Is nation-wide reciprocity for CPL a good idea?

[blackdog]

KFhunter no one is talking about a Federal permit! This not rocket science! If we can't the Constitution and its full faith and credit clause then who will!

[KFhunter]

KFhunter no one is talking about a Federal permit! This not rocket science! If we can't the Constitution and its full faith and credit clause then who will!

A 50 state reciprocity deal would certainly mean a federal permit. 

Otherwise you'd have states requiring class room instruction and range evaluation (IL) fighting with states who require nothing more than a background check (WA)

It's a foregone conclusion. I can't even fathom thinking otherwise 

[washelkhunter]

Every single CPL/CWP holder in the US has been veted by FBI. You have been fingerprinted and thoroughly background checked. In reality your CPL is an acknowledgement by the Fed govt that YOU are an outstanding citizen, something not implied by a mere drivers license or passport. I believe that as such you should be considered as a "deputy at large" to any and all law enforcement entities or jurisdictions in which you happen to find yourself nation wide.

This post gets to a problem I have with WA CPL as well as the notion of a universal reciprocity across all states. The NICS check only verifies that you do not meet the threshold for not being able to purchase a firearm. It DOES NOT indicate anything else such as you being an outstanding citizen, have any working knowledge of firearms or the legal implications of using a firearm in any particular state. THAT is a large deficiency in my opinion. Other than not being a felon, consuming oxygen is the only criteria for obtaining a CPL in WA. Like many on this forum, a lot of people take time to learn firearm techniques and some even go the next step to learn some of the legal issues and the responsibilities of using a firearm. It's those who don't have a clue, go out and buy a gun, get a permit and think they are ordained to resolve any conflict that comes their way that are the problem. They are a disaster waiting to happen will only serve to give the rest of us a bad name when they make a foolish mistake. Some states take this more seriously and do require some amount of training or proficiency to go along with the responsibility. My guess is that
the states with higher standards would not look kindly on the
notion of universal reciprocity.

I disagree with your rationale. For one the nics is the fbi and i dont want to see the states requiring some arbitrary level of special training in order to exercise your 2nd amenment rights. I would be interested to see what evidence is out there to support your conjecture that a citizen holding a  cpl has decided they were ordained to resolve a conflict. You would think after all this time we would have read of some cpl disaster by now.

[netcoyote]

Every single CPL/CWP holder in the US has been veted by FBI. You have been fingerprinted and thoroughly background checked. In reality your CPL is an acknowledgement by the Fed govt that YOU are an outstanding citizen, something not implied by a mere drivers license or passport. I believe that as such you should be considered as a "deputy at large" to any and all law enforcement entities or jurisdictions in which you happen to find yourself nation wide.

This post gets to a problem I have with WA CPL as well as the notion of a universal reciprocity across all states. The NICS check only verifies that you do not meet the threshold for not being able to purchase a firearm. It DOES NOT indicate anything else such as you being an outstanding citizen, have any working knowledge of firearms or the legal implications of using a firearm in any particular state. THAT is a large deficiency in my opinion. Other than not being a felon, consuming oxygen is the only criteria for obtaining a CPL in WA. Like many on this forum, a lot of people take time to learn firearm techniques and some even go the next step to learn some of the legal issues and the responsibilities of using a firearm. It's those who don't have a clue, go out and buy a gun, get a permit and think they are ordained to resolve any conflict that comes their way that are the problem. They are a disaster waiting to happen will only serve to give the rest of us a bad name when they make a foolish mistake. Some states take this more seriously and do require some amount of training or proficiency to go along with the responsibility. My guess is that
the states with higher standards would not look kindly on the
notion of universal reciprocity.

I disagree with your rationale. For one the nics is the fbi and i dont want to see the states requiring some arbitrary level of special training in order to exercise your 2nd amenment rights. I would be interested to see what evidence is out there to support your conjecture that a citizen holding a  cpl has decided they were ordained to resolve a conflict. You would think after all this time we would have read of some cpl disaster by now.

I wasn't basing that statement from any evidence, I was basing it on your own statement:

I believe that as such you should be considered as a "deputy at large" to any and all law enforcement entities or jurisdictions in which you happen to find yourself nation wide.

Are you proposing that someone with a CPL, regardless of training or demonstrated proficiency, should have the same level of authority as a LEO?

[blackdog]

We don't have a federal drivers license or a federal marriage license and the actual federal legislation does not create a federal CPL. What am I missing? What legislation anywhere can you point to that creates a federal CPL?

[KFhunter]

Every single CPL/CWP holder in the US has been veted by FBI. You have been fingerprinted and thoroughly background checked. In reality your CPL is an acknowledgement by the Fed govt that YOU are an outstanding citizen, something not implied by a mere drivers license or passport. I believe that as such you should be considered as a "deputy at large" to any and all law enforcement entities or jurisdictions in which you happen to find yourself nation wide.

This post gets to a problem I have with WA CPL as well as the notion of a universal reciprocity across all states. The NICS check only verifies that you do not meet the threshold for not being able to purchase a firearm. It DOES NOT indicate anything else such as you being an outstanding citizen, have any working knowledge of firearms or the legal implications of using a firearm in any particular state. THAT is a large deficiency in my opinion. Other than not being a felon, consuming oxygen is the only criteria for obtaining a CPL in WA. Like many on this forum, a lot of people take time to learn firearm techniques and some even go the next step to learn some of the legal issues and the responsibilities of using a firearm. It's those who don't have a clue, go out and buy a gun, get a permit and think they are ordained to resolve any conflict that comes their way that are the problem. They are a disaster waiting to happen will only serve to give the rest of us a bad name when they make a foolish mistake. Some states take this more seriously and do require some amount of training or proficiency to go along with the responsibility. My guess is that
the states with higher standards would not look kindly on the
notion of universal reciprocity.

I disagree with your rationale. For one the nics is the fbi and i dont want to see the states requiring some arbitrary level of special training in order to exercise your 2nd amenment rights. I would be interested to see what evidence is out there to support your conjecture that a citizen holding a  cpl has decided they were ordained to resolve a conflict. You would think after all this time we would have read of some cpl disaster by now.

I wasn't basing that statement from any evidence, I was basing it on your own statement:

I believe that as such you should be considered as a "deputy at large" to any and all law enforcement entities or jurisdictions in which you happen to find yourself nation wide.

Are you proposing that someone with a CPL, regardless of training or demonstrated proficiency, should have the same level of authority as a LEO?

Authority like an LE on active duty and on the clock?  Or an off duty LE on vacation in another state...

[KFhunter]

We don't have a federal drivers license or a federal marriage license and the actual federal legislation does not create a federal CPL. What am I missing? What legislation anywhere can you point to that creates a federal CPL?

Oh sorry I didn't mean that,  the federal deal would come after the states sue one another and take it to SCOTUS

I was just looking down the road a little further, didn't mean to confuse you.

[washelkhunter]

Not at all, but if you are a male citizen between the ages of 16-56 then you are a member of the militia.

[blackdog]

Thanks KF I wasn't tracking well! A State suing others States for following the Constitution would not get far IMHO but who knows in this world.

[csaaphill]

For but as bean counter stated I wonder how that would all play out.
anyone know of or hear the story of the guy in FLorida going to Maryland and home geting stoped and accused of being a liar and having to prove his inocence because in Florida he has a CCL CPL or whatever you want to call it?
Howd they know it's becauase they ran his license and knew he had a concealed permit in Florda that's how kind of a registration isn't it?
But ya you should be able to move about in the United States without jumping through bunches of hoops!

[netcoyote]

Not at all, but if you are a male citizen between the ages of 16-56 then you are a member of the militia.

Huh?! Care to elaborate on that statement?

I never got no stinking badges...

[deltaops]

Not at all, but if you are a male citizen between the ages of 16-56 then you are a member of the militia.

Huh?! Care to elaborate on that statement?

I never got no stinking badges...

To elaborate for him, it's called the "Selective Service Act".

[netcoyote]

Not at all, but if you are a male citizen between the ages of 16-56 then you are a member of the militia.

Huh?! Care to elaborate on that statement?

I never got no stinking badges...

To elaborate for him, it's called the "Selective Service Act".

I'm really getting confused here. Anyone care to explain what the Selective Service Act or the militia has to do with nation-wide reciprocity for CPLs? Am I the only one confused about this?

[Special T]

I would guess that if your required by law to register for the draft then you should be allowed to carry. Kinda points out the double standard. I actually think that what is going on currently between states is very good. It isn't hard to figure out if a CPL in this state is good else where, and where its not. OR and Cali are a no go, ID MT WY good to go. For those who wish to carry where they travel there is a class that you can take to get the ?utah? CC lic good in 30 states???

[smalldog]

Your Constitution should be good in every state in the nation. I hate it when states pick and choose what they want to honor in the Constitution. This nation has an obligation to honor every amendment equally in the Constitution. Its a shame that things are the way they are because the framers of the Constitution did not mean for it to be this way. The Second Amendment most of all should be guarded because without it all the others would  disappear.  If I want to carry my gun concealed, I should be able to carry it in every state. Your drivers license is good in every state and cars kill way more people then guns. You can't fight TYRANNY with a car but you can with a GUN.

If everybody kept track of their elected representatives like they do football, baseball and basket ball, you would not have such a mess in government and the country would not be so screwed up.  You would not have this President and Obamacare. Its going to bankrupt the country.