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Double U Hunting Supply Advertise on Hunting-Washington

Poll

Do you approve or disapprove of shooting grouse with rifle, pistol?

Approve
76 (90.5%)
Disapprove
4 (4.8%)
Not sure
0 (0%)
Shotguns Only!
4 (4.8%)

Total Members Voted: 84

Voting closed: September 30, 2017, 10:03:13 AM

Author Topic: Changes in grouse management?  (Read 2421 times)

Offline Dave Workman

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Changes in grouse management?
« on: August 31, 2017, 10:03:13 AM »
There's a rather interesting thread in progress on FACEBOOK about suggested changes in Washington grouse management. I encourage everyone to give it a read.

https://www.facebook.com/rich.landers/posts/10212775154127499?comment_id=10212776033429481&reply_comment_id=10212776172312953&notif_t=feed_comment_reply&notif_id=1504197897488220

Share your views.

And GOOD LUCK out there this season!  :tup:  :tup: :tup:
"The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer." - D.H. Lawrence

Offline Henrydog

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2017, 10:11:20 AM »
Good ol Evironut Lib, outdoor writer Rich Landers in the Jokesman Review also has a article today in the paper on Grouse wanting to push back the opener a few weeks so the momma and baby's don't get shot.  That's fine, the lack of logging and new clear cuts, and the invasion on turkeys in the NE have more to do with the populations decline vs a couple of rednecks and a 1/2 rack of keylight in my opinion.

Offline DOUBLELUNG

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2017, 10:46:10 AM »
Thanks for the link!  Here's my post:

I have been a grouse hunter for at least 32 years, and worked as a professional game manager and wildlife biologist for the states of Wyoming and Washington for 14 years before switching professions. Grouse do have lower productivity and are longer lived than many other game birds. Adult hens are important to the productivity of grouse populations, much of which was learned from sage grouse and inferred to other grouse species. I was a proponent of moving the Wyoming sage grouse hunting season to 9/15 from 9/1 in order to maintain opportunity while reducing the impact on adult hens. Juvenile or hatch year grouse have high annual mortality and hunting harvest of these birds is largely compensatory, having little impact on the breeding population the following year.
In high quality forest grouse habitat, which is fairly abundant in Washington but has declined for myriad factors, grouse populations are robust to hunting pressure. It is not surprising or an indictment of hunting that statewide grouse harvest shows a downward trend – it is an indication of the amount and quality of habitat.
I appreciate all grouse hunters, whether the deer hunter who shoots the head off a grouse with a .30-06, to the upland shotgunner behind a pointing dog, to the retired guys who buy a bear tag because it is the cheapest license that will allow them to drive around, *censored* and look for birds along the roads. One of my proudest limits was made while elk hunting in Wyoming, when I took an adult male blue grouse in the morning, and two hatch year ruffeds in the afternoon – all with rocks.  On another memorable occasion, my partners and I took 27 blue and ruffed grouse – nearly all hatch year birds in a boom year – with .22 pistols while scouting for moose.
 Much of our best habitat exists behind road closures on National Forest land and state wildlife areas.  If the data show excessive harvest of adult hens, I have no problems with moving the opener later – but I’d like to see some scientific evidence first demonstrating it is necessary for the conservation of forest grouse populations.
What I would really like to see, is an education campaign encouraging grouse hunters to select hatch year birds and let the adult hen go.  My friends and I have practiced this for years, primarily while hunting with .22 pistols or when broods are seen on the ground.  The hatch year males are often bigger than the females, and hatch year birds are superior eating compared to adults of both sexes.  Hunters with whom I’ve discussed this are invariably unaware of the benefits of letting the adult hen go.  Unfortunately, the most “sporting” hunting method – shooting grouse on the wing, allows the least selectivity for hatch year birds.  Something to think about before emulating the snobbery of method best left to fly fishing only purists. 
As long as we have the habitat, we can argue forever about who gets to kill what and when.  No habitat = no game.

Offline AspenBud

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2017, 11:24:51 PM »
If you want to save grouse and increase their numbers you need to do something about their habitat. Shortening the season and changing the firearms used to take them is just a bandaid that doesn't solve the problem.

The Ruffed Grouse Society can speak volumes to this.

Offline T-Bone

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2017, 06:27:47 AM »
If you want to save grouse and increase their numbers you need to do something about their habitat. Shortening the season and changing the firearms used to take them is just a bandaid that doesn't solve the problem.

The Ruffed Grouse Society can speak volumes to this.

Totally agree!

WDFW does nothing to work with the USFS, DNR and private timber companies (that allow public hunting) to enhance habitat for forest grouse.
" America will never be destroyed from outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves."

                                                      Abraham Lincoln

Offline jackmaster

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2017, 06:58:56 AM »
I just wish the state would STOP spraying and put a bounty on possums !! I can hunt places that have always held lots of grouse and now your lucky to a few!! My son who is almost 22 has NEVER expierienced a great day of grouse huntn, sure he has killed a few but never had shoots like I did as a young kid 🙁 It's sad, and all the pheasant "naturals" have all but disappeared from the west side, I can't remember the last time I heard cackle  :bash:
my grandpa always said "if it aint broke dont fix it"

Offline Luna butte

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2017, 07:47:21 AM »
In my opinion, the grouse has always been the states "token campmeat" which they graciously offer to the peasants during the "kings deer/elk season" for a nominal fee. I see no reason to upset the natural order established by our caregivers from the Wdfw.

Personally, I'd like to see the rifle option expanded to include fall turkey's.

Offline Hilltop123

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2017, 07:49:53 AM »
Just my two cents. But I believe for the westside, aerial spraying, of 2,4-D has done more damage to grouse populations, than any other factor.  I know private timber companies do it, not sure of DNR or the USFS. And private timber company land is where I draw this conclusion from. Having been raised hunting on Pope & Talbot land, I have personally seen the grouse populations plummet. Which just so happens to coincide with aerial spraying, that started heavily in the 70's. But what do I know... like I stated, it just my :twocents:

Offline nwwanderer

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2017, 07:56:31 AM »
Let's form an 'advisory group' for WDFW.  Aspenbud, T-bone and Luna butte leading.  We own a little multi species grouse habitat in Oregon and Washington, any cross line cooperation possible?

Online kirkl

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2017, 11:11:52 AM »
All the grouse I shoot I could of been able to shoot with a .22 or shotgun. Why fill them with pellets when you can head shoot em?

Offline 4T

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2017, 12:46:02 PM »
I am curious if the increase of turkey population the last few years have impacted the grouse much. Seems to be more turkeys than grouse where I like to go. 

Online boneaddict

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2017, 12:52:12 PM »
Interesting enough, this is the most grouse I have seen in a long time.  Hatches were incredible for grouse and quail.

Online kirkl

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2017, 02:00:59 PM »
We seen a group of 11 couple weeks ago up riding. Probably seen 25 grouse that day.

Offline wildweeds

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2017, 05:35:15 PM »
I don't think the state should be allowed to manage anything wildlife, they continue to prove it over and over again and again they aren't any good at any of it from fish to elk and everything between. They are good at segregating licenses down to needing half a tree in your wallet that is ridiculous in sizing.

Offline Smokepole

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Re: Changes in grouse management?
« Reply #14 on: September 05, 2017, 06:50:38 PM »
TURKEYS THE PROBLEM?

Grouse numbers in my area do seem to be good this year.  Must have been a great spring.  But...

I have observed turkeys taking a toll on grouse habitat.  Turkeys require a lot of food, and come through our area in droves -- picking bugs, snowberries... and just about everything available.  They even will eat grouse eggs from the nest.  They come by the dozen and do a complete job of gleaning available food, then move on.

The young roughed grouse I observed this summer were pretty skinny.  Easy prey for a coyote or wolf.  I am surprised the WDFW hasn't addressed it, since turkeys are not native to Washington State.    :twocents:   

 

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