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Is it time to push for a new system, draw, alternating year, etc?

No
Yes

Author Topic: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)  (Read 40045 times)

Offline jackelope

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #30 on: October 10, 2017, 06:59:36 PM »
10% of the hunters kill  90% of the deer, right?

That makes for a lot of unsuccessful hunters year after year. If you had half the # of hunters hunting deer on the eastside, I'd feel pretty confident thinking that more people would be successful. Take that guy that's been hunting for 5 years and hasn't shot a deer yet. Give him better odds at killing a deer every other year rather than not killing one in 5 years because there are more deer and less hunters and I bet he'd be somewhat interested at least.
 
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Offline wsmnut

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #31 on: October 10, 2017, 07:01:43 PM »
Yes.
Continuing to do nothing is a sure path to failure of the herd.  If in fact it can be saved at all.
Wsmnut


Belief is so often the death of reason.
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Offline Humptulips

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #32 on: October 10, 2017, 07:02:04 PM »
Even though this my last year hunting in WA, I voted yes. Yes because of the state of the herds here. Cats, wolves, bad winters, and disease has continued to bring down the numbers here. I seen quite a few dead yearlings this spring and have found a dozen or so cat kills. I've been seeing less than a dozen deer per day this past week.

I would like to see them implement a quota for tags and/or draw only for the Yakima herd. Try to reduce native harvest but that won't happen due to native rights. Increase cougar harvest to a dozen for each area.

Be happy with what you have. Here where I live on the W side I would think I was in heaven seeing that many deer. Been out two days this week. Saw three deer one of which was a cougar kill.
So if there were no doe seasons how would shortening the season or limiting hunter participation increase the deer herd? That is what I don't get about these type threads.

This thread specifically is about mule deer herds on the eastside.
:dunno:

Yes it is so what's your point?
My point, it could be worse and the question applies to Mule Deer.

Bruce Vandervort

Offline Humptulips

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #33 on: October 10, 2017, 07:05:10 PM »
10% of the hunters kill  90% of the deer, right?

That makes for a lot of unsuccessful hunters year after year. If you had half the # of hunters hunting deer on the eastside, I'd feel pretty confident thinking that more people would be successful. Take that guy that's been hunting for 5 years and hasn't shot a deer yet. Give him better odds at killing a deer every other year rather than not killing one in 5 years because there are more deer and less hunters and I bet he'd be somewhat interested at least.

So if there were no doe seasons how would shortening the season or limiting hunter participation increase the deer herd? That is what I don't get about these type threads.
Bruce Vandervort

Offline wolfbait

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #34 on: October 10, 2017, 07:08:36 PM »
I haven't voted because I don't think it matters.

I'm pretty sure if you make it draw only for mule deer the wolves and cats will eat what ever number you think your going to save.

A bandaid on a pumping artery isn't going to change much.

I voted yes, but at the same time I agree with Special T, with an over supply of bears killing the fawns in the spring, cougars and wolves killing 365 days a year, as stated above any change is just a short time bandaid. Without strict predator control the herd/herds will never recover.

Fit's right in with WDF&Wolves thirty year plan.

Offline Slamadoo

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #35 on: October 10, 2017, 07:17:06 PM »
This poll reminds me of a certain political slogan I heard a few years back. "Hope & Change." Nothing explicit or concrete in terms of what should be done, just a "we are pissed off and something needs to change." Going in a new direction doesn't necessarily mean it would be the correct or productive one.

Not criticizing the thread, original poster, or even disputing that some specific changes would be a good idea. Just offering food for thought.

FYI, I voted no, for the reasons stated above.

Offline Oh Mah

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #36 on: October 10, 2017, 07:21:32 PM »
I think a lot of things have to change that we have not been successful at getting changed for decades,The state and the department refuse to get on board with most plans presented to them by hunters.They will however listen to what the antis and the politicians of this state say and that is why we are where we are.Until they want to listen none of these polls will ever matter.

                         
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Offline Oh Mah

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #37 on: October 10, 2017, 07:23:15 PM »
First, I want to say that winters are in most cases probably the biggest factor in deer numbers. Next, with roughly 4000 cougar that average eating 25-50 deer per year, it seems that some 100,000 or more deer are destined to....
Exactly,if they would bring back hounds they would bring back the deer and the elk.
"Boss of the woods"
(this is in reference to the biggie not me).

Offline Oh Mah

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #38 on: October 10, 2017, 07:30:18 PM »
Even though this my last year hunting in WA, I voted yes. Yes because of the state of the herds here. Cats, wolves, bad winters, and disease has continued to bring down the numbers here. I seen quite a few dead yearlings this spring and have found a dozen or so cat kills. I've been seeing less than a dozen deer per day this past week.

I would like to see them implement a quota for tags and/or draw only for the Yakima herd. Try to reduce native harvest but that won't happen due to native rights. Increase cougar harvest to a dozen for each area.
what would raising the quota do?We don't reach the quota in almost all areas in WA.Fact is we need to bring back the hounds.  :twocents:
"Boss of the woods"
(this is in reference to the biggie not me).

Offline bigmacc

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #39 on: October 10, 2017, 07:42:26 PM »
First, I want to say that winters are in most cases probably the biggest factor in deer numbers. Next, with roughly 4000 cougar that average eating 25-50 deer per year, it seems that some 100,000 or more deer are destined to....

Yes sir!  "Back in the day" we would see very few deer killing animals(cats, yotes, bear and yes...people). When we went out we would see a yote every once in awhile, if it wasn't during prime time you would kill the yote and keep walking. When my great grandparents were out there(late 1900,s-40,s) a yote had a $25 bounty on it when you turned in a tail. I still get out there every year, the herd has a history with me as if it was my"family". I have seen more cougars in the last 6 years than my whole family has seen in the last 100 years in the Methow!(we keep journals). Bears, I have had to stop in the middle of roads to let a mama and 2 or 3 cubs cross, glassed migration routes of old to see "black dots" moving along, seen a huge bear rumbling through a thicket that I could only get a glimpse of now and then only to see it come out of the brush with a 6 or 7 day old fawn in its mouth, predators, oh yes there are a lot more than years past! Wolves, I have not seen one yet but I have heard them, seen tracks and have known they were in the Methow since the early 90,s(along with moose that we knew were in the vicinity since the late 60,s, found a skeleton that we had verified from a buddy in Fish and Game Dept back in the day). 
As far as the cougar problem, its bad! Like Bearpaw said they kill, kill, kill. We have wolves that like to do the same now. If we want our children and the next generations to enjoy Mule deer hunting in this state we will be the ones that need to demand changes. Once again, my  :twocents:

Offline Naches Sportsman

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #40 on: October 10, 2017, 07:49:03 PM »
Even though this my last year hunting in WA, I voted yes. Yes because of the state of the herds here. Cats, wolves, bad winters, and disease has continued to bring down the numbers here. I seen quite a few dead yearlings this spring and have found a dozen or so cat kills. I've been seeing less than a dozen deer per day this past week.

I would like to see them implement a quota for tags and/or draw only for the Yakima herd. Try to reduce native harvest but that won't happen due to native rights. Increase cougar harvest to a dozen for each area.
what would raising the quota do?We don't reach the quota in almost all areas in WA.Fact is we need to bring back the hounds.  :twocents:

Meant to say tag quota for every gmu by limiting amount of hunters.

Offline Mallardmasher

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #41 on: October 10, 2017, 07:51:38 PM »
To be honest we need to push for the use of hounds and bait for bears and Cougars, and bring back the bounty program on coyotes. And push for the declassification of Wolves, So a season can be had for Wolves.
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Offline Wingin it

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #42 on: October 10, 2017, 07:52:04 PM »
I voted yes because I have always loved chasing mule deer and I want future generations to have the same experience. The thing that bothers me about it is once opportunity is taken away it rarely is given back. When or if herds are brought back to good management levels I would like to see things return to normal. If they can recover they should have great carrying capacity for a number of years from the fires. Habitat loss will obviously always be an issue due to human encroachment.

Offline Humptulips

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #43 on: October 10, 2017, 07:55:28 PM »
Even though this my last year hunting in WA, I voted yes. Yes because of the state of the herds here. Cats, wolves, bad winters, and disease has continued to bring down the numbers here. I seen quite a few dead yearlings this spring and have found a dozen or so cat kills. I've been seeing less than a dozen deer per day this past week.

I would like to see them implement a quota for tags and/or draw only for the Yakima herd. Try to reduce native harvest but that won't happen due to native rights. Increase cougar harvest to a dozen for each area.

Be happy with what you have. Here where I live on the W side I would think I was in heaven seeing that many deer. Been out two days this week. Saw three deer one of which was a cougar kill.
So if there were no doe seasons how would shortening the season or limiting hunter participation increase the deer herd? That is what I don't get about these type threads.

This thread specifically is about mule deer herds on the eastside.
:dunno:

I have given this some more thought and maybe the west side does matter for Mule Deer.
Think about it. Hunters go where they think hunting is best. Lots of problems on the west side with deer hunting. Does it surprise you when a bunch of west siders decide to go over the hill.
I think we have a predator problem Statewide and it will take a Statewide fix to help Mule Deer. Sure there are other problems but are they really within our control? I think that is why limiting hunter participation seems appealing. Because it is the one thing we think we have control over.
I would posit that it is the one thing that will sink us. It won't help the decline in game herds and it will hurt our numbers, politically speaking.
The two things I think will help are decreasing predators and doing away with so many doe tags.
Problems there are both political and money. Cougars get a lot of sympathy from non-hunters and the Commission and the Department doesn't seem to be able to stand up to them. Money will be lost to the Department by limiting doe tags so that is a tough sell.
It seems to me the permit application money drives a lot of the doe tag drawings.
Tough things to grapple with but anything else won't help.
Bruce Vandervort

Offline Special T

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Re: Washington State Mule Deer Hunting Future (poll)
« Reply #44 on: October 10, 2017, 07:56:24 PM »
Look I'm not saying it would be that hard to convince me that overthe counter blacktail or whitetail with a Mule deer draw would be a firm no. Could be good for hunters in lots of ways...

Fact is arguing this point is like rearranging chairs on the titanic.  I feel a good farming analogy would work, but sadly some one else will have to come up with it.

We should have a ton of spring beat tags, year round cougar and bobcat and we would still likely not be hitting quotas.
In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

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