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Author Topic: WDFW called out.  (Read 5902 times)

Offline Elkcollector82

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WDFW called out.
« on: January 19, 2017, 09:11:53 AM »
Pretty sad. I have my own opinions on why this hoof rot is here. But that would start a thread that's already been beat to death.  :bash:

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Offline Threewolves

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2017, 07:33:08 AM »
Another thought on hoof rot. F&G says the meat is OK to eat. I helped a buddy take apart an elk that had hoof rot that he shot back in regular hunting season. The elk back legs were infected and clubbed out, one with the hoof grow way out, the other the leg the hoof were missing with just holes where the hoof used to be. Also, it looked like the it was missing half the meat that a normal elk would have on its body, not just the back legs, but everything the back straps looked little bigger than the size of a deer. The odor was horrific. I check other kill sites higher up I elevation and saw similar looking lower legs with hoof rot. 

So, I was thinking if the meat is OK to eat, why aren't the coyotes dragging these animals down and eating them. The elk would be easy to catch they can hardly move around. It wouldn't be anything for a bear or cougar to kill them and eat them.  IF the coyotes, bears and cougar are not eating them why should I? Heck maybe the coyotes, bears and cougars are and I am just not seeing it, but there seems to be a lot of easy to kill elk walking around.

I have talked to two hunters that said they had killed elk with hoof rot and ate them and they were OK. It just seems to me that the bears and cougars and coyotes would kill the elk (known as limpers) before I would ever see a hoof rot elk. They don't move that fast and they don't go that far, so much for nature taking the week.
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Offline HntnFsh

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2017, 08:34:47 AM »
 I bet our group have eaten a dozen elk with hoof rot. Usually the affected quarter is atrophied pretty bad. So were pretty selective about what we use off that area. There have been a couple elk that we deemed inedible.

My wife said she wont eat any more elk we harvest that has hoof rot. I'm starting to feel the same way. Guess I'll have to start hunting the east side so I stand a chance of harvesting a healthy elk. Cause there aren't many left over here.A few years ago there was an article in the Longview daily news. A WDFW bio said they couldn't guarantee the meat of affected elk was safe to eat. A little later they were saying its ok. But use discretion about eating from the affected area.

My thought has been. They don't even know whats causing hoof rot. How can they even say if its safe to consume or not!

Offline Ghost Hunter

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2017, 08:41:56 AM »
Watching a herd of 24 in the Yale unit today, from my house.  Several are limping and have visible sign of hoof rot.  First I've noticed with these in the valley.   :(
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Offline Sandberm

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2017, 08:48:24 AM »
I dont know anything about hoof rot but its my understanding that elk are not native to Washington and were brought here from Yellowstone. Could it be that they are just not adaptable to living in soggy western Washington?

Offline Duckslayer89

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2017, 08:51:50 AM »
I hunt up in the 654 unit and I haven't seen any elk limping. There's so many elk it's crazy. Makes you wonder if they need to be thinned out a little bit before this hoof rot moves in. Anyone know if there's a "line" where the hoof rot stops geographically?

Offline WAPatriot

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2017, 08:55:45 AM »
I've saw a limper in 654 this year

Offline grade-creek-rd

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2017, 08:59:00 AM »
Elk are native...the Yellowstone transplants only helped "re-populate" not "re-create" the population...and most of the elk with hoof rot are in areas where there is Roosevelts or Rosey/Rocky Mountain cross breeds (I-5 was only built in the 1960's and cut off of the herds)...look at any elk in the Toutle and Margaret areas and you will notice they are mostly Rosey genetics...

As for the meat of elk with hoof rot...would it pass a USDA inspection if it were beef?...Hell NO! remember "mad cow" disease (it hit Europe real bad and Canada freaked out and wouldn't import US beef when we had one case of it...) and that didn't affect the meat at all, just the brain of the cow...if I have a tag in my pocket and see a legal elk with hoof rot I will put it out of its misery, and feed the worms...and burn the tag, its inhumane to watch the elk suffer just so I can shoot a non-infected animal, but that rule of must eat the meat is crap..IMO.

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Offline Dhoey07

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2017, 08:59:48 AM »
I dont know anything about hoof rot but its my understanding that elk are not native to Washington and were brought here from Yellowstone. Could it be that they are just not adaptable to living in soggy western Washington?

http://www.rmef.org/Conservation/WhereWeConserve.aspx?elkrange=true&projects=false&restore=false

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2017, 09:06:36 AM »
I dont know anything about hoof rot but its my understanding that elk are not native to Washington and were brought here from Yellowstone. Could it be that they are just not adaptable to living in soggy western Washington?


According to the WDFW, Roosevelt elk, which are most highly affected by elk hoof disease, are native. Rocky mountain elk were relocated from Yellowstone in the early 1900s.
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Offline nwwanderer

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2017, 09:29:26 AM »
Lewis and Clark would have had a very slim winter on the coast without elk but pretty much wiped out the local herd by the time they left. 
Any critter, bovine, ovine, porcine or chicken losing weight and on the way out for what ever reason makes for poor table fare.  The closer to the end the worse it gets.  Might want to avoid those staggering with foot rot.
  If WDFW spent a couple of million on this issue instead of wolf predation the returns could be significant.  What is the value of an elk to the local economy?  How many could the southwest habitat hold and harvest with a healthy herd?

Offline 2MANY

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2017, 09:39:34 AM »
WDFW is a lame agency.

When they combined the two, Fish and Wildlife, this state took a turn for the worst.


Offline Bullkllr

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2017, 10:53:57 AM »
I really don't have much experience with other states' Departments of F&W, so I don't have a lot to compare to, but maybe others can help answer this question:

Are they all as "far behind the curve" as WDFW seems to be?

It doesn't even seem to matter what the issue is (salmon, steelhead, mule deer, hoof rot, wolves, et. al.), this seems to be the one constant; don't react until it's fubar, then do too little too late.
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Offline pianoman9701

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2017, 11:27:38 AM »
Lewis and Clark would have had a very slim winter on the coast without elk but pretty much wiped out the local herd by the time they left
Any critter, bovine, ovine, porcine or chicken losing weight and on the way out for what ever reason makes for poor table fare.  The closer to the end the worse it gets.  Might want to avoid those staggering with foot rot.
  If WDFW spent a couple of million on this issue instead of wolf predation the returns could be significant.  What is the value of an elk to the local economy?  How many could the southwest habitat hold and harvest with a healthy herd?
I was thinking about Undaunted Courage as I wrote my reply.

As far as dumping millions into the disease is concerned - too little, too late. They sat on their hands for 20 years while this plague grew. Now with funding accepted from chemical and timber companies in addition to WDFW budgeting, it's hard to believe that their research is objective and untainted. They have no plans for eradication other than killing limping elk until there aren't any more. The once largest elk herd in the state may be 1/3 of the size it was 7 or 8 years ago. If hunter reports are accurate, it may well be much worse than that.
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Offline Katmai Guy

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2017, 11:39:16 AM »
Problem is, it killing off affected animals wont get rid of the disease.  Need the cause gone. 

My guess is they know what causes this but have no balls to tell the people causing to stop.
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Offline Elkcollector82

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2017, 11:58:11 AM »
Problem is, it killing off affected animals wont get rid of the disease.  Need the cause gone. 

My guess is they know what causes this but have no balls to tell the people causing to stop.

 :yeah:

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2017, 12:01:08 PM »
They say they know the cause and it's a common bacteria - treponema. You can't get rid of that bacteria in a wet environment. You can only boost immunity. Of course, that's if they're correct. On the other hand, if the cause is leptospirosis, as one distinguished former CDC scientist (and expert in identifying and treating leptospirosis) contends it could be, there's a different route, one which includes stopping the spraying of herbicides on their forage in clear cuts. But, the working group has refused his offer of performing a free study to confirm or rule out leptospirosis. The influence of big timber and the chemical companies who supply them is huge in both the working group and on our legislature on both sides of the aisle. Political corruption can't be ruled out as an influencing factor in their studies or the pressure put on our politicians to accept the status quo.
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman

Offline Elkcollector82

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2017, 12:05:14 PM »
You go back in time and figure out when the slash burning was banned and the chemical treatment for herbicide started. Pretty sure that gonna go in to connection with the hoof rot starting.  :dunno:

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2017, 12:18:08 PM »
You go back in time and figure out when the slash burning was banned and the chemical treatment for herbicide started. Pretty sure that gonna go in to connection with the hoof rot starting.  :dunno:

I absolutely think there's a correlation. Timber companies should be able to burn but EPA and WA regulations force them to use herbicides instead. Don't use fire because of air quality BS standards but it's OK to dump chemicals all over the place. Flippin' crazy.
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman

Offline Elkcollector82

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #19 on: February 17, 2017, 12:36:16 PM »
You go back in time and figure out when the slash burning was banned and the chemical treatment for herbicide started. Pretty sure that gonna go in to connection with the hoof rot starting.  :dunno:

I absolutely think there's a correlation. Timber companies should be able to burn but EPA and WA regulations force them to use herbicides instead. Don't use fire because of air quality BS standards but it's OK to dump chemicals all over the place. Flippin' crazy.

If the great state of Olympia had it their way. We all would be hunting out of Prius'es.  :bash:

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #20 on: February 17, 2017, 12:38:29 PM »
You go back in time and figure out when the slash burning was banned and the chemical treatment for herbicide started. Pretty sure that gonna go in to connection with the hoof rot starting.  :dunno:

I absolutely think there's a correlation. Timber companies should be able to burn but EPA and WA regulations force them to use herbicides instead. Don't use fire because of air quality BS standards but it's OK to dump chemicals all over the place. Flippin' crazy.

If the great state of Olympia had it their way. We all would be hunting out of Prius'es.  :bash:

Don't be fooled into thinking that one side of the aisle is less corrupt than the other. That isn't so. The big money involved donates to everyone so that everyone votes their way.
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman

Offline Elkcollector82

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #21 on: February 17, 2017, 12:48:51 PM »
You go back in time and figure out when the slash burning was banned and the chemical treatment for herbicide started. Pretty sure that gonna go in to connection with the hoof rot starting.  :dunno:

I absolutely think there's a correlation. Timber companies should be able to burn but EPA and WA regulations force them to use herbicides instead. Don't use fire because of air quality BS standards but it's OK to dump chemicals all over the place. Flippin' crazy.

If the great state of Olympia had it their way. We all would be hunting out of Prius'es.  :bash:

Don't be fooled into thinking that one side of the aisle is less corrupt than the other. That isn't so. The big money involved donates to everyone so that everyone votes their way.

I know.both sides of that aisle would vote for Prius'es if the money was there.

Offline JimmyHoffa

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #22 on: February 17, 2017, 12:53:30 PM »
If only prius would make a small truck/SUV version.  I've been in a few and they are QUIET!!  Ultimate back road stealth.

Offline HUNTINCOUPLE

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #23 on: February 17, 2017, 12:54:53 PM »
If only prius would make a small truck/SUV version.  I've been in a few and they are QUIET!!  Ultimate back road stealth.


Road hunters dream!!!! :chuckle:
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Offline Elkcollector82

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Re: WDFW called out.
« Reply #24 on: February 17, 2017, 01:06:26 PM »
If only prius would make a small truck/SUV version.  I've been in a few and they are QUIET!!  Ultimate back road stealth.


Road hunters dream!!!! :chuckle:

Great. Now in 2017 we gonna see a lot these.

 

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