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Big Game Hunting => Out Of State Hunting => Topic started by: cem3434 on February 22, 2015, 07:35:39 PM


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Title: Sheep hunting options
Post by: cem3434 on February 22, 2015, 07:35:39 PM
So I am in my early 30's and really would like to go on at least ones sheep hunt in my life. Even though I have been putting in for WA most of my life, I realize the odds are stacked against all of us here due to the number of hunters and lack of tags. I have tried to justify a Stone or Dahl sheep hunt, but there is no way I can drop $12k to $20k on a hunt.

My question is, which state(s) do you think I would have the best chance at drawing if I didn't mind putting in for next 25 to 30 years? I realize there is no guarantees, but I'm just looking to up my odds a little and give myself a chance to draw one sheep tag in my lifetime. I am currently putting in for Utah and Colorado, but bailed on Wyoming after they changed how non-residents draw or how many can draw. I have also been applying for moose in Idaho, but I'm thinking about switching to sheep since there is no preference point system and its all about the luck of the draw.

I dont want to know what specific units or hunts you guys are putting in for, rather just what state(s) you guys think have the best chance of drawing as a non-resident after applying for 25 to 30 years.  Any advice you guys are willing to share would be appreciated.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: fair-chase on February 22, 2015, 07:39:53 PM
Have you considered Montana's OTC units?
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: longwalker on February 22, 2015, 07:46:05 PM
Over the next 25-30 years your odds are as good hear as anywhere and likly cheaper to apply for. The best odds around however are buying a life time membership to the wild sheep foundation. The hunt they give away at there banquet is the best odds anywhere
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: trophyhunt on February 22, 2015, 07:49:08 PM
Over the next 25-30 years your odds are as good hear as anywhere and likly cheaper to apply for. The best odds around however are buying a life time membership to the wild sheep foundation. The hunt they give away at there banquet is the best odds anywhere
Ssss, lets keep that info to ourselves!! :chuckle: Kinda joking anyway.  See ya on the 7th?
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: trophyhunt on February 22, 2015, 07:56:59 PM
As far as moose goes, your best bet might be Idaho when it comes to draw odds.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: bobcat on February 22, 2015, 08:01:34 PM
Look at the raffle tags for this state. Your odds might be better with purchasing some of those rather than applying in other states. The "South Central" raffle tag, sold 1,491 tickets last year. If you bought ten, your odds are 1 in 149. Or buy 20, gets you down to 1 in 75. Much better odds than the draw, which overall is about 1 in 555 (not taking points into account). Yes it is $17 per ticket, so 20 tickets would be $340. But that still may be cheaper than applying in several other states every year. However, I really don't know because I've never looked into it. I just know the odds are too low and the cost too high for me to get into that game.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: follow maggie on February 22, 2015, 08:37:41 PM
I think you can get a guaranteed tag in Alberta, but you have to hire a guide, because tags are issued to the guides.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: actionshooter on February 22, 2015, 08:51:39 PM
The best draw odds for sheep in the lower 48 is in Idaho.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: blacktail378 on February 22, 2015, 08:53:01 PM
No pts in New Mexico. Might as well try :tup:
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: WAcoueshunter on February 22, 2015, 09:07:06 PM
Idaho is your best shot at a NR tag, no doubt. 

NM is sticking it to the non-resident DIY sheep hunters - thousands of applicants, and exactly 1 desert and 1 rocky tag available, and you get to front the $3K tag price for a few months while they earn the interest.  I won't give them my money. 

In all seriousness, if you're on the 25-30 year plan anyway, take that $500+/year you will spend in app fees across the west and save it for a dall sheep hunt.  Realistically, a 25-30 year plan may net you nothing in the draws given the way the western states are cinching down on NR tags.  But saving that money over time WILL get you a tag. 
 
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Karl Blanchard on February 22, 2015, 09:10:06 PM
The OTC tags in Montana encompass some of the toughest terrain in North America and many of veteran sheep hunters have walked away beat down and empty handed.  Just an FYI.  Its not impossible but should not be jumped into lightly.  Also, I do believe that it is the hunters responsibility to keep track on whether the quota has been met or not so a sat phone is a requirement so you can call in daily to check.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: blacktail378 on February 22, 2015, 09:10:41 PM
Idaho is your best shot at a NR tag, no doubt. 

NM is sticking it to the non-resident DIY sheep hunters - thousands of applicants, and exactly 1 desert and 1 rocky tag available, and you get to front the $3K tag price for a few months while they earn the interest.  I won't give them my money. 

In all seriousness, if you're on the 25-30 year plan anyway, take that $500+/year you will spend in app fees across the west and save it for a dall sheep hunt.  Realistically, a 25-30 year plan may net you nothing in the draws given the way the western states are cinching down on NR tags.  But saving that money over time WILL get you a tag.
good point coueshunter , forgot about that
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bob33 on February 22, 2015, 09:13:41 PM
Idaho is your best shot at a NR tag, no doubt. 

NM is sticking it to the non-resident DIY sheep hunters - thousands of applicants, and exactly 1 desert and 1 rocky tag available, and you get to front the $3K tag price for a few months while they earn the interest.  I won't give them my money. 

In all seriousnress, if you're on the 25-30 year plan anyway, take that $500+/year you will spend in app fees across the west and save it for a dall sheep hunt.  Realistically, a 25-30 year plan may net you nothing in the draws given the way the western states are cinching down on NR tags.  But saving that money over time WILL get you a tag.
Applying for 30 years in a state with 1 in 200 odds gives you a 1 in 7 chance of being drawn. If you really want to hunt a specie like sheep, save your money and go.

A good idea might be to join Washington's Wild Sheep Foundation and meet some members. Their annual banquet is coming up soon.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: bearpaw on February 22, 2015, 09:21:23 PM
I know several guys who have killed sheep in the Montana unlimited areas, it can be done.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: cem3434 on February 22, 2015, 09:31:57 PM
Over the next 25-30 years your odds are as good hear as anywhere and likly cheaper to apply for. The best odds around however are buying a life time membership to the wild sheep foundation. The hunt they give away at there banquet is the best odds anywhere

Both my wife and myself are lifetime members and have been for a couple of years. I still plan on putting in for WA as well, but I have to think that our odds of drawing here only get worse every year.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: cem3434 on February 22, 2015, 09:35:42 PM
Idaho is your best shot at a NR tag, no doubt. 

NM is sticking it to the non-resident DIY sheep hunters - thousands of applicants, and exactly 1 desert and 1 rocky tag available, and you get to front the $3K tag price for a few months while they earn the interest.  I won't give them my money. 

In all seriousness, if you're on the 25-30 year plan anyway, take that $500+/year you will spend in app fees across the west and save it for a dall sheep hunt.  Realistically, a 25-30 year plan may net you nothing in the draws given the way the western states are cinching down on NR tags.  But saving that money over time WILL get you a tag.

I hear what you are saying but $15k over 25 years is easier to come up with than $15k all at once.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: cem3434 on February 22, 2015, 09:38:33 PM
The OTC tags in Montana encompass some of the toughest terrain in North America and many of veteran sheep hunters have walked away beat down and empty handed.  Just an FYI.  Its not impossible but should not be jumped into lightly.  Also, I do believe that it is the hunters responsibility to keep track on whether the quota has been met or not so a sat phone is a requirement so you can call in daily to check.

Thanks for the sound advice, its definitely worth looking into on my end.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Stein on February 22, 2015, 10:14:27 PM
Put $50 a month into your budget and then when you have a buck or five in your pocket, drop it into the coffee can as well.  You'll have a guaranteed trip.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Branden on February 23, 2015, 10:26:25 AM
I would get residency in Idaho and buy a lifetime license. And then I would do the same in Arizona. It really helps your odds when you are in the resident draw in 3 different states.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bob33 on February 23, 2015, 10:35:12 AM
I would get residency in Idaho and buy a lifetime license. And then I would do the same in Arizona. It really helps your odds when you are in the resident draw in 3 different states.
That's a great idea, but besides being illegal why only stop at three?
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: WAcoueshunter on February 23, 2015, 10:43:25 AM
I would get residency in Idaho and buy a lifetime license. And then I would do the same in Arizona. It really helps your odds when you are in the resident draw in 3 different states.
That's a great idea, but besides being illegal why only stop at three?

 :chuckle:

Yeah, I don't know about Idaho, but you're back in the NR draw pool once you no longer live in AZ regardless of whether you bought the lifetime license.  You don't have to buy a NR hunting license (or any hunting license, for that matter), but you're still in the NR draw and pay NR tag fees. 
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: huntnphool on February 23, 2015, 10:46:45 AM
If you only plan on one hunt, then start saving now. $2-3k/year will give you the money to go on that hunt for your 40th birthday present. :tup:
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bob33 on February 23, 2015, 11:01:02 AM
I would get residency in Idaho and buy a lifetime license. And then I would do the same in Arizona. It really helps your odds when you are in the resident draw in 3 different states.
That's a great idea, but besides being illegal why only stop at three?

 :chuckle:

Yeah, I don't know about Idaho, but you're back in the NR draw pool once you no longer live in AZ regardless of whether you bought the lifetime license.  You don't have to buy a NR hunting license (or any hunting license, for that matter), but you're still in the NR draw and pay NR tag fees.
http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/licenses/?getPage=78 (http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/licenses/?getPage=78)
"No one can claim Idaho resident privileges while claiming resident privileges in another state, except military personnel."
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Curly on February 23, 2015, 11:05:19 AM
I would get residency in Idaho and buy a lifetime license. And then I would do the same in Arizona. It really helps your odds when you are in the resident draw in 3 different states.
That's a great idea, but besides being illegal why only stop at three?

 :chuckle:

Yeah, I don't know about Idaho, but you're back in the NR draw pool once you no longer live in AZ regardless of whether you bought the lifetime license.  You don't have to buy a NR hunting license (or any hunting license, for that matter), but you're still in the NR draw and pay NR tag fees.
http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/licenses/?getPage=78 (http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/licenses/?getPage=78)
"No one can claim Idaho resident privileges while claiming resident privileges in another state, except military personnel."

Sounds like he should join the military then.  ;)   :)
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bean Counter on February 23, 2015, 11:22:38 AM
I'm in a similar boat.

My best advice is to stay in good health. Pass on all the aforementioned coffee can, under the mattress, and hide from yourself tactics and invest it in a low expense ratio IRA or your company's matched 401(k). If you stay in good health you can compound 3 decades of growth into millions. I would enjoy a Gawd awful expensive hunt far more if it were commensurate with with my overall net worth, as opposed to overextending my family's finances.  :twocents:

If you really want to kill a horned animal go to New Mexico or Texas for a Barbary sheep hunt. Aka an aoudad.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: BULLBLASTER on February 23, 2015, 12:09:28 PM
If a person has a lifetime license in idaho they will be considered a resident for the purpose of controlled hunt drawings regardless if they live in idaho anymore or not. Still must pay nr tag fees thou if not a current resident.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bigshooter on February 23, 2015, 12:10:06 PM
I would get residency in Idaho and buy a lifetime license. And then I would do the same in Arizona. It really helps your odds when you are in the resident draw in 3 different states.
That's a great idea, but besides being illegal why only stop at three?

 :chuckle:

Yeah, I don't know about Idaho, but you're back in the NR draw pool once you no longer live in AZ regardless of whether you bought the lifetime license.  You don't have to buy a NR hunting license (or any hunting license, for that matter), but you're still in the NR draw and pay NR tag fees.
http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/licenses/?getPage=78 (http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/licenses/?getPage=78)
"No one can claim Idaho resident privileges while claiming resident privileges in another state, except military personnel."

When you have an Idaho lifetime licenses and move out of Idaho you get a free nonresident licenses every year.  The kicker is you are in the resident draw side for draw tags (but still pay nonresidnet fee's for the tag).  So instead of being limited to up to 10% of the tags you have a chance of drawing from the 90% pool. 

I was also told by a hunter ed teacher that it works the same way in AZ.  But have never looked into it.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bob33 on February 23, 2015, 12:24:21 PM
I suppose if you were willing to move to Idaho and live there for six months in order to buy a resident lifetime license, and then move to Arizona, live there for six months and buy another resident lifetime license could work but the potential loss of income and expenses associated with the moves would probably be greater than the cost of a hunt.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: WAcoueshunter on February 23, 2015, 12:45:15 PM
I've looked in the Arizona regs on this, and all they say is you will still need to buy a NR tag.  It doesn't say anywhere that you get to participate in the resident draw before you buy that NR tag.  If that were the case, I'm sure they would make a huge deal about it, as that's a very significant benefit.  Here's a link to the summary:

http://www.azgfd.gov/eservices/documents/Lifetime%20License%20Application_2014.pdf (http://www.azgfd.gov/eservices/documents/Lifetime%20License%20Application_2014.pdf)

Also, as it relates to the original post, the 10% NR cap is only one limiting factor for Arizona sheep anyway - right now, max points is 26 and there are about 7,000 applicants with 12 or more points (most of which are residents, see link below) applying for 104 total tags.  There are at least that many more applicants with 12 points or less.  You do the math, but Arizona will always be a longshot for someone just starting now.  Heck, I've got like 15 and figure it's a longshot for me in the next 20 years.

http://www.azgfd.gov/eservices/documents/bonus/12-2014/Individual%20Bonus%20Points%20Totals%20by%20Species.pdf (http://www.azgfd.gov/eservices/documents/bonus/12-2014/Individual%20Bonus%20Points%20Totals%20by%20Species.pdf)
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Branden on February 23, 2015, 01:11:23 PM
lol at all the 'EXPERTS" in this thread that need to take their foots out of their mouths. Instead of typing maybe you should research a little before you type up completely wrong info. Thank you for proving once again why you should never trust what you read in a forum. Carry on all you 'EXPERTS'



I have called an it is the same in AZ as it is in ID. Also there is a thread on MM about it right now for AZ. And the other benefit is that it will help you draw other species as well. AZ has some of the best elk, deer, and pronghorn hunting in the world. ID you have a better chance to draw goat and moose after you draw sheep. Also neither state has a guaranteed 10% of tags going to non res. They are both "up to 10%" so as a non res with a lifetime license you have a shot at 100% of the tags not 90%.

Here is a snippet from AZ.
Lifetime License Holders
If a lifetime license holder changes residency
status from Arizona, the licensee must then
purchase non-resident stamps, tags, and
permits. older A non-resident tag or stamp can accompany
your lifetime resident license. If
you are a lifetime license holder that has
moved out of state, the 10 percent non-resident
cap does not apply to you.
The lifetime
license will remain legal for the taking of all
wildlife as permitted by law. Residency may
be re-established after moving back to Arizona
and meeting the required time period as
defined below.
Residency Requirements
“Resident” means a person who is domiciled
(claims the state of Arizona as their true,
fixed and permanent home and principal
residence) in this state for six months immediately
preceding the date of application for
a license, permit, tag, or stamp and does not
claim residency for any purpose in another
state or jurisdiction; or is a member of the
armed forces of the United States on active
duty and stationed in: (i)This state for a period
of thirty days immediately preceding the
date of applying for a license, permit, tag, or
stamp; (ii) Another state or country but who
lists this state as their home of record at the
time of applying for a license, permit, tag, or
stamp.
Arizona Residents may purchase a resident
license. All other individuals must purchase a
non-resident license.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: BULLBLASTER on February 23, 2015, 01:23:25 PM
 :yeah:  :chuckle: funny when people make up rules as they go.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: WAcoueshunter on February 23, 2015, 01:38:09 PM
Thanks, found it on page 4 of the regs.  I missed that before, but the 10% cap doesn't apply once you move out.

http://www.azgfd.gov/regs/springregs.pdf (http://www.azgfd.gov/regs/springregs.pdf)

Unfortunately that doesn't change the fact that you can go spend your 6 months in AZ to get a lifetime license and still be stuck behind 10,000 residents competing for 104 tags each year, and 20% of those go to max point holders.  A new applicant is not going to catch up when max is 26.   
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bigshooter on February 23, 2015, 01:40:54 PM
lol at all the 'EXPERTS" in this thread that need to take their foots out of their mouths. Instead of typing maybe you should research a little before you type up completely wrong info. Thank you for proving once again why you should never trust what you read in a forum. Carry on all you 'EXPERTS'



I have called an it is the same in AZ as it is in ID. Also there is a thread on MM about it right now for AZ. And the other benefit is that it will help you draw other species as well. AZ has some of the best elk, deer, and pronghorn hunting in the world. ID you have a better chance to draw goat and moose after you draw sheep. Also neither state has a guaranteed 10% of tags going to non res. They are both "up to 10%" so as a non res with a lifetime license you have a shot at 100% of the tags not 90%.

Here is a snippet from AZ.
Lifetime License Holders
If a lifetime license holder changes residency
status from Arizona, the licensee must then
purchase non-resident stamps, tags, and
permits. older A non-resident tag or stamp can accompany
your lifetime resident license. If
you are a lifetime license holder that has
moved out of state, the 10 percent non-resident
cap does not apply to you.
The lifetime
license will remain legal for the taking of all
wildlife as permitted by law. Residency may
be re-established after moving back to Arizona
and meeting the required time period as
defined below.
Residency Requirements
“Resident” means a person who is domiciled
(claims the state of Arizona as their true,
fixed and permanent home and principal
residence) in this state for six months immediately
preceding the date of application for
a license, permit, tag, or stamp and does not
claim residency for any purpose in another
state or jurisdiction; or is a member of the
armed forces of the United States on active
duty and stationed in: (i)This state for a period
of thirty days immediately preceding the
date of applying for a license, permit, tag, or
stamp; (ii) Another state or country but who
lists this state as their home of record at the
time of applying for a license, permit, tag, or
stamp.
Arizona Residents may purchase a resident
license. All other individuals must purchase a
non-resident license.

Take it easy lol  :chuckle:  :chuckle:  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Bob33 on February 23, 2015, 01:53:38 PM
Move to Idaho for six months, pay $1100 for a lifetime license, pack up and move to Arizona to live there for another six months, pay $600 for a lifetime license, and then move where you really want.

Whatever floats your boat.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: jackelope on February 23, 2015, 02:04:43 PM
If you guys are willing to do all of that and drag your family all over the country just so you have some better draw odds, you're a hell of a lot more dedicated than me.  Have at it.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Curly on February 23, 2015, 02:12:50 PM
The strategy would work well for a young guy.  If a kid right out of highschool could move to AZ and get a college degree while living there and get the lifetime license, then after graduation, get a job in Idaho and after living there long enough for residency, get the lifetime license there.  Then they are set.   :twocents:
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: BULLBLASTER on February 23, 2015, 02:15:51 PM
I had a chance to move to idaho a couple years ago between houses but couldnt convince the better half thats what we should do. Now i get limited to 10%, which is still way better odds than wa
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: idaho guy on February 23, 2015, 02:21:16 PM
I know several guys who have killed sheep in the Montana unlimited areas, it can be done.
[/quote
I did it back in I think 1990 really glad I did and haven't been able to draw a tag since worth it to at least have a chance to go no cell or sat phones then!
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Curly on February 23, 2015, 02:22:48 PM
Took me a minute to realize the pic was sideways.  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: idaho guy on February 23, 2015, 02:29:49 PM
Took me a minute to realize the pic was sideways.  :chuckle:


I was just crawling on my belly from exaustion :chuckle:I wish I was at that time.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Curly on February 23, 2015, 02:31:39 PM
That is hardcore.  :tup:
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: nwhunter on February 23, 2015, 06:54:23 PM
I bought the Idaho lifetime license when I lived over there 20 years ago. It was like $400 which was alot for me back then but glad I did it. I apply every year for hard to draw tags and the last few years for mt goat and I have NEVER drawn a tag yet even tho I am supposedly in the resident draw. It has saved me a bunch of license fees but not helped me draw a tag.  :bash: Maybe this is my lucky year.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: BULLBLASTER on February 23, 2015, 07:43:03 PM
I bought the Idaho lifetime license when I lived over there 20 years ago. It was like $400 which was alot for me back then but glad I did it. I apply every year for hard to draw tags and the last few years for mt goat and I have NEVER drawn a tag yet even tho I am supposedly in the resident draw. It has saved me a bunch of license fees but not helped me draw a tag.  :bash: Maybe this is my lucky year.
ive drawn a good mule deer tag and a bull moose tag in the last 4 years.  :P as a true nonresident.
Your time will come! Good luck
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: huntnnw on February 23, 2015, 09:45:34 PM
ID has the best odds...Unit 27 in frank church has the best odds, but its a super tough hunt.
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: Ridgerunner on February 24, 2015, 09:56:06 PM
Save your money for five years and go on a dall hunt before those prices go through the roof even more, you won't regret it.  If you wait till you draw in the lower 48 you may never go sheep hunting. 
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: idaho guy on February 25, 2015, 05:14:07 AM
ID has the best odds...Unit 27 in frank church has the best odds, but its a super tough hunt.
[/quote

 :yeah:cem do the unlimited sheep hunt In mt you will be sheep hunting this fall! I think the odds on 27 have been as high as 1 in 4 for residents? and it is a really tough hunt . I would do the OTC and keep putting in for a qaulity sheep hunt
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: jackelope on February 25, 2015, 06:20:40 AM
Took me a minute to realize the pic was sideways.  :chuckle:


I was just crawling on my belly from exaustion :chuckle:I wish I was at that time.

I wasn't sure if that was the case or if you fell off a cliff and splattered in the rocks.
 :dunno:
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: idaho guy on February 25, 2015, 09:45:17 AM
Took me a minute to realize the pic was sideways.  :chuckle:


I was just crawling on my belly from exaustion :chuckle:I wish I was at that time.

I wasn't sure if that was the case or if you fell off a cliff and splattered in the rocks.
 :dunno:




 :chuckle: thats funny and it does look like that!
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: idaho guy on August 16, 2017, 12:57:39 PM
I posted a picture in this thread but cant see it? it was a sheep hunt
Title: Re: Sheep hunting options
Post by: idaho guy on August 16, 2017, 12:59:25 PM
ok it worked
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