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Author Topic: Request for information about certain breeds  (Read 2196 times)

Offline jagermiester

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #25 on: December 01, 2017, 03:36:18 PM »
If the dog grows up with the cat it will be fine.
Truth is most of the time if the cat is worth owning the dog is the one you gotta worry about.

I have hunted behind more great labs than any other breed. Its like a super reliable car that you love to own. If you are new to bird hunting this is probably the dog you want to get. Train him or her to mind and you will have an awesome companion in the field.

Now if you want to drive a Ferrari get yourself a pointer just understand there is a lot more you need to do to train and to own a dog like that.
Now that I've owned a Ferrari (GWP) Ill never go back.
Lead em if they're running.

Offline tlbradford

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #26 on: December 01, 2017, 10:23:12 PM »
I purchased a golden retriever in college because I needed a dog that was easily trained, mild mannered, and could live in an apartment.  I hunted 95% upland game.  He had a great nose, worked close and thoroughly, and was awesome.  A flushing dog is great for edge cover, and you can kill a lot of birds.  But speaking as someone that has owned and trained both for upland game, there is no comparison to hunting behind a good pointer.  They are faster, more elegant, and make the hunting so much more enjoyable.  A pointer is watching the pinnacle of upland game hunting.  Every point becomes memorable.  A flushing dog is a means to an end, but much, much easier to train.  So it is clear what my opinion is when you compare a good pointer to a good flusher.  However, you can get a pointer that dislikes water, dislikes cold, dislikes penetrating super heavy cover, and shuts down when they get cut or encounter a little pain.  Your chances are higher of that happening with a pointer than most of the flushing breeds.  You need to carefully select your dog from a reputable kennel, and you need to expose your dog to many situations that are difficult while making it enjoyable.
Dreams are forever on the mind, realization in the hands.

Offline jagermiester

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2017, 08:09:35 AM »
Most important thing is have fun with the process of picking the dog and then training the dog and then hunting the dog. It is so rewarding when done right and it sounds like you are not going to make any rash decisions.
Good job for being a good dog owner before you even own a dog :tup:
Lead em if they're running.

Offline pens fan

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #28 on: December 07, 2017, 11:21:14 PM »
You can be one of the many....
Or be outstanding.

Offline SpringerFan

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2017, 04:53:46 PM »
My first hunting buddy was a field bred ESS. Lots of drive. Lots of love. Very loyal. Smart.

Second is a female field bred ESS. Lots of drive. Lots of love. Very loyal. Smart.

So, if you want a dog that is a great family dog as well I vote ESS. But do your research. That was the fun part. And I trained with some great teachers on Fort Lewis. WWESSC. The club dynamics have changed since I was part of them. But I learned a lot!

Have fun with the process!

We don't blame cars for drunk drivers......Why blame guns for violent people...

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Offline jimmy z

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #30 on: December 19, 2017, 07:44:16 PM »
French Britt. Awesome dogs. Smart, loyal, I trained my first, one and only, and he is lights out! Great family dog.  And I ain't no dog trainer. Start with obedience, good training tech, common sense, treat them like a dog not a person, and it's a piece of cake. I was shooting pointed birds over mine in 6 months. He is seven and I could never imagine hunting or owning a different breed.

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2017, 05:53:19 AM »
If you want primarily a hunting dog buy one that has been professionally started. If you want a family dog that also hunts buy a pup. Family dogs need conditioning to people and living indoors. Buying a pup allows for important social training with human interaction and also other dog interaction. A starter dog will rarely become your best friend but he will probably be a better hunter. Make sure you are familiar with a breed's traits such as being high-strung, aggressive, etc. Choose wisely because they will be around for the next 8 to 15 years.


I'm looking for a 50% family / 50% hunting dog.   Based on what everyone is saying, I think I might actually be looking for a unicorn...  I grew up with purebred GSDs so I'm relatively competent w/ training.  However, I've never trained a dog for hunting and don't have much hunting experience myself (lived in CT before moving out here).  I'm going to start by getting in touch with breeders and seeing where that takes me.     

I appreciate the insight from everyone.  Lots to consider!     

Why do you say that?  It should be very easy to find what your looking for.  Hereís a picture of the winningest 1hr female in Brittany history, hangin out with her new buddy.   Does she look like a unicorn?


Offline fethrduster

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2017, 09:26:50 AM »
Highly recommend a started dog vs doing it yourself.  I had a brit that I tried to train myself and it was a nightmare.  I purchased my setter as a started dog and he's been a pure joy from day one.  Of the dogs listed, I'd go for the setter, but they do require some grooming if you hunt where there are burrs.  No prettier dog to hunt behind though, and incredible family dogs as well.  Sweet, mild mannered, and smart. 


Offline constructeur

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2017, 01:50:36 PM »
^ and their retrieve work is a known problem. How come owners never seem to admit that?

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2017, 03:57:54 PM »
Because many people donít care about a retriev.

Offline constructeur

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #35 on: December 25, 2017, 10:10:02 PM »
No, it's because they are deliberately deceptive, and don't want to admit that out of all the dogs in pointerdom they are stuck feeding a dog that does 2/3 of it's job for the next decade plus.

...kind of like how you'd never admit those runts you run are hard as hell to see in any wild/tall cover.

Deception.

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #36 on: December 26, 2017, 04:20:33 AM »
No, it's because they are deliberately deceptive, and don't want to admit that out of all the dogs in pointerdom they are stuck feeding a dog that does 2/3 of it's job for the next decade plus.

...kind of like how you'd never admit those runts you run are hard as hell to see in any wild/tall cover.

Deception.

You must have the wrong guy, because Iíve never said my dogs are easy to see.  Itís just the opposite especially in trials.  But itís not the size, itís the color!   I talk about how hard they are to see all the time.  EVERYONE DOES, and itís a running joke.  But when hunting, why do I need to see my runts?  Thatís what GPS was created for!  I assure you I kill a hell of a lot more birds knowing exactly where my runts are on GPS and not having to hack at them, then guys like you who scream the birds out of the country while needing to hack at your dog to know where they are......  Oh and BTW, you probably donít ever want to put your dog on the ground against my runts.  At 9 1/2, my oldest still gets better as the hour progresses.

As far as retrieving, most people who own setters and Pointers want a dog to hunt, find,and point birds, thatís it.  Retrieving and flushing duties are often left to the cockers and Springers who dont have the motors to keep up with Setters and Pointers.  But, if you do want an ES or EP to retrieve, itís not really rocket science.  You just work on a trained retrieve or FF them, like they do every decent lab out there.  Go to any NSTRA trial out there, and you will see boat loads of ESís and EPís that retrieve to hand. Retrieve can easily be trained, huge motors with cannons for noses is something thatís bred.  Iíll take the things that have to be bred, all day every day, over something that can be trained into to any dog.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2017, 06:18:47 AM by jetjockey »

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #37 on: December 26, 2017, 09:40:20 AM »
No, it's because they are deliberately deceptive, and don't want to admit that out of all the dogs in pointerdom they are stuck feeding a dog that does 2/3 of it's job for the next decade plus.

...kind of like how you'd never admit those runts you run are hard as hell to see in any wild/tall cover.

Deception.

You must have the wrong guy, because Iíve never said my dogs are easy to see.  Itís just the opposite especially in trials.  But itís not the size, itís the color!   I talk about how hard they are to see all the time.  EVERYONE DOES, and itís a running joke.  But when hunting, why do I need to see my runts?  Thatís what GPS was created for!  I assure you I kill a hell of a lot more birds knowing exactly where my runts are on GPS and not having to hack at them, then guys like you who scream the birds out of the country while needing to hack at your dog to know where they are......  Oh and BTW, you probably donít ever want to put your dog on the ground against my runts.  At 9 1/2, my oldest still gets better as the hour progresses.

As far as retrieving, most people who own setters and Pointers want a dog to hunt, find,and point birds, thatís it.  Retrieving and flushing duties are often left to the cockers and Springers who dont have the motors to keep up with Setters and Pointers.  But, if you do want an ES or EP to retrieve, itís not really rocket science.  You just work on a trained retrieve or FF them, like they do every decent lab out there.  Go to any NSTRA trial out there, and you will see boat loads of ESís and EPís that retrieve to hand. Retrieve can easily be trained, huge motors with cannons for noses is something thatís bred.  Iíll take the things that have to be bred, all day every day, over something that can be trained into to any dog.

I'd be careful about asking to run against his shorthair....
"real dogs have beards"

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #38 on: December 26, 2017, 09:42:33 AM »
Retrieving is a necessary trait in a dog. It's an important conservation tool. A natural retrieve has a much better outcome after FF than a dog that hates to retrieve from the start....
"real dogs have beards"

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #39 on: December 26, 2017, 09:58:19 AM »
No, it's because they are deliberately deceptive, and don't want to admit that out of all the dogs in pointerdom they are stuck feeding a dog that does 2/3 of it's job for the next decade plus.

...kind of like how you'd never admit those runts you run are hard as hell to see in any wild/tall cover.

Deception.

You must have the wrong guy, because Iíve never said my dogs are easy to see.  Itís just the opposite especially in trials.  But itís not the size, itís the color!   I talk about how hard they are to see all the time.  EVERYONE DOES, and itís a running joke.  But when hunting, why do I need to see my runts?  Thatís what GPS was created for!  I assure you I kill a hell of a lot more birds knowing exactly where my runts are on GPS and not having to hack at them, then guys like you who scream the birds out of the country while needing to hack at your dog to know where they are......  Oh and BTW, you probably donít ever want to put your dog on the ground against my runts.  At 9 1/2, my oldest still gets better as the hour progresses.

As far as retrieving, most people who own setters and Pointers want a dog to hunt, find,and point birds, thatís it.  Retrieving and flushing duties are often left to the cockers and Springers who dont have the motors to keep up with Setters and Pointers.  But, if you do want an ES or EP to retrieve, itís not really rocket science.  You just work on a trained retrieve or FF them, like they do every decent lab out there.  Go to any NSTRA trial out there, and you will see boat loads of ESís and EPís that retrieve to hand. Retrieve can easily be trained, huge motors with cannons for noses is something thatís bred.  Iíll take the things that have to be bred, all day every day, over something that can be trained into to any dog.

I'd be careful about asking to run against his shorthair....

Why?  Iíve run against many of the best shorthairs in the country, and several of their NFCís.  Iíve also had the enjoyment of watching several GSP Pros at summer camp.   Iíve beat both, and lost to both, and I knew exactly why every time.   

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #40 on: December 26, 2017, 10:14:07 AM »
Because you will be humbled...
"real dogs have beards"

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #41 on: December 26, 2017, 10:17:39 AM »
Because you will be humbled...

Maybe.  But Iíve run against some of the best GSPís in the country, including NFCís. I know exactly what to expect.  Can you say the same?

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #42 on: December 26, 2017, 10:22:13 AM »
Well he doesn't play the field trial game, he hunts. His shorthair comes from multiple field trial champs though. His is the only dog I've seen be able to hunt chukar from daylight till dark for 3 days in a row without slowing a beat. That's through steep basalt with thousands of feet of elevation up and down. And still hunt the same as it did fresh from the box. That's much different than an hour or 2 long brace.
"real dogs have beards"

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #43 on: December 26, 2017, 10:41:10 AM »
Yes and No!  The best GSPís in the country often slow in an all out hour.  Hunting is a paced sport, while 1hr trialing is balls to the walls, lay it all on the line or get picked up sport.  Iíve seen dogs that could ďhunt all dayĒ, and I wouldnít own one.  Why?  Because thereís not a dog in the country that can hunt all day at the pace that I want.  They ALL get tired!!! 

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #44 on: December 26, 2017, 12:07:43 PM »
This one is balls out for multiple days non stop... doesn't get tired. It's rough trying to even keep up with the dog. The dog also damn near swam to anacortes from bayview chasing a raft of ducks.
"real dogs have beards"

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #45 on: December 26, 2017, 02:24:36 PM »
This one is balls out for multiple days non stop... doesn't get tired. It's rough trying to even keep up with the dog. The dog also damn near swam to anacortes from bayview chasing a raft of ducks.

Balls out until you put a GPS on it.  You win though.  Obviously we are talking about a GSP that is far superior to the best GSPís in the country.

Offline jagermiester

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #46 on: December 26, 2017, 03:42:18 PM »
 :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash:

Done?

 :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash:
Lead em if they're running.

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #47 on: December 26, 2017, 05:09:11 PM »
No...... plus his dog does all this while wearing a camelback full of beer....
"real dogs have beards"

Offline merkelman

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #48 on: December 26, 2017, 06:16:40 PM »
Yes and No!  The best GSPís in the country often slow in an all out hour.  Hunting is a paced sport, while 1hr trialing is balls to the walls, lay it all on the line or get picked up sport.  Iíve seen dogs that could ďhunt all dayĒ, and I wouldnít own one.  Why?  Because thereís not a dog in the country that can hunt all day at the pace that I want.  They ALL get tired!!!
I get 6.5-7 hours out of my GSP. HE paces himself after the first few hours, then getís methodical. We also hunt primarily Chukar and there is no need for a fast paced dog hunting wild Chukar.  I am more concerned about his pads over that time. Most real Chukar dogs will figure out the pace thing after a few good years on the hill.

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Request for information about certain breeds
« Reply #49 on: December 26, 2017, 07:00:07 PM »
How many miles does your dog cover in that 6-7 hrs, and whatís their average speed?

 

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