2021 archery season proposal

[yajsab]

I didn't see any proposal for 352/356 this year. Does that mean it will be spike only again? Anyone have any insight?

[hughjorgan]

Yes, spike only

[jstone]

I hope this cow permit thing helps

[hughjorgan]

I’ll be really curious to see archery success rates for 2020 with spike only and a few cow permits. Bet it doesn’t meet the percentages laid out for resource allocation for each user group.

[yajsab]

My group saw 0 spike.

[hughjorgan]

My group saw 0 spike.

Did you hunt early season or late? What type of hunting pressure was there? Down considerably?

I hunted the late hunt for a number of days and only seen branched bulls and cows. Hardly any guys hunting though.

[Karl Blanchard]

What would be really neat is for wdfw to actually make an attempt at counting elk this year. Im sure we will see some fantastic excuse about covid or something. Its incredible that seasons and permits can be set without actual herd data 🤦‍♂️

[Karl Blanchard]

I’ll be really curious to see archery success rates for 2020 with spike only and a few cow permits. Bet it doesn’t meet the percentages laid out for resource allocation for each user group.

I hunted one day of early season on my cow permit.  Didn't see anyone else but I never do in this area during early season so wasn't surprised. Smoke was so freaking bad up there. Couldn't see 100 yards. 🤮

[hughjorgan]

What would be really neat is for wdfw to actually make an attempt at counting elk this year. Im sure we will see some fantastic excuse about covid or something. Its incredible that seasons and permits can be set without actual herd data 🤦‍♂️

Agreed

[hughjorgan]

I’ll be really curious to see archery success rates for 2020 with spike only and a few cow permits. Bet it doesn’t meet the percentages laid out for resource allocation for each user group.

I hunted one day of early season on my cow permit.  Didn't see anyone else but I never do in this area during early season so wasn't surprised. Smoke was so freaking bad up there. Couldn't see 100 yards. 🤮

Karl which unit did you draw for early cow ?

[Karl Blanchard]

Taneum

[Rainier10]

What would be really neat is for wdfw to actually make an attempt at counting elk this year. Im sure we will see some fantastic excuse about covid or something. Its incredible that seasons and permits can be set without actual herd data 🤦‍♂️

I have six bulls on my place, not a single cow with them.  Not sure they would even be flying over my place since the big herds have all moved to vantage but I know if they do count those over there bull to cow ratio will be off with this bachelor group hanging back at my place.

[Karl Blanchard]

Yes but it would still be more accurate than not flying at all since thats the current strategy.

[Stein]

Yes but it would still be more accurate than not flying at all since thats the current strategy.

It's a biblically-based strategy.  Word went out all across the woods for all elk to travel to their ancestral feeding site to be registered.  As long as the windshield of the truck isn't too covered with bugs, they should get a very accurate accounting of the population and back to the office before lunch.

[yajsab]

My group saw 0 spike.

Did you hunt early season or late? What type of hunting pressure was there? Down considerably?

I hunted the late hunt for a number of days and only seen branched bulls and cows. Hardly any guys hunting though.

We hunted the first week during early season.  Not many people there, so the pressure was less than previous years.  We didn't go late season, since for the last 20 years, we saw no spike as well.

[Rainier10]

Yes but it would still be more accurate than not flying at all since thats the current strategy.

I agree 100%, any counting is better than no counting and just throwing numbers out there.

[jstone]

Do they go off of what they see at the feed lots?

[Jpmiller]

Do they go off of what they see at the feed lots?

I'm pretty sure they use a ouija board.

[elkchaser54]

They haven't produced 2020 points used in special draws yet . Wdfw sucked before they had to furlough people. Its only gotten worse. Probably will just status quo last years numbers and not change anything

[RobinHoodlum]

Agree with what others have already said about the fact that they've drastically reduced archery elk opportunity without data to support this for the Yakima herd. The survey strategy is weak at best. To answer jstones question -YES it is basically a windshield survey at the field lot with fingers crossed that old man winter has stressed the elk sufficiently that a 'good enough' number have shown up to make a guess on population size and age and gender ratios.

Several of us commented on this when they made last minute changes last year. Based on the extrapolation they made with their 'no data' at that time, the writing was already on the wall for anyone who was paying attention for this 3-year package. Kept hoping for the best, but gave up on trying to keep track of these shenanigans along with the rest of our 'more fees for diminished opportunity'.

It doesn't help when the divided user groups support restrictions if it's not their weapon of preference. The thing that really stings is that our state's '4th user group' will reap the spoils unabated while modern, muzzy, and archery divvy up 100 or so cow tags and handful of what is quickly becoming once-in-a-lifetime bull tags.

[MIKEXRAY]

As stated the rules for this unit ( probably most others) tend to run on three year stints without change. The state has run game cameras in the Bumping for atleast a dozen years , I've appeared in their pictures and corresponded with them. The cameras are being checked periodically and the purpose is to obviously observe the herd and count animals. Whether that data is being used correctly or at all I have no idea , just showing people what's being done more than " winter feed counting" . The biologist leaves their card with number and email at each camera.

[MIKEXRAY]

Another camera. 

[Naches Sportsman]

As stated the rules for this unit ( probably most others) tend to run on three year stints without change. The state has run game cameras in the Bumping for atleast a dozen years , I've appeared in their pictures and corresponded with them. The cameras are being checked periodically and the purpose is to obviously observe the herd and count animals. Whether that data is being used correctly or at all I have no idea , just showing people what's being done more than " winter feed counting" . The biologist leaves their card with number and email at each camera.

Those cameras aren't state cameras. They are USFS cameras and the biologists may give info to the state and or tribes to use, but the USFS cams are to develop best forest management plans for that area. They have cameras all over and yes they do run cameras for wolves, and small critters of interest such as cascade red fox, Fisher, Martin, and Wolverines who venture thoughout the bumping and surrounding units. They are also used for other purposes too.

That particular retired biologist who's name is on the card is a damn good big game hunter, bird hunter, and Lab breeder and is on our side overall

They leave pictures and cards behind so other hunters don't screw with them and destroy them. Destroying federal property is something you don't want to be caught doing. If you see an old guy out in the woods in strange places, he's another good retired usfs bio and last time I checked ran 30+ cameras. They have some other seasonals that run it too.


Now if you see a conservation NW camera out there or an Audubon society camera, they're not on our side. Cascades Carnivore Project also has cameras out there and they're good people.

[MIKEXRAY]

Yes , there have been new business cards the last couple of years on the cameras.  Thanks for the explanation / correction & private message, their correspondence always said " counting and checking on condition of animals " , plus wished me good luck. I just assumed it would have something to do with season setting and permits etc. Seems like the biologist would all know each other and talk each year about numbers up or down but I'm surmising.  Thanks again.

[dreamingbig]

What would be really neat is for wdfw to actually make an attempt at counting elk this year. Im sure we will see some fantastic excuse about covid or something. Its incredible that seasons and permits can be set without actual herd data 🤦‍♂️

Wouldn’t that be nice.  I have wasted way too many years on spike only archery seasons.

The latest commission adds are more salt in the wound.

Anyone know if the March meeting will be online?


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[jstone]

I will hunt general seasons after I get rid of my quality elk and deer
I was thinking of hunting a lesser unit to hunt quality but I also want to kill something nice