Private property in or near shelton

[Dirty Mike]

looking trade work or some cash to hunt private property in or near shelton

[Skyvalhunter]

Now this just might have to go in the classifieds!!

[Ireland Farms]

I've got 13 acres in Shelton. I think my renter hunts it though.

[Dirty Mike]

where at in shelton?

[Ireland Farms]

Harstine Island. Great deer hunting.

[rover747]

I thought Harstine Island is ban for hunting ? Is i am wrong ?

[Ireland Farms]

I thought Harstine Island is ban for hunting ? Is i am wrong ?

I know you can't hunt on Haskell Hill Rd., as well as developments. Otherwise hunting is allowed. Shotgoun, muzzle loader, or bow only.

[gasman]

I thought Harstine Island is ban for hunting ? Is i am wrong ?

You have to find someone on the island to give permission, its all private.

[Ireland Farms]

I thought Harstine Island is ban for hunting ? Is i am wrong ?

You have to find someone on the island to give permission, its all private.

Actually a timber company owns about 1/3 of the island. That's where most people hunt. If you go to Harstine, just park near the orange metal gates. That's the Manke Timber Company property. Also, last time I knew it was okay to hunt on property that had no signs on Harstine. Private or not.

[ICEMAN]

.... Also, last time I knew it was okay to hunt on property that had no signs on Harstine. Private or not.

Bad advice. Try explaining that one to the judge. Do your research and obtain permission to hunt on any private land. It is your responsiblilty to know where you are, not the land owners responsibility to post their property.

[Machias]

Actually the land has to be posted, improved or cultivated to be charged with tresspassing.  I'm not advocating tresspass and agree with Iceman you should find the property owner and obtain permission, but if it is not posted, improved or cultivated you cannot be charged with tresspass....98% sure of this. 

[skipper]

Actually the land has to be posted, improved or cultivated to be charged with tresspassing.  I'm not advocating tresspass and agree with Iceman you should find the property owner and obtain permission, but if it is not posted, improved or cultivated you cannot be charged with tresspass....98% sure of this. 

Not true we were hunting in Colville a couple years ago and one guy in our hunting party went into some trees that were not posted improved or cultivated and shot a nice buck. After he sot it other guy's that were hunting in there came out and told him it was private property and called the police he got a $600 criminal trespassing ticket and mandatory court date

[Machias]

This is from the hunting pamplet:

Private Lands
It is unlawful to trespass. State hunting
regulations apply to hunting private land, but do not
guarantee access. Entry onto any lands which are
fenced, posted, cultivated, or used for commercial
agricultural crops or aquaculture without permission
is considered trespass. Some private landowners
(individuals or corporations) have chosen to deny
access to, or across, their property. Check with
landowners before entering their property. It is
always best to obtain landowner permission before
entering private property.
It is unlawful to:
Hunt in areas posted with Hunting Only by
Written Permission without a permission card
signed by the landowner on your person.
Hunt or shoot behind a Safety Zone sign.
Operate a motor vehicle (including ORVs)
behind a No Unauthorized Vehicles sign
unless specifically authorized by the
landowner under the Regulated Access
Cooperative Agreement with the WDFW.

[Machias]

Your friend must have done something besides just shooting a animal in someones woods, if it's not posted, fenced, cultivated etc.. he can be asked to leave, now if he refused because he wanted his animal then yes he could be charged.  But if your out walking in the woods and end up on private property that is none of the above you cannot be charged.

[BULLBLASTER]

i always thought that it didnt need to be posted. private is private. 

[Machias]

You are not required to post your property, but if it is none of the above applies to your land a person cannot be charged with criminal trespass.  You can ask them to leave and if they don't or if they show up again, then you can have them arrested.  Check out page 66 of the Fish and Game pamplet.

[skipper]

Well i guess the stevens county sheriff and the judge were wrong???

[skipper]

also you cannot just shoot the animal and then when asked to leave just walk away from it that would have been illegal as well

[Machias]

Or there is more to the story that your not aware of. 

Actually if they identify the land you are on as private and ask you to leave, you are required to leave and if they tell you to leave the deer, your required to leave it.  You would then go call the warden and see if he can help you retrieve your downed game.  No different then if you shoot a buck on public land and it runs over and dies on private property.  You have to get permission first.  The land owner can refuse to grant you permission.  You cannot then be charged with waste of game animal.

[bobcat]

I have always wondered if private timberlands would be considered "cultivated" or "used for commercial
agricultural crops."  If so then I guess you can't trespass even if it's not posted. I suppose it would depend on the sheriff and/or the judge's interpretation of the law.

[ICEMAN]

In my humble opinion, to walk onto anyones land, posted or not is Criminal Trespassing 2nd as defined in Washington State RCW.

Definitions, then the RCW...

RCW 9A.52.010
Definitions. 

The following definitions apply in this chapter:

     (1) "Premises" includes any building, dwelling, structure used for commercial aquaculture, or any real property;
     (2) "Enter". The word "enter" when constituting an element or part of a crime, shall include the entrance of the person, or the insertion of any part of his body, or any instrument or weapon held in his hand and used or intended to be used to threaten or intimidate a person or to detach or remove property;

     (3) "Enters or remains unlawfully". A person "enters or remains unlawfully" in or upon premises when he is not then licensed, invited, or otherwise privileged to so enter or remain.  http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9A.52.010

The RCW....
RCW 9A.52.080
Criminal trespass in the second degree. 

(1) A person is guilty of criminal trespass in the second degree if he knowingly enters or remains unlawfully in or upon premises of another under circumstances not constituting criminal trespass in the first degree.

     (2) Criminal trespass in the second degree is a misdemeanor. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9A.52.080


Machias, I know what you are saying...sort of....I would also imagine that not many prosecutors would prosecute for a real property trespass, without signage....but I still argue that it is illegal. Either way, we should not do it, we should all learn where we can and should be or hunt or whatever....

[BULLBLASTER]

does anyone know if CRP is cultivated? if not i need to got out there with some signs

[Machias]

Key word up there Iceman is "knowingly".  Once you are aware it is private you must leave or you can be charged.  If your hiking in the woods, cross no fence, there is NO indication you have suddenly walked onto private property, they cannot then pounce on you and charge you.  The landowner is protected, but so is joe public.

[ICEMAN]

Yep, I know mens rea well.

Officer; "Do you know who owns this land?"....."Uhhhhh..."

Officer; "If you dont know who owns the land, did you think you could just hunt it anyway?" "I was on state land back there somewhere..." 

Machias, how do guys crossing into other GMU's or crossing into National Parks get cited in your scenario...? It is the hunters responsibility...

Walking forward is knowingly. The reasonable man knows that property boundaries exist and are often unmarked.

The general rule under U.S. law is that "ignorance of the law or a mistake of law is no defense to criminal prosecution." (internet quote)

[Machias]

Because even the GMUs are marked, they all have some boundary, they are not grid coordinates somewhere in the woods.  One of the legs on the prosecutor's chair is generally intent.  Look at page 66 of the WDFW regs, spells it out pretty clear.  Land owners are NOT required to post their property, however if they own property with none of the above no one could know what is and what is not private and what is and what is not public.  Sorry Iceman but that is not the case, the walking forward is knowingly.  I dunno what to tell you other then if you wander onto private property that is not fenced, posted, cultivated, doesn't have buildings or a home on it you should not be charged, unless you refuse to leave once you have been made aware. 

[rasbo]

somebody told me it don't have to be posted in this state..If it isn't yours you should get permission in writing

[Machias]

somebody told me it don't have to be posted in this state..If it isn't yours you should get permission in writing

Agreed and completely true.

[bobcat]

somebody told me it don't have to be posted in this state..If it isn't yours you should get permission in writing

Well, that's true, a person is not required to post his property.  But if it's not posted, and also doesn't meet the other requirements, then somebody cannot be charged with trespass if they're on it. The key sentence from what Machias posted is this:

Entry onto any lands which are fenced, posted, cultivated, or used for commercial agricultural crops or aquaculture without permission is considered trespass.

[gasman]

I have always used, if you do not know if it is huntable, stay off.


It is not the owners responsabilaty to post, it is my (or your) resonsability to know where I (you) are at all times.\


Ignorance is no excuse........

[SGM R]

Crazy, no matter what the armchair lawyers tell you, it is still your responsibility to know where you are and ask permission when necessary..

Good luck

[seansfire]

Sorry guys , if it is not posted it is NOT trespassing. I just dealt with this issue with my land. I had a lady digging through a pile of stuff in my yard when i came home. She split when i got home. I called the cops and when they came out they asked her not to come back and told me that they could do nothing about it because my land was not posted. Now i have guns and signs.

[jager]

As was stated earlier it does not have to be posted.
Sorry Sean...maybe it wasn't worth their time to charge the woman. 
I am a landowner with no house on the property and it is posted.....not every 300', but it is posted.
It is fenced and surely if someone were to cross a barbed wire fence they could safely assume the property doesn't belong to them.
As far as any type of law enforcement assistance. It's a little had to stop someone in the woods and say wait while I call the cops, wait for them to drive out and then hike for another hour to reach the so called violators. I have always told the few folks that I've run across that they do not have permission to be there and ask them to leave. I am confident that each of those people knew they weren't supposed to be there.   

[seansfire]

could be. the sheriff out here is as lazy as they come. just saying what happened to me.

[bobcat]

As was stated earlier it does not have to be posted.

When you say that what do you mean? It's true a person does not have to post their property, but if it's not posted, fenced, cultivated, etc. then somebody on that property without your permission will not be charged with trespassing. So if you are trying to say that the property does not have to be posted in order to charge somebody with trespassing, well that is not true.

[Eli346]

 Actually, Manke gates are not off limits to walk in traffic; whether it be for hunting, hiking, or photos. They're pretty good about that but leave them closed to vehicle traffic because of all the littering. I don't blame them. Every time I go in I usually bring out a large garbage bag full of trash left behind. The offenders appear to be the very people they let in to pick brush, thin trees, and the loggers themselves. Go fugure.