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Author Topic: Killing Coyotes  (Read 3370 times)

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2017, 02:32:55 PM »
Sorry, went fishing and chukar hunting in the Hells Canyon area and was gone for a couple of days.

Some of the posts in the other thread have been removed. 

I'm curious as to why some look at wounding a coyote and it getting away differently than wounding something like a deer?  Is it because with the deer they also don't get the meat, or is it because a deer is a beautiful, gentle herbivore and the coyote is a canine predator?  In my mind, and maybe I'm in the minority, to cause any animal to suffer needlessly because I took a shot I probably shouldn't have is a bad thing.  I grew up and spent 33 years of my life in Alaska.  I've shot a lot of predators.  I've also shot moose and caribou.  To my way of thinking they all deserve quick, ethical kills. The fact that predators hunt, and kill other animals doesn't come into the equation.  It's nature, and it's how they survive.  Sure, a wolf or cougar taking down an Elk may look horrific to some, and the elk no doubt experiences a period of severe pain.  It's how predators survive, and I don't feel that it's a hunters place to somehow judge them and deem them worthy of any less respect than any other quarry. 

I've noticed for years with many folks there seems to be a direct correlation between the size of an animal and the perceived value of their life and suffering.  I think that's interesting, and I'm not sure I completely understand it.

I'm like gringo, I'll take a shot at a coyote that I wouldn't ever take on a deer.  I'll shot a coyote on the run, shoot at a coyote way beyond the range I'd shoot a deer, I'll even guesstimate where I should hold and send a hailmary shot on a coyote just hoping to "get a piece of him", I'd never do so with a deer/elk or other valued game animal where every shot is precisely placed.

Do I want the coyote to suffer?  no, I don't humanize them in that regard.  In order to hate something enough to want it to suffer you have to humanize or anthropomorphize it to some degree which I don't do.  coyotes are simply vermin to me, vermin that are over populated and cut into the population of valued game animals and worse depredate livestock. 

If I see a coyote down and it's tail spinning circles I'll go finish it off right away.


Offline pianoman9701

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2017, 03:35:14 PM »
One of my best friends is a cattleman, he has thousands of head of cattle in several states.  He has seen coyotes eating half born calves while the cow is of course freaking out. He has lost animals to cougar.  He tries to eradicate all of the predators he can because it's also his livelihood that is affected.  He know that predators do what they do to survive.  Cattle graze, predators hunt.  He still believes, strongly, that the predators he kills deserve to die quickly.  He won't pass up an opportunity to kill one, but I know for a fact that when he wounds one he dispatches it quickly if he can, or tries to locate it.  Honestly, if he felt any other way we obviously wouldn't be friends. I'm still really surprised at the attitudes of so many folks.  Just because an animal doing what they do naturally effects you doesn't mean it's okay if they suffer. Not in my mind anyway. I know nobody is advocating torturing animals like coyotes, but some of the attitudes about it being okay if they're caused do suffer is a bit shocking.

We're not saying anything different from your cattleman friend. I'm not going to stand there and watch as they flop around and no one else is saying that either. None of us have said they'd like to see or would allow them to suffer. Not sure where you think you're going with this.  :dunno:

Not really going anywhere.  Folks have said they will take a more questionable shot on a coyote than a deer or elk or other animal they have personally different feelings about.  Not saying it's right or wrong, just interesting how most of us obviously place different values on different forms of life. I'm wondering how many others of them have heard a man, especially a friend, die?  Have they ever held someone as they take their last breath, and long enough for their muscles to relax as their bowels and bladder empty? Have they heard the screams, even of an enemy, after they've been shot?  I can promise that certain life experiences can change the way folks feel about any type of suffering, and everyone has had a different journey to get to where they are, and have differing reasons for why they feel the way they do.
I've never been in combat but as a medic, I've held the hands of a few as they took their last breath. That doesn't change the fact that killing coyotes saves lives and that's why I'd take a running shot at a coyote and not at an elk or deer. If I didn't kill it with the first shot, I would shortly thereafter. I don't want to see animals suffer either. You get exactly what I'm saying. Saying any more is redundant. Thanks for the discussion.
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman

Offline Gringo31

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2017, 04:23:33 PM »
I'm a little lost on how pics of a cow a group of coyotes killed is in poor taste.  It's what we try to prevent???

Has nothing to do with "anti's"

Ok

Gringo out


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Offline Blacktail Sniper

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2017, 05:14:32 PM »
I'm a little lost on how pics of a cow a group of coyotes killed is in poor taste.  It's what we try to prevent???

Has nothing to do with "anti's"

Ok

Gringo out


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Nothing to do with those pictures, it was in regards to the post about keeping the pictures in "Good taste," and hopefully giving some perspective for future consideration.

Sorry if you thought it was about those particular pictures, it was not in any way related to them.  I agree, there needs to more like them to show exactly why hunting is a necessary and needed tool.

EDIT: Just to be perfectly clear, so hopefully not to get any other backs up, I was talking about dead animals like coyotes and such, and statements such as not caring if they suffer, not as important as a deer, etc.  Again, just General zation, not calling any particular person out!!

But to think there is no risk from the anti's grabbing onto things like that is foolish, again, refer back to the commercials with the youtube videos of hounds with bears and cats treed during the campagian to ban hounds and baiting.

Believe it or not, like it or not, there is real possibility that things like that could be used against hunting on many levels. 

Will it stop it? I don't know, probably not, but why freely give them things that makes us look bad? 

Show the chewed up and uneatten calf, then show the dead coyote in a manner that looks presentable to someone who may never have seen such things, because that is the person who will ultimatly be deciding what happens when it comes time to vote. 

And again, make no mistake, they are and will use the ballot method simply because it is a game of numbers...way more non-hunters (both anti and possibly netrual, but uninformed) than hunters when it is time to vote.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2017, 05:33:54 PM by Blacktail Sniper »
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Online JakeLand

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #19 on: October 27, 2017, 09:47:31 PM »
You speak with any Game warden and they will stress on you to shoot every coyote you see . I personally will take every opportunity to shoot every yote I see and if it's a bad shot which I never intend but if it does happen I won't lose no sleep over it . My only  :twocents:

Offline ELKBURGER

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2017, 06:24:01 AM »
You speak with any Game warden and they will stress on you to shoot every coyote you see . I personally will take every opportunity to shoot every yote I see and if it's a bad shot which I never intend but if it does happen I won't lose no sleep over it . My only  :twocents:
Washington obviously has an issue with predators. Coyotes are a yearound, unlimited, resource. There is no weapon or baiting restriction. They are prolific as hell, too. But respecting them as Gods creation important. Intentionally wounding for thrill is criminal.

Offline CAMPMEAT

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2017, 06:55:33 AM »
Coyotes aren't ethical.....
I could care less about what anybody says..............

Offline Gringo31

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #22 on: November 13, 2017, 07:20:59 AM »
Quote
Intentionally wounding for thrill is criminal.

Talk about getting me wound up...  No one intentionally wounds coyotes.  No one intentionally wounds for thrill.


What's your point and why even say it?


Is it possible that someone out there does?  I suppose.  Do little kids pull wings off of house flies to see what happens?  Probably.  NOT THE POINT.
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Offline ELKBURGER

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2017, 01:20:35 PM »
Quote
Intentionally wounding for thrill is criminal.

Talk about getting me wound up...  No one intentionally wounds coyotes.  No one intentionally wounds for thrill.


What's your point and why even say it?


Is it possible that someone out there does?  I suppose.  Do little kids pull wings off of house flies to see what happens?  Probably.  NOT THE POINT.
I am just reiterating everyones stance. Not wound up.... Not accusing anyone....

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2017, 12:37:05 PM »
killing coyotes is more utilitarian for me, if I lived in the burbs somewhere and just went out on weekends to hunt coyotes then I'd have a different perspective, but living with them, raising livestock, and keeping track of a resident deer herd, I have a far different perspective. I'm not out to "hunt" coyotes, I'm out to kill them any way I can, and I think that is the concept you're scorning with those of us who will be happy just getting a piece of one, if we can't outright kill it (which is far more preferable). 


truth is we have far too many coyotes, I used to have 50 to 100 deer in my field every night back in the 90's (I used to trap coyotes with leg holds) but now I've only got a few resident does who are lucky to raise a fawn.  This year I have zero fawns in the resident herd of deer and only about 4 does left.   I don't even fence off my hay pile anymore, they get their fill each night.

4 does and a nice buck isn't a lot of hay anyways.   They have their choice of horse grass hay or premium alfalfa they don't touch the horse hay  :chuckle:

Offline drysideshooter

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #25 on: November 16, 2017, 09:08:20 AM »
Coyotes aren't ethical.....

That's one of the most idiotic things I've read in a while. They are a predator, no different than a cougar or other predators.  The fact that so many obviously don't give a darn about a fast, ethical kill with regard to animals like coyotes is just disgusting and doesn't speak well of our sport.  I have a relative that is a big cattle rancher.  He has seen coyotes eating half born calves as the cow giving birth helplessly freaks out.  It's nature at work. It's not always pretty, but a coyote will try to survive.  "Ethics" don't play a roll in how a coyote survives and to try to say that any animal doesn't deserve an ethical kill is pretty crappy.  I understand that some folks may take a more iffy shot on a coyote and not feel as bad if it ends up being a bad shot. I certainly hope anyone that does that would dispatch the animal as quickly as possible after such a shot though.

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #26 on: November 16, 2017, 09:14:12 AM »
Incidentally, as unclassified wildlife, it's legal to shoot them with an air gun.
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Online JakeLand

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #27 on: November 16, 2017, 09:29:00 AM »
Stack em whack em and let the maggots fight over em

Offline CAMPMEAT

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2017, 08:38:24 PM »
Coyotes aren't ethical.....

That's one of the most idiotic things I've read in a while. They are a predator, no different than a cougar or other predators.  The fact that so many obviously don't give a darn about a fast, ethical kill with regard to animals like coyotes is just disgusting and doesn't speak well of our sport.  I have a relative that is a big cattle rancher.  He has seen coyotes eating half born calves as the cow giving birth helplessly freaks out.  It's nature at work. It's not always pretty, but a coyote will try to survive.  "Ethics" don't play a roll in how a coyote survives and to try to say that any animal doesn't deserve an ethical kill is pretty crappy.  I understand that some folks may take a more iffy shot on a coyote and not feel as bad if it ends up being a bad shot. I certainly hope anyone that does that would dispatch the animal as quickly as possible after such a shot though.


Did I hurt your liberal view on an ethical coyote ? Too me, coyotes are worthless vermin that need to be shot and killed, period. I lived in eastern Washington for nearly 17 years and have seen my fair share of what coyotes do to any and all animals. You're preaching' to the wrong guy. I hate coyotes....Coyotes aren't ethical.
I could care less about what anybody says..............

Offline Romulus1297

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Re: Killing Coyotes
« Reply #29 on: November 16, 2017, 10:22:44 PM »
Our donkey and cows will crush the hips of coyotes which will then crawl under the closest bin. Then they stand around it for hours watching the coyote suffer. These cows don't care how long it suffers dryside. Hours and hours the cows watch it suffer. :drool:

 

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