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Author Topic: Slug guns in 12 ga  (Read 20372 times)

Offline Brushcrawler

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Slug guns in 12 ga
« on: March 31, 2016, 07:10:20 PM »
I'm getting ready to hunt in a firearm restricted area this year and am looking to buy a slug gun. Given budget and research so far I have narrowed the field to the Savage 212 or Rem 870. Anyone have experience with either of these and/or something else you like better?  Thanks for any ideas or help-
There is not enough wilderness left in the world, or in the hearts of men.

Offline northwesthunter84

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #1 on: March 31, 2016, 07:29:05 PM »
I have shot both and different variations of the 870.  I am originally from Illinois and that's all we can use. My uncle has the Savage. It's a tack driver but the bolt was awkward at the time along with the detachable magazine. 150 yards with partion golds or light fields. I hunted with a smooth bore 870 for 8 years. Dropped deer at 100+ a hand full of times. Then I added rifled choke, didn't see much of a difference. Now my buddies rifled barrel with sights was a different story. 150 was achievable and with a Leupold slug hunter he was blowing up milk jugs at 200 with partion golds. Longest kill he had that I know of was in the 160 yard range. They make a big hole shoot just off the back shoulder otherwise you will loose alot of meat on the front end. Slug hits bone your looking at a silver dollar exit wound up to a softball size hole.

Offline Bob33

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #2 on: March 31, 2016, 08:11:12 PM »
I've used an 870 for many years and killed several elk with it. I have a rifled barrel on it that I purchased from a company in Wisconsin (Badger Barrel) that I don't believe it is business any more. With a scope and practice, 150-175 yard shots are possible. Slugs have horrible ballistic coefficients and start running out of steam pretty quickly after 150 yards. They're a bugger to shoot from the bench, and the sabot rounds are expensive. Like every gun, they're usually particular about what ammunition they do and don't like.

I've attached a photo of a group I shot with Remington Accutips at 150 yards.
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline fishnfur

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #3 on: March 31, 2016, 09:55:02 PM »
I hung out on Gunbroker.com for four months after last season searching for a new slug gun.  I finally settled on the Savage 220, but followed many Rem. 870's for awhile.  The scoop I kept seeing on the less expensive Express 870 was that it was prone to quickly rusting in high humidity.  That's no good around Western WA.

I chose the 220 because the ballistics of the 20 gauge are almost identical to the 12 gauge.  I personally don't really love a gun that beats the crap out of my shoulder, and sometimes I'll flinch a bit with a 30-06 or a 12 gauge shotgun, so the 220 made perfect sense, and it is super accurate according to all reports.

I believe the Accutrigger on the savage is the same setup they use on their rimfire rifles, and is adjustable to suit personal taste (I may be wrong on this last point).  That improves overall accuracy of the gun over a standard shotgun trigger that requires more pull to discharge the gun.    These reasons above were based only on readings, not on live firing a weapon, so we'll see see if they're true when the time comes.

Guns are not one of the things that I play with for fun. For me, they are just a tool.  I got this beautiful shotgun with a Nikon scope in February and put it away until I have the time to go out and give it a test run and get it zeroed.  That may be June or July - I almost forgot that I got it.
“When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.”  - Will Rogers

Offline Bob33

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2016, 10:06:59 PM »
If you will never need the shotgun to hunt elk with, a 20 gauge is a good choice.
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline fishnfur

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #5 on: March 31, 2016, 10:36:05 PM »
Good point - it's not an elephant gun.
“When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.”  - Will Rogers

Offline Widgeondeke

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #6 on: March 31, 2016, 10:37:29 PM »
My son and I have taken 3 deer with a H&R break action 20ga topped with a scope. Gun was borrowed from H2Ohunter, hit has a rifled bull barrel.
Hit 2 of 3 over 100yds, 3rd was at 65yds.  We were shooting Remington Accutips.   
Groupings at the 100yd range were OK, but it was dead on for hunting.
Like Bob33 said.  20ga is plenty for deer.

Offline bobcat

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2016, 11:13:25 PM »
I would definitely go with a 20 gauge if you'll never need it for elk. Recoil with a 12 gauge can be brutal.

Offline Brushcrawler

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #8 on: April 01, 2016, 12:09:45 PM »
I really appreciate the ideas. Maybe I hadn't given the 20ga option enough thought. Anyone have a slug gun they are looking to sell? I don't need anything pretty, just functional.
There is not enough wilderness left in the world, or in the hearts of men.

Offline JDHasty

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #9 on: April 01, 2016, 12:24:26 PM »
Don't not consider an Ithaca Deerslayer II. 

I was just playing one day at the range and a guy w/a Browning bolt action slug gun asked me just how accurate a Deerslayer is and then wanted to bet (my buddy said:  Don't do it!!)  - so I shot three Hastings Laser Accurates because they cut such a clean hole in paper @ 50 yards. 

Ithaca's have a great trigger and are stinking accurate.  FWIW, every time I see the guy I ask him for my hundred bucks, his Browning shot about as well as my rifled DS barrel take-down barrel w/cantilever scope mount.  My rifled DS barrel is just slightly less accurate and my smooth DS barrel will shoot ~ 1/2 inch at 50 w/ammo it likes and a squeaky clean barrel. 

Lightfield Hybrid Elite shoots just as accurate and kill better.  The Hastings is a harder bullet.  I will try to find a comparison. 
« Last Edit: April 01, 2016, 12:47:39 PM by JDHasty »

Offline JDHasty

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #10 on: April 01, 2016, 12:49:55 PM »
Both shot into bucks quartering away and recovered in the neck area

Offline fishnfur

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #11 on: April 01, 2016, 01:26:40 PM »
Pretty cool report.  Good shootin' too.  Was that gun zeroed at 100 or 150?

I will never be that accurate with a gun/rifle - it goes hand in hand with not loving to shoot guns that much. 

I didn't mention the more expensive notable guns because the OP mentioned the buzz kill word "budget".  I love the look of those Deerslayers.  A nice DSIII can be had for somewhere around $1700.  I assume that is outside the "budget".
“When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.”  - Will Rogers

Offline JDHasty

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2016, 05:35:47 PM »
Oh God no!  I have bought a couple of DSII off Gunbroker for south of $450.  Just don't buy them during hunting season and go for ones that have a little finish issues.

They are on at 100 yards, but it is easy to shoot out to 150 w/them.

To get this accuracy, I just lay them across a rest and don't hold the foreend at all w/my left hand.  I would strongly encourage you not to do this.  I have two friends who have been severely cut by my guns and I don't know anyone else who shoots them this way.  It is the way to get them to shoot like this though. 

I will post on how to really get the barrels clean in a day or two - I just got in from a three-day marathon power run w/my seven year-old daughter that included taking our RV to Eburg and dropping it off, then Winged Sprint Cars in Yakima on Friday night until midnight, getting into Goldendale at noon after a full morning around Yakima, then Goldendale Observatory from ~ 14:00 until past mid-night Saturday, Stonehenge and Maryhill Museum Sunday morning and a stop at Spiffys and then Cabela's on the way back to Tacoma. 
« Last Edit: April 03, 2016, 05:57:32 PM by JDHasty »

Offline JDHasty

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2016, 06:12:33 PM »
Something like this.  The guy has two of them listed, I don't know what his reserve is, but if it is north of $450-$500 I would say just keep looking.  The King Ferry ones are just fine, there must be three or four of them (Deerslayers and bird guns, solid frame and takedowns) around here.  Some people look down their nose at them, but they are just fine. 

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=550161875

Offline fishnfur

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Re: Slug guns in 12 ga
« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2016, 09:23:51 PM »
That's a nice one.  I'm thinking the reserve is probably at least $500 since it is so clean.  M-37 models w/o rifled barrels and slightly to moderately abused run around $350 - $400, but in my mind, there's no sense in not getting a rifled barrel and extending your range of the gun out to 150 yards or so.   

 Even the M-87 DSIIs that have been abused generally start around $450 - $500.  Many of the gun/pawn shops that sell on that site know that they can get some sucker to pay a bit more money, so they start the auction at a higher price or set a higher reserve.  Private sellers set more realistic reserves, or start the auction at $0, and let the economics of supply and demand determine the final price.  These ones always sell, and often for more than you might think they are worth.  The 20 gauge models with rifled barrels don't come up very often, and if it is listed as a "buy it now", it may go quick.  The story is the same for the Savage 220s.  The Remingtons seem to be just a bit easier to find a decent deal on, perhaps because of the
huge volume of these guns in circulation in the mid-west.

Sadly, once you factor in the FFL costs, shipping costs, and WA state taxes, it get's hard to save a hundred bucks over buying one locally (which in the case of a used DSII, can be almost impossible to find - maybe the gun shows are the place to search (not my idea of fun, so I have no idea)). 
“When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.”  - Will Rogers

 


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