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Author Topic: BLM land grab in Nevada  (Read 2532 times)

Offline JLS

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #25 on: April 13, 2014, 06:24:30 AM »

I don't think $1.35 per AUM is very obnoxious.  There is a reason why these grazing leases are highly sought after.


The BLM fees are " a minimum of $1.35 per head per month". http://www.blm.gov/wo/st/en/prog/grazing.html

BLM says Bundy has 900 cattle. That equals $1200/month. He has not paid in 20 years. So theoretically that is $291,000.  But, the BLM says he owes more than $1 million. So I guess his fees are more than $1.35. More like $5 or $4500/month. That starts to sound pretty unreasonable to me since he is also responsible for his own water and fencing.


Look it up or call any office.  Federal grazing fees are $1.35 per AUM.
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Offline buckmaster_wa

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #26 on: April 13, 2014, 06:53:28 AM »
The reason he owes so much is because of the fines and penaltys for not paying over the last 20 years.

Offline smittyJ

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #27 on: April 13, 2014, 07:00:54 AM »
Since when is it my choice as a tenant to tell how my rental fee is spent? 

Should I pay my mortgage payment to Avista because I don't like how my bank spends the money?

If he doesn't like it he can lease pasture elsewhere, and pay a much higher rate.
Depends on your contract. His fees were to go for BLM management of the wild horse population because of potential over grazing (what they are acusing him of) and when they stopped he tried to pay his fees to the county. The County also has plans via the Reid/Chine deal for a Solar site in the area.

Offline smittyJ

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #28 on: April 13, 2014, 07:02:55 AM »
As a % of total, my understanding is that Nevada has the most land under federal "stewardship" of all the states in the west.
Kalifornia is close, Alaska by far the most!

Offline Sitka_Blacktail

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #29 on: April 13, 2014, 07:23:35 AM »
It probably got to a million dollars due to compounding interest.  :dunno:

I doubt his debt to the government is interest free.

I did see an article that mentioned interest and penalties. If those are anywhere close to what the IRS charges, it could get up to a million $ fast.
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Offline Runamuck

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #30 on: April 13, 2014, 07:57:48 AM »
Thankfully a rare common sense decision has been made by the government to get those arm agents out of there.
I don't know enough facts to pick a side on this but I do feel the government was handling it very poorly and it was beginning to look like another Ruby Ridge, Waco fiasco in the making.
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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #31 on: April 13, 2014, 08:04:02 AM »
As a % of total, my understanding is that Nevada has the most land under federal "stewardship" of all the states in the west.
Kalifornia is close, Alaska by far the most!

Read what Beancounter said, by percentage of state.  He is totally correct.

Nevada: 56,961,778 acres or 81% of the state
AK: 225,848,164 acres or 61.8 percent of the state his under federal ownership
CA: 47,797, 533 or 47.7%
WA: 12,173,813 or 28.5%

https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R42346.pdf

Offline Elkaholic daWg

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #32 on: April 13, 2014, 08:20:07 AM »
Thankfully a rare common sense decision has been made by the government to get those arm agents out of there.
I don't know enough facts to pick a side on this but I do feel the government was handling it very poorly and it was beginning to look like another Ruby Ridge, Waco fiasco in the making.
:yeah:

Harry Reid and Chinese solar investments in Nevada

On April 3, 3012, Bloomberg reported Chinese billionaire Wang Yusuo, one of China’s richest citizens and the founder of Chinese energy giant ENN Group, had teamed up with Senate Majority Leader Reid to win incentives including land 113 miles southeast of Las Vegas that ENN sought to buy for $4.5 million, less than one-eighth of the land’s $38.6 million assessed value.

Bloomberg reported ENN intended to create solar energy farms on the Nevada land, despite the nearly 50 percent plunge in solar panel prices globally in the previous 15 months that led to the bankruptcy of solar equipment maker Solyndra LLC, which had received approximately $535 million in U.S. government loan guarantees.

Bloomberg further documented ENN had contributed $40,650 individually and through its political action committee to Sen. Reid over the previous three election cycles.

Subsequently, on Sept. 4, 2012, Breitbart.com reported lawyer Rory Reid, the son of Sen. Reid, had been appointed the primary representative for ENN Energy Group, fronting the bid by the Chinese company to build a $5-billion solar panel plant on a 9,000-acre Clark County desert plot in Laughton, Nevada.

A Reuters report published on Aug. 31, 2012, documented that Reid was recruited by ENN during a 2011 trip he took to China with nine other U.S. senators, supposedly to invite Chinese investment in the United States.

The Senate group accompanying Reid on his 2011 trip to China included six other Democrats and three Republicans: Richard Shelby, R-Ala.; Barbara Boxer, D-Calif.; Dick Durbin, D-Ill.; Mike Enzi, R-Wyo.; Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y.; Frank Lautenberg, D-N.J.; Johnny Isakson, R-Ga.; Jeff Merkley, D-Ore.; and Michael Bennet, D-Colo.

“A tortoise isn’t the reason why BLM is harassing a 67-year-old rancher,” blogger Dana Loesch wrote last week. “They want his land.”


http://www.wnd.com/2014/04/reid-smelling-anything-but-rosy-in-ranch-fight/

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #34 on: April 13, 2014, 09:22:02 AM »
Bundy Ranch: This was a TEST, it was only a TEST

Posted on April 13, 2014 by TexasFred   
 

This is a message received from Doug Hagmann, the founder & director of the Northeast Intelligence Network . Doug is a published author with much of his work posted on Canada Free Press and he is a very reliable source of information. I have posted some of his work here on The TexasFred Blog in the past as well.

Big Eagle 1
Bundy Ranch far from free


From Doug Hagmann

At 1750 hours ET, I was contacted by my source within the Department of Homeland Security regarding the current situation at the Bundy Ranch. To put it bluntly, the people are being hoodwinked into believing that the situation is being resolved. It is not. It is a strategic de-escalation to fool the public. This source stated that the retreat of the BLM agents and the release of the cattle was actually crafted as a potential plan yesterday (Friday, 11 April 2014) based on the following:

1. A military assessment of satellite and drone surveillance imagery of the “patriot resistance. Drones under the control of the U.S. military were in use, taking real-time photographic images of not just the activity at the ranch, but “identifying the protesters, any arms and any supplies they might have or be carrying. “Mission accomplished.”

2. Real-time communication intercepts between patriots on-site and their off-site support;

3. Active monitoring of internet traffic regarding the coverage of events at ranch;

4. The monitoring of real-time video from the scene.

This source stated that a response by the patriot movement was anticipated, although exceeded their expectations. Although this was a real operation, they also ran this as a test case for future government operations once they saw the response. They were also actively managing the media, in some cases threatening to cut off White House access to anyone covering the event.

Despite this, the coverage by the alternative media began to create a public relations problem that was not easily managed. Note the lack of acknowledgment by the White House regarding this event. They are intentionally framing it as a state issue, despite the fact that all federal response has been and continues to be from the White House. There is a reason for this – a reason that has not been identified in any of the public reports to date.

I will explain in further detail in a follow-up report on Sunday, after this source attends [redacted] to obtain more specific information about future federal operations. Regardless, according to this source, the government will take back ‘their land’ as they must to fulfill international obligations.

It was never about grazing rights or anything other than (1) “securing clear title” to the land, and (2) further demonizing any patriotic resistance. It is my understanding, based on the information from this source, that it is a critical task to create a situation that will also advance their agenda of gun control and confiscation.

A more detailed report will follow on Sunday, 13 April 2014, with additional and much more specific information about their inside plans and future operations.

PLEASE MAKE THIS VIRAL!

Anyone that reads my blog knows that I am not some far right conspiracy nut, I don’t fall for much of what comes across the blog world, especially from people like Alex Jones and his network at PrisonPlanet and InfoWars, but I have to say this, Jones and his crew have been preaching that this was going to happen, and for a long time. Looks like they got this one right.

This Bundy Ranch episode is/was nothing more than a *test scenario*, one designed to show the Obama regime just how much resistance will be brought up, what weapons are possessed and to garner as many names and faces as possible.

Some are cheering, saying that Cliven Bundy won, but I have to tell you, Bundy did NOT win, this is not over, in fact, it is just now getting started. The American government is in the process of turning on the American people.

God help us all.
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Offline Knocker of rocks

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #35 on: April 13, 2014, 09:34:15 AM »
Bundy Ranch: This was a TEST, it was only a TEST

Posted on April 13, 2014 by TexasFred   
 

This is a message received from Doug Hagmann, the founder & director of the Northeast Intelligence Network . Doug is a published author with much of his work posted on Canada Free Press and he is a very reliable source of information. I have posted some of his work here on The TexasFred Blog in the past as well.

Big Eagle 1
Bundy Ranch far from free


From Doug Hagmann

At 1750 hours ET, I was contacted by my source within the Department of Homeland Security regarding the current situation at the Bundy Ranch. To put it bluntly, the people are being hoodwinked into believing that the situation is being resolved. It is not. It is a strategic de-escalation to fool the public. This source stated that the retreat of the BLM agents and the release of the cattle was actually crafted as a potential plan yesterday (Friday, 11 April 2014) based on the following:

1. A military assessment of satellite and drone surveillance imagery of the “patriot resistance. Drones under the control of the U.S. military were in use, taking real-time photographic images of not just the activity at the ranch, but “identifying the protesters, any arms and any supplies they might have or be carrying. “Mission accomplished.”

2. Real-time communication intercepts between patriots on-site and their off-site support;

3. Active monitoring of internet traffic regarding the coverage of events at ranch;

4. The monitoring of real-time video from the scene.

This source stated that a response by the patriot movement was anticipated, although exceeded their expectations. Although this was a real operation, they also ran this as a test case for future government operations once they saw the response. They were also actively managing the media, in some cases threatening to cut off White House access to anyone covering the event.

Despite this, the coverage by the alternative media began to create a public relations problem that was not easily managed. Note the lack of acknowledgment by the White House regarding this event. They are intentionally framing it as a state issue, despite the fact that all federal response has been and continues to be from the White House. There is a reason for this – a reason that has not been identified in any of the public reports to date.

I will explain in further detail in a follow-up report on Sunday, after this source attends [redacted] to obtain more specific information about future federal operations. Regardless, according to this source, the government will take back ‘their land’ as they must to fulfill international obligations.

It was never about grazing rights or anything other than (1) “securing clear title” to the land, and (2) further demonizing any patriotic resistance. It is my understanding, based on the information from this source, that it is a critical task to create a situation that will also advance their agenda of gun control and confiscation.

A more detailed report will follow on Sunday, 13 April 2014, with additional and much more specific information about their inside plans and future operations.

PLEASE MAKE THIS VIRAL!

Anyone that reads my blog knows that I am not some far right conspiracy nut, I don’t fall for much of what comes across the blog world, especially from people like Alex Jones and his network at PrisonPlanet and InfoWars, but I have to say this, Jones and his crew have been preaching that this was going to happen, and for a long time. Looks like they got this one right.

This Bundy Ranch episode is/was nothing more than a *test scenario*, one designed to show the Obama regime just how much resistance will be brought up, what weapons are possessed and to garner as many names and faces as possible.

Some are cheering, saying that Cliven Bundy won, but I have to tell you, Bundy did NOT win, this is not over, in fact, it is just now getting started. The American government is in the process of turning on the American people.

God help us all.

Yikes

Offline Naches Sportsman

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #36 on: April 13, 2014, 10:10:52 AM »
Where is Nevada? I am a young democrat who votes in the democrats because they are awesome. I live east of the Mississippi so who gives a crap about Nevada.  Harry Reid is Awesome because I live in Las Vegas. Again, Who gives a crap about Nevada, nothing is there.  great way for Chinese to invest in some solar power for us city slicker dems who don't give a crap about Americas history :rolleyes: :iamwithstupid: :stup:

It sounds like they are in a serious fight. hopefully they can still be able to be in business when all said in done.
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Offline Bean Counter

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #37 on: April 13, 2014, 10:39:57 AM »
As a % of total, my understanding is that Nevada has the most land under federal "stewardship" of all the states in the west.
Kalifornia is close, Alaska by far the most!

Read what Beancounter said, by percentage of state.  He is totally correct.

Nevada: 56,961,778 acres or 81% of the state
AK: 225,848,164 acres or 61.8 percent of the state his under federal ownership
CA: 47,797, 533 or 47.7%
WA: 12,173,813 or 28.5%

https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R42346.pdf

What he said.

My point is: I'm thinking of any state, Nevadans should be used to seeing federal land postings and LEOs driving around.
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Offline huntnphool

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #38 on: April 13, 2014, 10:45:46 AM »
It's not a land grab, it's already BLM land. The issue is the cattle on the BLM land.
It's not already, BLM Land, it's our land, the peoples land that the corrupt government wants. Don't give us the dribble otherwise.
It's land managed by BLM. "Land grab" to most, is when the government purchases land, which isn't what's going on here.

 Forget about all the smoke and mirrors, this is what this whole thing is about, crooked politicians.

Quote
You want to point fingers start with Harry Reid,  the BLM director who worked for him 8 years and toss in Harry's son's 5 Billion dollar Chinese contract to put in solar crap (o'bama had nothing to do with solar projects) to hook up to a 250+ mile long power grid harry coincidentally ran thru that area...that has a drop dead date of 2014. That needs water - alot of water..again coincidentally something the Clive Bundy ranch reportedly has an abundance of.
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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #39 on: April 13, 2014, 10:09:12 PM »
Where is Nevada? I am a young democrat who votes in the democrats because they are awesome. I live east of the Mississippi so who gives a crap about Nevada.  Harry Reid is Awesome because I live in Las Vegas. Again, Who gives a crap about Nevada, nothing is there.  great way for Chinese to invest in some solar power for us city slicker dems who don't give a crap about Americas history :rolleyes: :iamwithstupid: :stup:

It sounds like they are in a serious fight. hopefully they can still be able to be in business when all said in done.

Crazy thing is, I was in Las Vegas last week and I spoke with a relator and they had mentioned that 64% of the current investors in Las Vegas are Chinese and Canadians.  The larger portion being the Chinese.  Pretty interesting.  Las Vegas is not the only city with high Chinese investments.  I wonder how long until they buy most US cities.  Selling our sole to the communists.  I wonder who has the guns in China? 
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Offline motg9_6

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #40 on: April 15, 2014, 06:09:42 AM »
i dont think Bundy handled everything correctly but he did do his fellow Americans a HUGE favor and exposed CORRUPT POLITICS at its finest. For this i support him fully.  :tup:
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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #41 on: April 15, 2014, 11:07:00 AM »
saw this video kinda like it i watched it twice just to make sure my own opinion

http://scgnews.com/bundy-ranch-what-youre-not-being-told
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Offline Curly

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #42 on: April 15, 2014, 11:19:59 AM »
Where is Nevada? I am a young democrat who votes in the democrats because they are awesome. I live east of the Mississippi so who gives a crap about Nevada.  Harry Reid is Awesome because I live in Las Vegas. Again, Who gives a crap about Nevada, nothing is there.  great way for Chinese to invest in some solar power for us city slicker dems who don't give a crap about Americas history :rolleyes: :iamwithstupid: :stup:

It sounds like they are in a serious fight. hopefully they can still be able to be in business when all said in done.

Crazy thing is, I was in Las Vegas last week and I spoke with a relator and they had mentioned that 64% of the current investors in Las Vegas are Chinese and Canadians.  The larger portion being the Chinese.  Pretty interesting.  Las Vegas is not the only city with high Chinese investments.  I wonder how long until they buy most US cities.  Selling our sole to the communists.  I wonder who has the guns in China?

 :yeah:

I heard that Chinese investors are buying up much of the homes and apartment buildings in Detroit.
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Offline Colville

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #43 on: April 15, 2014, 11:27:17 AM »
It's simpler than most of the black helicopter stuff. First, it's not his land.  Whether you believe the federal government should have land holdings is not the point.  Even if it weren't federal, it would be state. Either way, the land the cattle need to be removed from isn't "his". He has land but that's not what's at issue.

If he had paid his grazing fees all along, the only thing being debated today is what is the max AUM that can be on the BLM grounds and at what fee, not if they can be there.  Was the ESA abused to diminish his grazing right? I have no clue.  I have little faith the int ESA believing it's more about control and power than species.

Regardless, the rancher has no legal claim to the land, it's not his.  He may have a basis to dispute how many cows should be allowed on it and at what cost but he kinda piszed that one away when he stopped paying for any of them.  I have no doubt that there are political interests in using the land in a more politically viable way (contributions) from those with a use for the land.   I feel bad for him, but no worse than for all the millions who end up not being able to build, farm, create a pond or any other thing on land based on some EPA/ESA or other agency that diminishes or destroys their value. 

He's making the equivalent approach of not paying your taxes and claiming the income tax is illegal.  If you think I'm going to grab my rifle and stand with someone not paying their taxes on that basis your nuts.  I'm not going to stand anywhere near a guy who paid $0 for his BLM grazing for 20 years and sells government tyranny when they finally come calling.

They should have removed no cattle. They should have drove them back on to his land. They should then have taken him to court on the owed $.  Then did asset forfeiture. He could attempt to win out in court or to make some sort of deal.  Why there'd need to be a massive militaristic invasion I'll never know.  Just evict the cows to his dirt and go to court.

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #44 on: April 15, 2014, 11:32:29 AM »
Colville,

Doesn't he only have 160 acres? How would they get all the cattle on that relatively small parcel, and if they did, what would keep the cattle there?

Other than that, I agree with you.


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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #45 on: April 15, 2014, 03:15:26 PM »
i agree with you colville on the "what bundy didnt do and what he should have done" but we cant control a single private person yet we can control our government being as they do work for us and without him bringing this to light would they have ever been held accountable??? really think about this blm has purchased thousands of rounds of ammo for what??? what does an agency that manages land need thousands of rounds for??? they should have driven his cows off the blm land with hired horseman and closed the gate. proceed to court. theres was no need for them to bring in hired guns and show the force they did.   

the issue here isnt what Bundys did im pretty sure we can all say it wasnt right, but instead what our government thought they could get away with. if there was one good thing out of this I hope it was to wake up the American people to the crooked politics going on in our country.
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Offline vandeman17

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #46 on: April 15, 2014, 03:18:58 PM »
It's simpler than most of the black helicopter stuff. First, it's not his land.  Whether you believe the federal government should have land holdings is not the point.  Even if it weren't federal, it would be state. Either way, the land the cattle need to be removed from isn't "his". He has land but that's not what's at issue.

If he had paid his grazing fees all along, the only thing being debated today is what is the max AUM that can be on the BLM grounds and at what fee, not if they can be there.  Was the ESA abused to diminish his grazing right? I have no clue.  I have little faith the int ESA believing it's more about control and power than species.

Regardless, the rancher has no legal claim to the land, it's not his.  He may have a basis to dispute how many cows should be allowed on it and at what cost but he kinda piszed that one away when he stopped paying for any of them.  I have no doubt that there are political interests in using the land in a more politically viable way (contributions) from those with a use for the land.   I feel bad for him, but no worse than for all the millions who end up not being able to build, farm, create a pond or any other thing on land based on some EPA/ESA or other agency that diminishes or destroys their value. 

He's making the equivalent approach of not paying your taxes and claiming the income tax is illegal.  If you think I'm going to grab my rifle and stand with someone not paying their taxes on that basis your nuts.  I'm not going to stand anywhere near a guy who paid $0 for his BLM grazing for 20 years and sells government tyranny when they finally come calling.

They should have removed no cattle. They should have drove them back on to his land. They should then have taken him to court on the owed $.  Then did asset forfeiture. He could attempt to win out in court or to make some sort of deal.  Why there'd need to be a massive militaristic invasion I'll never know.  Just evict the cows to his dirt and go to court.

100% spot on. I wouldn't stand up for this guy if you paid me. He got 20 years of free use and thus, income for his family and now wants to bite the hand that fed him.  :bdid:
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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #47 on: April 15, 2014, 03:28:42 PM »
 
Quote
really think about this blm has purchased thousands of rounds of ammo for what??? what does an agency that manages land need thousands of rounds for??? they should have driven his cows off the blm land with hired horseman and closed the gate. proceed to court. theres was no need for them to bring in hired guns and show the force they did.

I was under the impression that there is no gate, and no fence? Am I wrong?


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Offline motg9_6

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #48 on: April 15, 2014, 03:32:53 PM »
well there lies another issue ever notice around here BLM is fully fenced..... its your responsibility to fence out unwanted creatures on your place.  maybe blm should have just built a fence???? problem solved.
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Offline Pueblo

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Re: BLM land grab in Nevada
« Reply #49 on: April 15, 2014, 03:53:57 PM »
I've been on the actual site of this standoff....pulled a unit 271 deer tag a few years ago.  This particular patch of earth is better off not being grazed. Here's a photo a few miles from Bunkerville that I took in 2011:



Maybe there's truth in the conspiracy theories, and I personally never want the Feds on my tail, but the basic truth here is that an individual citizen is using a public resource for his own economic gain and he's not paying us for it.  Not only that, but the land he's running cattle on is marginal at best.  Maybe the Tortoises should have it.

BTW, deer were virtually non-existent. 
Wish I could earn a living hunting!

 



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