Post by: huntnphool on June 24, 2012, 10:00:53 PM
Quote
All indications point to possible banner sockeye salmon returns
This summer could very well be the "Year of the Sockeye Salmon."
Sockeye returns are bountiful in the Columbia and Skagit river systems, but the unexpected highlight is the early robust counts for Lake Washington.
"The outlook on each of those fronts is really positive, and all seems to be playing out well and consistent for sockeye," said Pat Pattillo said. "You can't help but get excited when you see good returns, but we don't want people to get too worked up about any kind of fishery just yet on (Lake Washington)."
Through Thursday, 23,546 sockeye have been counted at the Ballard Locks, which is more than half of the preseason forecast of 45,871 in just the first 10-days of counting. Usually peak counts vary each year, but occurs between July 7 and July 15.
The single-day counts are: 1,633 fish on June 12; 687 on June 13; 532 on June 14; 2,183 on June 15; 3,062 on June 16; 1,724 on June 17; 1,515 on June 18; 2,241 on June 19; 6,421 on June 20; and 3,548 on June 21.
"At this point we have twice as many fish coming back to Lake Washington than we saw in 2006 (when a sport fishery last happened)," Pattillo said.
During that same time frame in 2006, only 12,785 sockeye had returned, but the bulk ended up surging in quite later than normal. That year, 470,000 sockeye allowed an 18-day sport fishery. Other fisheries occurred in 1996, 2000, 2002 and 2004.
The big urban lake has an escapement goal of 350,000 sockeye before any fisheries are considered.
"It's the highest number we've seen at this point including 2006 when we last had a fishery in Lake Washington," said Frank Urabeck, a longtime sport-fishing advocate and Cedar River Council member. "I think it will come in quite a bit stronger than the (preseason forecast of 45,871)."
"We need to reexamine that goal, and see if it can be lowered to 200,000 or 150,000 fish," Urabeck said. "It's an involved process that needs to be addressed between the tribes and state. If we can lower it then we'll be a lot closer to having more fisheries in the future."
Since 2006, sockeye returns have dropped close to historic lows, and the run last summer ended up at about 43,000.
Back in 2009, the sockeye fry entered the lake in low numbers so this summer's adult return wasn't expected to be that good.
One positive factor is these fish could be reaping benefits from an excellent ocean and freshwater conditions.
"If we get more fish in the hatchery, it will help us toward recovery, and eventually build up numbers to a point where we can have a fishery again not too far into the future," Urabeck said.
The new permanent hatchery on the Upper Cedar River just below Landsburg Dam can produce more than 34-million fry, but last year it only got 25 percent of that figure from spawned sockeye.
On the Columbia River, a record 462,000 sockeye are expected this summer, and so far the counts at Bonneville Dam are well above par as 137,925 have been tallied through June 21.
"Sockeye counts are definitely on the rise, and things are tracking pretty well," Joe Hymer, a state Fish and Wildlife biologist who said the record was in 2010 when about 288,000 returned.
"The sockeye were just pouring over the dam, and (Friday) they were counting 130 fish every seven minutes on one fish ladder alone," Hymer said. "In fact, they were seeing more sockeye than shad (1.9-million have been counted through June 21) so the counters were really excited."
On June 16, the single-day count at Bonneville was 11,955, and has continued to increase with a high of 22,164 by Thursday.
Hymer says they checked quite a few sockeye caught this week in the sport fishery down in Longview on the Lower Columbia, which means more are still heading upstream.
The huge Columbia sockeye return is due in part mainly to excellent production on the Okanogan River where the bulk of more than 430,000 are expected back.
"They've been doing some excellent production work in British Columbia's Okanogan system at places like Lake Shaka," Hymer said. "Much of this stems from additional rearing areas and improvements to water management."
The newly implemented Lower Skagit River sockeye fishery opened on June 16 with fairly good success for sport anglers.
"I am so happy in the river fishery when the bank guys catch more fish than the boat guys, and these fish are moving up near shore so they're really accessible to the bank guys," Pattillo said. "We've just gotten scant information on how things are shaping up for the sockeye in the Skagit system, and it seems to be tracking consistently with forecast."
Those fish are part of a return of 35,366 headed for the Baker River, a tributary of the Skagit, where through June 19, 165 fish have been trapped and 135 transferred to Baker Lake.
The Upper Skagit Tribe conducted their first test fishery last week and caught three fish, but this week it ramped up to 45.
Baker Lake will also open for sockeye fishing on July 1, but the action won't likely pick up until mid-July.
Post by: LabChamp on June 24, 2012, 10:39:38 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on June 24, 2012, 11:17:47 PM
Post by: doyourtime89 on June 25, 2012, 09:00:35 AM
Post by: Holg3107 on June 25, 2012, 09:15:47 AM
Post by: h20hunter on June 25, 2012, 09:21:35 AM
Here is they way to do it. Run smaller rods and lighter line. Tie two hooks.....red or purple and put them on a 20 inch or so 40 lb leader. Tie leader to small chrome dodger. Troll very very very slowly....you just want your dodger rocking back and forth. They will hit those bare hooks just fine. You can use a little krill scent if you want. Also, do NOT run your lines way the hell behind the boat. I keep my gear about 12-15 feet behind the boat. Long lines will create a nightmare.
Thats about it.
Follow the regs regarding any and all gear. Have your license and punch card. They will and do add enforcement. Respect other boaters, know you are combat trolling, be prepared for a tangle or two, and boat safe.
Post by: h20hunter on June 25, 2012, 09:23:22 AM
Post by: Holg3107 on June 25, 2012, 09:29:19 AM
Post by: h20hunter on June 25, 2012, 09:31:13 AM
Post by: WSU on June 25, 2012, 09:46:58 AM
Post by: Skillet on June 25, 2012, 10:03:49 AM
Post by: Buckmark on June 25, 2012, 10:07:01 AM
Post by: Button Nubbs on June 25, 2012, 10:20:07 AM
Post by: Skillet on June 25, 2012, 10:25:38 AM
Post by: mp.hunter on June 25, 2012, 10:34:39 AM
Post by: Holg3107 on June 25, 2012, 11:08:14 AM
Post by: iRem on June 25, 2012, 11:10:47 AM
Post by: doyourtime89 on June 25, 2012, 12:45:40 PM
Daily Counts Total Count
June 18 1,515 11,336
June 19 2,241 13,577
June 20 6,421 19,999
June 21 3,548 23,546
June 22 1,839 25,385
June 23 1,883 27,268
June 24 4,100 31,368
Post by: huntnphool on June 25, 2012, 03:41:08 PM
I would agree the key is light gear. I use steelhead gear, 8# mainline and 4 rods off of downriggers. Over the years I have found one dodger that seems to out catch sockeye 5-1 and I have tried most, you can see it in one of the pics. Its a Les Davis "0", brass/chrome with a single red Gami about 18" behind.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on June 26, 2012, 04:45:30 PM
Post by: LabChamp on June 28, 2012, 08:32:20 AM
June 18 1,515 11,336
June 19 2,241 13,577
June 20 6,421 19,999
June 21 3,548 23,546
June 22 1,839 25,385
June 23 1,883 27,268
June 24 4,100 31,368
June 25 5,823 37,191
June 26 1,780 38,971
:drool:
Post by: huntnphool on June 28, 2012, 12:18:20 PM
Post by: mkcj on June 28, 2012, 12:45:27 PM
Post by: NRA4LIFE on June 28, 2012, 01:23:48 PM
Post by: h20hunter on June 28, 2012, 01:27:13 PM
Post by: Dan-o on June 28, 2012, 01:39:33 PM
Post by: D-Rock425 on June 28, 2012, 01:41:36 PM
Post by: h20hunter on June 28, 2012, 01:47:51 PM
Post by: WSU on June 28, 2012, 01:55:58 PM
Post by: huntnphool on June 28, 2012, 03:40:35 PM
Where do you guys put in? Seems like the ramps would be a major pain.Launching your boat is the easy part, finding a place to park is the issue. I launch in Renton at Gene Coulon, we used to be able to park across the street when Boeing owned the land around there. Now its Fry's Electronics so you can't park there.
Post by: Button Nubbs on June 28, 2012, 03:43:38 PM
Soon as it opens.....
what time? :chuckle: i know of a couple not-so used launches...
Post by: mkcj on June 28, 2012, 03:46:35 PM
Post by: huntnphool on June 29, 2012, 01:03:04 PM
Quote
Update from today's Seattle Times:
Lake Washington sockeye exceeds the preseason forecast with the third largest single-day count on Thursday
Posted by Mark Yuasa
All it took was 16 days of counting at the Ballard Locks for the sockeye numbers to exceed the preseason forecast 45,871.
Through Thursday, June 28, the inseason count is now up to 47,781, and the single-day count was the third largest so far this season at 5,080.
"The sockeye counts from the Locks continue to rise to levels well over recent historic returns," Bill Robinson a member of the Seattle Public Utilities Cedar River HCP Oversight Committee said in an email.
"If I do my calculations correctly, I think that the peak of the return occurs around (July 17) with fairly solid returns through mid-August," Robinson said. "Followed by a dropoff into September."
"We can all hope for a continuation of the strong returns for the next several weeks," Robinson said. "While these numbers won't lead to a fishery, they will "seed" both the Cedar River ecosystem and the north Lake Washington, which will perhaps lead to future harvestable numbers of sockeye returning."
Many are wondering if this is just some anomaly, but there have been only two days of counting where the sockeye numbered 687 (June 13) and 532 (June 14). Since then the counts have stayed above 1,515 and the biggest single-day count was 6,421 on June 20.
Usually peak counts vary each year, but occurs between July 7 and July 15.
The single-day counts are: 1,633 fish on June 12; 687 on June 13; 532 on June 14; 2,183 on June 15; 3,062 on June 16; 1,724 on June 17; 1,515 on June 18; 2,241 on June 19; 6,421 on June 20; 3,548 on June 21; 1,839 on June 22; 1,883 on June 23; 4,100 on June 24; 5,823 on June 25; 1,780 on June 26; 3,730 on June 27; and 5,080 on June 28.
Those monitoring the returns say the majority of sockeye are made up of bigger wild five-year-old sockeye. When these fish were in the freshwater environment they encountered decent water conditions and no major flooding, which probably led to a stronger survival rate. Add to that good ocean conditions when they migrated out.
During this same time frame in 2006, 44,168 sockeye had returned, but the bulk ended up surging in quite later than normal. That year, 470,000 sockeye allowed an 18-day sport fishery.
Other fisheries occurred in 1996, 2000, 2002 and 2004.
Anything can happen at this point, but one person who has been keeping an eye on the Lake Washington sockeye stock for many years says by extrapolating from the 2007, 2009, 2010 and 2011 runs would produce estimates for 2012 of 140,317, 90,435, 279,835 and 149,462, respectively.
He predicts the this summer's Lake Washington sockeye run would be between 100,000 and 150,000.
The big urban lake has an escapement goal of 350,000 sockeye before any fisheries are considered.
Some are saying the goal is much higher than needed, and should be more in the range of 150,000 to 200,000. Those close to the Lake Washington sockeye management issues are planning on meeting in the fall or early winter to discuss the goal figure and other topics related to the fish.
Since 2006, sockeye returns have dropped close to historic lows, and the run last summer ended up at about 43,000.
Back in 2009, the sockeye fry entered the lake in low numbers so this summer's adult return wasn't expected to be that good.
One positive factor is these fish could be reaping benefits from an excellent ocean and freshwater conditions.
The new permanent hatchery on the Upper Cedar River just below Landsburg Dam can produce more than 34-million fry, but last year it only got 25 percent of that figure from spawned adult sockeye. A run above 100,000 this summer could raise the bar in production number of spawning fish at the new facility.
Post by: oldcamper on June 29, 2012, 07:38:40 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on June 29, 2012, 08:21:56 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 05, 2012, 04:16:47 PM
Post by: CastleRocker on July 05, 2012, 04:54:50 PM
I was a commercial fisherman in AK for 12 years, and many of the sockeye runs there were directly influenced by the unregulated catch of sockeye by the Japanese high seas gillnet fleet.
This past year, there was a tsunami over in Japan that wiped out a huge portion of their high seas fleet. (You may have heard about it...). I'm SURE it's just a coincidence that we now have record runs of sockeye just about everywhere. I know it must be a combination of our fantastic fisheries management, and other natural ocean conditions that I've read about on the WDFW site. Just kind of makes me say hmmmm.
I LOVE sockeye!
Post by: huntnphool on July 05, 2012, 05:58:37 PM
Post by: Dan-o on July 05, 2012, 06:16:43 PM
Almost double what they predicted the entire run would be so far but I don't think it will hit the escapement goal.
Oh, PLEASE, Oh, Please, Oh, Please............
Post by: huntnphool on July 09, 2012, 09:33:06 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 09, 2012, 09:46:02 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on July 09, 2012, 09:48:20 PM
Post by: Swannytheswan on July 09, 2012, 10:01:45 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 14, 2012, 04:08:42 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on July 14, 2012, 04:21:34 PM
Post by: Button Nubbs on July 14, 2012, 04:24:08 PM
Post by: doyourtime89 on July 14, 2012, 04:44:57 PM
20k below '06. not lookin good unless we get a major push.
:yeah:
I am starting to get worried :bash:
Post by: huntnphool on June 27, 2013, 04:53:29 PM
Post by: Holg3107 on June 27, 2013, 04:57:34 PM
Post by: cohoho on June 27, 2013, 05:41:43 PM
Post by: _TONY_ on June 27, 2013, 05:47:09 PM
Post by: Cap.Silver on June 27, 2013, 07:23:46 PM
Post by: cohoho on June 27, 2013, 09:21:55 PM
I live on the lake, right up from the mouth of the cedar... Boats docked and ready to go!!
Even better... Perfect if it goes down, thoughts on that?
Post by: huntnphool on June 27, 2013, 09:29:11 PM
Through Thursday, 5,202 sockeye have been counted that are headed for tributaries such as the Cedar River and other smaller creeks in Lake Washington.
You can almost reach out and touch the sockeye at the Ballard Locks fish ladder, they're so close. Jay Wells, program director of visitor services, discusses the return of sockeye salmon to people who gathered Friday afternoon.
The first two days of Lake Washington sockeye counts have started off strong at the Ballard Locks fish ladder.
Through Thursday, 5,202 sockeye have been counted that are headed for tributaries such as the Cedar River and other smaller creeks in Lake Washington.
“I’m optimistic there might be more sockeye than predicted,” said Pat Pattillo, the state Fish and Wildlife salmon policy coordinator. “It is such a dynamic run, and we can’t make anything of the first two days of counting.”
This summer’s forecast of 96,866 sockeye falls well short of the 350,000 spawning escapement needed before any fisheries can be considered.
“We are off to a good start, the best since 2005,” said Frank Urabeck, a member of the Cedar River Council and sport fishing advocate. “Sockeye could be early, although what we have seen so far is encouraging.”
Only 17 million sockeye fry entered the lake from Cedar River in 2010, survivors of which would be 4-year-old adults coming back this summer.
The last time Lake Washington was open for sport sockeye fishing was 2006 when 453,543 fish returned. In 2009, the actual return dipped to 22,166 sockeye.
Other years a fishery was held include 2004, 2002, 2000 and 1996. Last summer, 145,815 returned compared to a preseason forecast of 45,871. More than 20 million fry were released into the lake earlier this spring.
Post by: Wacenturion on June 29, 2013, 08:31:18 AM
Post by: singleshot12 on June 29, 2013, 11:23:37 AM
Post by: Dustin07 on June 30, 2013, 04:14:31 PM
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwdfw.wa.gov%2Ffishing%2Fcounts%2Fsockeye%2Fchinook_chart.jpg&hash=2214edd9442fd87c51581b49d32103d44cf00594)
Post by: Rainier10 on June 30, 2013, 04:32:56 PM
Open, open, open....please.
Post by: snowpack on June 30, 2013, 04:35:13 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on June 30, 2013, 04:38:33 PM
Post by: Rainier10 on June 30, 2013, 04:45:02 PM
Here are the numbers I was looking at.
Current year daily totals.
http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/index.html (http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/index.html)
Past years totals.
http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/archives.html (http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/archives.html)
Post by: Dustin07 on July 01, 2013, 08:54:08 AM
Post by: WAcoueshunter on July 01, 2013, 09:49:31 AM
But then again, we're also not that far ahead of 2012, when it petered out at 144K.
Anyway, still a great start. Fingers crossed!
Post by: Rainier10 on July 08, 2013, 03:20:03 PM
Post by: h20hunter on July 08, 2013, 03:22:07 PM
Post by: X-Force on July 08, 2013, 03:26:30 PM
Gonna get bashed for this I'm sure....I'm hoping there is no season. I've got get out crabbing, humpy fishing, general season bear opening, bow practicing, and still spend a little time with the family. I'm simply not ready this year!
:chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: huntnphool on July 08, 2013, 04:27:21 PM
Looks like we are now behind 06 but still ahead of 04 and 02.As of 7/7 we are at 130k, same day in '06 we were at 97k, not sure which stats you are looking at. :dunno:
Post by: magnanimous_j on July 08, 2013, 04:34:16 PM
Post by: Buckmark on July 08, 2013, 04:38:04 PM
Gonna get bashed for this I'm sure....I'm hoping there is no season. I've got get out crabbing, humpy fishing, general season bear opening, bow practicing, and still spend a little time with the family. I'm simply not ready this year!Dude, come on even you can catch these in no time, like an hr max, off the water and home by 8-9am easy, still time for a pedicure... :chuckle:
Post by: huntnphool on July 08, 2013, 05:10:40 PM
:chuckle:Gonna get bashed for this I'm sure....I'm hoping there is no season. I've got get out crabbing, humpy fishing, general season bear opening, bow practicing, and still spend a little time with the family. I'm simply not ready this year!off the water and home by 8-9am easy, still time for a pedicure... :chuckle:
Post by: Rainier10 on July 08, 2013, 05:33:55 PM
Not sure what I was looking at, too many numbers on that past history screen, I must have been on the wrong chart as I scrolled down.Looks like we are now behind 06 but still ahead of 04 and 02.As of 7/7 we are at 130k, same day in '06 we were at 97k, not sure which stats you are looking at. :dunno:
Note to self wear your reading glasses even if you don't think you need them.
Post by: huntnphool on July 08, 2013, 05:43:12 PM
Just didn't want you wondering what's going on when guys start posting up pics of their limits. ;)Not sure what I was looking at, too many numbers on that past history screen, I must have been on the wrong chart as I scrolled down.Looks like we are now behind 06 but still ahead of 04 and 02.As of 7/7 we are at 130k, same day in '06 we were at 97k, not sure which stats you are looking at. :dunno:
Note to self wear your reading glasses even if you don't think you need them.
Post by: Rainier10 on July 08, 2013, 05:50:55 PM
Thanks, I will keep my schedule clear and get my pedicure now so I am ready if it does open.Just didn't want you wondering what's going on when guys start posting up pics of their limits. ;)Not sure what I was looking at, too many numbers on that past history screen, I must have been on the wrong chart as I scrolled down.Looks like we are now behind 06 but still ahead of 04 and 02.As of 7/7 we are at 130k, same day in '06 we were at 97k, not sure which stats you are looking at. :dunno:
Note to self wear your reading glasses even if you don't think you need them.
I would love to know what type of revenue the sockeye season generates in gear sales, parking fees and businesses around the lake.
Post by: Rainier10 on July 08, 2013, 05:59:53 PM
Looking again I had it backwards, we are ahead of 06, and behind 04 and 02. Not very far behind 02 though.Not sure what I was looking at, too many numbers on that past history screen, I must have been on the wrong chart as I scrolled down.Looks like we are now behind 06 but still ahead of 04 and 02.As of 7/7 we are at 130k, same day in '06 we were at 97k, not sure which stats you are looking at. :dunno:
Note to self wear your reading glasses even if you don't think you need them.
Open, open, open...
Post by: lokidog on July 08, 2013, 10:28:31 PM
Thanks, I will keep my schedule clear and get my pedicure now so I am ready if it does open.Just didn't want you wondering what's going on when guys start posting up pics of their limits. ;)Not sure what I was looking at, too many numbers on that past history screen, I must have been on the wrong chart as I scrolled down.Looks like we are now behind 06 but still ahead of 04 and 02.As of 7/7 we are at 130k, same day in '06 we were at 97k, not sure which stats you are looking at. :dunno:
Note to self wear your reading glasses even if you don't think you need them.
I would love to know what type of revenue the sockeye season generates in gear sales, parking fees and businesses around the lake.
More in parking tickets than anything else. :bash: Years ago, I tucked my boat trailer under my truck so as to take up little space, and got a ticket for it. What a bunch of BS.
What's to prevent people from catching sockeye in Area 10 outside of the entrance to Lake WA? I got one out by San Juan two years ago. The regs don't say you cannot do so. :dunno:
Post by: Rainier10 on July 09, 2013, 07:38:06 AM
Post by: CP on July 09, 2013, 08:10:30 AM
What's to prevent people from catching sockeye in Area 10 outside of the entrance to Lake WA? I got one out by San Juan two years ago. The regs don't say you cannot do so. :dunno:
Perfectly legal, but not easy to do.
Post by: Rainier10 on July 16, 2013, 10:08:48 PM
Post by: Rainier10 on July 22, 2013, 07:39:13 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on July 22, 2013, 09:12:15 PM
Post by: huntnphool on June 26, 2016, 11:06:47 PM
Post by: lokidog on June 27, 2016, 09:21:21 AM
What's to prevent people from catching sockeye in Area 10 outside of the entrance to Lake WA? I got one out by San Juan two years ago. The regs don't say you cannot do so. :dunno:
Perfectly legal, but not easy to do.
We put 8 or ten into the boat last summer, including one over ten pounds, off of San Juan. These fish were probably heading for the Fraser though.
Post by: WSU on June 27, 2016, 09:39:32 AM
What's to prevent people from catching sockeye in Area 10 outside of the entrance to Lake WA? I got one out by San Juan two years ago. The regs don't say you cannot do so. :dunno:
Perfectly legal, but not easy to do.
We put 8 or ten into the boat last summer, including one over ten pounds, off of San Juan. These fish were probably heading for the Fraser though.
The Fraser gets millions. I'm sure that helps.
Post by: WAPatriot on June 27, 2016, 09:53:15 AM
Post by: WSU on June 27, 2016, 09:55:54 AM
If it wasn't for the Indians netting the living piss out of these fish before we can get a count on them, we could have a fishery every year. How does the 50/50 thing work with this fishery Indians get to catch as much as they want literally nets in front of the fish latter. White man hasn't be able to fish it in over a decade.
Situations like that and the Puyallup really beg the question: why are we, through our license fees, paying to release hatchery fish in locations where the only ones that catch them are the tribes?
Post by: WAPatriot on June 27, 2016, 09:56:27 AM
What's to prevent people from catching sockeye in Area 10 outside of the entrance to Lake WA? I got one out by San Juan two years ago. The regs don't say you cannot do so. :dunno:
Perfectly legal, but not easy to do.
We put 8 or ten into the boat last summer, including one over ten pounds, off of San Juan. These fish were probably heading for the Fraser though.
What's the ticket for getting them in the salt?
Post by: WSU on June 27, 2016, 09:58:34 AM
Post by: WAcoueshunter on June 27, 2016, 10:01:47 AM
Is this the year we finally get to fish the lake again? http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/lake-washinton-sockeye-counts-are-still-increasing-at-a-decent-rate/
Wouldn't that be nice, take some sting out of no coho fishing. It's been a long time since we've been able to fish the lake.
Post by: WAPatriot on June 27, 2016, 10:05:11 AM
When I've done it it was small flasher and pretty short leader to a small pink squid.
What speed/depth is it similar to catching um in the lakes. Dodger and supper slow.
Post by: WSU on June 27, 2016, 10:23:43 AM
Post by: lokidog on June 28, 2016, 09:01:12 PM
What's to prevent people from catching sockeye in Area 10 outside of the entrance to Lake WA? I got one out by San Juan two years ago. The regs don't say you cannot do so. :dunno:
Perfectly legal, but not easy to do.
We put 8 or ten into the boat last summer, including one over ten pounds, off of San Juan. These fish were probably heading for the Fraser though.
What's the ticket for getting them in the salt?
Being out there fishing.... 8)
Seriously, I rig basically for Kings and catch Kings, Pinks, and Sockeye, no Coho last year though. The Sockeye hit off downriggers and even the dive plane (set up with small dodger and short leader for pinks), they hit Coho Killers and Hoochies, no rhyme or reason, unfortunately.
If it wasn't for the Indians netting the living piss out of these fish before we can get a count on them, we could have a fishery every year. How does the 50/50 thing work with this fishery Indians get to catch as much as they want literally nets in front of the fish latter. White man hasn't be able to fish it in over a decade.
I've always wondered this as well. Throw in the fact that they get to keep EVERY SINGLE FISH they catch in the purse seines and gillnets right next to where we have to release at least 30% of the fish we catch. :bash:
Post by: huntnphool on June 29, 2016, 02:50:49 PM
Post by: bassquatch on June 30, 2016, 08:29:32 PM
Here's a pic from 1988, talk about chaos lol
Post by: hunthard on June 30, 2016, 08:37:15 PM
Post by: huntnphool on June 30, 2016, 08:40:26 PM
What months is this fishery usually open? Thought the lake was to close again Sept 1st?
Here's a pic from 1988, talk about chaos lol
Here are some pics for you Bass. http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,100116.msg1301554.html#msg1301554
End of July and into August were typical.
Post by: hunthard on June 30, 2016, 09:24:08 PM
Post by: h20hunter on June 30, 2016, 09:29:43 PM
Post by: cavemann on July 01, 2016, 11:05:03 AM
Post by: Widgeondeke on July 01, 2016, 11:26:10 AM
Escapement goal is 350,000 fish, currently sitting just under 120,000
:twocents: is we will come up just short @ 320,000 :'(
Post by: CP on July 01, 2016, 11:48:46 AM
Post by: huntnphool on July 01, 2016, 11:53:23 AM
Combat fishing at its best :yike:
Escapement goal is 350,000 fish, currently sitting just under 120,000
:twocents: is we will come up just short @ 320,000 :'(
They are negotiating a fishery if the run hits 200k, this years run estimate is 119k. The current count is 24,763. http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/
Post by: Widgeondeke on July 01, 2016, 12:18:36 PM
Combat fishing at its best :yike:
Escapement goal is 350,000 fish, currently sitting just under 120,000
:twocents: is we will come up just short @ 320,000 :'(
They are negotiating a fishery if the run hits 200k, this years run estimate is 119k. The current count is 24,763. http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/
oops you are correct.. I put in the run estimate amount instead of current count :bdid: I had checked the counts, last 3 days. just shy of 8k
Post by: doyourtime89 on July 03, 2016, 03:00:42 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 03, 2016, 03:07:56 PM
Don't get me wrong I would LOVE to fish Lake Wa again for some sockeye but giving the state of all the salmon runs around here. Why in the hell would we want to lower the number of fish to 200k from 350k to allow fishing.
With the new hatchery I believe they process the fish better and have less mortality with the eggs/smolt? :dunno:
Post by: skidynastar33 on July 03, 2016, 05:40:56 PM
Don't get me wrong I would LOVE to fish Lake Wa again for some sockeye but giving the state of all the salmon runs around here. Why in the hell would we want to lower the number of fish to 200k from 350k to allow fishing.
Because 350000 is an extremely rediculas number. 200000 even seems high. Plus you have hatchery fish coming back every year now. There should be a hatchery season every year. This is not a native run any ways... As far as I have learned. Plus imagine the $$$ put into the economy from this fishery!
Post by: skidynastar33 on July 03, 2016, 05:48:00 PM
Post by: GEARHEAD on July 03, 2016, 07:37:24 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on July 03, 2016, 08:57:01 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 10, 2016, 10:34:33 PM
Post by: Dan-o on July 10, 2016, 10:58:29 PM
Up to 40k, hoping they really start showing in high numbers, we need another 160k
I wish.
I love the Lake Washington Sockeye fishery. It's the only combat fishery I participate in...... I don't know why I like it so much....
When is the hatchery supposed to really kick in?
Post by: bearpaw on July 11, 2016, 12:50:45 PM
Can you catch and release in these closed fisheries until they open to keep the fish?
Post by: huntnphool on July 11, 2016, 01:00:49 PM
Maybe someone already addressed this, I didn't read all the posts! :sry:
Can you catch and release in these closed fisheries until they open to keep the fish?
No, be sure to release any accidentally caught while trolling for trout too!
Post by: CP on July 11, 2016, 03:09:04 PM
Maybe someone already addressed this, I didn't read all the posts! :sry:
Can you catch and release in these closed fisheries until they open to keep the fish?
No, be sure to release any accidentally caught while trolling for trout too!
Any sockeye under 15" is legally a KOKANEE and may be retained.
Post by: huntnphool on July 15, 2016, 03:31:55 PM
WDFW FISHING RULE CHANGE
Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife
600 Capitol Way North, Olympia, WA 98501-1091
http://wdfw.wa.gov
July 15, 2016
Lake Wenatchee sockeye fishery opens July 20
Action: Lake Wenatchee opens for sockeye salmon fishing.
Effective date/time: July 20 (one hour before official sunrise) until further notice.
Species affected: Sockeye salmon
Daily limit: The daily limit per angler is 6 sockeye, 12 inches in length or greater.
Location: Lake Wenatchee (Chelan County)
Reason for action: Based on current sockeye passage analysis at both Tumwater Dam and mainstem Columbia River Dams, at least 60,000 total sockeye are projected to be destined for Lake Wenatchee. This provides an estimated 37,000 sockeye to be available for harvest above the natural spawning escapement goal of 23,000 fish.
Other information: Selective gear rules are in effect (up to three single barbless hooks per line, no bait or scent allowed, knotless nets required). A night closure will be in effect. Anglers may fish with 2 poles as long as they possess a valid two-pole endorsement. Legal angling hours are one hour before sunrise to one hour after sunset. Bull trout, steelhead, and chinook salmon must be released unharmed without removing the fish from the water.
NOTE: The Lake Wenatchee sockeye fishery may close on short notice depending on participation and catch rates. Anglers are advised to check the fishing hotline at 360-902-2500 or WDFW's website daily at https://fortress.wa.gov/dfw/erules/efishrules/rules_all_freshwater.j.
Anglers are required to possess a Columbia River Salmon/Steelhead Endorsement as part of their valid fishing license and catch record card. Revenue from the endorsement supports salmon or steelhead seasons in the Columbia Basin, including enforcement and monitoring the upper Columbia River fisheries. The endorsement has generated more than $1 million annually for WDFW to maintain and increase fishing opportunities throughout the Columbia River basin.
Information contact: Travis Maitland, District 7 Fish Biologist, (509) 665-3337 (Wenatchee District Office). Jeff Korth, Region 2 Fish Program Manager (509) 754-4624.
Fishers must have a current Washington fishing license, appropriate to the fishery. Check the WDFW "Fishing in Washington" rules pamphlet for details on fishing seasons and regulations. Fishing rules are subject to change. Check the WDFW Fishing hotline for the latest rule information at (360) 902-2500, press 2 for recreational rules. For the Shellfish Rule Change hotline call (360)796-3215 or toll free 1-866-880-5431.
Persons with disabilities who need to receive this information in an alternative format or who need reasonable accommodations to participate in WDFW-sponsored public meetings or other activities may contact Dolores Noyes by phone (360-902-2349), TTY (360-902-2207), or email (dolores.noyes@dfw.wa.gov). For more information, see http://wdfw.wa.gov/accessibility/reasonable_request.html.
Post by: bullfisher on July 15, 2016, 07:29:54 PM
I wish someone would would have the now how and stones to fight the native bureaucracy.
Post by: hunthard on July 16, 2016, 09:21:41 AM
Post by: huntnphool on June 21, 2017, 11:57:10 AM
http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/
Post by: Mfowl on June 21, 2017, 12:03:57 PM
Could this be the year?
http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/
It would sure be nice but.....
Post by: WAcoueshunter on June 21, 2017, 12:43:05 PM
Could this be the year?
http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/
We can dream!
Year to date we are way ahead of the last couple years, although still a drop in the bucket. Pre season forecast is only 77k, for whatever that's worth.
Post by: huntnphool on June 21, 2017, 12:44:33 PM
Could this be the year?
http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/
We can dream!
Year to date we are way ahead of the last couple years, although still a drop in the bucket. Pre season forecast is only 77k, for whatever that's worth.
I bet it gets up to about 150k this year, twice their forecast.
Post by: Stein on June 21, 2017, 01:27:17 PM
Post by: skidynastar33 on June 21, 2017, 10:29:12 PM
Post by: Stein on June 22, 2017, 02:10:39 PM
Post by: WAcoueshunter on June 23, 2017, 09:36:47 PM
If not a crazy big run, still interesting to see so many so early. We're ahead of pace from 2006, the last season we had, finishing with 418K. But in 2013, we had twice this many by 6/22, and finished with 178K. :dunno:
Post by: huntnphool on June 23, 2017, 09:51:51 PM
Post by: jmscon on June 23, 2017, 09:52:49 PM
Post by: Stein on June 23, 2017, 09:53:59 PM
I'm betting they give us a short season if they get 100k+
Can't, it's already set in stone at 350k fish before we get a crack.
Post by: huntnphool on June 23, 2017, 09:58:10 PM
I'm betting they give us a short season if they get 100k+
Can't, it's already set in stone at 350k fish before we get a crack.
They've talked about changing it and allowing a fishery if it reached 150k the last couple years, if it gets there this year I'll bet they give us something. :twocents:
Post by: Jake Dogfish on June 24, 2017, 07:48:10 AM
I agree the 350k number is not realistic.
I'm not sure our current wdfw leadership will be able to do anything about it.
There was talk on the radio of changing our hatcheries to coho, if they won't let us fish for sockeye.
Post by: huntnphool on June 28, 2017, 09:37:54 AM
Reading the WDFW sockeye page I couldn't help but laugh at this...
Quote
2017 Pre-season Sockeye Forecast
The pre-season forecast for the 2017 sockeye return is 77,292. The estimate is based primarily upon sibling relationships in recent years (2012-2014). Since lake and marine survival rates are highly variable from year to year, the actual return to Lake Washington could be higher or lower than 77,292.
So basically they are saying they have no freakin clue! :chuckle:
Post by: huntnphool on July 03, 2017, 03:22:44 PM
Post by: Rainier10 on July 03, 2017, 04:22:13 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 03, 2017, 04:55:14 PM
Looks like the experts were right when they said it could be higher or lower. :chuckle:
Yeah, they really went out on a limb with that forecast didn't they. :mor:
Post by: Rainier10 on July 03, 2017, 05:22:22 PM
The estimated number, 77,292 , made me think wow they really put some thought into this. Why not 70,000, 75,000 or 70-80,000? 77,292? Okay. But the old "could be higher or lower" sounds right on the money/ "we really have no clue".Looks like the experts were right when they said it could be higher or lower. :chuckle:
Yeah, they really went out on a limb with that forecast didn't they. :mor:
Hopefully we have a season, that is always a good time and really fun if you have little kids.
Post by: huntnphool on July 03, 2017, 05:25:42 PM
The estimated number, 77,292 , made me think wow they really put some thought into this. Why not 70,000, 75,000 or 70-80,000? 77,292? Okay. But the old "could be higher or lower" sounds right on the money/ "we really have no clue".Looks like the experts were right when they said it could be higher or lower. :chuckle:
Yeah, they really went out on a limb with that forecast didn't they. :mor:
Hopefully we have a season, that is always a good time and really fun if you have little kids.
Exactly, they are so accurate with their forecast they can predict it right down to the lack of 8 fish that would have rounded it to 77,300, or the 2 that would have had it at 77,290, yet hedge their "expert analysis" with "could be higher/could be lower" :chuckle:
Post by: huntnphool on July 05, 2017, 08:16:11 PM
Post by: jmscon on July 05, 2017, 08:41:14 PM
Feels like there is a person in a room with six darts and a dart board. Here's the number for the year!
Post by: Stein on July 05, 2017, 08:45:26 PM
They have a models with inputs and it kicks out several numbers depending on the formula and inputs. They report that number. It really isn't more complicated or sinister than that.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: huntnphool on July 05, 2017, 08:48:04 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 05, 2017, 08:54:52 PM
So you guys expect them to take an estimate of the outgoing fry, predict ocean survival for a couple of years and then know exactly to the fish how many are coming back?
They have a models with inputs and it kicks out several numbers depending on the formula and inputs. They report that number. It really isn't more complicated or sinister than that.
And how much money/time is spent on these models, formula and input when in the end the determining factor is the count through the locks?
Why spend money on that system when they can simply say "we will know if there is a fishery after the counts are done"?
Seems to me any money spent on this meaningless, inaccurate system could be better spent elsewhere. :dunno:
Post by: jmscon on July 08, 2017, 04:16:03 PM
Post by: WAcoueshunter on July 09, 2017, 06:22:03 PM
Post by: jmscon on July 09, 2017, 07:44:01 PM
Post by: Gobble Doc on July 09, 2017, 09:11:01 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 09, 2017, 11:08:13 PM
If the bolt decision allows indians 50% of the harvest, where is our 50%?
Post by: WAcoueshunter on July 10, 2017, 09:12:43 AM
If the bolt decision allows indians 50% of the harvest, where is our 50%?
That's what I keep wondering. How is it that they get 100% of the take in this run?
Post by: Rainier10 on July 10, 2017, 09:31:10 AM
Our 50% is needed so that there are salmon in the future for us to split 50/50. Their 50% is 100% of the harvest and our 50% is 100% to conservation and preserving the run. It's a team effort. It's pretty simple really. :chuckle:
If the bolt decision allows indians 50% of the harvest, where is our 50%?
That's what I keep wondering. How is it that they get 100% of the take in this run?
Post by: Fl0und3rz on July 10, 2017, 10:03:22 AM
Post by: lokidog on July 10, 2017, 11:09:13 AM
Our 50% is needed so that there are salmon in the future for us to split 50/50. Their 50% is 100% of the harvest and our 50% is 100% to conservation and preserving the run. It's a team effort. It's pretty simple really. :chuckle:
If the bolt decision allows indians 50% of the harvest, where is our 50%?
That's what I keep wondering. How is it that they get 100% of the take in this run?
Sadly too true for words..... :bash:
Post by: Whitpirate on July 10, 2017, 11:19:29 AM
:bash: :bash: :bash:
Post by: huntnphool on July 13, 2017, 03:05:08 PM
Quote
"WDFW,
I am very curious to know in what way it is ok for the Tribe(s) to be netting the Ballard Locks at low water, with the gates closed?
This is happening as we speak, and a crowd of tourists are clapping with each fish netted.
I understand that there are certain privileges given to the tribes for fishing and hunting.
This seems to me to be taking clear advantage of the system. I might be wrong, and that is what I would like to know.
But to be able to have the locks shut the gates, and then net... That to me just doesn't seem right.
I am not trying to stir the pot, but would like to know if this is really allowed, or if this is a special program?
Thankyou."
Post by: Dhoey07 on July 13, 2017, 03:15:03 PM
Post by: nwwanderer on July 13, 2017, 04:20:00 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on July 13, 2017, 09:28:56 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 19, 2017, 12:03:52 PM
This is not a natural run of fish, why are they entitled? :dunno:
Post by: singleshot12 on July 19, 2017, 12:10:20 PM
I heard from a reliable source friend of mine yesterday that a couple of the tribes are allowed to harvest some of the sockeye for "ceremonial and subsistence" purposes.
This is not a natural run of fish, why are they entitled? :dunno:
That "ceremonial and subsistence purpose thing" is a joke and is being abused by continuing to have nets in the water any time of the year and basically do what ever they want.
Post by: birdmanwa on July 19, 2017, 01:19:39 PM
I heard from a reliable source friend of mine yesterday that a couple of the tribes are allowed to harvest some of the sockeye for "ceremonial and subsistence" purposes.
This is not a natural run of fish, why are they entitled? :dunno:
Wtf! The tribes have our state by the balls. The ceremonial thing is a bunch of bull for a run that didn't even exist back in the day.
Post by: NRA4LIFE on July 19, 2017, 02:17:59 PM
Post by: Badhabit on July 19, 2017, 03:14:17 PM
Post by: Dhoey07 on July 24, 2017, 12:54:35 PM
If the fish are being netted in the Ballard Locks, those fish are not going to C&S, instead they are collected for biological sampling purposes. Every year the state and the tribes jointly sample somewhere around 800 -1200 fish. We take scales from these fish to determine age composition of the return as well as to using their otoliths (inner ear bones) to determine the proportions of hatchery vs naturally produces fish. The tribes net the fish and WDFW staff are a little ways up the ship canal where the fish are dropped off and WDFW staff sample the fish. Very rarely do they ever use dipnets for C&S fisheries, they would instead likely use gillnets."
Response I got when I emailed the Salmon Specialist.
Post by: Colville on July 24, 2017, 01:03:03 PM
Post by: lokidog on July 24, 2017, 11:12:00 PM
"Hi again Danny,
If the fish are being netted in the Ballard Locks, those fish are not going to C&S, instead they are collected for biological sampling purposes. Every year the state and the tribes jointly sample somewhere around 800 -1200 fish. We take scales from these fish to determine age composition of the return as well as to using their otoliths (inner ear bones) to determine the proportions of hatchery vs naturally produces fish. The tribes net the fish and WDFW staff are a little ways up the ship canal where the fish are dropped off and WDFW staff sample the fish. Very rarely do they ever use dipnets for C&S fisheries, they would instead likely use gillnets."
Response I got when I emailed the Salmon Specialist.
This is like the Japanese saying they are only killing a few whales for "scientific purposes"..... :rolleyes:
They could easily take scales and heads from sport harvested fish, if nothing else, they should add the fish taken for "sampling" to the total count, if this is actually the case.
Post by: huntnphool on July 25, 2017, 08:24:42 AM
"Hi again Danny,
If the fish are being netted in the Ballard Locks, those fish are not going to C&S, instead they are collected for biological sampling purposes. Every year the state and the tribes jointly sample somewhere around 800 -1200 fish. We take scales from these fish to determine age composition of the return as well as to using their otoliths (inner ear bones) to determine the proportions of hatchery vs naturally produces fish. The tribes net the fish and WDFW staff are a little ways up the ship canal where the fish are dropped off and WDFW staff sample the fish. Very rarely do they ever use dipnets for C&S fisheries, they would instead likely use gillnets."
Response I got when I emailed the Salmon Specialist.
This is not a natural run of fish, why are the tribes involved at all? :dunno:
Post by: Katmai Guy on July 25, 2017, 08:48:41 AM
Post by: Dhoey07 on July 25, 2017, 09:58:24 AM
"Hi again Danny,
If the fish are being netted in the Ballard Locks, those fish are not going to C&S, instead they are collected for biological sampling purposes. Every year the state and the tribes jointly sample somewhere around 800 -1200 fish. We take scales from these fish to determine age composition of the return as well as to using their otoliths (inner ear bones) to determine the proportions of hatchery vs naturally produces fish. The tribes net the fish and WDFW staff are a little ways up the ship canal where the fish are dropped off and WDFW staff sample the fish. Very rarely do they ever use dipnets for C&S fisheries, they would instead likely use gillnets."
Response I got when I emailed the Salmon Specialist.
This is not a natural run of fish, why are the tribes involved at all? :dunno:
My guess.......They are co-managers of the water, not an individual species of fish.
Post by: Alchase on July 27, 2017, 02:45:06 PM
"Lake Washington sockeye salmon are cooperatively managed by the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) and three Puget Sound Indian tribes; the Muckleshoot, Suquamish, and Tulalip tribes. Annually, the co-managers base decisions on fishing seasons on counts made as the sockeye enter freshwater at the Ballard Locks."
http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/salmon/sockeye/lkwashington.html
Post by: jmscon on July 28, 2017, 07:40:30 PM
Post by: huntnphool on July 05, 2018, 01:48:30 PM
https://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/counts/sockeye/