Permit Change

[billythekidrock]

i may have missed these points while i was reading the "proposed" changes so heres my two questions.

1. do i have to by an application for each category i wish to put in for? ie. $5 app for big buck draw and another $5 app for a doe draw so my $5 fee from last year just doubled.

2. if if put in for both big buck and doe draws and i get drawn for both do i get to harvest two deer, do i get a transport tag for the big buck and the doe or is the state going to make me choose between the two and what happens to my points in the category of the tag i turned down?

Steve

Yes, seperate application for each category.

If drawn for multiple permits you get to choose which (or all) to pursue but can only kill one animal (unless it is a second deer permit) and you lose all points in all categories you were drawn in.

[bobcat]

It probably won't increase odds unless a lot of people decide to only apply in one category per species (deer/elk.)  If that happens then I could see some permits becoming easier to draw, but not all. It will depend on how much money people are willing to spend on applications. Also, if a person puts in for all the different categories, they may only put in for a point, which is what I will be doing. That is the same as not applying.

Now whether this new plan will decrease odds, I may be in the minority, but I don't think odds of drawing a permit will decrease significantly overall. Sure some of the most sought after permits will most likely get more applicants, because they will be in the "quality" category, which most everyone will apply for. But overall, you've still got the same number of hunters applying for permits, and the same number of permits, meaning odds shouldn't change all that much. Of course for those of us with only 1 or 2 points per species, odds are now terrible, especially for doe and cow permits.

Anyway there's really no way to predict how odds will change, just too many variables. We will know in about another 6 months. Just have to wait and see.

[Dansk]

It probably won't increase odds unless a lot of people decide to only apply in one category per species (deer/elk.)  If that happens then I could see some permits becoming easier to draw, but not all. It will depend on how much money people are willing to spend on applications. Also, if a person puts in for all the different categories, they may only put in for a point, which is what I will be doing. That is the same as not applying.

Now whether this new plan will decrease odds, I may be in the minority, but I don't think odds of drawing a permit will decrease significantly overall. Sure some of the most sought after permits will most likely get more applicants, because they will be in the "quality" category, which most everyone will apply for. But overall, you've still got the same number of hunters applying for permits, and the same number of permits, meaning odds shouldn't change all that much. Of course for those of us with only 1 or 2 points per species, odds are now terrible, especially for doe and cow permits.

Anyway there's really no way to predict how odds will change, just too many variables. We will know in about another 6 months. Just have to wait and see.

I agree - I also believe that if you have say 15+ pts, and apply for all categories, your chances of drawing "a" tag got better.  If you have 1-2 points, or only apply to 1 category (even with 15 points), your chances of drawing "a" tag are horrible.  I just think this system will favor people with the most points - they will be drawing more tags accross all the categories- so I still think thier overall odds for drawing a tag go up.

[Curly]

I would feel better about this if they made us choose one category for our points and the rest start at zero and dropped the choices from 4 to 2.

I agree.  I could support the new system somewhat if they changed that part......(not that they really care if I support the system.)

I email WDFW last week with the following email:

I have a question regarding the Proposed Hunting Special Permit changes.  In the FAQ section on the WDFW website, it states:

What happens to the points hunters have accumulated if these changes are made?

Hunters would retain the points they have accrued in years when they applied for a special hunting permit, but were not selected to receive one.  To ensure fairness, these points would be applied to each of the new subcategories created under the new proposal.  For example, if a deer hunter currently has 10 points, that hunter would be credited 10 points in each of the eight deer categories (e.g. buck, second antlerless, quality).  Future drawings would continue to be “weighted,” providing an advantage to hunters with the greatest number of points.

My question is, how does it “ensure fairness” to credit hunters their points in each of the categories?  It seems like it would be more fair for an applicant to be required to choose where they wanted to points to be, no simply give points in categories that the applicant has not earned them.
 

Thank you in advance for a reply to this question.

The reply I received was that I should expect a response within 5 business days.   I can't wait to see what they have to say.

[bobcat]

Curly,

Why don't you let me proofread that letter before you send it off? Just glancing at it a see a couple of mistakes.



Ooops, I see you already sent it. 

Oh well, they'll probably be able to decipher it. 


Seriously that's a good question to ask of them. I'm pretty sure the answer will be, whether they admit it or not, that doing it the way you suggest would be too complicated and would either be impossible or would simply take too much work.

[Curly]

I should have proofread it myself before I sent it......   I sent it after getting pissed off reading their website for the 4th time.....and it was pretty late when I wrote it.  But yes, they will get the idea and should be able to answer it.  I'm not sure I will ever get a reply to it since I'm sure they don't have a good answer....we'll see.

Yeah, I think it may make it more complicated for them, but to come out and say that the way they propose will "ensure fairness"......give me a break.

[SkookumHntr]

-Your question is a good question curly, I would like to hear there answer!

[bobcat]

Good point Curly. I don't know about you, but I also don't buy their claim that the extra revenue will be used to gain more access to private property for hunting. Yeah, right!  

I really don't mind paying a little extra to keep the WDFW in business, but come on, they shouldn't have to lie to us about it.

[Curly]

I'd rather they just increased the price of the permit applications a few dollars than do this big change.  I think most people would still apply if the increase was $3 per app.  But it does really sound like it's a done deal. 

If they've been planning it since last spring, then their minds are probably already made-up.  And they must be working on the new hunting regs and permit application wording in the regs right now.  I can't imagine how they would have time to change much after the public input meetings in Feb to get the regs out in time and get the draw and applications all set-up for this years draw if they don't already have everything all worked out at least to about a 95% level of completion by now.

They should also reduce the amount of choices, but then people would bitch saying that they are reducing their choices and increasing the price.......that wouldn't go over well with a lot of people.

[billythekidrock]

They should also reduce the amount of choices, but then people would bitch saying that they are reducing their choices and increasing the price.......that wouldn't go over well with a lot of people.

They will decrease the choices for "Quality" down to two.

My question is if they can do that, why can't they decrease the choices for all cagetories?

[Bigshooter]

They should also reduce the amount of choices, but then people would bitch saying that they are reducing their choices and increasing the price.......that wouldn't go over well with a lot of people.

They will decrease the choices for "Quality" down to two.

My question is if they can do that, why can't they decrease the choices for all cagetories?

That's a good question.  Maybe that will be something that they can be talked into doing.

[billythekidrock]

Anyway there's really no way to predict how odds will change, just too many variables. We will know in about another 6 months. Just have to wait and see.

I agree.
I just have a hard time seeing how a possible 26 hunt choices (depending on what you qualify for) per species will do anything good for the odds. (and how the hell do you come up with 26 choices each for deer and elk? lol)

Lets take the basics that most will be eligible for in the deer category. Buck, Antlerless and Quality.

Up to:
4 choices in Buck
4 choices in Antlerless
2 choices in Quality

That is ten choices for $15 (or more).
Last year it was 4 choices for $5.

If we have the same amount of applicants applying for the same amount of permits with more choices it seems that more people will NOT be drawn. Some people will be drawn for multiple permits. Permits that could have gone to others. Yes, the upside to that is they lose points in all categories, but the downside is others will miss out on permits.

Think of it like the lucky ones who draw more than 1 OIL tag in the same year. Makes some people a tad upset.

[Dry creek]

washington changing special-hunting permit draw good or bad

[Dry creek]

deer or elk

[SkookumHntr]

If it pans out how wdfw is wanting it, special permits will be so hard to draw that it will be pretty much just a waste of time to apply, but I dont have the money or vacation time to hunt in other states so for guys like me were stuck with it! WDFW SUCKS!!!!