Post by: predatorpro on October 06, 2012, 02:37:33 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on October 06, 2012, 03:01:15 PM
Post by: predatorpro on October 06, 2012, 03:07:24 PM
Call The dept . and tell them what he did .. I would be frickin peeeeeesed if he was such and arz hole ...Thats BS.. How some people act in situations like that ...He would of been calling the sheriff If that was me :yeah:i will be giving them a call for sure! nothing like waisting a bunch of money in diesel and time so my wife can miss deer season cuz the stupid gps sent us on a wild goose chase! there was no reason he couldnt have couldnt have been alittle understanding and let her in! we can only drop our two year old off so early at someones house! i was about ready to grab him when he walked off and be like hey im not done with you yet! ur gonna stand here and listen to me tell you what a jerk you are!
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on October 06, 2012, 03:11:43 PM
Post by: shoot-em-dead on October 06, 2012, 03:14:24 PM
Post by: salmonslayer on October 06, 2012, 03:23:58 PM
Post by: jess on October 06, 2012, 03:34:47 PM
Post by: Kola16 on October 06, 2012, 03:45:20 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 03:52:18 PM
Post by: predatorpro on October 06, 2012, 03:56:55 PM
I was actually thinking the instructor was in the right. Late is late and he didn't allow the kid in either. He didn't have anything against you personally. Look at it from the other end- He doesn't know you had to get a baby sitter, drive a long way, have a sick wife ect. He has a class that he must teach and doesn't need to be repeating information. Even if it is something as simple as "place your name in the upper corner". I do sympathize for those that can't hunt this year but that is just the way it is sometimes. And it is VERY common with hunter ed teachers to not tolerate tardiness.except he does know all that cuz i told him! what would have happened if he blew a tire on the way there? you think he never was late to work because something happened? i guess your thinking you should just fire that person and find someone else right?
Post by: wapiti hunter2 on October 06, 2012, 04:10:25 PM
Post by: CAMPMEAT on October 06, 2012, 04:19:08 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 04:25:44 PM
It is your responsibility to be on time, not his to let you in because you were late. Learn to use a map and do not rely on a GPS. If you haven't learned that lesson until now, shame on you. You are acting like a wining victim. Allow more time next time if you have to go that far. All of this support for you and bashing of the instructor for doing his job drives me crazy. Man up.............you screwed up. All you had to do was look the address up and be sure it wasn't a tree in the middle of nowhere before you left.......................
Thats great support....your a jerk.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on October 06, 2012, 04:35:03 PM
Post by: winshooter88 on October 06, 2012, 05:09:05 PM
Post by: CAMPMEAT on October 06, 2012, 05:16:01 PM
Post by: windygorge on October 06, 2012, 05:25:36 PM
Post by: predatorpro on October 06, 2012, 05:31:07 PM
There are no paid hunter safety instructors in this state, all are volunteers. Do the instructions about the class say anything about being late? If you want your wife to hunt this year, is she eligible for the one year hunter ed deferment? That might be something to check out.i will check out the deferment thing thanks! and wapiti i do know how to use a map but mine doesnt show where 104 BFE ST Gun Range, Chelan, WA is on it but maybe yours does! and in case you didnt read my first post i cant go drop my kid off at someones house at 5 in the monring to be at the class 45 minutes early unless you think taking a 2 year old to the gun range with a bunch of newbies for 8 hours is a good idea, next time ill just have you babysit for me! i agree with you tho that yes it is his choice wether or not to be a jerk about it tho!
Post by: Hunterman on October 06, 2012, 05:56:05 PM
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: wraithen on October 06, 2012, 06:17:54 PM
If you had to be somewhere by a certain time or you lost your house and would be sold to indentured service for 6 months, how early would you be? Make better decisions man.
Post by: ribka on October 06, 2012, 06:20:47 PM
I learned a long time ago that GP's do not work in rural areas with directions for roads. I always bring a map and /or directions from Google with me. People die every year because they don't use common sense and rely solely on their GPS.
Post by: Stickerbush on October 06, 2012, 06:27:20 PM
Post by: predatorpro on October 06, 2012, 06:54:44 PM
I think that I would be ticked off too.. Getting my "SICK" wife up out of bed so she could infect a room full of "ON TIME" students with "STREP THROAT". Hell after all don't he know the price of fuel?? Now your "SICK" wife has to wait until she is over her "STREP THROAT" to finish her hunters ed cource "LIKE SHE SHOULD". Damn the gps..
Hunterman(Tony)
well unless my wife starts making out with everyone in the room i think they should be fine, that and shes been on antibiotics for 2 or 3 days now, sometimes i wish i was a perfect as some of the people on here, my life would be so much nicer! i dont think i need to repeat again why i couldnt leave 24 hours ahead of time
Post by: bullcanyon on October 06, 2012, 07:00:35 PM
Post by: LeeMajors on October 06, 2012, 07:03:10 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 07:06:49 PM
You should leave early if you don't know where you're going. I'd be pissed if someone showed up 15 minutes late and I had to listen to already slow and dumbed down instructions again. Those types of classes are bad enough to sit through without having to start over for someone that can't be on time. yeah, 20 other people should waste 15 minutes of their time for the 1 person that was late. That makes sense.
If that would piss you off you may have some issues.
Post by: JLS on October 06, 2012, 07:12:54 PM
While I do sympathize with the OP, I can tell you that if something is 20 minutes away, I'm minimum 15 minutes early. If something should take an hour away I'm at least 30 minutes early. If it's any farther than that it's generally an hour free time. I get that that timeline is difficult for some people but the instructor is a volunteer. I understand the anger, but if I show up half an hour early to make sure I'm on time, why do I have to wait 10, 13, 15, 30 minutes after I need to be there for everyone to arrive? I think it's on the individual to be responsible and show up early. I get that this sounds like a dick move but I'm the guy that is in the parking lot usually before anyone else. Being late means missing out. I don't want or need that lesson any more, esp if it's something I deem important.
If you had to be somewhere by a certain time or you lost your house and would be sold to indentured service for 6 months, how early would you be? Make better decisions man.
I agree. I'm sure it sucks, but I don't feel it's completely out of line. It is a one day class and I don't think it's unreasonable for them to be able to start on time. I don't think we should all be allotted a 15 minute grace period. I'm not perfect so please don't take this to mean I am. It's funny how so many folks on this board scream for accountability, but then turn around and grab pitchforks when someone is held accountable.
Hopefully it goes better next time.
Post by: deleted BGS on October 06, 2012, 07:25:18 PM
Post by: h20hunter on October 06, 2012, 07:27:58 PM
Post by: dbor on October 06, 2012, 07:43:58 PM
Post by: coachcw on October 06, 2012, 07:45:04 PM
Post by: Knocker of rocks on October 06, 2012, 07:47:37 PM
In my book, being up to 15 minutes late is acceptable
Is that how you feel when your bus or plane is late?
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 08:01:01 PM
Post by: h2ofowlr on October 06, 2012, 08:03:41 PM
Post by: windygorge on October 06, 2012, 08:04:28 PM
In my book, being up to 15 minutes late is acceptable
Is that how you feel when your bus or plane is late?
no, only maybe if i was waiting on a heart or a kidney for a transplant.....really?, you can't compare this to a bus or plane. these classes are nothing short of informal. and again, 15 min is something that can be made up quickly. at 15 min, there is nothing being taught at that moment, and is why the grace period should be acceptable. those of you who have the type A personality need to take a chill pill.
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 08:07:09 PM
It varies from instructor to instructor. I know a lot of the instructors do not like teaching the field courses to online students. They feel they don't learn as much in many cases. These guys all volunteer their time and we do ask that students be on time. If a student misses a class he or she will not be passed unfortunately. The instructors spend a lot of their personal time training and making sure they have all certification required. Their will be people that show up an hour early and those that will always show up late. At some point you have to draw a line. Everyone will always have a reason as to why they are late. If you taught classes, you would understand how disruptive this can be to the other students that, prepared and were early for class. It's unfortunate but, you have to draw a line somewhere!
Its not about drawing a line it is about a little understanding and consideration when it makes sense. And not to mention just being a reasonable person. I am glad I do not see life as black and white as what hell those haveto live in that do.
Post by: wraithen on October 06, 2012, 08:09:02 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 08:11:46 PM
Post by: windygorge on October 06, 2012, 08:13:52 PM
As far as the type A personality taking a chill, I'm sorry but it was droned into me to be that way for the safety of everyone around me. I think this conversation has just become one of those "ethics" topics. Everyone thinks the law should be their own way instead of allowing everyone to follow the current letter of the law.
its all good wraithen. just me puttin my :twocents: in. i just don't see the big deal.
Post by: JLS on October 06, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
15 min is something that can be made up quickly. at 15 min, there is nothing being taught at that moment, and is why the grace period should be acceptable. those of you who have the type A personality need to take a chill pill.
And we think you need to drink an extra Red Bull and light a bit of a fire. Difference in perspective.
Post by: wraithen on October 06, 2012, 08:24:57 PM
What did I miss? Were we talking about laws?
:chuckle: I was speaking in metaphors.
Post by: h20hunter on October 06, 2012, 08:25:33 PM
Post by: windygorge on October 06, 2012, 08:27:25 PM
I guess one should also not expect everyone to have the same opinion as you. If you post you should be ready for all opinions, even those you disagree with.
no kidding. those type a's always seem to have a different opinion than mine.. :chuckle:
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 08:29:12 PM
Post by: windygorge on October 06, 2012, 08:33:51 PM
Since we are speaking about opinions I will vocalize mine. 15 minutes is nothing when you spend 7 plus hours in a deer stand.
yep, but if they are a few minutes late......no huntin for them that day. gotta come back when they have more responsibility and know their priorities. i mean for heavens sake, you can't have the deer waiting on you.... :o :chuckle:
Post by: dscubame on October 06, 2012, 08:43:23 PM
Post by: stuckalot on October 06, 2012, 09:07:26 PM
That's a shame, isn't the main reason people get into hunter ed instruction to get more people involved in the activity they love and to better the "sport" for all? At least that would be my motivation if I was an instructor, its not like this was a freaking navy seals tryout or something. If this guys wants to get all power tripped up then yea, I guess that's his right. But I feel he screwed the pooch on this one. Good luck to you and your wife, I hope she is able to hunt this year!:yeah:
Unfortunately my experience with "instructors" has often been that it's more about the instructor, than actually educating people. Or promoting their sport, industry, or safety.
Post by: steen on October 06, 2012, 09:40:03 PM
Post by: Kola16 on October 06, 2012, 10:03:55 PM
Post by: Kola16 on October 06, 2012, 10:24:45 PM
Not that I care one way or the other about the class, but reading this I can see who has never been in the military. Try 15 minutes late to formation and see how important or not it is. 15 minutes late to work every week? Guess why you are not getting the raise and promotion the guy who isn't 15 minutes late gets. May seem like no big deal, but it is.
This isn't the military. This is a safety class that tells the obvious.
Several people were there on time and you being late is disrupting their class.
Really? Is it that disturbing to open and close a door. Ok.
Post by: winshooter88 on October 06, 2012, 10:37:19 PM
Post by: Kola16 on October 06, 2012, 10:42:55 PM
Post by: shoot-em-dead on October 06, 2012, 11:01:00 PM
Really dude- Sit back and read how childish this whole thread is and realize that you have some growing up to do. You were late for a class because you didn't prepare and now your lashing out at the wdfw- the instructor- and anyone else who does not side with you. You asked if I have ever been 15 minutes late, well yes I have and I also have accepted the consequences instead of playing the woe is me BS that you are doing here.
Post by: stuckalot on October 06, 2012, 11:47:16 PM
Should he have found a way to be there on time? Yes
Did the instructor have the right to turn them away? Yes
Is this the damn military? NO
Is this anybody's livelihood? NO
The point of the hunter Ed program should be to teach people safety the fundamentals of responsible hunting, and promote new people getting into our sport! Not whether or not they were a few minutes late, or made a mistake during their field evaluation. The "these are my rules" and you'll have to try again next year types do nothing but drive people away from our sport! That kid that got turned away likely won't get to hunt this year, by next year with all of the other pressures and activities that kids have out there he may not want to go through that "crap" again and we've lost one more kid!
But by god rules are rules!
Post by: TangoU on October 06, 2012, 11:47:44 PM
Who's responsibility is it to be on time? Yours. This is clear cut. Don't blame the GPS. Take responsibility for your own actions.
I had a job candidate show up late for the interview because he couldn't find my office. Guess what? I sent him packing right when he arrived. Maybe he should have figured out where my office was the day before.
Post by: salmonslayer on October 07, 2012, 12:48:43 AM
Could the instructor have let you in? Sure. But he doesn't have to. He's not an arse for not letting you be late.Actually him not letting him in DOES make him an arse according to 80% of the responses on here. Take a look in the mirror...are you the guy yelling at kids to stay off your lawn?
Who's responsibility is it to be on time? Yours. This is clear cut. Don't blame the GPS. Take responsibility for your own actions.
I had a job candidate show up late for the interview because he couldn't find my office. Guess what? I sent him packing right when he arrived. Maybe he should have figured out where my office was the day before.
This wasn't a job interview. It wasn't a military meeting. Everyone comparing it to something else can just stop. This was a kid that was ten minutes late to his evaluation. Chastise the kid, make an example out of it, make him go last...there is lots of ways you could still teach the kid a lesson and not make him miss hunting season. Now the kid has the late hunt ruined for him for the whole family, and I am sure he is devastated....all because he was ten minutes late? Give me a break. Some of you need to get over yourselves. :bash:
Post by: salmonslayer on October 07, 2012, 01:24:20 AM
You have a couple hundred bucks I can borrow? I'll pay you back Wednesday. I Promise I won't be late.
Worst analogy ever?
Post by: windygorge on October 07, 2012, 04:38:46 AM
Wow the whole hollier than thou crowd is out tonight!
Should he have found a way to be there on time? Yes
Did the instructor have the right to turn them away? Yes
Is this the damn military? NO
Is this anybody's livelihood? NO
The point of the hunter Ed program should be to teach people safety the fundamentals of responsible hunting, and promote new people getting into our sport! Not whether or not they were a few minutes late, or made a mistake during their field evaluation. The "these are my rules" and you'll have to try again next year types do nothing but drive people away from our sport! That kid that got turned away likely won't get to hunt this year, by next year with all of the other pressures and activities that kids have out there he may not want to go through that "crap" again and we've lost one more kid!
But by god rules are rules!
:yeah:
yep, the late nazi's are on this thread. with no consideration for the topic nor reasoning, all they see in the post is the word "late". military? :chuckle: i have been in the military, but that doesn't mean i need to be closed minded because i was. why are you late nazi's comparing this to those kind of things? i am never late. but that doesn't mean i haven't had reasons to be late, or that i shouldn't sympathize for those who are on occasion.
i see preparation was an issue, but come on nazi's. future hunters are what we are after, not tardiness discipline.
Post by: gotshot on October 07, 2012, 05:42:20 AM
Post by: MIKEXRAY on October 07, 2012, 06:23:08 AM
Post by: Atroxus on October 07, 2012, 07:31:52 AM
Post by: CoryTDF on October 07, 2012, 08:04:06 AM
I HATE when people are late but also things happen it's a fine line and somtimes has some grey areas.
My GPS got me lost as hell in Seattle once for about 20 min. It kept telling me to turn down one way streets going the wrong way. I hate them! I am almost never late but it happens. Personaly if i was the instructor i would have let you in but i believe in the bigger picture if more of us are hunters the stronger our voice is. And really if you are one of those habitualy late people thats fine I know you will never beat me to the duck blind.
Yes I was in the ARMY for 6 years I undrstand being on time. But this is not basic training. Not everybody is cut out to deal with that type of structure. Dont fault them for it.
Post by: predatorpro on October 07, 2012, 08:24:34 AM
we werent even 15 minutes late! it had barely hit 8:10 by the time we made it to the door on foot!
Post by: vandeman17 on October 07, 2012, 09:07:22 AM
Post by: Atroxus on October 07, 2012, 09:18:48 AM
I was actually at the class with my old lady for her hunter ed. We were about 5 minutes early luckily! I was pretty shocked as well when he said that he was going to turn away anyone that was late. There were a few groups after you that were also turned away. He started out the class by saying how he has no problem failing people and that he wasn't going to be easy on them etc. We were also under the impression that we were going to find out if they passed or failed at the end but when it ended, he said we would get stuff mailed to us because he had to leave for a scouting trip to montana! :yike:
Wow, sounds like he just was just in a hurry to rush through the class so he could go do other stuff. I guess I was lucky, in my class the instructors graded our exams and let us all know how we did before we left. I am pretty sure they would have liked to get out sooner too as it was an evening class, but they never made us feel rushed and even stayed late to answer questions from newbs like me with questions about things that weren't covered in class. I would definitely complain about that instructor. IMO he should have either scheduled his scouting trip to leave more time to do right by his class, or tried to find an alternative solution for the class, like rescheduling or finding another instructor to fill in.
Post by: vandeman17 on October 07, 2012, 09:21:14 AM
Post by: Atroxus on October 07, 2012, 09:34:20 AM
Quote
The work of the hunter education instructor is demanding, the pay is lousy (as in non-existent!) and the hours are often long and inconvenient. Instructors love their work not because of any material rewards or benefits, but because they know they are contributing in some small way to the future of hunting. If you like a challenge, aren't afraid of hard work and see yourself as a good team player, we want to hear from you soon!
This seems to give the impression that scheduling isn't very flexible. Any of the current instructors care to weigh in on how classes are scheduled and such? If an instructor is only available for teaching certain dates does WDFW allow them to work within their individual availability, or is it just a matter of WDFW saying "We need instructor's available these dates."?
Post by: winshooter88 on October 07, 2012, 09:51:15 AM
Post by: vandeman17 on October 07, 2012, 10:00:24 AM
The instructors set their own class dates and then submit them to the WDFW to be set up on the class schedule. Also instructors class used to be one weekend, from what I hear it now takes most people at least a month to pass the instructor training. Then you have to teach with a experienced instructor before you can start your own class.
He actually mentioned that they wanted him to teach one in september and one in october. It was his choice of the dates
Post by: winshooter88 on October 07, 2012, 10:05:08 AM
Post by: Atroxus on October 07, 2012, 10:08:40 AM
Post by: predatorpro on October 07, 2012, 10:10:43 AM
Post by: Cap.Silver on October 07, 2012, 10:23:43 AM
Post by: supermatt9 on October 07, 2012, 10:24:18 AM
Post by: gotshot on October 07, 2012, 10:32:01 AM
Post by: JLS on October 07, 2012, 11:39:25 AM
ok last post on this for me...i never once said i was entitled or my wife was to get what we want cuz we werent there on time, i like how people try to make me out as a spoiled little brat who throws a fit when i dont get what i want...i never said it wasnt his right to tell us no, his attitude towards us when he told us is what made me the most mad he came out there with a big ol *censored* eating grin and told us we cant come in....i dont know what its like to be like some of you on here like your just gods gift to the earth...for some reason i seriously doubt you are that amazing...but i could be wrong...even tho some of you post on here all the time about how much better you are than everyone else....good luck in life! maybe some day ill run in to you on the side of the road with a broken truck and ill just have to tell you with a big grin on my face! "well i guess you should brought the right tool to fix that! hope you learned your lesson!" while i leave you there!
I know I'm not amazing. If I ran into you broken down, I'd still help you, even after how you've represented yourself through all of this. Even as a Type A who's always in a hurry and despises being late.
Post by: predatorpro on October 07, 2012, 01:39:40 PM
Predatorpro I think you're crossing a fine line here ........nothing until now was IMHO said with feel of revengesorry i do not want "revenge" im not really sure what your implying? i do not want revenge on anyone...i was just kinda mad! thats it! i did not want to make it this big of a deal!
Post by: mfswallace on October 07, 2012, 01:45:54 PM
Post by: Cap.Silver on October 07, 2012, 01:57:31 PM
Stay cool :chuckle:
Post by: windygorge on October 07, 2012, 01:58:34 PM
i was just kinda mad! thats it! i did not want to make it this big of a deal!
[/quote]
i do know for one thing. on this forum, if you were completely tickled and happy that the instructor kicked you out of class, and then posted it on here. everyone in their mother would have told you that you should have been mad and went off on him. given you a ton of... :tup: and a whole lotta.. :chuckle: :chuckle:
it doesn't matter what you do, the nazi's always come out.
Post by: csaaphill on October 07, 2012, 02:19:03 PM
If it would have been me I would have let you in 5-10 minutes aint sh!t come on damn.
Post by: Mudman on October 07, 2012, 02:36:15 PM
Post by: winshooter88 on October 07, 2012, 03:11:28 PM
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/huntered/files/hunter_ed_deferral_application.pdf (http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/huntered/files/hunter_ed_deferral_application.pdf)
Be sure to send in the required ID copies and the accompanying hunter has to have had a license for three years.
good luck.
Post by: greenhead_killer on October 07, 2012, 03:11:39 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 03:13:34 PM
And by the way I would pass up on the highway many of the people who showed their colors on this thread right with ya.
All those angry folks over 10 - 15 minutes, can you imagine what kind of lives they lead? On second thought lets not, movin on.
I am 99% early and I assume you are too but every once in a great while late happens, it just happens, I call it life.
Post by: FC on October 07, 2012, 03:39:10 PM
Any time I am going somewhere new to meet someone or attend some kind of function I give myself a huge time cushion out of respect for the people I am meeting. I also go over my route on a map the day before. Anyone who has fished or hunted with me much knows that I am chronically 15+ minutes EARLY, it's basic courtesy and there appears to be a few in this thread who don't grasp this. Show up 15 minutes late to the launch to fish and you will probably be doing some swimming to get to my boat if you want to join me!
Post by: Kola16 on October 07, 2012, 04:37:23 PM
Post by: ribka on October 07, 2012, 05:11:26 PM
I'll help you with your GPS if you help me with some coyote tips :chuckle:
ok last post on this for me...i never once said i was entitled or my wife was to get what we want cuz we werent there on time, i like how people try to make me out as a spoiled little brat who throws a fit when i dont get what i want...i never said it wasnt his right to tell us no, his attitude towards us when he told us is what made me the most mad he came out there with a big ol *censored* eating grin and told us we cant come in....i dont know what its like to be like some of you on here like your just gods gift to the earth...for some reason i seriously doubt you are that amazing...but i could be wrong...even tho some of you post on here all the time about how much better you are than everyone else....good luck in life! maybe some day ill run in to you on the side of the road with a broken truck and ill just have to tell you with a big grin on my face! "well i guess you should brought the right tool to fix that! hope you learned your lesson!" while i leave you there!
Post by: runningboard on October 07, 2012, 05:18:37 PM
another person who said he was present said others were denied after you left and certainly after the boy left, so I wonder if he let you in when does he draw the line? does he let the kid in @ 5 minutes late, your wife @ 15 minutes late then have disgruntled people who turn him into the state for denying them when he let your wife and the kid in?
I do not do online certs(yet), I only teach full-on regular classes that are 15 hours in length. I make it clear from orientation day that I expect everyone to be on time so I can start and you will receive the required amount of instructing only by being on time and present. but also on that 1st day I give everyone a # where they can reach me, not my home # when I am @ the place where I hold classes, if they are lost or late(legimately) they can call me & say so. in those situations maybe we can reach a compromise.
if I were to deny access to someone who missed a day, even for a legimate reason I would apologize for having to do it rather than smirk in their face and tell them to go packing. even if he was in the right over the tardiness, he doesn't need to be a jerk about it.
the state likes us to turn in our class schedule in December so they can put it on the website but it can be difficult to know when local events are going on and to schedule accordingly to those when they aren't scheduled yet.
I have never been asked by the state to do a class on their schedule, I choose & I always say to my classes, "I do this because I love to hunt myself & I believe in what we are trying to teach you, so if you have friends who need this class tell them to get in here and let's get it done. if they're too busy to do it when I have classes, sorry. but when they need it, I'll be too busy hunting."
Post by: Mudman on October 07, 2012, 07:10:45 PM
I am an instructor and can see both sides, if you were told to be there at a specific time then you need to be there at that time or be denied entry for the sake of the people that did show up on time to be able to get done and leave at the appointed time.:tup:
another person who said he was present said others were denied after you left and certainly after the boy left, so I wonder if he let you in when does he draw the line? does he let the kid in @ 5 minutes late, your wife @ 15 minutes late then have disgruntled people who turn him into the state for denying them when he let your wife and the kid in?
I do not do online certs(yet), I only teach full-on regular classes that are 15 hours in length. I make it clear from orientation day that I expect everyone to be on time so I can start and you will receive the required amount of instructing only by being on time and present. but also on that 1st day I give everyone a # where they can reach me, not my home # when I am @ the place where I hold classes, if they are lost or late(legimately) they can call me & say so. in those situations maybe we can reach a compromise.
if I were to deny access to someone who missed a day, even for a legimate reason I would apologize for having to do it rather than smirk in their face and tell them to go packing. even if he was in the right over the tardiness, he doesn't need to be a jerk about it.
the state likes us to turn in our class schedule in December so they can put it on the website but it can be difficult to know when local events are going on and to schedule accordingly to those when they aren't scheduled yet.
I have never been asked by the state to do a class on their schedule, I choose & I always say to my classes, "I do this because I love to hunt myself & I believe in what we are trying to teach you, so if you have friends who need this class tell them to get in here and let's get it done. if they're too busy to do it when I have classes, sorry. but when they need it, I'll be too busy hunting."
Post by: iusmc2002 on October 07, 2012, 08:04:33 PM
Sucks that you wasted your time but I can't say I blame the guy much. When I am in a class on time and people start trickling in 5-10-15-20 minutes late and disrupting the class it pisses me off bigtime! It takes away from those who took the extra care to be on time. :twocents:
Any time I am going somewhere new to meet someone or attend some kind of function I give myself a huge time cushion out of respect for the people I am meeting. I also go over my route on a map the day before. Anyone who has fished or hunted with me much knows that I am chronically 15+ minutes EARLY, it's basic courtesy and there appears to be a few in this thread who don't grasp this. Show up 15 minutes late to the launch to fish and you will probably be doing some swimming to get to my boat if you want to join me!
Can't blame the guy much? He took the time to walk out and give them a ration of *censored* about being late, while he was supposed to be instructing..... Makes a lot of sense. Best part is, he turns a 12 year old boy away, did the kid drive himself, or did his parents screw him over? So now the kid gets punished for something his parents possibly caused. "Thanks mom and dad, for giving this *censored* a reason to get his rocks off by turning me away"
Comparing this to the military is moronic at best. It has no bearing on whether he was on time or not. Congrats there Superman, you served and it made you more AWESOMER! :o
Post by: predatorpro on October 07, 2012, 08:21:18 PM
Predatorpro, here is link to the form to apply for the one year hunter ed deferral.awesome thanks!!! i really appreciate it!
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/huntered/files/hunter_ed_deferral_application.pdf (http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/huntered/files/hunter_ed_deferral_application.pdf)
Be sure to send in the required ID copies and the accompanying hunter has to have had a license for three years.
good luck.
Post by: predatorpro on October 07, 2012, 08:24:16 PM
For the record I met PP and he helped me with the Desert Unit last year. Good guy.hey thanks ribka! i wish i could have done more for ya on that desert hunt! i was really stoked to help you out i just couldnt get away from stuff at home when the season opened! if you want to let me know we can get out and call some coyotes in for sure this winter!
I'll help you with your GPS if you help me with some coyote tips :chuckle:ok last post on this for me...i never once said i was entitled or my wife was to get what we want cuz we werent there on time, i like how people try to make me out as a spoiled little brat who throws a fit when i dont get what i want...i never said it wasnt his right to tell us no, his attitude towards us when he told us is what made me the most mad he came out there with a big ol *censored* eating grin and told us we cant come in....i dont know what its like to be like some of you on here like your just gods gift to the earth...for some reason i seriously doubt you are that amazing...but i could be wrong...even tho some of you post on here all the time about how much better you are than everyone else....good luck in life! maybe some day ill run in to you on the side of the road with a broken truck and ill just have to tell you with a big grin on my face! "well i guess you should brought the right tool to fix that! hope you learned your lesson!" while i leave you there!
Post by: Huntbear on October 07, 2012, 08:24:54 PM
The instructor I spoke with, even agreed with turning this other guy into the state. Filing a formal complaint.
Post by: brew on October 07, 2012, 08:29:02 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 08:31:32 PM
Post by: ICEMAN on October 07, 2012, 08:40:34 PM
So is 20 minutes late OK too? How about 30...? In my opinion, it is best to stick to your guns on a policy like this, this way it is an easier decision, you end up applying your policy fairly to everyone. We all have reasons we could be late.
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 08:43:04 PM
I guarantee you a guy walks in 10 - 15 minutes late in Rosalia hunters Ed is not going to get a second look.
Post by: ICEMAN on October 07, 2012, 08:48:29 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 08:49:39 PM
It's like writing a speeding ticket.... pick a speed you are comfortable with writing a ticket for, and write it for anyone over that limit. Simple.
lol. That is a moronic comparison. Sorry speaking my mind.
Post by: h20hunter on October 07, 2012, 08:50:30 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 08:53:48 PM
Post by: Atroxus on October 07, 2012, 08:54:00 PM
....we are losing hunter numbers at a staggering pace and all need to band together to ensure this privelege is handed down and not taken away.
But lets be jerks to potential new hunters instead of maybe giving them the benefit of the doubt and doing our best to help them? :bash: I get the whole being late thing, and I hate being late myself. But in a situation like this where they were very likely not even past the "Let's all get to know eachother" portion of the class I see absolutely no reason that the instructor could not have cut them a little slack. I also find it odd that there are people defending the instructor, considering *how* the instructor went about it. :bdid: If I decide to get certified to teach hunter education I would only refuse a late-comer if the class was already far enough that it would be disruptive to let them in. I would not go back over already covered material to benefit a late-comer, and if I did refuse them I would try to at least be polite about it though. :twocents:
It's like writing a speeding ticket.... pick a speed you are comfortable with writing a ticket for, and write it for anyone over that limit. Simple.
Actually I am pretty sure that is how cops do it. I don't hear of many people getting pulled over for going 3 mph over the speed limit. :dunno:
Post by: ICEMAN on October 07, 2012, 08:54:13 PM
It's like writing a speeding ticket.... pick a speed you are comfortable with writing a ticket for, and write it for anyone over that limit. Simple.
lol. That is a moronic comparison. Sorry speaking my mind.
It is all good.
If I was an instructor, with lots of folks arriving late over the years, I would have developed my own set point for folks getting to stay or not. "Sorry folks, it's my policy."
Nobody said volunteering to teach a bunch of folks you do not know was going to make you Mr. Popular.
Post by: ICEMAN on October 07, 2012, 08:55:41 PM
[It's like writing a speeding ticket.... pick a speed you are comfortable with writing a ticket for, and write it for anyone over that limit. Simple.
Actually I am pretty sure that is how cops do it. I don't hear of many people getting pulled over for going 3 mph over the speed limit. :dunno:
:chuckle: I know for a fact that it is... :chuckle:
Post by: h20hunter on October 07, 2012, 08:56:14 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 08:56:44 PM
It's like writing a speeding ticket.... pick a speed you are comfortable with writing a ticket for, and write it for anyone over that limit. Simple.
lol. That is a moronic comparison. Sorry speaking my mind.
It is all good.
If I was an instructor, with lots of folks arriving late over the years, I would have developed my own set point for folks getting to stay or not. "Sorry folks, it's my policy."
Nobody said volunteering to teach a bunch of folks you do not know was going to make you Mr. Popular.
True there. I bet the nerves get frayed with all the arse hats that they have to deal with.
Post by: ICEMAN on October 07, 2012, 08:57:14 PM
You guys are just crushing the poor deceased horse on this one. He should have known where he was going and the instuctor should have been less of an ass. Pretty simple to me.
Hey, no fair, I was gone all day yesterday and just read this! :chuckle:
Post by: iusmc2002 on October 07, 2012, 08:57:55 PM
Sucks that you wasted your time but I can't say I blame the guy much. When I am in a class on time and people start trickling in 5-10-15-20 minutes late and disrupting the class it pisses me off bigtime! It takes away from those who took the extra care to be on time. :twocents:
Any time I am going somewhere new to meet someone or attend some kind of function I give myself a huge time cushion out of respect for the people I am meeting. I also go over my route on a map the day before. Anyone who has fished or hunted with me much knows that I am chronically 15+ minutes EARLY, it's basic courtesy and there appears to be a few in this thread who don't grasp this. Show up 15 minutes late to the launch to fish and you will probably be doing some swimming to get to my boat if you want to join me!
Can't blame the guy much? He took the time to walk out and give them a ration of *censored* about being late, while he was supposed to be instructing..... Makes a lot of sense. Best part is, he turns a 12 year old boy away, did the kid drive himself, or did his parents screw him over? So now the kid gets punished for something his parents possibly caused. "Thanks mom and dad, for giving this *censored* a reason to get his rocks off by turning me away"
Comparing this to the military is moronic at best. It has no bearing on whether he was on time or not. Congrats there Superman, you served and it made you more AWESOMER! :o
Good thing you aren't paid to read there MC. I didn't compare this to the military. I said I could take a good guess who had been in. I was taught to respect a timetable. Eat your puke and keep grunting MC.
Yeah, ya know, because EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEVERYONE that is in the military is super squared away and on time..... Hang in there, we'll get this figured out my Ain't Ready for the Marines Yet, friend. BTW, that last line is one of the stupidest GD things I've ever seen in my life. WTF is that even supposed to mean? Were you dropped on your head one too many times?
Post by: Atroxus on October 07, 2012, 08:59:02 PM
[It's like writing a speeding ticket.... pick a speed you are comfortable with writing a ticket for, and write it for anyone over that limit. Simple.
Actually I am pretty sure that is how cops do it. I don't hear of many people getting pulled over for going 3 mph over the speed limit. :dunno:
:chuckle: I know for a fact that it is... :chuckle:
In this case what the instructor did was equivalent to a cop writing a ticket for 3 Mph over on the freeway, and being rude to the driver while doing it. Sure the cop is technically doing his job, that doesn't make him/her less of a jerk for being rude about it, and nobody would die if he didn't write the ticket.
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 09:00:56 PM
Post by: Kola16 on October 07, 2012, 09:01:36 PM
[It's like writing a speeding ticket.... pick a speed you are comfortable with writing a ticket for, and write it for anyone over that limit. Simple.
Actually I am pretty sure that is how cops do it. I don't hear of many people getting pulled over for going 3 mph over the speed limit. :dunno:
:chuckle: I know for a fact that it is... :chuckle:
In this case what the instructor did was equivalent to a cop writing a ticket for 3 Mph over on the freeway, and being rude to the driver while doing it. Sure the cop is technically doing his job, that doesn't make him/her less of a jerk for being rude about it, and nobody would die if he didn't write the ticket.
Actually, the goody two shoes on here are bothered when someone walks through a door :chuckle:
Post by: ICEMAN on October 07, 2012, 09:03:49 PM
Hey on Sunday night we are obviously not out hunting like Dr. Death, huntnnw and others so what the heck lets talk about being late to a hunters ed class and discuss whether we should be sent home over it. :chuckle:
No kidding, sad really, isn't it... ?
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 09:06:25 PM
Post by: dscubame on October 07, 2012, 09:09:30 PM
Post by: csaaphill on October 07, 2012, 10:40:53 PM
Heres a question for those that say tough luck.
You work for a company that says that under no circumstance should an employee go outside to help anyone so my question is this.
You see an old lady on a cold day outside carrying packages she slips and falls on the ice outside do you say the heck with company policy and go out and help her or as you guys would say she's sh!t out of luck. I expect those that have already said so to say she's sh!t out of luck. What a society we live in now no wonder people go postal.
Post by: rebal69972 on October 08, 2012, 01:22:21 AM
there should be a grace period. 15 min is not unreasonable. like someone said, what if the instructor had a blowout and was late. nothing they teach in hunter ed is so critical that you can't quickly make up in under 15 min. :twocents:
when my kids took there hunter ed class last year they gave everyone 10 or 15 min. But my kids made up half the class :chuckle:
Post by: FC on October 08, 2012, 05:21:33 AM
Actually, the goody two shoes on here are bothered when someone walks through a door :chuckle:
Spoken like a disrespectful child no less, if you go to college you will find out just how much the average instructor appreciates tardy students.If you get yourself a job you will find out how much employers dig it...Hopefully by the time you are an adult you will start thinking of others before yourself. :twocents:
It sounds like the instructor was a dick about it but I would turn away latecomers as well in deference to those that had enough respect to show up on time.
Post by: Skyvalhunter on October 08, 2012, 05:36:20 AM
Post by: windygorge on October 08, 2012, 05:59:06 AM
Post by: FC on October 08, 2012, 06:39:25 AM
can we stop this thread now.....im sick of it showing on my unread. thanks
Would madame care for some cheese with her wine?
Post by: winshooter88 on October 08, 2012, 07:28:15 AM
Post by: FC on October 08, 2012, 07:33:39 AM
Post by: dscubame on October 08, 2012, 07:38:41 AM
Post by: leed on October 08, 2012, 02:51:51 PM
Post by: Kola16 on October 08, 2012, 03:28:16 PM
can we stop this thread now.....im sick of it showing on my unread. thanks
Would madame care for some cheese with her wine?
Spoken like a disrespectful child no less, if you go to college you will find out just how much the average instructor appreciates tardy students.If you get yourself a job you will find out how much employers dig it...Hopefully by the time you are an adult you will start thinking of others before yourself. :twocents:
It sounds like the instructor was a dick about it but I would turn away latecomers as well in deference to those that had enough respect to show up on time.
Sounds like someone needs to speak for himself :dunno:
I am almost never late for classes (I got caught in heavy traffic once). Some are always late. The professors let them in no matter the time. Ask any of my friends who comes first in my life. Their answer will always be them. To speak so poorly about someone that you don't know is very ignorant. The instructor was a jerk, and it isn't like he had to go through a whole review of what had already been said.
Post by: windygorge on October 08, 2012, 04:50:11 PM
can we stop this thread now.....im sick of it showing on my unread. thanks
Would madame care for some cheese with her wine?
:chuckle: funny one fart cheese, or whatever fc stands for. :chuckle:
Post by: CAMPMEAT on October 08, 2012, 07:38:21 PM
Post by: CedarPants on October 16, 2012, 11:15:47 AM
Post by: CedarPants on October 16, 2012, 12:07:52 PM
If I was his wife reading some of the comments on this thread I would say screw hunting and hunters, I've now lost all interest I ever had in becoming a woman in the outdoors.
I sure hope nothing I said in my last comment made you feel this way? But you sure shouldn't let some ahole comments from some anonymous people on a forum affect your desire to enjoy hunting and the outdoors.
Sorry for the confusion - I was speaking as if I was the wife.
I personally have never had any interest whatsoever in becoming a woman in the outdoors :chuckle:
Post by: jackmaster on October 16, 2012, 12:15:23 PM
Post by: Curly on October 16, 2012, 12:25:23 PM
I also think some on here should be a little more understanding and let the guy that started the thread vent a little bit and not be trying to give him or his wife a bunch of crap or lecturing him and/or her about being on time. :twocents:
Post by: winshooter88 on October 16, 2012, 12:25:50 PM
Post by: jackmaster on October 16, 2012, 12:28:55 PM
Post by: CedarPants on October 16, 2012, 12:59:03 PM
If I was his wife reading some of the comments on this thread I would say screw hunting and hunters, I've now lost all interest I ever had in becoming a woman in the outdoors.
I sure hope nothing I said in my last comment made you feel this way? But you sure shouldn't let some ahole comments from some anonymous people on a forum affect your desire to enjoy hunting and the outdoors.
Sorry for the confusion - I was speaking as if I was the wife.
I personally have never had any interest whatsoever in becoming a woman in the outdoors :chuckle:
So that wasn't you I saw in the camo skirt up in the hills this weekend? :chuckle:
Actually ya that was me. My hunting partner kept saying the skirt was a little too revealing, I told him to stop being a prude
Post by: CedarPants on October 16, 2012, 01:12:21 PM
Post by: Mudman on October 16, 2012, 03:17:48 PM
Post by: Holg3107 on October 16, 2012, 03:24:32 PM
Quote
No offense but all of these required classes are a big fat joke. A violation of our rights. You can legally buy a gun but not hunt with it? We used to teach our kids, what happened? I ran around on my bicycle with my gun at 11 years old. So did our parents. Now a legislator knows best? I dont like it. Safety is great, yes and so are classes but to require it simply puts our rights at their whim and desire. Remember the old classes? Were they bad? Probably better then, because they werent managed by the gov.
Really??? so do you think taking a drivers test is a joke? I dont think your example of riding around with your gun at 11 years old is a good representation of why hunters education courses shouldnt exist. :twocents:
show up early, get your class done before its 1 week before season, follow the outlined rules, get over yourself your not above the rules, its a one time course get it done and move on.
Post by: Mudman on October 16, 2012, 03:44:48 PM
Post by: Holg3107 on October 16, 2012, 04:09:35 PM
Quote
Is the right to drive in constitution? And ya I do think it is a good example. My father and family taught me more then any class will. I'm tired of giving up freedoms too keep idiots safe. Give em a gun or a car and let em take themselves out, just like they did 50years ago.
Last I checked the right to hunt is not in the constitution. The right to bear arms is (very different). I agree that I learned most everything from my parents when it came to hunting and the ethics that go along with it (I also grew up out in the country). I'm unsure of your age Mudman but this isn't the 50's and not everyone lives out in the sticks or with parents who are able to expose them and educate them about the responsibilities that go along with gun ownership and hunting. The goal is not to keep idiots safe, the goal is to keep the everyone safe. The problem is the idiots are not taking themselves out (as you mentioned), they are taking out others. Hunters ed will not stop this but it may help.
Quote
And offer a course for those that want it and make them pass the same test the guys that don't want the course.
I have no idea what this means?
Quote
99% of it comes down to personal responsibly, most of the guys that are going to have or cause problems in the field are going to no matter how many hours of class they are required to take.
:yeah: I couldn't agree more with this statement, but it puts more responsibility on the individual since they have passed and are "educated" now. It makes it easier to justify violations and harder for people to play the ignorant card when they are doing something illegal.
Post by: Mudman on October 16, 2012, 09:42:49 PM
Post by: Lunchbox1981 on October 17, 2012, 03:12:45 AM
Not that I care one way or the other about the class, but reading this I can see who has never been in the military. Try 15 minutes late to formation and see how important or not it is. 15 minutes late to work every week? Guess why you are not getting the raise and promotion the guy who isn't 15 minutes late gets. May seem like no big deal, but it is.
This isn't the military. This is a safety class that tells the obvious.Several people were there on time and you being late is disrupting their class.
Really? Is it that disturbing to open and close a door. Ok.
I haven't made to the end of this topic yet but I had to post. So if this was already posted my bad.
15 Minutes late is disrespectful to everyone that has taken their time to make it on time. I know that there are always circumstances and things happen. When they do you suck it up and move on. Now I am not saying that the instructor acted right but we don't hear his side of the story. Were you 5-10 minutes late according to your time or 5-10 minutes late past the "Normal 15 Minutes" (no normal to that.
And the second thing folks keep saying is the safety class just tells the obvious. Obvious to one is not obvious to another. If this was true we wouldn't see at least 10 topics a year about don't use your scope as Bino's and point them at other hunters. Something that's obvious and taught at hunters safety courses. Maybe more people should pay attention to the course that just tells the obvious".
Just my 2 cents on the topic.
Post by: Sitka_Blacktail on October 17, 2012, 03:17:13 AM
We are responsible if we are late, period. An unyielding hardnosed jerk does not care if you stopped to give cpr to a dying man or if you had a wrong turn. They dont care if it was their directions that put you in another county. Its Your responsibility.... What a jerk. Its not a life or death meeting. :twocents:
If it wasn't a life or death meeting, Why is PP acting like it was? For crying out loud, He could have called days ahead of time and gotten detailed instructions of how to get there. Instead, he waited 'til the last minute and relied on his GPS. Who's fault is that? And why wait 'til the last chance to get checked out? If I was the instructor all this would say to me, "This gal isn't taking this class seriously."
And of course the instructor delivered the message, then turned and walked away. What did PP expect. He was going to stand there arguing with him while he had students waiting for instruction? He was going to go mano a mano with him and if PP won, his wife got to go in?
If he let anyone late come in, then he had to let the next guy. How late does he have to let someone in. All you late people interrupted his class. He should have just locked the door at starting time.
There's an old saying. "Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part."
I'll bet PP and his wife aren't late next time.
But I hope he's 15 min late getting out hunting, cuz guys like me will already be where he wants to go and might already have an animal down when he gets there.
Post by: Lunchbox1981 on October 17, 2012, 03:42:53 AM
"Piss poor planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine".
One of my favorite old quotes. I will have to dig this back out for my new desk. LOL
Post by: pianoman9701 on October 17, 2012, 08:22:08 AM
I believe the right to hunt is in our constitution in many ways. Our country, including minerals water and animals. Our right to freedom and prosperity, protection from others including gov. and wild animals, I think it is covered just not specifically. But it should be and there is a movement to clear this up!! And the seatbelt argument is exactly what I speak of in reference to laws and freedoms. Bad law that then was morphed into more freedoms being taken and all of a sudden you dont like it anymore. This has been the attack plan on gun rights for years. Regulating hunting under the idea of safety is just another way of gun regulation period. If the Gov. is not involved then I think it is great for everybody to be taught or reminded of safety and ethics. The unsafe city idiot has the same right I do whether I like it or not and I will not support his rights being regulated in any way because it leads to mine as well. The Gov. needs to operate in its cons. boundary. Asks yourselves what will be next. When some idiots do something stupid and its plastered all over liberal news what will our wonderful gun hating democratic legislators do next? Give em an inch and they take a mile! Remember when seatbelt law passed they promised they would not pull you over for it, howz that working? The list goes on foreever.
We have no right to hunt and should actively pursue that and have it added to our state's constitution. It will help us maintain our gun rights. I agree with that.
There is no right to prosperity, only the pursuit of happiness. A right to prosperity smacks of socialism. If there were a right to prosperity, I would stop working yesterday.
In my limited HE teaching experience, for the first class, there are usually one or two who are late. We've dealt with that by saying to the whole class that if anyone's late from here on, they will not be allowed to continue. 1 minute late or 15 - that's the rule. This is not to say that every instructor is required to make an exception in the first class. It only says that's what has happened in mine. The argument of being only a little late is similar to being a little pregnant. You're still late. Although there may well be mitigating circumstances, everyone could have them and there would be chaos. Either you're on time or you're not. If you stop to save someone's life, you've made a decision that doing so is more important than that which you'd previously committed to, and rightfully so.
When I ran a resort in NH, people who were late to work were either sent home or they lost a day later in the week. Rarely was anyone ever late for work. My favorite question was, "if being on time meant that you would make a $million, would you be on time?" So by not being on time, you're telling me that I'm not worth it to you.
I think you guys could possibly have been better prepared to be on time and that possibly, the instructor could have handled it differently. I say possibly for both because I wasn't there.
Post by: Mudman on October 17, 2012, 08:43:50 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on October 17, 2012, 09:32:59 AM
prosperity was a bad word choice, I was shooting from the hip! :chuckle: Keep in mind when const. was written there was no hunting season. It was a fact of life you hunted when needed just like you poop when needed. It was a given and no need to mention.
:yeah: :tup:
Post by: winshooter88 on October 18, 2012, 06:29:41 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on October 18, 2012, 07:14:13 AM
The reason that the WDFW has to do hunter ed is because they receive money from the federal government. The feds have certain things that they say you have to do to get certain funds for wildlife is the way I understand it.
Not to mention that since Hunter Education had commenced, incidents of hunting accidents have dropped dramatically. It's good for our sport to have it.
Post by: Bob33 on October 18, 2012, 07:16:43 AM
The reason that the WDFW has to do hunter ed is because they receive money from the federal government. The feds have certain things that they say you have to do to get certain funds for wildlife is the way I understand it.I do not believe the state is required to provide hunter education training. A portion of Pittman-Robertson funds must be used for hunter education, but if a state does not offer hunter education they simply would not receive that portion of the funds. All states offer some form of hunter education.
Post by: winshooter88 on October 18, 2012, 07:20:28 AM
Post by: Bob33 on October 18, 2012, 07:24:15 AM
By no means do these funds cover the full cost of a state's hunter education program, but they do help.
Post by: ironhead14 on October 23, 2012, 05:55:32 AM