Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Deer Hunting => Topic started by: hntrspud on November 01, 2012, 11:11:25 AM

Title: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 01, 2012, 11:11:25 AM: That I would be able to see a buck during hunting season. I have hunted and hunted, doing all types of hunting. I have sat for days, not moved at all. I have hunted clear cuts, anything you can imagine. I hunted everyday after work and all of my days off, including 3 extra I took off for deer. I have seen does, but not even a spike during season. Been in places with rubs galore, etc. I am looking for the correct word, because frustrated doesnt cut it. I have hunted all my life, taken suggestions from those who know what they are doing. Time is always the answer, well how much time do I have to spend to shoot a deer for some meat on the table? I dont want big horns. I walk REALLY SLOW, look everywhere. Nothing. It is beginning to make me wonder if all my time spent looking for a deer is futile. Dont get me wrong, I LOVE being in the woods, learn something new everytime. Then I see posts that say, "This buck just stepped right out in front of me on the road". Just sat in a clearcut and there were 4 bucks feeding and decided to take the largest,etc. What is it going to take? :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 01, 2012, 11:15:03 AM: Oh yea, its very tough to stay positive!
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: tbrady on November 01, 2012, 11:17:41 AM: Believe me, for every "success" post you see on this site there are probably 100 guys eating their tag...
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: TheFewTheProud on November 01, 2012, 11:20:56 AM: Man. Well I dont know what to tell you except to just stay at it. I switched to muzzleloader a few years back. Less hunters so there is less pressure... Maybe try that??
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 01, 2012, 11:28:19 AM: I have a bow now, but they would not let me switch tags. I have archery elk. I will probably change to archery next year. I am just tired of saying "next year", it will be next year I do better. Its not happening.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: janttihunter on November 01, 2012, 11:28:50 AM: I grew up on the East Coast hunting Whitetail. This is my first year in WA hunting Blacktail...They are tough..So far what ive learned is get away from people..go farther than anyone else will. And read Boyd Iversons Blacktail Trophy Tactics if you havnt..Other than that all I can say is that some of it is knowing or being allowed to hunt spots that others dont ..And some of it is being in the right place at the right time.(luck)

Another option is switch to Muzzy? You can shoot a doe in allot of spots during muzzy!

Good luck
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Wildsau on November 01, 2012, 11:29:36 AM: I feel your pain hntrspud, I seem to be out in the woods for the clean air and exercise. :dunno: I though, with going Archery, I would have a better chance, but, unless Late season is successful I will be joining so many others in having "Tag Soup".

I guess one has to look at it as it is called "Hunting" and not "Getting". If you keep at it (I know, you have heard it many, many times before), sooner or later, something will get stupid and follow you home.

I see it as I spent too much money getting ready to just give up without a fight. At the "end of the day", if I have to eat "Tag Soup", it won't be because I didn't try; and that, in itself, doesn't mean you are a failure, only that the animals are still very lucky. I am looking for their luck to run out anytime.

If I don't convince anything on Ft. Lewis, I will go spend some time in Moseyrock/Winston.

Sumpins gotta give.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: deleted BGS on November 01, 2012, 11:31:58 AM: You need to buy out of state tags. Stop wasting your time in WA, I will am tired of it here and wont be hunting it much anymore
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Wildsau on November 01, 2012, 11:35:08 AM: Outta state hunting is good, IF you have the monies to do it. Not all of us that kind of money handy. :twocents:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: crane on November 01, 2012, 11:37:10 AM: Karma dude, Karma!

No not really. Sorry about your luck though. If it has been that many years and you have put that much effort into it I am not sure how to explain it!!

Maybe eat less beans.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Fl0und3rz on November 01, 2012, 11:43:39 AM: Oh great! So now I have at least another four more years of ~~waiting~~ hunting?
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Derailed on November 01, 2012, 11:44:48 AM: I am in the same boat here. hunt and hunt listen to what people are saying. I trying to be good at hunting but more and more I hope I just get lucky, . I think next year I am going to where it will be more getting than hunting.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Kowsrule30 on November 01, 2012, 11:52:44 AM: I ran into a guy that missed a buck 5 or 6 times..... It ran by me and I dropped it... When he got there he was almost in tears.... Told me it was the first buck he'd seen in 20 years and he blew it.... :o I didn't know what to tell him... Just hope you aren't that guy!!!!
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 01, 2012, 11:53:34 AM: I havent done anything to deserve bad Karma. I dont have the money to hunt out of state, if I did, I wouldnt have this issue. I grew up in Idaho, have family and land there. I havent had beans in a while either. :dunno: I dont give up either, if I can make it 8 years. I fight every year, hunt till the last minute of every day I am out, go out before light, dont leave the woods, sit, scent, rattle etc...
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Russ McDonald on November 01, 2012, 11:54:12 AM: I just started hunting here too. Second year. I am archery hunting this year for deer and muzzy for elk. Yes the amount of people out there is between gerneral and the other two is stagering. If you switch to archery next year let me know maybe we can get together since we live in the same area. Plus you get an early and late season with arcery and muzzy too.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Skyvalhunter on November 01, 2012, 11:55:07 AM: Are you hunting Blacktail? Usually it's only a matter of time before the bucks come around with does in the area. My buck was by himself and had the rut smell but alot of times the rut isn't until later but that varies from area to area.. I know guys that hunt the Hancock and does is pretty much all they see. Might try a different area and a little more higher elevation. I didn't hear much for shots during my blacktail hunt. On the east side there is always the clowns that decide they want to target practice on Sunday aftern the opener. But they are weeded out after a couple days. but thats another topic. Just stay with it and maybe look at another area and scouting. Best time to scout is now thru the later part of the month for Blacktails.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Russ McDonald on November 01, 2012, 12:10:50 PM: I am going out scouting tomorrow for the late season. I was up on Finney Ridge for work yesterday in the pouring down rain and saw one big damn doe with another deer (just saw the ass of that one) as they headed into the woods at a high rate of speed. On the way back down there was a big old fat butterball spike in the middle of the road. So they are out moving. I had to laugh too. Last day of gerneral rifle and not a single soul out there. I was in an area that the doe could have been taken too.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Seabass on November 01, 2012, 12:26:43 PM: My dad is an awesome golfer. I assumed when I got older I would be too. Turned out after 4 years of OBSESSIVE practice...I suck at golf. I had to make the decision to accept that I suck at golf and play anyway just for the "fun" of it or quit. I couldn't find anything about it that I enjoyed since I was no good so I quit. Some guys can find other aspects of the game besides score that keeps them playing. I personally could not.

In hunting it has been the exact reverse for my dad and I. While he is a great golfer he would starve if it were up to him to kill a deer. I on the other hand have not had that problem. My dad gave up hunting years ago. I have tried on many occasions to drag him back in but he doesn't enjoy it as much as I do and he rarely has any success.

I guess the moral of the story is some people are better at some activities than others. Some find other redeeming qualities that keep them involved despite a lack of success. Some simply just move on to something that they are succesful at.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: jackmaster on November 01, 2012, 12:32:21 PM: Have you tried throwin up a prayer to "ORION" the hunter, when ever it is a clear morning i always say "how,do" and i have to say i have been treated pretty damn good, i havent killed a deer for 4 years but it been by choice, i have had chances but didnt take them, my son gets to hunt for meat and i hunt for the chance at crackn a hog blackie, if i was you i would go back to where you saw all those doe, and spend the whole extended season watchn that spot
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: RoyBoy on November 03, 2012, 03:32:49 AM: yeah keep your head up its partially skill and partially luck you just gotta be in the right spot at the right time. think about it your going into there home and trying to find them. if someone came into your home and you didnt want to be seen it probably would be pretty hard to find you huh? my dad is one hell of a hunter and he finally broke his curse this year! it was 9 years straight of nothing for him! he took this big boy opening day. your time will come. :hello: :tup:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: bassquatch on November 03, 2012, 06:51:20 AM: If you are seeing animals it is only a matter of time. Took me 10 years to harvest my first muley and that was on a late tag. I wasted 5 years hunting crap deer areas to scout for elk though. Try hunting areas with more deer, Republic, Twisp, Mazama, Vail? increase your odds?. I look at it this way, if I had to hunt to live I would do just fine cause I find deer every single year, however, playing the "count the tines" game in this State has cost me 2 bucks that bolted before I could assertain their legal status and missed one walking at 330 yards (later realized my scope was off high :bash: ). What I am saying is pat yourself on the back for being 'in deer', just focus cause when that legal buck does finally show himself you want to be ready to take him! I get more frustrated finding giant 2 points that aren't legal to shoot cause it's a 3pt min area, they just stand and stare at you :bash:

Hang in there :tup:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Selkirk on November 03, 2012, 06:54:37 AM: :yeah:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Raul Duke on November 03, 2012, 07:22:09 AM: My hunting buddy went 8 yrs before he got his first buck. The year after that he got a bigger one. In the last 5 years he has taken 2bucks, 2 doe. This year we are going on a late hunt to see if we have any luck.
Well I've been hunting 5 years now, and I should of shot the 1st buck,the 1st year I hunted, but I let him shoot it. Same thing happend the 2ND year. I spotted that on too. I've yet to fire my rifle at anything, but I've always had meat in the freezer. Even my 12yr old got her first deer this years her 1st time out.
Stay positive and keep your eyes open. Your time will come.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: billythekidrock on November 03, 2012, 07:26:01 AM: Every year we get a couple of threads like this and I honestly don’t know what to say especially when it comes to BTs. I just don’t understand how someone can go more than a few seasons without harvesting a buck or at least having a couple of opportunities.

I am not talking about the guys holding out for a masher buck. I am talking about the guys who are willing to shoot any legal buck.

I had a conversation at work the other day with a contract worker who told me that he hunted modern elk for a couple days on the eastside and he didn’t see any until he was back over the crest on his way home. He said that if he had a westside tag he would have gotten an elk. I told him that modern didn’t open until this Saturday.

It only took a few minutes to realize that he had no clue about what he was doing or how to read the regs.

It got me to wondering about these yearly posts and below is a short list of my thoughts. My reason for posting this is to create an introspective look and hopefully give the unsuccessful hunters an idea of what they might be missing or not taking into account. This is not intended to insult or belittle.

I wonder:
·   If the hunters have had a mentor or are they self-made big game hunters? A mentor can speed up the learning curve and keep an inexperienced hunter on track.
·   Do they understand “sign”? Multiple sets of tracks do not always mean multiple deer. Large scat does not always mean it’s a buck.
·   Does the hunter have more than a couple tactics or willing to change styles of hunting? Have you tried hunting the first clear cut on the mainline? You know the one that everyone drives by?
·   Are they using the right tactics for the location? Hunting public land can be a lot different from hunting private property.
·   Are they willing to break from proven tactics or conventions when necessary? Try hunting with the wind in certain situations.
·   Are they really spending a lot of time in the woods? Most successful hunters are in the woods numerous times during the year.
·   Are they spending enough time in the woods during the season? This means being in the woods well before daylight and hunting right up till dark in the evening and hunting more than opening weekend.
·   Are they hunting between 10 and 2 or are they leaving the woods? Lots of bucks get killed mid day when hunter pressure is lower.
·   Are there many bucks where you hunt? Are you scouting year round, talking to locals or viewing harvest data?
·   Do they know how to hunt various terrain or even know what the terrain is really like in the area they hunt? Learning favored terrain and habitat can be crucial.
·   Are you hunting or drinking? I know that hunting is a social event for many, but others have better success by themselves.
·   Are you utilizing permits and seasons to your benefit? Only have a few days to hunt? Choose modern for the rut. Have a lot of vacation? Try archery or multi-season.

There are a few good BTs books out there, but reading those won’t help if you don’t understand the thoughts and ideas listed above.

Don’t get me wrong, I have hunted BTs for over 30 years and I know that it is never easy. But I do know that you can be successful if the time and effort is put in.

Many of these same thoughts are had when I hear about people going 10, 15 or 20 years without killing an elk.

I am not trying to bash those that are unsuccessful. Just trying to understand, offer some constructive criticism and hopefully create some insight into why they are not successful.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 03, 2012, 07:50:25 AM: I have never been mentored for bt, have no friends to hunt with, consistently. I'm from Idaho, I know what sign is,i don't know many areas, but I am very much trying to learn. Its just hard to do it alone. I am researching and trying to educate myself, because knowledge is power right? I don't sound like an elephant,I walk very very slow, scent control and so on.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: CoryTDF on November 03, 2012, 08:20:17 AM: You need the following:

1) half a stick of butter in your left back pocket.
2) a bear claw
3) 13 barbie legs in a ziplock bag in your backpack.
4) 6 trout fins in an Altiods box.
5) 3 burt match heads and a pencil eraser.
6) 9 grean army men with gummy bears impailed on thier bayonets.
7) A marble.
8) A picture of me.
9) The number 23
10) The answer to life, love, and everything. 42.

As long as you have those things you should be fine. Thats what you have been doing wrong all this time.

Really though time is all it takes. Right place at the right time. Like the old saying goes " I would rather be lucky than good" and that is about as true as it gets.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: DaveBTS on November 03, 2012, 08:36:40 AM: Honestly, you need to find a new area or hunt that area better. Spend more time out there during the off-season. That will tell you if it's a spot worth hunting.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 03, 2012, 09:22:26 AM: Ok, I have everything on the list, but I am missing 3 barbie legs. Cory, do you have a couple I could use for a bit? :chuckle: :chuckle:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Rob on November 03, 2012, 09:25:48 AM: My buddy calls it armed hiking...

Best advice on this thread I have read is to get a mentor. Or at least find a hunting buddy to go with. Helps to have someone who is in it with you, and will strategize with you when the deer are not where they are supposed to be.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: mikelonsford on November 03, 2012, 09:58:57 AM: I think it sounds like you are primarily still hunting as I was taught. Take several creeping quiet steps and stop, listen, watch and repeat. Hunting blacktails in this manner is really tough. If you are hunting more open terrain on the east slope for mulies, no problem. I think you either need to find a great game trail in the bottom of a nasty drainage and sit on it after vericying with game camera there are bucks around. Or you could try clear cuts first and last of the day way behind locked gates, miles behind. Most successful BT's I know use quads on logging land and hit as many clear cuts as they can and they basically either find them first or last in the cuts or while road hunting with their quad during the day. Which is why I hunt the eastside for mulies. The only chnces I've had for BT has been early archery up high while elk hunting or local deer on private, or road hunting clear cuts on logging land. Go east young man, you'll have more fun! Good luck and hang in there, the worm will turn for you.
Mike
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Rooster1981 on November 03, 2012, 10:03:29 AM: Quote from: DaveBTS on November 03, 2012, 08:36:40 AM
Honestly, you need to find a new area or hunt that area better. Spend more time out there during the off-season. That will tell you if it's a spot worth hunting.

:yeah:

Scouting,Scouting,Scouting
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 03, 2012, 10:19:11 AM: I agree. In reading and thinking about it all, I have thought to myself that I need to change areas. I have been very adimate? in getting to know the areas that I do hunt. In that I may have put on blinders, so to speak. I do know the areas very well now, but it would be nice to find a higher population of deer in an area. I will post something in the partner/hunt swap forum and see if I can find someone to go with.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: longstevo on November 03, 2012, 11:41:49 AM: Hntrspud I feel your pain.

I've always been fortunate enough to see bucks almost every year that I hunt, but most years they're pretty sparse. I hunt muzzle in Wash. and each year that I've been able to put forth an entire season (or at least a full week), I've got shooting. But, that being said, it my fifteen plus years of hunting, I only have two muzzle bucks to my name.

Its tough not to think that the woods are empty when you're putting mile and mile down and you aren't even seeing fleeing deer.

I don't know what to tell you. If I were you, I'd be hooking up with your friends and family in Idaho. Even then though, $500 is a pretty steep price to pay.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: CoryTDF on November 03, 2012, 12:44:10 PM: Quote from: hntrspud on November 03, 2012, 09:22:26 AM
Ok, I have everything on the list, but I am missing 3 barbie legs. Cory, do you have a couple I could use for a bit? :chuckle: :chuckle:

I'll have to check but I think I might have a few in reserve.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: billythekidrock on November 03, 2012, 01:18:30 PM: Quote from: Rooster1981 on November 03, 2012, 10:03:29 AM
Quote from: DaveBTS on November 03, 2012, 08:36:40 AM
Honestly, you need to find a new area or hunt that area better. Spend more time out there during the off-season. That will tell you if it's a spot worth hunting.

:yeah:

Scouting,Scouting,Scouting

:yeah:

Like today. Today would be great day to scout for late buck and beyond, as would next weekend.

Today I checked a cam on state land and ran into an elk hunter who told me about a 3pt buck that crossed the road minutes before I got there.

No one I talked to this year saw anything larger than a fork during the season, but now I know we should still be looking for this 3x3.

(Steve, if you read this, it was at the 4 way)

Some other things to think about:
The BT rut is never really "early" or "late". It is what it is and it always peaks at the same time. Don't let posts about the rut change your plans. Just because someone did or did not see what they think they should does not mean that it isn't happening. Opening weekend I saw a nice three point sniffing some does on private property. That does not mean the rut was early..it just means that I actually saw some prerut activity. I saw the same 3 does in the same field today without a buck...does that mean the rut is over already? No, it just means that I did not see any rutting activity.

Knowing a lot of areas is good, but knowing fewer areas better is best. Have back up places, but know your primary area inside and out. Know every trail, creek and falling log. Note when you see things out of the ordinary like ravens, tracks or toilet paper. Know how others hunt the same area and learn to use that to your advantage.

Finding large deer populations can be key, but that also means you will face more competition from other hunters. You only need one to fill your tag. If there are not many bucks in your area, get to know them as individuals. Know where they go when pressured and where they will feed during the season. I would rather hunt 1 or 2 bucks and not see hunters than move to an area with more deer and more pressure.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 03, 2012, 02:07:24 PM: Thanks Billy. I do have one area I know in and out. I just dont see as many does as I guess Im thinking I should see. I know they are in that area, just not many. Funny you say that about other hunters. I know how they hunt it and had never thought about it that way. Most will walk the roads. There isnt really any clearcuts, just thinning out in areas. No re-plant. Funny how I thought I knew that area so well and then this year, I go just a little farther down one trail and low and behold another spot I didnt know about. So, I will just keep persisting. I would like to find another area tho.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: FLIZZ on November 03, 2012, 03:34:15 PM: I understand, My first 4 years of hunting I never saw a single buck, but then I killed 3 in the 4 years after that (one was a pig). Passed up 5 last year and 3 so far this year. Trust me, it will only get better from here on out for you. A lot of people think its a hoax, but I would get some HS scent away laundry detergent, deodorant, shampoo, and fresh earth spray and follow that regimen before your hunts. If you aren't already doing so, you might as well try it. :dunno: AND HIT LATE BUCK HARD BECAUSE THE RUT WILL BE ON. ps; pack a headlamp so you can walk out in the dark, so you can sit watching a cut for the last half hour of light. Unload your gun after legal light though. :)
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: jnevs23 on November 03, 2012, 03:49:23 PM: Late rifle NE corner opens next weekend...
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Jonathan_S on November 03, 2012, 04:29:01 PM: Quote from: Rob on November 03, 2012, 09:25:48 AM
My buddy calls it armed hiking...

Best advice on this thread I have read is to get a mentor. Or at least find a hunting buddy to go with. Helps to have someone who is in it with you, and will strategize with you when the deer are not where they are supposed to be.

:tup: that's all there is to anything, find somebody who has what you want and mirror their efforts. Find a hunting buddy.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 03, 2012, 05:00:41 PM: Im trying to find one. If I knew where to go over there in NE corner, I would. But that is a long way to drive for a public spot that "not a bad spot to hunt".
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: bowhntr on November 04, 2012, 01:51:36 AM: Trail cams help keep me motivated. They are nice reminder that blacktail bucks do exist while I am out there hunting.

(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1219.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd434%2FwillinghRJ%2FPICT00192.jpg&hash=02f2175d6b2627c7e26161a89e91e5be35f2c01f)
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1219.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd434%2FwillinghRJ%2FPICT0063.jpg&hash=6905e77f477f0b839f3aa803dae582147d372e8d)
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1219.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd434%2FwillinghRJ%2FPICT00432.jpg&hash=99a70b173272227024f7f465ff9f635c2e76bd85)
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1219.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd434%2FwillinghRJ%2FPICT0119.jpg&hash=6cff91e1399594e6153f79d4059c17aec576c70a)
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on November 04, 2012, 01:58:53 AM: Quote from: hntrspud on November 01, 2012, 11:28:19 AM
I have a bow now, but they would not let me switch tags. I have archery elk. I will probably change to archery next year. I am just tired of saying "next year", it will be next year I do better. Its not happening.
This is your best option :tup: practice hard and put the rifle in the closet ...once you stick an animal with an arrow you will become hooked for life .....and you have way more opportunity to hunt longer ...like 2 1/2 months :IBCOOL: :dunno: :tup:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on November 04, 2012, 09:19:28 AM: I bought a rifle tag first year 2008 hunted hard as ever! Did the alpine high hunt. Every chance I got i went.... vail and capital peak and other spots local too. I even went to friggin colville !!!! No buck! The next year archery tag went east seen good deer numbers and got to spot and stalk archery mule deer hunt. Best thing on earth btw. No buck for three straight years of archery I was discouraged to say the least. The fifth year 2012 I got a rifle tag and went at it as I normally would have to start the season. I saw lots of guys by no deer. Untill about my tenth trip hiking behind a gate right by my home even with guys trespassing I got a Nice two point down! Iron sights spined him! I see a lot more deer bow hunting. But killing one with an arrow has proven very difficult. I meat hunt so every doe I see gets me going w a bow. I you go to the bow become very efficient with it at long range on a target before hunting. Archery is a lot more meticulous than rifle hunting. Your gear mus be tuned and re tuned and way more effort is required to make a leathal one shot kill. I encourage you to try but just some lessons I've learned. After you find he deer stay put a buck will show himself. Good luck .
Title: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: sirmissalot on November 04, 2012, 10:46:31 AM: Blacktail hunting is frustrating that's for sure. I think the biggest reason I've been successful at it is because I spend every waking moment possible out in the woods when the season is open. A lot of it is luck and being in the right place at the right time, and more time in the field just gives you more opportunity to get lucky.

I never see a lot of deer. I find areas that consistently have does, and just wait for the bucks to come, because they will. Eventually they will slip up and come out before dark. Don't get frustrated because you don't see a lot of deer, because you only need one.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: AKBowman on November 04, 2012, 03:03:06 PM: Quote from: billythekidrock on November 03, 2012, 01:18:30 PM
Quote from: Rooster1981 on November 03, 2012, 10:03:29 AM
Quote from: DaveBTS on November 03, 2012, 08:36:40 AM
Honestly, you need to find a new area or hunt that area better. Spend more time out there during the off-season. That will tell you if it's a spot worth hunting.

:yeah:

Scouting,Scouting,Scouting

:yeah:

Like today. Today would be great day to scout for late buck and beyond, as would next weekend.

Today I checked a cam on state land and ran into an elk hunter who told me about a 3pt buck that crossed the road minutes before I got there.

No one I talked to this year saw anything larger than a fork during the season, but now I know we should still be looking for this 3x3.

(Steve, if you read this, it was at the 4 way)

Some other things to think about:
The BT rut is never really "early" or "late". It is what it is and it always peaks at the same time. Don't let posts about the rut change your plans. Just because someone did or did not see what they think they should does not mean that it isn't happening. Opening weekend I saw a nice three point sniffing some does on private property. That does not mean the rut was early..it just means that I actually saw some prerut activity. I saw the same 3 does in the same field today without a buck...does that mean the rut is over already? No, it just means that I did not see any rutting activity.

Knowing a lot of areas is good, but knowing fewer areas better is best. Have back up places, but know your primary area inside and out. Know every trail, creek and falling log. Note when you see things out of the ordinary like ravens, tracks or toilet paper. Know how others hunt the same area and learn to use that to your advantage.

Finding large deer populations can be key, but that also means you will face more competition from other hunters. You only need one to fill your tag. If there are not many bucks in your area, get to know them as individuals. Know where they go when pressured and where they will feed during the season. I would rather hunt 1 or 2 bucks and not see hunters than move to an area with more deer and more pressure.

It is interesting to hear what experienced hunters have to say about this. It sure as hell helps to have a father or mentor to show you the ropes anda how to kill Blacktails like you had Btkr. The thing is lots of guys do the right things but just give up after they aren't successful b/c hunting bts in this thick country can mentally defeat the most experienced hunter let alone the guy who hasn't killed anything before. Now if you hear a guy who's killed a lot of big bt's that you are doing things right and just keep it up then you are more likely to persevere and perseverance is usually the difference between success and failure with Bt's.
I went two years without killing anything archery then killed a spike followed by a doe the next yr. Finally started scouting and missed a really nice buck last yr. I put in 15 days in the field to get the shot at that buck last yr. Now this is where the luck thing comes into play...I showed a guy a little out of the way spot not too far from the gate to sit and he sat there one day and killed a great 4X4 with eyeguards. I sat in that spot for 5 days and never saw a thing. He killed another buck in that same spot this yr after hunting no more than a few hrs in the spot...I had a camera in there all summer and got pics of bucks only a dozen or so different days. It just happens that way sometimes, I hardly ever see deer in the area when I'm scouting but they are there.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 04, 2012, 03:35:51 PM: I guess then I need someone to go out with me and observe what I do and give some criticism or encouragment.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: billythekidrock on November 04, 2012, 05:44:38 PM: Quote from: AKBowman on November 04, 2012, 03:03:06 PM
Quote from: billythekidrock on November 03, 2012, 01:18:30 PM
Quote from: Rooster1981 on November 03, 2012, 10:03:29 AM
Quote from: DaveBTS on November 03, 2012, 08:36:40 AM
Honestly, you need to find a new area or hunt that area better. Spend more time out there during the off-season. That will tell you if it's a spot worth hunting.

:yeah:

Scouting,Scouting,Scouting

:yeah:

Like today. Today would be great day to scout for late buck and beyond, as would next weekend.

Today I checked a cam on state land and ran into an elk hunter who told me about a 3pt buck that crossed the road minutes before I got there.

No one I talked to this year saw anything larger than a fork during the season, but now I know we should still be looking for this 3x3.

(Steve, if you read this, it was at the 4 way)

Some other things to think about:
The BT rut is never really "early" or "late". It is what it is and it always peaks at the same time. Don't let posts about the rut change your plans. Just because someone did or did not see what they think they should does not mean that it isn't happening. Opening weekend I saw a nice three point sniffing some does on private property. That does not mean the rut was early..it just means that I actually saw some prerut activity. I saw the same 3 does in the same field today without a buck...does that mean the rut is over already? No, it just means that I did not see any rutting activity.

Knowing a lot of areas is good, but knowing fewer areas better is best. Have back up places, but know your primary area inside and out. Know every trail, creek and falling log. Note when you see things out of the ordinary like ravens, tracks or toilet paper. Know how others hunt the same area and learn to use that to your advantage.

Finding large deer populations can be key, but that also means you will face more competition from other hunters. You only need one to fill your tag. If there are not many bucks in your area, get to know them as individuals. Know where they go when pressured and where they will feed during the season. I would rather hunt 1 or 2 bucks and not see hunters than move to an area with more deer and more pressure.

It is interesting to hear what experienced hunters have to say about this. It sure as hell helps to have a father or mentor to show you the ropes anda how to kill Blacktails like you had Btkr. The thing is lots of guys do the right things but just give up after they aren't successful b/c hunting bts in this thick country can mentally defeat the most experienced hunter let alone the guy who hasn't killed anything before. Now if you hear a guy who's killed a lot of big bt's that you are doing things right and just keep it up then you are more likely to persevere and perseverance is usually the difference between success and failure with Bt's.
I went two years without killing anything archery then killed a spike followed by a doe the next yr. Finally started scouting and missed a really nice buck last yr. I put in 15 days in the field to get the shot at that buck last yr. Now this is where the luck thing comes into play...I showed a guy a little out of the way spot not too far from the gate to sit and he sat there one day and killed a great 4X4 with eyeguards. I sat in that spot for 5 days and never saw a thing. He killed another buck in that same spot this yr after hunting no more than a few hrs in the spot...I had a camera in there all summer and got pics of bucks only a dozen or so different days. It just happens that way sometimes, I hardly ever see deer in the area when I'm scouting but they are there.

Yes, I was very fortunate to have learned to hunt deer and elk from my father. He was basically a self taught big game hunter but did have friends that hunted as well. I also learned a lot from those friends as well as by comparing experiences with my brothers. So in my opinion, the more styles or experiences the better.

I think you took the right aproach by getting a few legal animals under your belt to learn and to fend off feelings of defeat. Too many hold out, are not successfull and then give up.

You also mentioned a very important key to BT hunting. Knowing they are they is paramount to success and helps endure those blank afternoons of cold and rain.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: BlacktailBowhunter on November 05, 2012, 10:58:17 AM: 2 books that are a must read and will help you kill your buck.

Cameron Hanes "Bowhunting Trophy Blacktail" Oh yea, he has a BT DVD out as well.

Scott Haugen's "Trohpy Blacktail" The Science of the Hunt.

These 2 books give you everything you need to know and if you basically follow them as an instruction booklet, you will kill blacktail bucks.

Just remember, if you want to be successful on a consistent basis, you have to do it basically year around.

Good luck.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: billythekidrock on November 05, 2012, 04:46:29 PM: Blacktail Trophy Tactics I & II by Boyd Iverson are better.
http://www.blacktailtrophytactics.com/ (http://www.blacktailtrophytactics.com/)
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: enaz on November 05, 2012, 05:58:10 PM: This has been an extremely humbling thread for me, and for that I thank you. I've been wandering around pouting because I couldn't get my fiance on a buck during rifle season. Her brother came over from the eastside and hadn't shot a buck in 11 years and is inexperienced. He got a good 2 point the first day. I got my first elk during archery this year after hunting hard for 2 years. What do I have to complain about? DO NOT switch to golf or quit hunting to take up something else. After going at it for 8 years you must love just being out there like I, and everyone else on this site. I've been lucky enough to have a great mentor in my Dad and other friends and family and that really is a key. Reading the book Blacktail tactics is an awesome idea ,I love that book. But having someone show you the ropes first hand is what is needed in my opinion. Take all this advice, find yourself a partner who shares the passion ( unless you wanna fly solo ) , and find where the deer are. If you want to find the deer, get out and scout early ( may, june, july ). The deer are alot less spooky and seem to show themselves more, and they also are wearing their summer coats that are way more orangish/tan colored and easy to see. Picking them out of clearcuts is really easy this time of year. Continue watching them as they change coats through september, and you will be able to pick them out much better. Being able to spot a deer in october in the pouring rain is not easy, and you may be overlooking many deer. As much as I'm sure your inspired like me by all the success stories and pics on here, I'm even more inspired to hunt harder after reading your thread. I'm not too lucky when it comes to hunting so I have to bust my ass for everything I harvest. Keep at it man, get out there and make your own luck.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: kentrek on November 05, 2012, 06:19:14 PM: hmmm...i remember a saying.. Thomas Edison had over 1200 light bulb designs that faild,when asked about his lack of discovery he said ,he had made a great discovery...over 1200 different ways on how not to make a light bulb

stay positive,negativity doesn't belong in the woods.. easier said then done i know

a guide could make for a great investment aswell

good luck :tup:
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Rickyrebar on November 05, 2012, 06:47:19 PM: Keep the faith, it will happen.
I hunt with a couple of fellas who's father hunted for twenty years before putting his first one on the ground. It happened 2 years ago and wouldn't you know it he was the only one in camp that year to score!
The following year (last year) the beast gods granted him another!
I don't wish a 20 year dry spell on anyone, but the point is don't throw in the towel.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on November 07, 2012, 07:12:13 AM: Quote from: kentrek on November 05, 2012, 06:19:14 PM
hmmm...i remember a saying.. Thomas Edison had over 1200 light bulb designs that faild,when asked about his lack of discovery he said ,he had made a great discovery...over 1200 different ways on how not to make a light bulb

stay positive,negativity doesn't belong in the woods.. easier said then done i know

a guide could make for a great investment aswell

good luck :tup:

This is why after a long scouting trip or hunt with no game spotted " I found where there not at" and it's important to know where not to go as to not waste time and money so the discovery of no game benefits me for next time. You might not shoot one this year but from the couch for sure you won't shoot one. Point is get out an hunt! I saw a smasher buck yesterday w my lady while elk hunting. She was mad as she walked for 15+ days during deer season w no shots then he steps out and teased her. We found this same bucks shed in April and seen him without bone shortly after bedded off the road we walk. Building a preseason relashionship with blacktails is helpfull in finding them. Stay at it and one will show himself on the 15th.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: hntrspud on November 07, 2012, 02:10:41 PM: I am definatly not negative with myself. I really enjoy being out there. I went out today to scout out a new area, thanks to some help from billythekidrock! He didnt give me an area, but helped me understand mine better. Sure enough, with that advice, I saw more sign, and even some Elk. I put my trail camera out in a better place, and cant wait to see what shows. I cannot however hunt this spot the rest of the season for elk or deer, but I sure as heck will be out there lookin anyway. I cant wait till the snow flies, kinda hard to see tracks in leaves....
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: Labs07 on November 07, 2012, 02:57:50 PM: Hang in there! I have killed many, many deer over my life! I do more sitting then walking and when ever I break a twig or something I stop for a few minutes and crouch down and look, I have killed many deer doing this as they are trying to sneak away! The other thing though is I have been hunting the same mountians all of my life so I knwo where the big boys are and I know where they go when they get some preasure. Hunt the wind! It is the biggest advantage you have!
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: 264winmag on November 07, 2012, 04:08:47 PM: Hang in there! I know I have gone an entire early season without seeing any deer on public land let alone bucks. When I go to eastern WA I can't go half a day without seeing a buck even if I tried not to see one.
I chased around 14 4point or bigger bucks for the first four days of archery, closest I got was 85yds. I chased around 17 4+point bucks for 5 days during Muzzle Loader, closest I got 220yds.
My point is, if you can do some homework, hook up with another hunter and go to eastern wa. It's very different hunting but I am a better BT huntr because of it. I spot them better, use the wind better, and watch my movement better! Things you can easily forget here on the west side bescause like the deer you feel at ease in the surrounding thick crap.

The wife would not let me go to the eastside for a third time during modern for the first year in a while. I spent to much money I guess. So I hunted 8 days out of the early season on this side. I saw 81 deer, 6bucks. My buddy shot one spike, I passed on a spikey, I passed on 2 spikes and a small forkie that were running together and the last day (wednesday) I saw a great forkie that refused to cooperate!

Expect to see deer! if the sign is there, they are there! You live north of me, but i would take you out late buck if you want. Somthings gotta give and someone needs to help you if your that sincere. I'm no expert by any means. There's alot of guys on here that shoot way bigger deer than me. I wish I could get in on what and where they know. If i help you, mabe carma will come back to me. It took me 5 years to tag my first BT. And I'm still looking for my first bruiser! Most are.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: billythekidrock on November 08, 2012, 05:58:50 PM: Quote from: hntrspud on November 07, 2012, 02:10:41 PM
I am definatly not negative with myself. I really enjoy being out there. I went out today to scout out a new area, thanks to some help from billythekidrock! He didnt give me an area, but helped me understand mine better. Sure enough, with that advice, I saw more sign, and even some Elk. I put my trail camera out in a better place, and cant wait to see what shows. I cannot however hunt this spot the rest of the season for elk or deer, but I sure as heck will be out there lookin anyway. I cant wait till the snow flies, kinda hard to see tracks in leaves....

Glad to help. Can't wait to see some trail cam pics.
Oh yea, you might check that valley up to the NW. That would be my second bet to start scouting. Good luck.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: BlacktailBowhunter on November 10, 2012, 12:00:19 PM: Quote from: billythekidrock on November 05, 2012, 04:46:29 PM
Blacktail Trophy Tactics I & II by Boyd Iverson are better.
http://www.blacktailtrophytactics.com/ (http://www.blacktailtrophytactics.com/)

I have read all 4 books and I believe they all have equal value.

Scott Haugen's is almost too scientific for most guys to grasp, but it offers a lot of stuff that I have never read anywhere else.

Cam's book is very simple and straight forward, which makes it an easy read.
Title: Re: You would think after 8 yrs.......
Post by: mtman on November 10, 2012, 07:06:24 PM: 90% of the blacktail bucks I see are During the early archery season. I don't hunt archery seasons but it is nice to Know were the big ones are before the velvet comes off. After that good luck until the rut, unless you got them figured out. Blacktails are hard to hunt Read some books and put alot or time in. I still haven't got the blacktail of my dreams but I see them every year. My dads got 4 bucks that I would be happy with for the rest of my life. But I just got to keep trying and it will happen never give up. Mine is coming neat year. Hope yours does too.