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Author Topic: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?  (Read 4266 times)

Offline Kylew

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #25 on: January 25, 2018, 08:24:09 PM »
I would have to agree that there needs to be more predator control with the use of hounds in this state. It really makes me sick. I just really wonder what our fish and game is really thinking and doing. It feels they run off of emotions rather than science or what works. I do remember before 96í our numbers of blacktail and elk where far better when you where lucky to see a bear and hardly even heard of a lion being spotted. What can a guy do ? Leaving comments isnít working. The elk and deer need help now. We need a Randy newberg or adopt Idahoís fish and game lol.

Offline hughjorgan

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #26 on: January 25, 2018, 09:07:43 PM »
Early season will be a ghost town like it was in the Nile and bumping the last time they made it spike only.

Offline follow maggie

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #27 on: January 25, 2018, 09:43:04 PM »
I would have to agree that there needs to be more predator control with the use of hounds in this state. It really makes me sick. I just really wonder what our fish and game is really thinking and doing. It feels they run off of emotions rather than science or what works. I do remember before 96í our numbers of blacktail and elk where far better when you where lucky to see a bear and hardly even heard of a lion being spotted. What can a guy do ? Leaving comments isnít working. The elk and deer need help now. We need a Randy newberg or adopt Idahoís fish and game lol.

It is run off of emotion. Last year fish & wildlife recommended increasing the cougar quota but Inslee nixed it because his anti hunting base wanted him to. As far as what can a guy do, this guy is spending his time and money in Idaho, Montana & North Dakota. And I'll be writing a letter to all of my representatives detailing the thousands of dollars I spend doing so, that otherwise would have been spent in Washington.

Offline dreamingbig

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #28 on: January 26, 2018, 07:18:17 AM »
 I like that.  I am going to tell them how much I will spend out of state  too!


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Offline winshooter88

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #29 on: January 26, 2018, 08:04:52 AM »
Bow hunters have some of the most vocal lobbying groups in this state, if they aren't complaining about these changes then there must be a good reason, from what I have seen they push for everything they think they can get all the time.

Offline Karl Blanchard

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #30 on: January 26, 2018, 08:44:10 AM »
I just wish for once Hunter's as a collective would have herd health as first priority instead of our own personal gain. If the Yakima pmu is under objective numbers then we all need to take a little hit on opportunity to build those numbers back up to a healthy sustainable population. We need to remember we can still take our stick and string into the woods in September and Chase elk. That was not taken away from us. Remember it's only a three year cycle as well. 

Unfortunately wdfw rarely gets to use science when it comes to actual management because when a group doesn't get their way they scream the loudest. Then the pendulum swings in the other direction and that group starts to scream. I have had good conversations with the biologist in my area and they know what they are doing. I just wish for once we let their recommendations be the guide for the future of our hunting heritage.
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Offline Pathfinder101

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #31 on: January 26, 2018, 08:52:18 AM »
Idaho Fish and Game should use our Hunting Regulations as an advertisement for promoting tourism...
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.  That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.

Offline hughjorgan

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #32 on: January 26, 2018, 09:02:44 AM »
I just wish for once Hunter's as a collective would have herd health as first priority instead of our own personal gain. If the Yakima pmu is under objective numbers then we all need to take a little hit on opportunity to build those numbers back up to a healthy sustainable population. We need to remember we can still take our stick and string into the woods in September and Chase elk. That was not taken away from us. Remember it's only a three year cycle as well. 

Unfortunately wdfw rarely gets to use science when it comes to actual management because when a group doesn't get their way they scream the loudest. Then the pendulum swings in the other direction and that group starts to scream. I have had good conversations with the biologist in my area and they know what they are doing. I just wish for once we let their recommendations be the guide for the future of our hunting heritage.

Maybe the WDFW should be more concerned for the health of our elk herd before they go and give out exorbitant amount of cow tags to reduce the herd even though they didn't do any aerial surveys in 2014 and 2015 when they were being so generous with tags. Even as late as 2016 the WDFW claimed the status of the Yakima herd was well above its objective. Doesn't seem like they are being good stewards of the peoples resource...

Offline nitroelk

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #33 on: January 26, 2018, 09:11:12 AM »
typical wdfw. maybe enough public comment will sway them, but not likely. at least we'll have late season.

Offline Rainier10

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #34 on: January 26, 2018, 09:35:33 AM »
typical wdfw. maybe enough public comment will sway them, but not likely. at least we'll have late season.
I have been to commission meetings before and the rules were actually modified based on comments received via the website comment page and testimony given at the meeting.

These rules are by no means set in stone.

I am going to be asking more questions and doing some more research.  If there is a good reason for the changes I am all in.  If I don't like the responses I get for the changes I will let them know at the meeting.  For now I am going to comment on my concerns with the changes and see if they get back to me with their reasoning for the changes.  My guess is I will have to wait until the commission meeting.  That is where they have given their reasons in the past.
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Offline bearpaw

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #35 on: January 26, 2018, 09:41:02 AM »
typical wdfw. maybe enough public comment will sway them, but not likely. at least we'll have late season.
I have been to commission meetings before and the rules were actually modified based on comments received via the website comment page and testimony given at the meeting.

These rules are by no means set in stone.

I am going to be asking more questions and doing some more research.  If there is a good reason for the changes I am all in.  If I don't like the responses I get for the changes I will let them know at the meeting.  For now I am going to comment on my concerns with the changes and see if they get back to me with their reasoning for the changes.  My guess is I will have to wait until the commission meeting.  That is where they have given their reasons in the past.

 :yeah: Bow hunters and other user groups can certainly encourage changes, like you I've seen it happen at the commission meetings.

However, I don't think the commission will vary much on big predators, the anti-groups and upper government really control that agenda.
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Offline Special T

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #36 on: January 26, 2018, 10:43:26 AM »
typical wdfw. maybe enough public comment will sway them, but not likely. at least we'll have late season.
I have been to commission meetings before and the rules were actually modified based on comments received via the website comment page and testimony given at the meeting.

These rules are by no means set in stone.

I am going to be asking more questions and doing some more research.  If there is a good reason for the changes I am all in.  If I don't like the responses I get for the changes I will let them know at the meeting.  For now I am going to comment on my concerns with the changes and see if they get back to me with their reasoning for the changes.  My guess is I will have to wait until the commission meeting.  That is where they have given their reasons in the past.

 :yeah: Bow hunters and other user groups can certainly encourage changes, like you I've seen it happen at the commission meetings.

However, I don't think the commission will vary much on big predators, the anti-groups and upper government really control that agenda.
If that is the case BP it means we are fighting over a decreasing pool of game.it also means that while the different user groups are fighting amongst themselves the department can slowly transition away from sportsmen priorities and $.

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Offline dreamingbig

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #37 on: January 26, 2018, 02:38:52 PM »
Bow hunters have some of the most vocal lobbying groups in this state, if they aren't complaining about these changes then there must be a good reason, from what I have seen they push for everything they think they can get all the time.
They are complaining.  These changes/moves caught them off guard.  #doyourresearch


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Offline bobcat

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #38 on: January 26, 2018, 02:49:45 PM »
I'm happy with the reduction in general season antlerless elk opportunity, because I think it's needed to bring elk numbers back up. But at the same time I'm really surprised that they're not offering at least a small number of special permits for antlerless elk during the early archery elk season. They could definitely sell a lot of applications at $7.10 each, so why there are none is really baffling to me.

I think I'll send in a comment suggesting that they do just that. Even if it were only 40 to 50 permits for each unit, that would be better than nothing, and fair since there are antlerless permits offered for muzzleloader and modern firearm.

Offline dreamingbig

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #39 on: January 26, 2018, 05:32:36 PM »
They should be required to submit the science behind these changes now and not wait for the meeting.  They made the same changes in 2010 without a scientific reason.  If you are going to go from unlimited to zero you can at least be forthcoming with a reason.


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Offline nitroelk

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #40 on: January 27, 2018, 05:47:48 AM »
 :yeah:

Offline Stickerbush

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #41 on: January 27, 2018, 08:12:51 AM »
Tag
Coastal Perspective.

Offline bobcat

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #42 on: January 27, 2018, 08:17:07 AM »
Hunting seasons for the most part are not based on science. And that's not necessarily a bad thing, it's just the way it is. It's fine to ask for the reasoning behind a change like this, but don't ask for that reason to be based on science.

Offline hunter399

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #43 on: January 27, 2018, 08:22:14 AM »
Here's the science, we gave out a lot of permits and OTC tags made a pile of 💰 ,oops the herd in trouble we better do something we don't wanna lose our 💰 maker.
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Offline Buzz2401

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #44 on: January 27, 2018, 08:59:15 AM »
The herds are in trouble because of last winter.  It was brutal for herds.  The increased number of antlerless tags the few years prior was a good thing or even more elk would of died last winter.  Elk permits for Eastern Modern and eastern Muzzleloader are down to less then 5% of what they historically have been.  Ya it sucks for a loss of opportunity but with the increased number of archery guys out and the reduced herds do to last years harsh weather I think this is a smart move.  With each of the units that saw antlerless archery go away they were averaging 50 or so cows taken a year per GMU so the that is still more then the rifle hunters averaged even with 250 permits when they used to hand that many out.  Look at the statistics, hunting during modern is not easy and success rates are really low.  It is not because of lack of skill or effort it is because the animals have been getting pushed around for two months and are not in the rut. 

Offline fastdam

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #45 on: January 27, 2018, 10:51:51 AM »
Muzzy guys better get ready for some company!

Offline dreamingbig

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #46 on: January 27, 2018, 01:43:37 PM »
Hunting seasons for the most part are not based on science. And that's not necessarily a bad thing, it's just the way it is. It's fine to ask for the reasoning behind a change like this, but don't ask for that reason to be based on science.
Huh?  I meant herd health, total population, management goals etc.  There is science and math used counting total population and carrying capacity of land.

If the game department doesnít use science they are even more screwed up than your view of hunting.


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Offline dreamingbig

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #47 on: January 27, 2018, 01:44:06 PM »
Muzzy guys better get ready for some company!
Yup.  A cow tag in October will have to do.


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Offline dreamingbig

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #48 on: January 27, 2018, 01:52:20 PM »
The herds are in trouble because of last winter.  It was brutal for herds.  The increased number of antlerless tags the few years prior was a good thing or even more elk would of died last winter.  Elk permits for Eastern Modern and eastern Muzzleloader are down to less then 5% of what they historically have been.  Ya it sucks for a loss of opportunity but with the increased number of archery guys out and the reduced herds do to last years harsh weather I think this is a smart move.  With each of the units that saw antlerless archery go away they were averaging 50 or so cows taken a year per GMU so the that is still more then the rifle hunters averaged even with 250 permits when they used to hand that many out.  Look at the statistics, hunting during modern is not easy and success rates are really low.  It is not because of lack of skill or effort it is because the animals have been getting pushed around for two months and are not in the rut.
The allocation of harvest is based on % of hunters.  That is the formula the GMAC has agreed upon. These changes are in direct violation of this agreement.

If the herd (big if) is down then 1. They should be able to present numbers and facts and 2. Then all anterless opportunity should be eliminated.

I donít agree with the allocation process but if those are the rules then they better follow them.


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Offline bobcat

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Re: Any other bowhunters want to throw up?
« Reply #49 on: January 27, 2018, 02:07:52 PM »
Hunting seasons for the most part are not based on science. And that's not necessarily a bad thing, it's just the way it is. It's fine to ask for the reasoning behind a change like this, but don't ask for that reason to be based on science.
Huh?  I meant herd health, total population, management goals etc.  There is science and math used counting total population and carrying capacity of land.

If the game department doesnít use science they are even more screwed up than your view of hunting.


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First, we don't have a game department. I wish we did, maybe then deer and elk would be the priority.

Second, ask the WDFW if deer and elk population objectives are based more on science, or on what private landowners will tolerate.