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Author Topic: A couple nutless bucks  (Read 1421 times)

Offline longrange7mm

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A couple nutless bucks
« on: February 02, 2018, 06:37:55 PM »
This year was a little different for Mrs. Lr7mm and myself. 2 out of the 4 bucks we harvested did not have testicles  :dunno: I think mine may have been from EHD because last year I have pictures of him hard horned. I killed him on the last day I could hunt in Wy before heading to Saskatchewan and she killed hers in Utah while I was in Sask. I believe hers was born messed up. this is the first time in over 4 years he has shed his velvet
« Last Edit: February 02, 2018, 07:04:47 PM by longrange7mm »
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Offline monster

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2018, 03:30:36 AM »
I hunt in Oregon and Washington    In Oregon we have seen this for the past 3 years and getting worse more bucks every year   In Washington we seen this for the first time this year  Someone told me its a nat fly that bites them  Who knows 
  Does anyone have another Idea why   It is wiping out the big bucks   I have seen a 4 point one year all velvet and the next he is a spike with a lot of trash at the base  all velvet and keeps his antler all year  Its also weird the antlers are really lite  like there hollow   

Offline Axle

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2018, 07:39:49 AM »
Question for those who have gotten a 'deer steer' - do the bodies get bigger than average or is it noticeable? Those bucks do look like they have rather large bodies.
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Offline HardCorpsHuntr

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2018, 08:01:26 AM »
Nice looking interesting bucks LR7.  My son too killed a nutless buck; Wyoming 2016 Oct.  Curious of the cause as well.
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Offline hunter399

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2018, 08:17:23 AM »
Man that sucks for you guys ,cause you don't get to try this meateater recipe. :dunno: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:

Two birds in the Bush is always better than one in the hand-that way you can always go to the Bush and hunt another day .conservation=Better hunting.
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Offline Bullkllr

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2018, 08:58:38 AM »
  Someone told me its a nat fly that bites them   

I think  it's "nad fly"


Weird trend, for sure.
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Offline Sitka_Blacktail

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2018, 10:04:15 AM »
This condition is present on Kodiak Island in their transplanted deer population. At first it was considered that it may have been from a genetic condition one of the original transplanted bucks had, but it is now considered to be something in the environment that pregnant females ingest while pregnant that does this. There is one area of Kodiak, the  Aliulik Peninsula , where most of this seems to occur.

There has been a fairly large study which is very interesting. Here's a link and a short quote from the article.

"We cannot rule out that these abnormalities are linked sequelae of a mutation(s) in a founder animal, followed by transmission over many years and causing high prevalence only on the AP. However, based on lesions observed, we hypothesize that it is more likely that this testis–antler dysgenesis resulted from continuing exposure of pregnant females to an estrogenic environmental agent(s), thereby transforming testicular cells, affecting development of primordial antler pedicles, and blocking transabdominal descent of fetal testes. A browse (e.g., kelp) favored by deer in this locale might carry the putative estrogenic agent(s)."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1874179/
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Offline Okanagan

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2018, 10:08:02 AM »
Interesting.  Thanks for posting. 

I haven't killed a nutless buck but in this genre I killed an odd moose in northern BC that I suspect was a natural steer, though his equipment was in place.  He had tiny antlers covered in velvet and two inches tall.  Yet he was obviously a mature bull several years old.  Skinned and hanging, this bull was easily 100-150 lbs. bigger than a two year old bull with normal antlers that my partner killed and hung beside him.  He was also the most tender and good flavored moose any of us have ever tasted.  His nut sack and genitals looked normal externally.

How was the flavor and tenderness of the meat on nutless bucks?  I've heard of old time cowboys roping and castrating a local buck that they would later kill for the meat.


Offline Sitka_Blacktail

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2018, 10:08:42 AM »
Another quote from the Kodiak study.

"Deer on AP are unique (AP = Aliulik Peninsula)

Cryptorchid deer represented 72% of the population shot on AP, with 9 times more BCO than UCO males. This is an unusually high prevalence of cryptorchidism and predominance of BCO over UCO (McEntee 1990). Further, 62% of BCO deer for which data were available had a shape defect of the antlers, 36% a velvet defect, and 29% both a shape and velvet defect. This combination of cryptorchidism and antler malformation is different from earlier reports of deer with abnormal antlers or cryptorchidism. Most reports of abnormal antlers (Carrasco et al. 1997; DeMartini and Connolly 1975; Robinette and Jones 1959; Taylor et al. 1964; Tiller et al. 1997) were for animals with atrophy of scrotal testes. Further, available evidence suggests that cryptorchidism in deer typically is not accompanied by abnormal antlers"
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Offline longrange7mm

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2018, 02:52:42 PM »
Question for those who have gotten a 'deer steer' - do the bodies get bigger than average or is it noticeable? Those bucks do look like they have rather large bodies.

Actually opposite they are quite a bit smaller, far less bulk and fat on both of them Here is a Pic of a buck in the same age class in the same general area as mine The Mrs killed in 2017 as well. I have sent all teeth off for age analysis but have not gotten results back yet on this years deer so Im basing ages off similar bucks from past years I figure mine was in the 6.5 yr old range and Jacis we know was 8.5 because the outfitter has been watching him that long.

This Buck was aged at 9.5 by WG&F This is her 2017 General Wy buck as you can see he's quite a bit larger bodied
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Offline longrange7mm

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2018, 02:56:06 PM »
Interesting.  Thanks for posting. 

I haven't killed a nutless buck but in this genre I killed an odd moose in northern BC that I suspect was a natural steer, though his equipment was in place.  He had tiny antlers covered in velvet and two inches tall.  Yet he was obviously a mature bull several years old.  Skinned and hanging, this bull was easily 100-150 lbs. bigger than a two year old bull with normal antlers that my partner killed and hung beside him.  He was also the most tender and good flavored moose any of us have ever tasted.  His nut sack and genitals looked normal externally.

How was the flavor and tenderness of the meat on nutless bucks?  I've heard of old time cowboys roping and castrating a local buck that they would later kill for the meat.

Thats interesting about the moose, The meat is great super tender very minimal game taste.
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Offline Pinetar

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2018, 04:46:17 PM »
My son's first buck was nutless in full velvet. He shot it on a management hunt. The buck was a 7x8 and around 24 wide with drops on both sides. He was hanging with the does which the ranch owner said was common for him. He'd been on the ranch for 4 to 5 years that he knew of. The ranch owner said his antlers would break off when the weather was super cold due to frostbite and they would just keep growing year around.

Pretty sure he thought my son was crazy when he told him he wanted to shoot him. Said "why would you want to shoot that buck it is basically a doe" lol My son said "because he is cool and different". He said they had shot a couple others over the years and that they were always super good eating. Sure enough one of the best eating deer ever, super tender. This buck had a huge body and fat that was 2 inches thick. One of the coolest part was his hide. The hair was super long, so we tanned his hide and made Mouse Patterns for years.  :)

When my son was getting ready to drop the hammer, the guy said "you need to run up
there as fast as you can and don't let that buck flop around or he will break all his points off" lol. It was like -5 degrees that morning, holding onto his antlers were like hand warmers from all the blood flowing thru them.

Offline longrange7mm

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2018, 05:01:03 PM »
My son's first buck was nutless in full velvet. He shot it on a management hunt. The buck was a 7x8 and around 24 wide with drops on both sides. He was hanging with the does which the ranch owner said was common for him. He'd been on the ranch for 4 to 5 years that he knew of. The ranch owner said his antlers would break off when the weather was super cold due to frostbite and they would just keep growing year around.

Pretty sure he thought my son was crazy when he told him he wanted to shoot him. Said "why would you want to shoot that buck it is basically a doe" lol My son said "because he is cool and different". He said they had shot a couple others over the years and that they were always super good eating. Sure enough one of the best eating deer ever, super tender. This buck had a huge body and fat that was 2 inches thick. One of the coolest part was his hide. The hair was super long, so we tanned his hide and made Mouse Patterns for years.  :)

When my son was getting ready to drop the hammer, the guy said "you need to run up
there as fast as you can and don't let that buck flop around or he will break all his points off" lol. It was like -5 degrees that morning, holding onto his antlers were like hand warmers from all the blood flowing thru them.

That is awesome congrats to your son. Yea she was supposed to shoot a 170 3x4 as a management buck and seen this and the outfitter couldnt talk her out of it. needless to say the guy that took the 3x4 was happy
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Offline Pinetar

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2018, 05:22:41 PM »
My son's first buck was nutless in full velvet. He shot it on a management hunt. The buck was a 7x8 and around 24 wide with drops on both sides. He was hanging with the does which the ranch owner said was common for him. He'd been on the ranch for 4 to 5 years that he knew of. The ranch owner said his antlers would break off when the weather was super cold due to frostbite and they would just keep growing year around.

Pretty sure he thought my son was crazy when he told him he wanted to shoot him. Said "why would you want to shoot that buck it is basically a doe" lol My son said "because he is cool and different". He said they had shot a couple others over the years and that they were always super good eating. Sure enough one of the best eating deer ever, super tender. This buck had a huge body and fat that was 2 inches thick. One of the coolest part was his hide. The hair was super long, so we tanned his hide and made Mouse Patterns for years.  :)

When my son was getting ready to drop the hammer, the guy said "you need to run up
there as fast as you can and don't let that buck flop around or he will break all his points off" lol. It was like -5 degrees that morning, holding onto his antlers were like hand warmers from all the blood flowing thru them.

That is awesome congrats to your son. Yea she was supposed to shoot a 170 3x4 as a management buck and seen this and the outfitter couldnt talk her out of it. needless to say the guy that took the 3x4 was happy

I'm with her, that buck is super cool and different, Congrats to her! Not only that but some day she will more then likely shoot her 170 buck. Shooting a buck like she did is going to be hard to beat!

Offline longrange7mm

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Re: A couple nutless bucks
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2018, 06:12:36 PM »
My son's first buck was nutless in full velvet. He shot it on a management hunt. The buck was a 7x8 and around 24 wide with drops on both sides. He was hanging with the does which the ranch owner said was common for him. He'd been on the ranch for 4 to 5 years that he knew of. The ranch owner said his antlers would break off when the weather was super cold due to frostbite and they would just keep growing year around.

Pretty sure he thought my son was crazy when he told him he wanted to shoot him. Said "why would you want to shoot that buck it is basically a doe" lol My son said "because he is cool and different". He said they had shot a couple others over the years and that they were always super good eating. Sure enough one of the best eating deer ever, super tender. This buck had a huge body and fat that was 2 inches thick. One of the coolest part was his hide. The hair was super long, so we tanned his hide and made Mouse Patterns for years.  :)

When my son was getting ready to drop the hammer, the guy said "you need to run up
there as fast as you can and don't let that buck flop around or he will break all his points off" lol. It was like -5 degrees that morning, holding onto his antlers were like hand warmers from all the blood flowing thru them.

That is awesome congrats to your son. Yea she was supposed to shoot a 170 3x4 as a management buck and seen this and the outfitter couldnt talk her out of it. needless to say the guy that took the 3x4 was happy

I'm with her, that buck is super cool and different, Congrats to her! Not only that but some day she will more then likely shoot her 170 buck. Shooting a buck like she did is going to be hard to beat!

yea thats why she passed the 3x4 she said she can shoot one like that at home :) she has a 167 otc archery and a 179 otc rifle
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