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Author Topic: Cougar Harvest question  (Read 22594 times)

Offline bobcat

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #50 on: August 07, 2012, 06:03:22 PM »
There is an exception for cougar meat. I don't know where it is in the pamphlet, or if it's even in there this year, but I'm pretty sure they didn't change the law.

So now I'm just wondering, when wolves become legal "big game," who is going to eat the meat? Should eating the meat be required by law?


Offline seth30

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #51 on: August 07, 2012, 06:04:51 PM »
There is an exception for cougar meat. I don't know where it is in the pamphlet, or if it's even in there this year, but I'm pretty sure they didn't change the law.

So now I'm just wondering, when wolves become legal "big game," who is going to eat the meat? Should eating the meat be required by law?
No worries, not sure about you bobcat but I know plenty of people from certain areas of the world that would love to eat a k9....
Rather be dead than cool.
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Offline Bob33

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #52 on: August 07, 2012, 06:36:03 PM »
I have never seen any formal exception for meat of any animal, including cougar. The RCW, which has been referenced in this thread, does not specifically address meat at all. It states that wildlife shall not be recklessly "wasted". How that is interpreted is not clear from any current regulation that I'm aware of.
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline bearpaw

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #53 on: August 07, 2012, 06:44:35 PM »
I agree with bobcat, I think it used to be in the rules, might have gotten accidentally deleted.

If wolves are required to be eaten I may have to break the law someday, just sayin....  :chuckle:
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Offline grundy53

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #54 on: August 07, 2012, 06:47:02 PM »
I agree with bobcat, I think it used to be in the rules, might have gotten accidentally deleted.

If wolves are required to be eaten I may have to break the law someday, just sayin....  :chuckle:

 :chuckle: :chuckle: :yeah:
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Offline BOWHUNTER45

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #55 on: August 07, 2012, 07:19:05 PM »
HUH...You saying you would not like some wolf backstrap  :dunno: :chuckle:

Offline Bob33

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #56 on: August 07, 2012, 07:29:20 PM »
Wolf. The other white meat.
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline buckhorn2

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #57 on: August 08, 2012, 07:12:12 AM »
Why is there a season on cougar at all. You would think june and july with the baby deer and elk they would be in season I saw a really big one yesterday that we could have got while looking for bear. He sat cleaning himself on top of a slash pile about 2oo yars away for about 15 minutes enough time to call home to see what the season was but like pike minnow that they pay to get out of the river but yet have a season on them some things just don;t make since. I guess if they can;t figure the wolf thing out they could;nt figure cougar either.

Offline grundy53

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #58 on: August 08, 2012, 07:49:03 AM »
Why is there a season on cougar at all. You would think june and july with the baby deer and elk they would be in season I saw a really big one yesterday that we could have got while looking for bear. He sat cleaning himself on top of a slash pile about 2oo yars away for about 15 minutes enough time to call home to see what the season was but like pike minnow that they pay to get out of the river but yet have a season on them some things just don;t make since. I guess if they can;t figure the wolf thing out they could;nt figure cougar either.

I agree. They should be open year round. Without hounds people don't kill enough of them to make a difference anyway.
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Offline pianoman9701

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #59 on: August 08, 2012, 07:54:14 AM »
Why is there a season on cougar at all. You would think june and july with the baby deer and elk they would be in season I saw a really big one yesterday that we could have got while looking for bear. He sat cleaning himself on top of a slash pile about 2oo yars away for about 15 minutes enough time to call home to see what the season was but like pike minnow that they pay to get out of the river but yet have a season on them some things just don;t make since. I guess if they can;t figure the wolf thing out they could;nt figure cougar either.

I agree. They should be open year round. Without hounds people don't kill enough of them to make a difference anyway.

There may well be an open season eventually. With the strides that people like Kain have made by staying in the DFW's face about predator management, the season has been restored to it's old dates. The main reason I believe it's closed now between April 1st and Aug 31st is that if a mother with kittens is accidentally shot, the kittens have a better chance of survival in the fall. That's my guess.
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Offline buckhorn2

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #60 on: August 08, 2012, 10:34:56 AM »
You are probley right about kitten survival but I am more concerned about fawn survival after it;s mother is killed by a cougar. Like Grundy said without dogs it;s usually just by chance you see one maybe more chance now since without dogs there are many more of them. Just hope he is around when season does start he was a big one.

Offline jackmaster

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #61 on: August 08, 2012, 12:11:12 PM »
i am all for killn cats and protecting deer and elk fawns, but baby kittens runnin around because mama kitty got killed dont fly with with me, yes they are deer and elk killn machines, but it aint the cats fault that the tree huggers and bunny lovers took away the only 2 affective methods of controling their numbers, same with baiting they took away the only true method of controlling numbers and cutn down on mother with cub kills. to be honest baby cats and bears are one of the cutest animals in the woods, we as hunters just got to come up with a couple of sure fire methods of killn them when they reach adulthood  :twocents:
my grandpa always said "if it aint broke dont fix it"

Offline Humptulips

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #62 on: August 08, 2012, 10:47:24 PM »
I agree with bobcat, I think it used to be in the rules, might have gotten accidentally deleted.

If wolves are required to be eaten I may have to break the law someday, just sayin....  :chuckle:

Note that the law was changed in 2012 so what was good last year is no longer valid.
Pretty clear it is against the law to waste wildlife if (and here is the loophole if there is one) it's worth more then $20.
Also if that wolf season opens you wouldn't be wasting it by not eating it but you would have to salvage the hide if it was worth more then $20.
Nothing says wilflife has to be eaten just not wasted.
Shoot that mangy coyote, not worth $20, mangy wolf also not worth $20. Prime wolf, better skin it out.
Cougar, hide probably worth at least $20. Meat, all depends on wheather the judge thinks it's edible.
I'll take it all, Good Stuff!
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Offline bobcat

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #63 on: August 08, 2012, 10:49:26 PM »
You can't sell game meat, so I'd say it's worth nothing. Not deer meat, elk meat, or cougar meat.


Offline KFhunter

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #64 on: August 08, 2012, 10:50:08 PM »
hmm wonder if I can find that thread where someone got a wolf in Idaho and documented himself BBQ'n the wolf and him and his guests all trying it out.
 
 
Said it was really good!
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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #65 on: August 08, 2012, 10:52:39 PM »
I've had one Cougar I would have shot in self defence out of season - but I wasn't armed.
 
almost got to wack it with a big stick though, but never again.
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Offline Humptulips

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #66 on: August 08, 2012, 10:58:53 PM »
You can't sell game meat, so I'd say it's worth nothing. Not deer meat, elk meat, or cougar meat.

May seem strange but I believe you can sell cougar meat. I'd have to do some checking to be sure.
State does set a value on big game animals though so I think the courts would go by that.
Bruce Vandervort

Offline Humptulips

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #67 on: August 08, 2012, 11:13:23 PM »
You can't sell game meat, so I'd say it's worth nothing. Not deer meat, elk meat, or cougar meat.

Found this for you.

 (2) For purposes of this chapter, the value of any fish, seaweed, shellfish, or wildlife may be proved based on evidence of legal or illegal sales involving the person charged or any other person, of offers to sell or solicitation of offers to sell by the person charged or by any other person, or of any market price for the fish, seaweed, shellfish, or wildlife including market price for farm-raised game animals. The value assigned to specific fish, seaweed, shellfish, or wildlife by RCW 77.15.420 may be presumed to be the value of such fish, seaweed, shellfish, or wildlife. It is not relevant to proof of value that the person charged misrepresented that the fish, seaweed, shellfish, or wildlife was taken in compliance with law if the fish, seaweed, shellfish, or wildlife was unlawfully taken and had no lawful market value.

Bruce Vandervort

Offline bobcat

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #68 on: August 08, 2012, 11:16:17 PM »
Interesting. Sounds like they've got it covered.


Offline Humptulips

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #69 on: August 08, 2012, 11:19:39 PM »
You can't sell game meat, so I'd say it's worth nothing. Not deer meat, elk meat, or cougar meat.

May seem strange but I believe you can sell cougar meat. I'd have to do some checking to be sure.
State does set a value on big game animals though so I think the courts would go by that.

All right, I looked that up about selling cougar meat and I was wrong. Can't do it

WAC 232-12-071 Agency filings affecting this section 
Buying or selling game unlawful — Game-farmed meat exception.
  (1) It is unlawful to offer for sale, sell, purchase, or barter edible parts of wild animals or game birds. It is unlawful to offer for sale, sell, purchase, or barter edible parts of game fish, except pursuant to RCW 77.65.480.

     (2) It is unlawful to offer for sale, sell, purchase, or barter the nonedible parts of wild animals, game birds, or game fish if:

     (a) The possession, sale, selling, purchase, or barter is prohibited by federal regulations;

     (b) The wild animals, game birds, or game fish were taken in violation of any law or regulation in any jurisdiction, and the seller, purchaser, or person bartering knew the animal, bird, or fish was illegally taken; or

     (c) The nonedible parts are of bighorn sheep or mountain goat; bear gall bladders; claws or teeth of bear that are not permanently attached to a full bear skin or mounted bear; or velvet antlers of deer, elk, or moose; and a permit has not been granted by the department allowing for the sale, purchase, or barter of any of the animal parts listed in this subsection (2)(c).

     (3) For purposes of subsection (2)(c) of this section, all of those parts are considered "nonedible" even if they are used for human consumption.

     (4) Under RCW 77.15.194, it is unlawful to knowingly buy, sell, or otherwise exchange, or to offer to buy, sell, or otherwise exchange, the raw fur or carcass of a wild animal trapped in Washington with a body-gripping trap, whether or not the animal is trapped pursuant to a permit.

     (5) It is unlawful to offer for sale, sell, purchase, or barter game-farm raised deer and elk, unless the following conditions have been met:

     (a) Proof of the source of the game-farmed meat is maintained with the meat until the meat is consumed or exported. Qualifying proof includes sales or purchase invoices or receipts containing the following information in the English language:

     (i) Name of seller or importer;

     (ii) Name of the company selling the meat;

     (iii) The date of sale;

     (iv) The quantity of meat sold; and

     (v) The species of the meat sold.

     (b) The meat is imported from a U.S. licensed game farm, or a game farm in another country.

     (c) The meat is boned, and only the meat is imported.

     (d) The meat is packaged for retail sale prior to importation into this state.

     (6) A violation of subsection (4) of this section is punishable under RCW 77.15.194. The remaining subsections in this section are punishable under RCW 77.15.260.

     (7) If you request a written permit to offer for sale, sell, purchase, or barter the nonedible parts of wild animals listed in subsection (2)(c) of this section, and your request is denied, you have a right to a hearing under the provisions of chapter 34.05 RCW. In order to obtain a hearing, you must notify the department, in writing, within forty-five days of the date of the letter denying your permit. The address to send hearing requests to is:


Bruce Vandervort

Offline bearpaw

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #70 on: August 08, 2012, 11:51:42 PM »
Why is there a season on cougar at all. You would think june and july with the baby deer and elk they would be in season I saw a really big one yesterday that we could have got while looking for bear. He sat cleaning himself on top of a slash pile about 2oo yars away for about 15 minutes enough time to call home to see what the season was but like pike minnow that they pay to get out of the river but yet have a season on them some things just don;t make since. I guess if they can;t figure the wolf thing out they could;nt figure cougar either.

I agree. They should be open year round. Without hounds people don't kill enough of them to make a difference anyway.

There may well be an open season eventually. With the strides that people like Kain have made by staying in the DFW's face about predator management, the season has been restored to it's old dates. The main reason I believe it's closed now between April 1st and Aug 31st is that if a mother with kittens is accidentally shot, the kittens have a better chance of survival in the fall. That's my guess.

Kittens can be born anytime of the year. Cougar are like housecats, they can cycle anytime and kittens can be born anytime.

Quote
http://wdfw.wa.gov/living/cougars.html
• Cougars can breed year-round, but breeding is more common in winter and early spring.
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Offline bearpaw

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #71 on: August 08, 2012, 11:56:22 PM »
It would be nice if Outdoor Guardian could clear this up for us. Hunters really need to know if the law has actually changed regarding meat recovery on cougar or if there's been a simple ommission of the language regarding cougar meat for whatever reason.
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Offline grundy53

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #72 on: August 09, 2012, 05:29:39 AM »



I agree with bobcat, I think it used to be in the rules, might have gotten accidentally deleted.

If wolves are required to be eaten I may have to break the law someday, just sayin....  :chuckle:

Note that the law was changed in 2012 so what was good last year is no longer valid.
Pretty clear it is against the law to waste wildlife if (and here is the loophole if there is one) it's worth more then $20.
Also if that wolf season opens you wouldn't be wasting it by not eating it but you would have to salvage the hide if it was worth more then $20.
Nothing says wilflife has to be eaten just not wasted.
Shoot that mangy coyote, not worth $20, mangy wolf also not worth $20. Prime wolf, better skin it out.
Cougar, hide probably worth at least $20. Meat, all depends on wheather the judge thinks it's edible.
I'll take it all, Good Stuff!

The value is irrelevant unless the animal is not considered a big game animal. If the animal is considered a big game animal you can't allow it to go to waste.



Cougars are considered big game therefore it is illegal to let them go to waste...

RCW = 77.15.170


77.15.170
Waste of fish and wildlife — Penalty.

     *** CHANGE IN 2012 *** (SEE 6135-S.SL) ***

(1) A person is guilty of waste of fish and wildlife in the second degree if:

     (a) The person kills, takes, or possesses fish, shellfish, or wildlife and the value of the fish, shellfish, or wildlife is greater than twenty dollars but less than two hundred fifty dollars; and

     (b) The person recklessly allows such fish, shellfish, or wildlife to be wasted.

     (2) A person is guilty of waste of fish and wildlife in the first degree if:

     (a) The person kills, takes, or possesses fish, shellfish, or wildlife having a value of two hundred fifty dollars or more or wildlife classified as big game; and

     (b) The person recklessly allows such fish, shellfish, or wildlife to be wasted.

     (3)(a) Waste of fish and wildlife in the second degree is a misdemeanor.

     (b) Waste of fish and wildlife in the first degree is a gross misdemeanor. Upon conviction, the department shall revoke any license or tag used in the crime and shall order suspension of the person's privileges to engage in the activity in which the person committed waste of fish and wildlife in the first degree for a period of one year.

     (4) It is prima facie evidence of waste if a processor purchases or engages a quantity of food fish, shellfish, or game fish that cannot be processed within sixty hours after the food fish, game fish, or shellfish are taken from the water, unless the food fish, game fish, or shellfish are preserved in good marketable condition.


[1999 c 258 § 5; 1998 c 190 § 21.]




http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=77.15&full=true#77.15.170
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Offline bobcat

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #73 on: August 09, 2012, 07:00:10 AM »
Quote
The value is irrelevant unless the animal is not considered a big game animal. If the animal is considered a big game animal you can't allow it to go to waste.


That woulld depend on the definition of waste. What if cougar meat is by law considered unfit for human consumption? Then it really wouldn't be considered wasted if you left it in the woods for other animals to eat.


Offline grundy53

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Re: Cougar Harvest question
« Reply #74 on: August 09, 2012, 07:59:08 AM »
Quote
The value is irrelevant unless the animal is not considered a big game animal. If the animal is considered a big game animal you can't allow it to go to waste.


That woulld depend on the definition of waste. What if cougar meat is by law considered unfit for human consumption? Then it really wouldn't be considered wasted if you left it in the woods for other animals to eat.

Find where it says that and I will concur. But at this point I have not heard that. Also I was commenting on the value of said animal not being relevant.
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[Yesterday at 10:16:05 PM]


BH45- CIDER VENSION STEW .... by DaveMonti
[Yesterday at 09:59:58 PM]


Poached Goat by KFhunter
[Yesterday at 09:59:08 PM]


Any report on Roosevelt? by Boss .300 winmag
[Yesterday at 09:57:41 PM]


One More to go by bigelk1030
[Yesterday at 09:40:16 PM]