Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Deer Hunting => Topic started by: CJ1962 on September 27, 2017, 05:57:42 PM

Title: Scent Control Debate
Post by: CJ1962 on September 27, 2017, 05:57:42 PM
I've been on a short term assignment to Florida and in my effort to fast forward my hunting knowledge of the area I started listening to the Down South Hunting podcast.  It's an ok podcast in general, but the last 3 episodes have been really good.  They interviewed two very successful deer hunters from the Midwest.  One that really believes in Scent Control and one that doesn't.  I recommend that all hunters listen to these 3 podcasts.  I listen on Google Play, but attached are links to all 3.

Enjoy

http://www.downsouthhunting.com/down-south-hunting-podcast-episode-013-scent-control-debate-part-1/

http://www.downsouthhunting.com/south-hunting-podcast-episode-014-scent-control-strategy-comparison-w-dan-infalt-john-eberhart-part-2/

http://www.downsouthhunting.com/south-hunting-podcast-episode-015-scent-control-strategy-comparison-w-dan-infalt-john-eberhart-part-3/
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Dan-o on September 27, 2017, 06:11:32 PM
Carl,

There is no debate.......    PLEASE start practicing scent control. Do it for the children. 

(are you back yet?   I know where some elk are.)
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: fishnfur on September 27, 2017, 07:42:36 PM
Thanks, I'll check 'em out.  In the mean time .........

Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Stein on September 27, 2017, 08:08:50 PM
For sure, scent control is legit.  Cook your bacon, hand around your running Powerstroke, chew and smoke and then get a couple sprays of the latest and greatest.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: CJ1962 on September 28, 2017, 04:42:45 AM
Carl,

There is no debate.......    PLEASE start practicing scent control. Do it for the children. 

(are you back yet?   I know where some elk are.)

I was back for the whole Archery Elk season.  Had some chances, but struck out.  Might be home for rifle deer season, but just for the weekend.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: CJ1962 on September 28, 2017, 04:43:21 AM
Thanks, I'll check 'em out.  In the mean time .........

They talk about this.  Neither are that impressed.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Stein on September 28, 2017, 06:50:14 AM
I read a book by an ex-military guy turned dog trainer that works up high dollar dogs for Seal teams.  He had a chapter on dog's sense of smell and noted that cover scents don't work as dogs sense of smell works differently than people.  They smell everything individually where we smell things together.  An example would be a pot of chili cooking on the stove.  We smell chili where dogs smell beans, chili powder, ground beef, tomatoes, etc.

He had a dog that sniffed out a drug package hidden in a tank of gas.

I wonder if deer smell that way.  If so, all of the cover scents would be completely worthless.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: vandeman17 on September 28, 2017, 06:55:05 AM
I am guilty of using scent control sprays, detergent etc but I still think playing the wind/thermals is paramount. I have gotten much better over the years of not only being aware of them but planning my every move based on them. I will hike an extra mile to get the wind right versus trusting my scent control in an unfavorable wind.  :twocents:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Okanagan on September 28, 2017, 08:44:30 AM
I am guilty of using scent control sprays, detergent etc but I still think playing the wind/thermals is paramount. I have gotten much better over the years of not only being aware of them but planning my every move based on them. I will hike an extra mile to get the wind right versus trusting my scent control in an unfavorable wind.  :twocents:

Ditto on hiking waaay around to hunt a place with the wind right.  I have some places where I have a different plan and hunt approach depending on which way the wind is blowing. 

Directly on topic:  If you think scent control spray or clothes etc. work, use them by all means because anything that ups our confidence helps. 

However, IMO scent control is impossible with current technology and is no more than a lucrative scam, though some of the sellers probably believe their own hype.  I admit that I may overreact to this topic!    A hermetically sealed rebreather spacesuit that contains your breath and every molecule that leaves you skin might have possibilities, except that the suit material itself has some kind of odor.  If scent control worked, drug dealers would wrap their shipments in a scent control jacket or bag and be home free.   

The stories given as evidence that scent control works are downright  funny.  Last Fall I had a mule deer doe come off of a clearcut hillside onto an abandoned road with me, downwind of me, within 15 yards.  She looked at me a few times but mostly just walked on her way up the road.  I could say, "WOW!  She did not smell me and my camo was so good that she did not even see me standing in the open inside of 15 yards.  WOW!  This stuff really works!"

In my early days of calling critters to my bow, I went fanatical about scent control:  washing clothes scent free, bagging them sealed with sage or pine boughs, scrubbing myself, washing again after I left my vehicle and changing clothes from skin out before a short non-sweaty walk to a stand, etc.  I concluded that maybe I could surprise a coyote by the different or lack of scent for a few seconds, probably less than 5 seconds of double take body language on his part, maybe a bit more sometimes.  I don't think that the animal could not smell me but rather that it was an unusual smell coming from a human. 

Let's see:  my grandson killed a huge bull elk with his bow last year at 4 yards.  I have called coyotes inside of 18 inches, powder burned my first bull elk, lynx inside of 6 feet, a fox inside of 12 inches, black bear at a dozen feet, a 175 class mule deer killed within 40 feet, had a blacktail spike sniff of my boots as I sat by a deer trail, and my son called a bull moose to within touching distance (not a good idea by the way).  All of this without scent control clothes nor gear. 

Again, if you have confidence in it, use it. 

Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: JeffRaines on September 28, 2017, 09:04:47 AM
I am guilty of using scent control sprays, detergent etc but I still think playing the wind/thermals is paramount. I have gotten much better over the years of not only being aware of them but planning my every move based on them. I will hike an extra mile to get the wind right versus trusting my scent control in an unfavorable wind.  :twocents:

Ditto on hiking waaay around to hunt a place with the wind right.  I have some places where I have a different plan and hunt approach depending on which way the wind is blowing. 

Directly on topic:  If you think scent control spray or clothes etc. work, use them by all means because anything that ups our confidence helps. 

However, IMO scent control is impossible with current technology and is no more than a lucrative scam, though some of the sellers probably believe their own hype.  I admit that I may overreact to this topic!    A hermetically sealed rebreather spacesuit that contains your breath and every molecule that leaves you skin might have possibilities, except that the suit material itself has some kind of odor.  If scent control worked, drug dealers would wrap their shipments in a scent control jacket or bag and be home free.   

The stories given as evidence that scent control works are downright  funny.  Last Fall I had a mule deer doe come off of a clearcut hillside onto an abandoned road with me, downwind of me, within 15 yards.  She looked at me a few times but mostly just walked on her way up the road.  I could say, "WOW!  She did not smell me and my camo was so good that she did not even see me standing in the open inside of 15 yards.  WOW!  This stuff really works!"

In my early days of calling critters to my bow, I went fanatical about scent control:  washing clothes scent free, bagging them sealed with sage or pine boughs, scrubbing myself, washing again after I left my vehicle and changing clothes from skin out before a short non-sweaty walk to a stand, etc.  I concluded that maybe I could surprise a coyote by the different or lack of scent for a few seconds, probably less than 5 seconds of double take body language on his part, maybe a bit more sometimes.  I don't think that the animal could not smell me but rather that it was an unusual smell coming from a human. 

Let's see:  my grandson killed a huge bull elk with his bow last year at 4 yards.  I have called coyotes inside of 18 inches, powder burned my first bull elk, lynx inside of 6 feet, a fox inside of 12 inches, black bear at a dozen feet, a 175 class mule deer killed within 40 feet, had a blacktail spike sniff of my boots as I sat by a deer trail, and my son called a bull moose to within touching distance (not a good idea by the way).  All of this without scent control clothes nor gear. 

Again, if you have confidence in it, use it. 



I agree completely. I don't have near the experience that you do, but one thing has always stood out to me... what about our breath? Yeah, you can use some special scent killing toothpaste I guess, but that doesn't take away the fact that our breath is still going to smell unlike anything out there. Even if you use that stuff, what happens an hour later when the natural bacteria in our mouths have repopulated somewhat and are causing an odor again? Same thing for scent killing body wash.

We should take two guys in a season, one of them uses scent control and the other doesn't, have the scent control guy ignore the wind entirely while hunting(because scent control) and the other guy who's wearing regular deodorant, who has eaten something in his hunting clothes and kept them in a scented area, plays the wind. I know who I'm betting on.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: PolarBear on September 28, 2017, 09:09:02 AM
There are times when you just can't use the wind to your advantage.  For those times I use scent control products.  They don't eliminate your scent but if it takes away a little, anything helps.  Scent control and good natural cover scent like crushed up fir or pine needles and dirt.  I think they give you a better advantage than so called scent elimination products.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Doublelunger on September 28, 2017, 09:22:36 AM
When you're ready to take your scent control to the next level start taking chlorophyll pills :tup:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Okanagan on September 28, 2017, 09:31:19 AM
There are times when you just can't use the wind to your advantage. 

You are probably right, but I am close to disagreeing.  :)

We can use the wind far more than is generally assumed, and far more than merely hunting upwind.  For nose dominant animals, which include ungulates, canines and bears, the wind allows us to predict with high probability what an animal will do, where he will go, etc.  Any pattern a hunter can predict about an animal is a huge advantage.  I'd do my usual and post a corroborating/example story or two but am giving away too much hard learned info already!

Steady wind in one direction is a hunter's gift, no matter which way it blows.  Variable swirling winds are trouble. 
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on September 28, 2017, 10:18:41 AM
I just stand around the camp fire at night.  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: rtspring on September 28, 2017, 10:51:05 AM
Scent control is a billion dollar business! Biggest ripoff in the world.   The one thing you cannot hide is your breath.  If you dont have wind in your face, then you had best move to get it in your face no matter what..  I have 30 years hunting experience and never try to COVER up my scent.  Oh and I smoke whenever and where ever. 


I never clean my clothes in anything but regular laundry soap, srand around the fire in my hunting clothes, chew gum, smoke, wear deodorant and so on amd so forth. 

I have been involved in 100 plus elk kils and probably twice that in deer kills.  Get that wind in your face and you will be fine..  I do agree to try and limit unatural scents, but there are far better hunting things to spend money on.. 
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: boneaddict on September 28, 2017, 11:00:29 AM
 :yeah:   Minus the smoking part, I don't smoke.   
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: bigmacc on September 28, 2017, 11:12:59 AM
Scent control is a billion dollar business! Biggest ripoff in the world.   The one thing you cannot hide is your breath.  If you dont have wind in your face, then you had best move to get it in your face no matter what..  I have 30 years hunting experience and never try to COVER up my scent.  Oh and I smoke whenever and where ever. 


I never clean my clothes in anything but regular laundry soap, srand around the fire in my hunting clothes, chew gum, smoke, wear deodorant and so on amd so forth. 

I have been involved in 100 plus elk kils and probably twice that in deer kills.  Get that wind in your face and you will be fine..  I do agree to try and limit unatural scents, but there are far better hunting things to spend money on..

I 100% agree with rt, I,m not a smoker but I pretty much go about my hunting trips the same way and I've been doing it for over 50years, the family for over 100 years, been very successful. "Keep the wind in your face and if its not you better get it there!" This was pumped into me from the age of 5, and yes, lots better "hunting stuff" to spend my money on... :twocents:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Skyvalhunter on September 28, 2017, 11:17:17 AM
what do you smoke Wacky Tabacky?? :chuckle:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: OutHouse on September 28, 2017, 11:21:21 AM
I use the scent control products and have seen them work as advertised. For those commenting about breath that is a tough one to control. However, there is an easy fix to that. Breath through your nose. Sure there's scent coming from the lungs but not nearly as much coming from the bacteria filled mouth. Whenever I am close to deer I make sure to breath exclusively through the shnaaz.

Of course, using the wind to one's advantage is the best bet but like someone else said, that's not always possible. I think if you're gonna use the products you have to use all of them. I de-scent everything I possibly can, then let everything sit outside to soak up the woods smell. The last two deer I harvested were shot with my scent carrying directly toward the animal (bow and muzzy). One from a few years ago was with a group of 5 other bucks and none of them alerted to me. Can't speak for everyone else's experience, but for me I know without a doubt those products work if applied properly.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: 92xj on September 28, 2017, 11:35:10 AM
I dip alfalfa
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: BULLBLASTER on September 28, 2017, 11:59:26 AM
I think that the scent control products can help to a point. I do a pretty rigorous scent control protocol before I climb into a blind or stand hunting Whitetail's. If I am backpacking or hiking enough to break a sweat, then all the products are usuless.
I also won't sit in my whitetail stands with a bad wind. No matter what scent control you do with sprays or wips or detergent it won't eliminate all of your odors. But if it helps a bit and can buy me a few seconds that may be just enough to seal the deal.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Eric M on September 28, 2017, 12:29:40 PM
I think Mythbusters answered this pretty well. They had a guy in a protective suit and boots and everything. The dog smelled him easily. I have heard (for bear hunting at least) to chew mint gum. That hasn't worked so far this year haha. I used to bag my clothes up with vegetation and use special detergent and dryer sheets. I think I felt more confident but I don't think I was fooling anyone or anything else.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: fishnfur on September 28, 2017, 01:11:18 PM
There are times when you just can't use the wind to your advantage. 


.......Any pattern a hunter can predict about an animal is a huge advantage.  I'd do my usual and post a corroborating/example story or two but am giving away too much hard learned info already!


Quit being a tease Okanagan.  Give up the goods!
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: fishnfur on September 28, 2017, 01:38:59 PM
... an interesting idea from last year came from one of the members who mentioned that he could walk through the woods in his (loggers) work clothes which were covered in bar/chain oil and not startle the deer he encountered. 

Western WA commercial forests are literally covered in the stuff.  Questions remain whether those deer:

1) associate the smell of the oil as normal non-threatening smell
2) associate the smell of oil on people in the woods to mean they're not out there hunting for deer
or 3) have their olfactory senses overwhelmed by the smell of the oil

Does any of this matter?  Is bar and chain oil an effective scent control?  How would your spouse like it if you came home smelling of oil instead of deer urine?  :yike:

Also, has anyone researched the science behind scent?  I have tried.  The best explanation I've seen was that scent particles literally fall off us as we walk through the woods.  Perhaps it is dead skin cells or some such thing, but the fact that a deer can smell that you walked down a trail (and touched nothing) hours or days after the fact tells me that there's something to this idea.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: boneaddict on September 28, 2017, 01:47:57 PM
I think Mythbusters answered this pretty well. They had a guy in a protective suit and boots and everything. The dog smelled him easily. I have heard (for bear hunting at least) to chew mint gum. That hasn't worked so far this year haha. I used to bag my clothes up with vegetation and use special detergent and dryer sheets. I think I felt more confident but I don't think I was fooling anyone or anything else.

No, you chew bacon 🥓
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: tonymiller7 on September 28, 2017, 03:38:13 PM
Tried nose jammer once, and I spooked every whitetail deer that got even remotely close to me.  The smell of that crap is way too strong.  I found it to be a total detourant.


Thanks, I'll check 'em out.  In the mean time .........
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: CJ1962 on September 28, 2017, 04:36:38 PM
I wonder if deer smell that way.  If so, all of the cover scents would be completely worthless.

According to the pod cast deer sense of smell is like a dogs.  So if you use a cover scent they smell the cover scent and you.  If you spilled gasoline on yourself, they would smell gasoline and you.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: CJ1962 on September 28, 2017, 04:41:25 PM
I think Mythbusters answered this pretty well. They had a guy in a protective suit and boots and everything. The dog smelled him easily. I have heard (for bear hunting at least) to chew mint gum. That hasn't worked so far this year haha. I used to bag my clothes up with vegetation and use special detergent and dryer sheets. I think I felt more confident but I don't think I was fooling anyone or anything else.
They talk about this as well in the podcast.  Discovery took the show down from their website based on a threat of lawsuit from Scent Locker.  They also talk about a lawsuit that Scent Locker won (on appeal) against some hunters from Minnesota.  And a study that Rutgers University as part of that lawsuit.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Okanagan on September 28, 2017, 05:03:04 PM
The last two deer I harvested were shot with my scent carrying directly toward the animal (bow and muzzy). One from a few years ago was with a group of 5 other bucks and none of them alerted to me. Can't speak for everyone else's experience, but for me I know without a doubt those products work if applied properly.

I have shot a lot of game downwind of me, where I wanted them to be, with bow and rifle.  I don't use scent stuff and don't bother with my super clean natural scent efforts anymore. This is getting into the tease stuff that fishnfur ribbed me about.   :)  I'm not saying that your scent control did not work, merely that there may be another explanation for shooting an animal directly downwind other than that he did not smell you.  The fact is that you shot it downwind of you. The hows and whys and whether the animal could or did smell you are speculation, including my comments.

Re scent of oil, gasoline and loggers:  a faller friend on the Peninsula told me that every day when he fired up his chainsaw several blacktails showed up, including some bucks, and they followed him around to get the moss that grows in treetops.  Deer love it, and a faller serves it up more consistently than wind storms do.  A faller on the east side Okanogen many years ago told me the same about mule deer in one place he worked.  That's a sometimes thing with loggers and fallers, not always.

 
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Stein on September 28, 2017, 05:03:46 PM
I wonder if deer smell that way.  If so, all of the cover scents would be completely worthless.

According to the pod cast deer sense of smell is like a dogs.  So if you use a cover scent they smell the cover scent and you.  If you spilled gasoline on yourself, they would smell gasoline and you.

That's what I figured, the nature equivalent of someone dropping the bomb and then spraying spring lilac over the top of it.  Nobody is fooled.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Seabass on September 28, 2017, 05:30:41 PM
The assumption that an animal downwind of you is going to have your scent blow directly into a place he can smell you is purely assumptive. When I'm in my stand and bored enough to jab a broad head into my jugular; I will often times pick out fluff from my fleece and let it ride the wind....tracking it as far as I can see it. It's amazing where that fluff will end up.

Obviously scent is going to spread the farther away it gets, it will also dissipate, fluff doesn't spread but it always amazes me where it ends up even when it seems that it would obviously go one way or the other.
Being elevated changes everything as well...so there is that to consider as well.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Eric M on September 28, 2017, 07:09:00 PM
I think Mythbusters answered this pretty well. They had a guy in a protective suit and boots and everything. The dog smelled him easily. I have heard (for bear hunting at least) to chew mint gum. That hasn't worked so far this year haha. I used to bag my clothes up with vegetation and use special detergent and dryer sheets. I think I felt more confident but I don't think I was fooling anyone or anything else.

No, you chew bacon 🥓
Well now I know what I've been doing wrong haha
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: OutHouse on September 29, 2017, 11:01:03 AM
The last two deer I harvested were shot with my scent carrying directly toward the animal (bow and muzzy). One from a few years ago was with a group of 5 other bucks and none of them alerted to me. Can't speak for everyone else's experience, but for me I know without a doubt those products work if applied properly.

I have shot a lot of game downwind of me, where I wanted them to be, with bow and rifle.  I don't use scent stuff and don't bother with my super clean natural scent efforts anymore. This is getting into the tease stuff that fishnfur ribbed me about.   :)  I'm not saying that your scent control did not work, merely that there may be another explanation for shooting an animal directly downwind other than that he did not smell you.  The fact is that you shot it downwind of you. The hows and whys and whether the animal could or did smell you are speculation, including my comments.

Re scent of oil, gasoline and loggers:  a faller friend on the Peninsula told me that every day when he fired up his chainsaw several blacktails showed up, including some bucks, and they followed him around to get the moss that grows in treetops.  Deer love it, and a faller serves it up more consistently than wind storms do.  A faller on the east side Okanogen many years ago told me the same about mule deer in one place he worked.  That's a sometimes thing with loggers and fallers, not always.

That's a good point. I actually cannot be certain that it was the scent control stuff that helped me on those hunts. There's just way too many factors. However, with regard to the harvest where 5 other bucks were present, I shot the deer at about 8 yards with a bow. The bucks were in a line following one another with my scent pushing right toward them. In that specific instance, I have a hard time believing the scent control didn't work because of the close proximity with many animals present. Another reason I use it is because where I hunt it tends to have a pattern of swirling winds and gusts that push the scent all over the place. A directional, prevailing wind can be rare so I think it's a good area to use scent control.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: OutHouse on September 29, 2017, 11:02:20 AM
The assumption that an animal downwind of you is going to have your scent blow directly into a place he can smell you is purely assumptive. When I'm in my stand and bored enough to jab a broad head into my jugular; I will often times pick out fluff from my fleece and let it ride the wind....tracking it as far as I can see it. It's amazing where that fluff will end up.

Obviously scent is going to spread the farther away it gets, it will also dissipate, fluff doesn't spread but it always amazes me where it ends up even when it seems that it would obviously go one way or the other.
Being elevated changes everything as well...so there is that to consider as well.

Agreed. I cannot be certain but I like to think the stuff works!
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Deerelk37 on September 29, 2017, 12:36:08 PM
IMO you can't beat a buck or bulls nose. That being said-I'm going to always use some kind of scent control. It may do nothing, so play the wind. However, if it buys me one second on even one encounter, then it's all worth it.  :twocents:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: luvmystang67 on September 29, 2017, 01:14:09 PM
The one thing that I feel like really does work is the ozonics.  If you get ozone in your nose you can't smell anything else, it almost kind of hurts.  Hunting whitetails in Texas, I was NEVER winded with bucks coming from downwind when running the ozonics.  I didn't get winded every time when I ignored scent control, but it did happen probably 50% of the time.  I think being up in a tree helped carry scent over their heads in a lot of cases. 

Otherwise, I've seen the field and stream articles.  We flat stink.  You can't wrap your whole body in a garbage bag and eliminate scent.  I truly believe that an animal like a deer or dog will smell you whether you're covered in deer pee, bar oil, you're own sweat or your deodorant.

Last weekend I watched a cow elk walk by me in wide open timber at 10 yards, I had no scent control, hadn't showered or brushed my teeth, and was wearing old spice original scent.  She walked roughly downwind of me, nothing.  She passed DIRECTLY downwind of me, I watched her nostrils flare and she bolted.  I think even with a full suit of scentlock and pine needles I would've seen the same result there.  Due to her proximity, she had to be directly downwind to smell anything, and when she got there I'm sure it was pungent. 

The best part about scent control is that you're playing to something that cannot be proven and that people have firm beliefs about.  We should really all be in the scent control space.  My personal belief is that you stink, you can't help it, and you either play the wind or lose.  Any grace you get with an animal moving downwind is likely to occur with or without pine needle scent.

Rant over.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: bigmacc on September 29, 2017, 03:12:51 PM
Heres a story of why I put no thought into ever using or spending money on scent control products.....Bone, you know this area I,m talking about :tup:....Late 1950,s my mom and dad were in one of our haunts that is A-a migration route, B-thick,dark and steep, and C-THICK,DARK and STEEP! They had made a make-shift ground blind out of pine bows, limbs and brush next to a blow down. The blind was maybe 30 to 40 feet off of a trail that was being very well used (by the tracks that were in the fresh3" of snow that fell 2 days earlier) my dad figured more were on their way. They settled in, covered themselves good with the foliage  and my mom had her 30-30 ready to go. About an hour after day light my dad had "that feeling" something was watching him(that feeling we have all had at one time or another) but could not see anything.They did not have a lot of visibility in this area because of the "jungle" they were in.My dad whispered to my mom to "not move and be ready". A few minutes passed and my dad SLOWELY turned his head to his left(my mom was sitting on his right), a tank of a heavy horned muley had his face in the blind sniffing my dad, when my dad seen him they were looking each other in the eyes from about a foot apart! The encounter scared the crap out of both of them, the buck blew snot on my dad and jumped about 15 feet in one hop, walked another few steps, turned and stood broadside to them. My dad whispered to my mom"there he is, drop him", my mom in a frenzy had already put the crosshairs on the big fella and was ejecting rounds like the Chuck Connors the Rifleman, the only problem was the "buck fever" had hit so bad she had forgotten to pull the trigger :chuckle:, 5 perfectly shiny, pristine and un-fired 30-30 rounds lay on the ground as the monster disappeared with one more jump and then crashed into that hell hole.....oh the good old days :tup:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: bigmacc on September 29, 2017, 05:27:25 PM
The jist of the above story is my mom and dad both wore Black Bear wool coats back in the day that had been wore around campfires, used during fishing trips from Alaska, B.C, Washington, wore to shovel snow up in Bellingham, change oil in trucks and probably had a few baby's spit up on them, heck my dad would let our dog lay on them during cold camping trips! They had them for years(great coats!) and used and abused them, they had all kinds of smells and scents on them. Didn't seem to bother the deer, they killed a ton of them, heck maybe all those "smells" on those coats had them deer completely baffled and they had to move closer to find out exactly what it was :chuckle:..
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: fishnfur on September 29, 2017, 09:02:05 PM
Thanks for givin' it up Okanagan.  I don't care what these guys say about you.  I like ya!  :chuckle:

I listened to the Podcasts yesterday.  After the first in the series, I pretty much skipped everything John Eberhart said.  He's clearly on the Scentlock payroll, and is so extreme in his scent control that I couldn't even imagine trying to attain his hermetically sealed approach to hunting.  I pretty much fast forwarded through his interviews about activated carbon.

The interviews with Dan Infalt were really interesting and entirely worth listening to.  I recommend everyone give his interview sections a listen.  He discusses many of the things that have been noted on this thread,especially swirling and multi-directional winds.  Okanagan - this guy seems to think like you.  He hunts dirty but plays the wind well. I was so impressed, I went to Amazon and purchased one of his DVDs on how he hunts big WT bucks in their beds.

Good thread!
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: LEN on September 30, 2017, 09:35:23 AM
Have you ever smelled a smoker long before you came to them or them to you? Humans breath is that bad so cover scent and breathe through a filter. I just roll in the hay for cover scent and not the bailed type.

LEN
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Miles on September 30, 2017, 10:05:03 AM
Without reading all two pages, here's my opinion.  You could use every product marketed in the scent control hunting world of 2017, or you could just watch the wind...   I could scent myself up with all kinds of "human odors" and still get within bow range if I pay attention to the wind.


Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: pope on September 30, 2017, 09:48:46 PM
I don't have years of experience on which to base my opinion, but I have watched two bucks in two consecutive years approach my tree stand from down wind. I assume they were traveling into the wind because of the deer urine I sprayed on the ground, and I am also confident they didn't detect my odor because I was 20 feet up a tree. I should have tagged them both but I only killed the 2nd one. Outside of showering and wearing clean clothes, the only precaution I regularly practice is wearing gloves while climbing into the tree stand. Also, I approach the stand wearing almost nothing so I don't sweat (and I maintain great cardio-vascular fitness all year), then I put on everything I need to be "comfortable" for many hours.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: 3dvapor on September 30, 2017, 10:46:54 PM
I work in the high tech industry.  We lose millions and millions of skin particles a day.  we where special clean room suits to protect the micro chips from Contamination.   These same particles are what the deer and elk pick up.   Unless you put a gortex clean room suit on and respirator on they will smell you.  Keep the wind in your face and you will have better success.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: PolarBear on October 01, 2017, 09:57:19 AM
Hunting in the rain helps keep your scent from traveling as far.  A lot of the places I like to hunt it are almost impossible or completely impractical to get into without the wind being at your back.  It's just the lay of the land and that is why the critters are in there.  Those folks who's only answer is to "play the wind" must pass up on a lot of good spots.   :chuckle:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: boneaddict on October 01, 2017, 10:42:35 AM
You know better than that PB
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: fishnfur on October 01, 2017, 11:19:38 AM
I might be off base, but I think his point was that you're going to have to accept the fact that you'll blow out some areas (hunting with bad wind) as you work your way into the spots where the big boys are.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Cylvertip on October 01, 2017, 12:30:04 PM
 :twocents: You cant always play the wind.  I take scent control way to seriously, I know that. 

However, I have very high confidence in animals not detecting me, or at least not detecting me enough to be scared off by my scent.   I have very carefully walked through the middle of a feeding elk herd (20 plus animals) in a clear cut in the Winston during early archery with numerous animals inside 20 yards and the closest being 5yds(which I have pictures of).  All was fine until the battery went dead in my camera and it started beeping.  Prior to that,  the animals knew I was there, but they did not feel I posed a threat.  Many more stories like this with elk, deer, and bear, but this one is the best example I think.

In addition to scent control, I think UV control plays a role.  I use Sport Wash and UV killer on all of my clothes.

I will do whatever I can to up my odds. 
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: PolarBear on October 01, 2017, 01:25:22 PM
You know better than that PB
:chuckle:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: HunterofWA on October 02, 2017, 04:50:00 PM
Has anybody tried this? https://www.labproven.com/
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on October 02, 2017, 06:07:13 PM
Has anybody tried this? https://www.labproven.com/

Typically something that removes scent leaves scent if ever so slightly right?  :dunno:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Alchase on October 02, 2017, 07:15:22 PM
We just need to go back to our roots and learn from other animals. No predator wears phony charcoal impregnated clothing or the latest and greatest anti-stink spray that is only good at separating hunters from their money. We should learn our lesson from the Scent lock lawsuits and the Doe urine controversy.
But if you really do want to spend some money, I am thinking of starting a new product called “Clean Air” you can buy it by the bottle and when you want to de-stinkify just open the bottle and pour “Clean Air” on you.
Lifetime Garuntee !!
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: pope on October 02, 2017, 09:03:26 PM
:twocents: You cant always play the wind.  I take scent control way to seriously, I know that. 

However, I have very high confidence in animals not detecting me, or at least not detecting me enough to be scared off by my scent.   I have very carefully walked through the middle of a feeding elk herd (20 plus animals) in a clear cut in the Winston during early archery with numerous animals inside 20 yards and the closest being 5yds(which I have pictures of).  All was fine until the battery went dead in my camera and it started beeping.  Prior to that,  the animals knew I was there, but they did not feel I posed a threat.  Many more stories like this with elk, deer, and bear, but this one is the best example I think.

In addition to scent control, I think UV control plays a role.  I use Sport Wash and UV killer on all of my clothes.

I will do whatever I can to up my odds.

We hear the argument that the elimination of scent is not possible, so why bother? But what about reduction of scent? If reducing scent fools the deer's nose into thinking you are not a close threat, then maybe it's worth the effort.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Alchase on October 03, 2017, 09:45:15 AM
:twocents: You cant always play the wind.  I take scent control way to seriously, I know that. 

However, I have very high confidence in animals not detecting me, or at least not detecting me enough to be scared off by my scent.   I have very carefully walked through the middle of a feeding elk herd (20 plus animals) in a clear cut in the Winston during early archery with numerous animals inside 20 yards and the closest being 5yds(which I have pictures of).  All was fine until the battery went dead in my camera and it started beeping.  Prior to that,  the animals knew I was there, but they did not feel I posed a threat.  Many more stories like this with elk, deer, and bear, but this one is the best example I think.

In addition to scent control, I think UV control plays a role.  I use Sport Wash and UV killer on all of my clothes.

I will do whatever I can to up my odds.

We hear the argument that the elimination of scent is not possible, so why bother? But what about reduction of scent? If reducing scent fools the deer's nose into thinking you are not a close threat, then maybe it's worth the effort.

I think the issue is if any product sold, actually does as advertised and reduces or eliminates scent.

I have seen no scientific evidence that any work.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: PolarBear on October 03, 2017, 12:18:48 PM
Let me 'splain it dis way.  If you are sitting on the sidelines during a game and there are 2 guys that are all sweaty and nasty.  One is using deodorant and the other none.  You will smell the one without far sooner than the guy that is.  Even if there is a breeze the guy without's stank will be much more prevalent and stronger than the other.  Neither smells good but one aint as nasty.  :chuckle:  I think scent control products reduce your smell therefore making the intensity less and travel a shorter distance before becoming diluted I hate to admit it but I have inherited that "old man smell" from my Dad and Grandpa.  When I use scent "eliminating" products, even after a long day of hiking my wife notices a huge difference in the amount of old man funk.  In fact, sometimes she does not smell it at all.  I know an animal has much better sniffer but it does pass the old lady test and that's proof enough for me.   :chuckle:
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: HunterofWA on October 06, 2017, 10:53:21 AM
 :yeah: I understand that you can't eliminate but it might make the deer less alarmed by the human scent if it isn't so strong.
Title: Re: Scent Control Debate
Post by: Skyvalhunter on October 06, 2017, 12:01:34 PM
The deer and elk are already on alarm with the wolves, cougar, and bears around