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Author Topic: Duplicity in the wolf debate  (Read 4027 times)

Offline CGDucksandDeer

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2017, 11:52:50 AM »
Chase I see your the media director for CNW and have a degree in journalism and it your job to spread their propaganda

I don't know how a degree in journalism  makes you an expert in apex predators but maybe I just stupid. I had my first wolf experience in 1977 in NW WI sitting in a tree stand bow hunting when a large wolf walked underneath me. I reported the sighting to local DNR guy and he said I was nuts, I went back took a plaster cast of the track and showed it to a bio and was proven right. . I have encountered wolves in NE Quebec, Ontario, Manitoba Alberta Alaska BC in Wyoming, Minnesota, Idaho , Washington, Wyoming and I worked in Russia for years and encountered wolves there  and in Kazakhstan, Kyrgistan.   I went wolf and boar hunting twice in the Altai region of Russia. A good friend of mine, Nestor, was a wildlife Bio in Russia who specialized in the Siberian tiger and as far as I know was one of the most experienced bios in the world. He felt strongly that wolf populations had to be controlled through any means necessary  due to their fast reproductive rates

I see no one on CNW's staff that is an avid hunter. I see no legislation that CNW supports those who hunt. I do see that they supported legislation that bans forms of hunting. That is why I am skeptical. I would like to see Mr. Friedman post photos of some of the game he harvested on CNW's website to show that he supports sportsmen.
 
For those who think Mr. Friedman is a nice guy looking out for sportsmen:

from CNW director Friedman
"Mitch Friedman wrote in a letter to the Earth First! Journal. Friedman, a former Earth First!er, was among Washington's first tree-sitters during the 1980s' Timber Wars, and now heads Conservation Northwest",

more wisdom from Mr. Friedman:

 "In 1987, tree-spiking claimed its first known casualty: A California mill worker named George Anderson had his jaw shattered when a shard from a spiked tree, splintered by his band saw, ricocheted into his face. In response to the incident, Dave Foreman said: “It’s unfortunate this worker was injured and I wish him the best. But the real destruction and injury is being perpetrated by Louisiana-Pacific and the Forest Service in liquidating old-growth forests.” In 1988, EF member Mitch Friedman stated that “tree-spiking is not terrorism; it is a justifiably extreme and noble deed.”



please post some pro sportsmen legislation supported  by CNW
List members on your staff who actively hunt as you repeatedly stated that your group supports every side.

I spent the last week home processing my High Buck muley. Does that count? Not defending Mitch's past deeds, nor am I likely to get through to you if you feel I'm just a propaganda tool, but yes a number (at least 4) of our staffers, including Mitch, hunt each season.  Personally, I'm already looking forward to elk season, and am a little bummed that the downside of finally getting a deer in the September High Hunt means not hitting the Okanogan for my annual general season camp.

If you or others want to attack me or CNW on here, that's your prerogative. There's things the org has done in the past that I certainly don't agree with either. But know that the policy-making landscape when it comes to wolves, other wildlife, and hunting is a hell of a lot wider cross section of society than this forum. Collaboration, and compromise, will always be necessary from all stakeholders. Especially in states like ours where the hardline groups have significant advantages.

Hunters and anglers make up approximately 5 percent of the population. If we refuse to participate in that wider process, we lose. Making policy that benefits hunters, and game, in the real world is a lot more complex than finding agreement on this forum. Say what you will on here, but if we ever cross paths at the trailhead, I'd be happy to chat with any of you about it further.

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2017, 12:02:28 PM »
I understand the issues very well and would have a beer with you. I still feel that CNW has no interest in sportsmen when it comes to the table negotiate and your responses to my questions just reaffirmed my beliefs

 I  see zero proof from you or past activities of CNW. If fact they have always supported legislation against hunting.

I asked you for proof and you just change the subject as anyone would pushes propaganda and bring up more meaningless platitudes again

I see your IT guy  at CNW is a proud member of this anti hunting organization

http://www.howlingforwolves.org/

I look forward to your and Mr Friedman posting pics of your supposed hunting this October on CNW to show your support for sportsmen. :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:

Offline Special T

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2017, 12:08:04 PM »
Stake holders pay the bills... as the general budget commitment shrinks from the state so should the general public's input...
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Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2017, 12:34:41 PM »
I see on Facebook  that CNW is having a pizza party this month at the sierra club a known anti hunting organization. I see zero support for sportsmen on their facebook page in fact the majority of the comments attack sportsmen. Oh well I guess they are looking out for best interest I guess according to the new poster :chuckle:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/ConservationNW/posts/?ref=page_internal

Sierra Club—Sierra Club and many of its chapters oppose access by roads to vast tracts of public lands and the group also opposes many scientific wildlife management practices. The Sierra Club’s Legal Defense Fund has frequently sued the federal government over those issues, then sought reimbursement for its legal expenses. Many of its chapters have actively opposed hunting.  For example, a New Jersey Sierra Club chapter has been a leader in opposing that state’s bear hunts. The Sierra Club Grand Canyon chapter worked to end all hunting in Arizona when Proposition 109 was being considered. The Sierra Club in California opposed bear hunting with hounds. Yes, actions speak louder than words – the Sierra Club and many of its chapters are anti-hunting

Offline CGDucksandDeer

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2017, 12:47:04 PM »
I see on Facebook  that CNW is having a pizza party this month at the sierra club a known anti hunting organization. I see zero support for sportsmen on their facebook page in fact the majority of the comments attack sportsmen. Oh well I guess they are looking out for best interest I guess according to the new poster :chuckle:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/ConservationNW/posts/?ref=page_internal

Sierra Club—Sierra Club and many of its chapters oppose access by roads to vast tracts of public lands and the group also opposes many scientific wildlife management practices. The Sierra Club’s Legal Defense Fund has frequently sued the federal government over those issues, then sought reimbursement for its legal expenses. Many of its chapters have actively opposed hunting.  For example, a New Jersey Sierra Club chapter has been a leader in opposing that state’s bear hunts. The Sierra Club Grand Canyon chapter worked to end all hunting in Arizona when Proposition 109 was being considered. The Sierra Club in California opposed bear hunting with hounds. Yes, actions speak louder than words – the Sierra Club and many of its chapters are anti-hunting

I'm not aware of any such event. And it's certainly not on our Facebook page. Nor are we in anyway affiliated with the Club. While we may see eye to eye with them on some issues, they hate us on others, and take a very different track. Particularly when it comes to wolves. Keep painting with your broad brush. It may fit your worldview, but it doesn't help hunters or wildlife.

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #30 on: September 25, 2017, 12:53:13 PM »
here ya go. Going to give a smug lecture again that I don't understand the complex issues? :chuckle:

https://www.facebook.com/events/799030296832867/?acontext=%7B%22source%22%3A5%2C%22page_id_source%22%3A7890108747%2C%22action_history%22%3A[%7B%22surface%22%3A%22page%22%2C%22mechanism%22%3A%22main_list%22%2C%22extra_data%22%3A%22%7B%5C%22page_id%5C%22%3A7890108747%2C%5C%22tour_id%5C%22%3Anull%7D%22%7D]%2C%22has_source%22%3Atrue%7D



Why does CNW have a staff member who is member of an anti hunting group that wants to ban all  hunting?

Where are the sportsmen on your staff?


Matt Johnson, IT Administrator
Matt Johnson
mjohnson (at) conservationnw.org
Matt has extensive professional experience and education in information technology systems and electronics. After realizing both the deplorable status that non-human animals hold in modern society and the constant degradation of the environment by humanity, he decided to apply his training to solving these problems by working for a world class non-profit, Conservation Northwest. Matt also has experience as a volunteer for the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society and Howling For Wolves, is trained as a Minnesota Master Naturalist, and worked on a successful campaign to limit pesticide use in Minneapolis, among many other conservation-related activities

Chase I look forward to you and Mr Friedman posting your supposed hunting pics on the CNW facebook page as sport hunting brings millions of dollars each year  in to protect wildlife habitat. Much more than CNW. I highly doubt you both hunt. May be a pic of last year's hunt might convince me otherwise here

wont be holding my breath though






I see on Facebook  that CNW is having a pizza party this month at the sierra club a known anti hunting organization. I see zero support for sportsmen on their facebook page in fact the majority of the comments attack sportsmen. Oh well I guess they are looking out for best interest I guess according to the new poster :chuckle:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/ConservationNW/posts/?ref=page_internal

Sierra Club—Sierra Club and many of its chapters oppose access by roads to vast tracts of public lands and the group also opposes many scientific wildlife management practices. The Sierra Club’s Legal Defense Fund has frequently sued the federal government over those issues, then sought reimbursement for its legal expenses. Many of its chapters have actively opposed hunting.  For example, a New Jersey Sierra Club chapter has been a leader in opposing that state’s bear hunts. The Sierra Club Grand Canyon chapter worked to end all hunting in Arizona when Proposition 109 was being considered. The Sierra Club in California opposed bear hunting with hounds. Yes, actions speak louder than words – the Sierra Club and many of its chapters are anti-hunting

I'm not aware of any such event. And it's certainly not on our Facebook page. Nor are we in anyway affiliated with the Club. While we may see eye to eye with them on some issues, they hate us on others, and take a very different track. Particularly when it comes to wolves. Keep painting with your broad brush. It may fit your worldview, but it doesn't help hunters or wildlife.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 12:58:45 PM by ribka »

Offline CGDucksandDeer

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #31 on: September 25, 2017, 12:57:32 PM »
here ya go. Going to give a smug lecture agin that I don't understand the complex issues? :chuckle:

https://www.facebook.com/events/799030296832867/?acontext=%7B%22source%22%3A5%2C%22page_id_source%22%3A7890108747%2C%22action_history%22%3A[%7B%22surface%22%3A%22page%22%2C%22mechanism%22%3A%22main_list%22%2C%22extra_data%22%3A%22%7B%5C%22page_id%5C%22%3A7890108747%2C%5C%22tour_id%5C%22%3Anull%7D%22%7D]%2C%22has_source%22%3Atrue%7D


Why does CNW have a staff member who is member of an anti hunting group that wants to ban all  hunting?

Where are the sportsmen on your staff?





I see on Facebook  that CNW is having a pizza party this month at the sierra club a known anti hunting organization. I see zero support for sportsmen on their facebook page in fact the majority of the comments attack sportsmen. Oh well I guess they are looking out for best interest I guess according to the new poster :chuckle:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/ConservationNW/posts/?ref=page_internal

Sierra Club—Sierra Club and many of its chapters oppose access by roads to vast tracts of public lands and the group also opposes many scientific wildlife management practices. The Sierra Club’s Legal Defense Fund has frequently sued the federal government over those issues, then sought reimbursement for its legal expenses. Many of its chapters have actively opposed hunting.  For example, a New Jersey Sierra Club chapter has been a leader in opposing that state’s bear hunts. The Sierra Club Grand Canyon chapter worked to end all hunting in Arizona when Proposition 109 was being considered. The Sierra Club in California opposed bear hunting with hounds. Yes, actions speak louder than words – the Sierra Club and many of its chapters are anti-hunting

I'm not aware of any such event. And it's certainly not on our Facebook page. Nor are we in anyway affiliated with the Club. While we may see eye to eye with them on some issues, they hate us on others, and take a very different track. Particularly when it comes to wolves. Keep painting with your broad brush. It may fit your worldview, but it doesn't help hunters or wildlife.

That event is from September 2011, and was related to USFS forest plan updates, not wolves.  As to my lack of awareness, that was two years before I started working for the org.

Yes, if you're citing a "pizza party" event from six years ago as proof of some anti-hunter conspiracy from a regional organization with a long track record of collaborating with hunters, ranchers and others to find acceptable common ground, I don't think you understand the complexity of the situation.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 01:10:03 PM by CGDucksandDeer »

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #32 on: September 25, 2017, 01:00:58 PM »
"Join Conservation Northwest, Sierra Club, and others for some tasty activism. Free pizza and beer and a chance to ensure Colville and Okanogan-Wenatchee National Forests get the best forest plans possible. Your letters make a difference."



your quote- more duplicity again
"I'm not aware of any such event. And it's certainly not on our Facebook page. Nor are we in anyway affiliated with the Club"




tasty activism. Sounds like fun

Again name pro sportsmen legislation that CNW or the Sierra Club has supported the past 5 years
The sierra club has been documented these days to very anti hunting in legislation that it has supported

looking forward to your deer and elk pics from your supposed hunting exploits




I see on Facebook  that CNW is having a pizza party this month at the sierra club a known anti hunting organization. I see zero support for sportsmen on their facebook page in fact the majority of the comments attack sportsmen. Oh well I guess they are looking out for best interest I guess according to the new poster :chuckle:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/ConservationNW/posts/?ref=page_internal

Sierra Club—Sierra Club and many of its chapters oppose access by roads to vast tracts of public lands and the group also opposes many scientific wildlife management practices. The Sierra Club’s Legal Defense Fund has frequently sued the federal government over those issues, then sought reimbursement for its legal expenses. Many of its chapters have actively opposed hunting.  For example, a New Jersey Sierra Club chapter has been a leader in opposing that state’s bear hunts. The Sierra Club Grand Canyon chapter worked to end all hunting in Arizona when Proposition 109 was being considered. The Sierra Club in California opposed bear hunting with hounds. Yes, actions speak louder than words – the Sierra Club and many of its chapters are anti-hunting

I'm not aware of any such event. And it's certainly not on our Facebook page. Nor are we in anyway affiliated with the Club. While we may see eye to eye with them on some issues, they hate us on others, and take a very different track. Particularly when it comes to wolves. Keep painting with your broad brush. It may fit your worldview, but it doesn't help hunters or wildlife.

Offline Special T

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #33 on: September 25, 2017, 01:02:04 PM »
Unfortunately lots of "conservation" groups try to straddle the fence by stating that they are for habitat. RMEF comes to mind... and since their was a revolt, and  further opportunity to fundraise they modified their stance.

Just because an organization is a Non profit Conservation group doesn't mean they are without  $ motivation... They just like to drag things out longer that a for profit company does.
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Offline JLS

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Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #34 on: September 25, 2017, 02:41:27 PM »
Public trust of wildlife means just that, public trust. It does not discriminate whether you are a hunter, birdwatcher, non-Hunter, or anti-Hunter. In the world we live in all people have the same vested ownership of wildlife under the public trust doctrine.

You can sit and argue all day about the motives of nonprofit groups. In the end, it really does no good. Collaboration will be an essential aspect as we move forward in an environment where fewer people take part in nature.

Hunters do not have the political clout, nor sheer numbers to achieve what many of you would like to see. That's not to say your end goals are wrong, it just means they are highly unlikely to happen. There are two choices, collaborate and realize that you will give some to get some, or draw a hard line in the sand and watch things happen like citizens initiative that ban hound hunting, foothold trapping, and as we recently saw,  trophy hunting for grizzly bears.

I am willing to bet a good many hound hunters and trappers in Washington, Oregon, and California wish they had collaborated with groups ahead of time so that maybe those activities would still be legal. Maybe not in the same sense they were prior to the bans, but it's certainly better than the end result that we are faced with now.


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« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 02:58:11 PM by JLS »
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Offline Special T

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #35 on: September 25, 2017, 03:07:35 PM »
There is no "Give some to get sum"....  there is collaborate to slow the attack... and give cover to those spineless enough not to tell the general public the truth.

Ask Californians how preventing the hunting of cougars have helped those in the suburbs that have had fluffy snatched while walking them, or people whom been attacked. The role of hunters and how it helps non hunters is the key problem. A lack of knowledge and understanding....   but hey they can feel good about outlawing traps and hound hunting.
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Offline JLS

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Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #36 on: September 25, 2017, 03:12:24 PM »
I would agree 100% that lack of knowledge and lack of understanding is a key component. And that is where joining in collaboration can help hunters in the long run. We have done an exceptionally poor job of educating the public and telling our story on our own, and this is where it's gotten us.

The circle the wagons, and sit exclusively at our own table all by ourselves telling ourselves how great we've done is not going to cut it in the future.

It's also a reality for the future that we should expect a number of future hunters will also be affiliated with groups like Conservation Northwest. I'm not saying that's bad or good, it's just a reality. Are we going to choose to accept them as hunters or try and exclude them because of their disparate views on certain topics?


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« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 03:23:29 PM by JLS »
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Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #37 on: September 25, 2017, 03:14:23 PM »
Just to reiterate cnw has come publically against trapping and hunting with dogs

I fail how they have ever supported sportsmen

They did help diminish the mountain caribou herd with their antics though

Offline WAcoyotehunter

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #38 on: September 25, 2017, 03:57:18 PM »
I worked with Mitch and CNW to get legislation for hound hunting back in WA.  Mitch did a ton of legwork and had Reps. Blake and Kretz ready to sponsor something. 

CNW was a big reason we lost hound hunting, but they (Mitch at least) recognized that the best biological option was use of hounds and changed his position.  This was in 2011 or 12 maybe, that was the first time I worked with him.  I think you guys need to quit doing your research online and spend some time actually talking to people. 

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #39 on: September 25, 2017, 04:22:38 PM »
Wacoyte

Show me on cnw web site where they support any form of hunting

Chase the cnw spokesman, has already they support the ban of all forms of trapping too

They collaborate with anti hunting groups on their facebook page. They have zero collaboration with sportsmen in their agenda.

So cnw help shut down hunting and this can be easily found searching legislation and has at least one staff member who is a member of an anti hunting group who wants to ends all forms of hunting

Mitch was 20 years plus member of an eco terrorist group who advocated violent acts against loggers
But hey he is a nice guy whom we need to work with him to help shut down some of our hunting so we can be his friend

He helped end hunting so we really to listen to him

This is insane
« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 04:31:15 PM by ribka »

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #40 on: September 25, 2017, 04:25:19 PM »
Show me on cnw web site where they support any form of hunting

Chase their spokesman has already they support the ban of all forms of trapping and dog hunting too

Tell either to come here and state CNW supports hunting, witch does more for wild wildlife habitat, than any other group and that they support hunting with dogs. Just come on here and publically state this. Pretty simple

They collaborate with anti hunting groups on their facebook page. They have zero collaboration with sportsmen in their agenda.

So cnw help shut down hunting and this can be easily found searching legislation and has at least one staff member who is a member of an anti hunting group who wants to ends all forms of hunting

Mitch was 20 years plus member who advocated violent acts against loggers
But hey he is a nice guy whom we need to work with him to help shut down some of our hunting so we can be his friend

Sheesh

Offline CGDucksandDeer

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #41 on: September 25, 2017, 04:31:12 PM »
CNW has a webpage devoted to the ways in which they support hunting. www.conservationnw.org/hunting

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2017, 04:48:39 PM »
For the third time do you have hunters trappers hound hunters who are members of your cnw staff

Does cnw support trapping and hunting with dogs?

Third time what are the numbers of wolves and grizzly bears you want in WA?

You still have not provided any evidence that you hunt

Just so I'm clear you recently graduated from CWU with a degree in journalism ( really tough degree btw no science or math required) and now you travel around the west and lecture people how to live, push anti hunting legislation and that they need to give up their lifestyles

Where on your Fb page do you support hunting and trapping?9

Offline CGDucksandDeer

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #43 on: September 25, 2017, 05:18:28 PM »
Ribka, still with the personal attacks. Based on what you posted below, your reading comprehension of whatever Google search you did on me must be poor. I sure didn't go to Central, though the access to fly fishing and hunting around there would have been nice. Not a recent grad either, nor did I get a journalism degree... but I doubt most of the forum gives a damn about your research into me, so I'll leave it be.

If you're really dying for proof that I hunt, I'll give you that. I tagged a high buck muley in the North Cascades last week. I've hit that hunt hard for the last few years, and this year scouting and hunting smart paid off. Here's about 1/4 of him. The next two freezer racks are now also full, and we've had some delicious tenderloin steaks and venison stews around my house this week. Grinding up burgers tonight. The heart was the absolute best part of this deer so far. Fried with a light flour coating and dipped in ketchup and siricha mayo.



I hope that's enough for your inquisition. I also shared a bit more about this deer in this article: http://nwsportsmanmag.com/editors-blog/high-hunters-find-bucks-crowded-conditions-due-to-fires/. Go Cougs,


For the third time do you have hunters trappers hound hunters who are members of your cnw staff

Does cnw support trapping and hunting with dogs?

Third time what are the numbers of wolves and grizzly bears you want in WA?

You still have not provided any evidence that you hunt

Just so I'm clear you recently graduated from CWU with a degree in journalism ( really tough degree btw no science or math required) and now you travel around the west and lecture people how to live, push anti hunting legislation and that they need to give up their lifestyles

Where on your Fb page do you support hunting and trapping?9

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #44 on: September 25, 2017, 05:45:36 PM »
WSU communications major-rigorous

Does CNW support trapping , hound hunting, and has the organization
Shut down hunting seasons?

Forth time what cnw's agreed on numbers  for wolves in Washington?

simple question

You already lied about cnw's association the anti hunting group sierra club which has spent thousands shutting down hunting in many states

Congrats on the deer I look forward to you posting a pic of you and your deer on the cnw Facebook page!

The deer numbers are so low now I'm surprised as a supposed conservationist  that you choose to shoot a deer up there. Oh sorry am I being smug? The only decent numbers are whitetail now in the

My friends stopped the high hunt because the deer numbers are too low there now






Ribka, still with the personal attacks. Based on what you posted below, your reading comprehension of whatever Google search you did on me must be poor. I sure didn't go to Central, though the access to fly fishing and hunting around there would have been nice. Not a recent grad either, nor did I get a journalism degree... but I doubt most of the forum gives a damn about your research into me, so I'll leave it be.

If you're really dying for proof that I hunt, I'll give you that. I tagged a high buck muley in the North Cascades last week. I've hit that hunt hard for the last few years, and this year scouting and hunting smart paid off. Here's about 1/4 of him. The next two freezer racks are now also full, and we've had some delicious tenderloin steaks and venison stews around my house this week. Grinding up burgers tonight. The heart was the absolute best part of this deer so far. Fried with a light flour coating and dipped in ketchup and siricha mayo.



I hope that's enough for your inquisition. I also shared a bit more about this deer in this article: http://nwsportsmanmag.com/editors-blog/high-hunters-find-bucks-crowded-conditions-due-to-fires/. Go Cougs,


For the third time do you have hunters trappers hound hunters who are members of your cnw staff

Does cnw support trapping and hunting with dogs?

Third time what are the numbers of wolves and grizzly bears you want in WA?

You still have not provided any evidence that you hunt

Just so I'm clear you recently graduated from CWU with a degree in journalism ( really tough degree btw no science or math required) and now you travel around the west and lecture people how to live, push anti hunting legislation and that they need to give up their lifestyles

Where on your Fb page do you support hunting and trapping?9

Offline WAcoyotehunter

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #45 on: September 25, 2017, 06:06:13 PM »
Wacoyte

Show me on cnw web site where they support any form of hunting

Chase the cnw spokesman, has already they support the ban of all forms of trapping too

They collaborate with anti hunting groups on their facebook page. They have zero collaboration with sportsmen in their agenda.

So cnw help shut down hunting and this can be easily found searching legislation and has at least one staff member who is a member of an anti hunting group who wants to ends all forms of hunting

Mitch was 20 years plus member of an eco terrorist group who advocated violent acts against loggers
But hey he is a nice guy whom we need to work with him to help shut down some of our hunting so we can be his friend

He helped end hunting so we really to listen to him

This is insane
I haven't been on third website.  Like I said, go meet someone in person and quit worrying with the internet research

Offline Lucky1

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #46 on: September 25, 2017, 06:20:43 PM »
CNW has a webpage devoted to the ways in which they support hunting. www.conservationnw.org/hunting
I see that CNW seems to accept "fair chase hunting". Do you know if their definition of fair chase includes baiting? Hound hunting? All legal hunting methods?

Offline ribka

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #47 on: September 25, 2017, 06:42:34 PM »
CNW has a webpage devoted to the ways in which they support hunting. www.conservationnw.org/hunting
I see that CNW seems to accept "fair chase hunting". Do you know if their definition of fair chase includes baiting? Hound hunting? All legal hunting methods?

Nope against hound hunting , baiting, trapping

Lobbying to hound hunting of cats shut down

Feel free to come on and set the record straight chase

Seem like nice  :dunno:guys though

Offline mfswallace

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #48 on: September 25, 2017, 08:34:11 PM »
I worked with Mitch and CNW to get legislation for hound hunting back in WA.  Mitch did a ton of legwork and had Reps. Blake and Kretz ready to sponsor something. 

CNW was a big reason we lost hound hunting, but they (Mitch at least) recognized that the best biological option was use of hounds and changed his position.  This was in 2011 or 12 maybe, that was the first time I worked with him.  I think you guys need to quit doing your research online and spend some time actually talking to people.

I think you just pointed out the duplicity this thread is about, you got duped  :chuckle:
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Offline Special T

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Re: Duplicity in the wolf debate
« Reply #49 on: September 25, 2017, 09:05:08 PM »
Here is some of the history of Mitch Friedman... do a quick Google search and you will find the kind of lawsuits he considers sucess.

http://Http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19970714&slug=2549520

While advocates like Beth Church, conservation manager for Wolfhaven, a research and wolf advocacy south of Olympia, applaud Dicks' effort in the Olympics, they are still rankled by the budget cuts in the North Cascades.

Argues Mitch Friedman, director of the Northwest Ecosystem Alliance, "Wolves in the Olympics make perfect political sense because you've got a congressman who wants them in his district. But biologically speaking, why are we starting another batch of cookies while we let the ones we've already got in the oven burn?"

While funding for the Olympic wolf-restoration program has been rolling through the House, the Fish and Wildlife Service last week announced it had completed a grizzly-bear recovery plan for the North Cascades - a study first begun in 1991.




http://www.whatcomwatch.org/php/WW_open.php?id=649

I founded the Greater Ecosystem Alliance (later renamed Northwest Ecosystem Alliance) that year, along with some friends who now have mostly moved on to other projects. On our minds was to champion bold new approaches to saving biodiversity. With big goals envisioned, we wanted to protect not just the big trees, trails and owls, but the entire old growth ecosystem. We wanted to protect not just the alpine gems, but the entire North Cascades ecosystem, capable of sustaining a viable grizzly bear population. We wanted to infuse new ideas of science and conservation to keep the Northwest wild, with large interconnected wild ecosystems from the Washington Coast to the British Columbia Rockies.

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