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Community => Butchering, Cooking, Recipes => Topic started by: merkaba93 on March 05, 2018, 05:40:50 PM

Title: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 05, 2018, 05:40:50 PM
I thought id ask, see if there is some cool stuff out there and maybe steal some ideas.
At the moment I have going, fish sauce, soy sauce, Brussels sprouts, white wine vinegar. I just finished a batch of kimchi and kraut. I also just created a sourdough starter. Going to tackle bread soon.
I don't have any cheese or salami going at the moment.
What are you guys doing?
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: onmygame on March 05, 2018, 06:24:11 PM
You are pretty brave with the fish sauce - though I don't know the environment you are letting it sit in. I do know that the typical environment where they let fish gut slurry sit and ferment from between months to years is usually 70+ degrees (if not 90+) and quite humid, and crocks sitting in the sun are the norm.

My apologies if I'm thinking of something different - either way, please be diligent.

We do kimchi on the regular (wife is Korean born and awesome at this) and have considered kraut as well as kosher dill pickles and a few pickled spiced items like asparagus spears and beets.

Even though these things are in our sights, seems that back burner runs cool as all get out.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Fl0und3rz on March 05, 2018, 06:38:12 PM
Love your threads.  I have not been brave enough to ferment, though kosher pickles and kraut would be first targets.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Twispriver on March 05, 2018, 06:55:22 PM
I pickle cukes, peppers and beans every year and I've been making and canning sauerkraut for several years. Most of the pickling is done in jars but I've also done the odd batch in the ceramic crock and I always use the crock for sauerkraut but I'd like to try some in an oak barrel.
If it's a good fruit or berry year I've made all different kinds of wine and mead and in my younger days I got pretty good at fermenting different grain mashes for homemade whiskey.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 05, 2018, 07:16:44 PM
You are pretty brave with the fish sauce - though I don't know the environment you are letting it sit in. I do know that the typical environment where they let fish gut slurry sit and ferment from between months to years is usually 70+ degrees (if not 90+) and quite humid, and crocks sitting in the sun are the norm.

My apologies if I'm thinking of something different - either way, please be diligent.

We do kimchi on the regular (wife is Korean born and awesome at this) and have considered kraut as well as kosher dill pickles and a few pickled spiced items like asparagus spears and beets.

Even though these things are in our sights, seems that back burner runs cool as all get out.

Nope you are correct. Whole anchovies and 25% by weight sea salt added. Mix and wait. I have a bucket with a fermentation top. Though science shows there really isn't a lot of fermentation going on, just some of the gastrointestinal enzymes breaking down solids. Otherwise it's just the salt pulling liquid out of the fish.
Dude, I get it, I find my projects are kinda spotty at times.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 05, 2018, 07:18:42 PM
Love your threads.  I have not been brave enough to ferment, though kosher pickles and kraut would be first targets.

There is nothing easier than Kraut. You should really try it. Shave cabbage. Add pure sea salt (no anti caking agent) a tbs at a time and massage until you have enough brine to cover the cabbage as you move it to your fermentation vessel. I usually keep a leaf whole to leave on top so that if it ends up exposed to air it will go bad not the kraut. Remember lactic acid fermentation is going to create some gas, so everything is going to want to rise to the top. And it needs to stay submerged! Anaerobic environment. You can also buy weights to keep it all down. Let it set until it's a sour as you like. I like 8 days. 
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 05, 2018, 07:19:57 PM
I pickle cukes, peppers and beans every year and I've been making and canning sauerkraut for several years. Most of the pickling is done in jars but I've also done the odd batch in the ceramic crock and I always use the crock for sauerkraut but I'd like to try some in an oak barrel.
If it's a good fruit or berry year I've made all different kinds of wine and mead and in my younger days I got pretty good at fermenting different grain mashes for homemade whiskey.

Homemade whiskey? That's cool, tell me some more about that!
And what kind of peppers are we talking? Bell? Habenero?
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: KFhunter on March 05, 2018, 07:23:03 PM
I'm fermenting kombucha


but I'd like to do kraut one of these days, and maybe kimchi although i don't like Asian food much I do eat that if it's good.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: JimmyHoffa on March 05, 2018, 07:26:16 PM
Is there much difference between the oriental fish sauce and the roman fish sauce?
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: AL WORRELLS KID on March 06, 2018, 10:25:41 AM
We love to make Kim-chi, Sauerkraut and Sourdough for our Bread Machine, Pancakes and Biscuits (although I have yet to try them all mixed altogether.)  ;)
If you don't want to experiment, you might want to try buying "OlyKraut", (it's not your normal Sauerkraut) that's for sure.
 Doug
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: magnanimous_j on March 06, 2018, 10:37:14 AM
Is there much difference between the oriental fish sauce and the roman fish sauce?

Supposedly they are very similar. Roman garum was usually more heavily herbed, but there were many fish sauces that were under the umbrella term of garum. But it was the same basic concept: salt, fish guts and time.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Whitpirate on March 06, 2018, 10:39:03 AM
Love your threads.  I have not been brave enough to ferment, though kosher pickles and kraut would be first targets.

There is nothing easier than Kraut. You should really try it. Shave cabbage. Add pure sea salt (no anti caking agent) a tbs at a time and massage until you have enough brine to cover the cabbage as you move it to your fermentation vessel. I usually keep a leaf whole to leave on top so that if it ends up exposed to air it will go bad not the kraut. Remember lactic acid fermentation is going to create some gas, so everything is going to want to rise to the top. And it needs to stay submerged! Anaerobic environment. You can also buy weights to keep it all down. Let it set until it's a sour as you like. I like 8 days.

I make a fair bit of kraut and can it for use through the winter, garlic and dill beans/asparagus and I make a fresh kimchee but I'm starting to play around with kombucha and other fermented drinks.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 06, 2018, 02:05:20 PM
Is there much difference between the oriental fish sauce and the roman fish sauce?

Supposedly they are very similar. Roman garum was usually more heavily herbed, but there were many fish sauces that were under the umbrella term of garum. But it was the same basic concept: salt, fish guts and time.

Yeah, there can be some aeromatics added to the sauce to change the flavor. I feel like that was done more in garum than in Vietnamese or Thai fish sauce. Heck even worcestershire sauce is partly a fish sauce.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: boneaddict on March 06, 2018, 02:11:39 PM
Playing with Kvass now.   its more or less in the idea stage. 
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: NRA4LIFE on March 06, 2018, 02:50:04 PM
We make kraut every year in the fall.  We've been experimenting with things other than cabbage too.  Kohlrabi works great, it has a slightly different flavor than cabbage.  Adding some grated carrots gives any kraut a nice color and slightly different taste as well.

We also started dabbling in fermented pickles, using no vinegar.  I think some people call them Water Pickles.  You use only water and canning salt.  They have a slightly different flavor than vinegar pickles but are very tasty. 
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Calvin Rayborn on March 06, 2018, 07:44:31 PM
Ain't' Bea's PICKLES. MMMMM!!! SO GOOD!!!!  :puke: :puke: cough...

Oh, I'm so glad you like them, boys! I'll make a whole mess of some more for ya!!!  :yike:
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: NOCK NOCK on March 06, 2018, 09:14:34 PM
Well as a matter of fact I am in the process of fermenting right now..............my liver.  :chuckle: :chuckle: :brew:

Sorry, couldn't resist
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Calvin Rayborn on March 06, 2018, 10:40:26 PM
Well as a matter of fact I am in the process of fermenting right now..............my liver.  :chuckle: :chuckle: :brew:

Sorry, couldn't resist

BWAAAHAHA!  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Calvin Rayborn on March 06, 2018, 10:49:07 PM
Honestly I do enjoy a good dill or two every now and then with a grilled cheese sand; never knew that you could actually make fermented pickles at home. Heck Iíd give em a try, long as they donít taste like KEROSENE like aunt Beaís did!  :tup:  :chuckle:

https://www.makesauerkraut.com/fermented-pickles/
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: PolarBear on March 07, 2018, 12:02:22 AM
Yeah, I ferment corn, barley, rye, red wheat and yeast.  ;)
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: nwwanderer on March 07, 2018, 06:41:36 AM
PolarBear, might add triticale to that list.  Our DNS, dark northern spring, from 2017 might ferment above average.  The silage guys make us all look like amateurs, thousands of tons to keep those milk tanks full
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: PolarBear on March 07, 2018, 09:27:53 AM
 :tup:
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: AL WORRELLS KID on March 07, 2018, 10:24:58 AM
Sourdough Starter is easier to keep and use than you might think.
We keep ours in a old butter tub in the fridge and try to use it every couple of months by adding it (the night before baking with it) to a couple cups of warm water mixed with a can of evaporated milk and as much white flour as it takes to make it look like thick pancake batter. That's it nothing else. In the morning after it has bubbled all night, we take out a cup of starter and return it to the fridge for future use, then usually make Pancakes or Biscuits and throw some in our bread machine to add a little kick to the English Muffin Bread.
The dark liquid that you might find on top of your Starter is a form of naturally-occurring alcohol known as "Hooch", which indicates that your sourdough starter is hungry. Hooch is harmless but should be poured off and discarded prior to stirring and feeding your starter. If hooch is forming on your starter regularly, increase the feeding frequency and/or move the starter to a cooler spot (like the fridge) to slow things down.
Doug
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 08, 2018, 04:58:23 PM
Sourdough Starter is easier to keep and use than you might think.
We keep ours in a old butter tub in the fridge and try to use it every couple of months by adding it (the night before baking with it) to a couple cups of warm water mixed with a can of evaporated milk and as much white flour as it takes to make it look like thick pancake batter. That's it nothing else. In the morning after it has bubbled all night, we take out a cup of starter and return it to the fridge for future use, then usually make Pancakes or Biscuits and throw some in our bread machine to add a little kick to the English Muffin Bread.
The dark liquid that you might find on top of your Starter is a form of naturally-occurring alcohol known as "Hooch", which indicates that your sourdough starter is hungry. Hooch is harmless but should be poured off and discarded prior to stirring and feeding your starter. If hooch is forming on your starter regularly, increase the feeding frequency and/or move the starter to a cooler spot (like the fridge) to slow things down.
Doug

I bought the book Flour Water Salt Yeast by Ken Forkish years back and just never decided to tackle making bread. I used that cookbook mostly for pizza dough recipes to play around with. He also put out a book recently The Elements of Pizza, tons of good stuff in there for anyone looking to make some good pizza. But there is a ton of info in the first book on sourdough and you're right it's not really all that hard to keep your starter going. Right now mine is sitting in the fridge. Going to wake it up Friday and bake Sunday!
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: AL WORRELLS KID on March 08, 2018, 09:16:01 PM
Thanks, merkaba93
I'll have to order that book online in the used books section, it sounds like good reading.

Here is the English Muffin Bread Recipe we enjoy making in our bread machine.
 
1 Cup Water
2 1/2 Cups Bread Flour
2/3 tsp Salt
1/8 tsp Baking Soda
2 TBSP Nonfat Powdered Milk
1 1/2 tsp yeast
Add to Bread Machine in the order given (and bake as for white bread).
(We like to cut back on the water and add a Cup of Sourdough Starter to kick up the flavor).
This recipe makes for Great "Crunchy" Toast......enjoy! (Okay to "Double" the recipe if your Bread Machine is big enough)

Doug
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 11, 2018, 11:46:53 PM
My first sourdough. Went well with some razor clam chowder.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on March 11, 2018, 11:52:37 PM
Some of the other fermenting projects. The aforementioned fish sauce, brussel sprouts, white wine vinegar and soy sauce.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: AL WORRELLS KID on March 12, 2018, 09:57:40 AM
Wow merkaba93, you are a lot more daring than I am, quite a variety of pots you have bubbling.
I love the looks of your Sourdough Bread, makes me want to take mine out of the bread machine while it's still dough and bake it like you did! Mom's clam chowder recipe would really go good with that.
Thanks for the great pictures. Doug
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on August 12, 2018, 04:24:55 PM
Finished Fish sauce. Waited about 10 months. Mostly anchovies but some tuna and salmon scrapes from fish I've caught. I have more Thai and Vietnamese food in my future.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: PolarBear on August 13, 2018, 03:48:44 PM
My wife is fermenting sweet pickles in a crock.  The whole process takes about a month and she has to do something with it every day.  Afterwards she is trying sauerkraut.  Mmmmmmmm....
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Bullkllr on August 13, 2018, 04:42:58 PM
I started making sauerkraut a couple months ago. I can't keep up with the demand, so I'm going to make bigger batches. It is so much better than any store-bought kraut I've had it seems like an entirely different food. Good stuff.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on August 13, 2018, 05:45:35 PM
I started making sauerkraut a couple months ago. I can't keep up with the demand, so I'm going to make bigger batches. It is so much better than any store-bought kraut I've had it seems like an entirely different food. Good stuff.

Doing stuff yourself always is better! Glad to hear it man. How big of a batch are we talking? Started any different flavors? Apple Caraway? Use purple cabbage for blackkraut? Or added a tad of sugar for the lactobacillus to feed off of to make it even more sour?
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: Bullkllr on August 16, 2018, 05:05:26 PM
I started making sauerkraut a couple months ago. I can't keep up with the demand, so I'm going to make bigger batches. It is so much better than any store-bought kraut I've had it seems like an entirely different food. Good stuff.

Doing stuff yourself always is better! Glad to hear it man. How big of a batch are we talking? Started any different flavors? Apple Caraway? Use purple cabbage for blackkraut? Or added a tad of sugar for the lactobacillus to feed off of to make it even more sour?

I made my first two batches in a 2.5 quart jar. 1st batch was just cabbage and salt. 2nd batch I added fresh garlic. I have a double batch fermenting now- 2 of those 2.5 quart jars- 1 straight kraut, 1 garlic.

I figured I'd start slow. My first attempts were tasty and went quickly. Next step is to add some variety. I like the sound of the apple and caraway kraut- I know caraway pairs with cabbage well and we have a ton of apples right now. Thanks for the encouragement.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: shallowforks on August 16, 2018, 05:22:35 PM
I ferment Kraut, Pickles, salsa, garlic and have even fermented my deer livers. Love fermented food and like you said the fermented kraut tastes waaaaay better. I do plain kraut with juice from my fermented garlic as a starter and jalepeno kraut. For my salsa I use a whey starter that I make from plain yogurt. The garlic is pretty easy to do, just cover in salt water and room temp for couple weeks. It goes good with just about anything. salads, stuffed olives, just about anything. the pickles I do garlic dill, and the deer liver I chop super fine and add rosemary and raisins to feed the lactobacilli, and a whey starter. All of this I make during the summer and store refrigerated through the next spring.
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: merkaba93 on August 17, 2018, 02:24:50 PM
I ferment Kraut, Pickles, salsa, garlic and have even fermented my deer livers. Love fermented food and like you said the fermented kraut tastes waaaaay better. I do plain kraut with juice from my fermented garlic as a starter and jalepeno kraut. For my salsa I use a whey starter that I make from plain yogurt. The garlic is pretty easy to do, just cover in salt water and room temp for couple weeks. It goes good with just about anything. salads, stuffed olives, just about anything. the pickles I do garlic dill, and the deer liver I chop super fine and add rosemary and raisins to feed the lactobacilli, and a whey starter. All of this I make during the summer and store refrigerated through the next spring.

The liver technique sounds interesting. Does the liver turn out a bit more sour?
Title: Re: Anyone ferment?
Post by: shallowforks on August 18, 2018, 11:36:54 AM
yes it gets tart with the lactic acid from the lacto. You can control this somewhat with the amount of chopped dry fruit you add. I usually add more as it ages to keep it a little sweet as I consume it. Havent tried it but dried apricots could really shine in this recipe