few 5.5 or older bucks are killed, and at that point it almost seems moot as that buck has probably already spread his genes,) seems very similar to areas I hunt in Washington. In the NW units of oregon anyway. As you move south of salem I think genetically some things change and I have seen bucks and found sheds of larger framed deer, however I am not convinced they are older deer by any means.

 

Offline Dave Workman

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #46 on: September 29, 2017, 06:47:32 PM »
I argued with the state biologist about this at the hunting expo. I cant see that producing any more trophies than normal in any unit. Limiting access will only help people who dont give a rip about their objectives.  I beleive most areas produce decent bucks if you put some time in.
Precisely, all that new restrictions will do is reduce trophy buck harvest. The last week of october, and extended buck is when the big boys get stupid. Take that away and your chance of harvesting them goes down drastically. Not impossible but greatly reduced. I'd just really like to talk to the biologist who has come up with this and see who is pushing for this??


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Offline Sitka_Blacktail

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #47 on: September 30, 2017, 10:43:39 PM »
    Why this unit? That would be my question for WDFW. I have a hard time believing there is some sort of excellent 4 point gene that somehow eludes the rest of western washington. And since on topic of 4 point I would assume they are talking about 3 main points with eyegaurds. Since harvest reports include eyegaurds in total points. Anything that holds true for this unit should hold true for many units. Blocks of state land mixed in with private timber. If there is an issue make it an across the westside change.   

   As far as spikes go, while I would not oppose the idea I dont think its gonna be some sort of magical cure. Oregon has 2 point min, and having hunted it, the number of "mature" bucks ( I use 4.5 years old for reference, although to be fully mature I think 5.5 is more realistic. However, IMO very few 5.5 or older bucks are killed, and at that point it almost seems moot as that buck has probably already spread his genes,) seems very similar to areas I hunt in Washington. In the NW units of oregon anyway. As you move south of salem I think genetically some things change and I have seen bucks and found sheds of larger framed deer, however I am not convinced they are older deer by any means.

 

It does border Lincoln which is where Les Clark shot the world record. so who knows?
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Offline fishnfur

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #48 on: October 01, 2017, 09:01:26 AM »
My wife read me the highlights of an online article this AM while I drank my morning coffee....Apparently the Longview newspaper - The Daily News, reported this morning about the upcoming meeting in Elma about making Minot Peak unit a four-point restriction.  The public is invited, but will not be given a chance to comment. 

As I guessed before, they'd already made up their minds before they got around to asking for public comment.  Word leaked out about their meeting, so now they're going to give us the privilege of listening to them approve their great idea.

My coffee didn't taste quite so good today....
“When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.”  - Will Rogers

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Re: New Blacktail restrictions coming for Minot Peak GMU 660
« Reply #49 on: October 03, 2017, 09:45:47 AM »
Anyone make the meeting last night?
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