Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Elk Hunting => Topic started by: Dbax129 on February 03, 2013, 02:08:36 PM

Title: What' the difference?
Post by: Dbax129 on February 03, 2013, 02:08:36 PM: Do elk bulls have rub lines like deer? How can you tell the difference? I have seen buck's rub lines on alder sapplings plenty, here in western washington.
2nd question, when are elk in winter vs summer areas? Is it worth scouting winter areas march-september? I plan to hunt rifle, so that'll be November right, I assume they will be in winter areas then?
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Giggles on February 03, 2013, 02:24:44 PM: I don't know about the rub lines, but there is a "big" difference in the size of the rub. Found one last year that the tree had tine marks on it at the 9 foot mark. The actual rub area on the tree was about at the 5 foot mark. I'm not an expert on elk, but I think it must have been a bigun.
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: WaHeadhunter on February 03, 2013, 06:53:40 PM: Elk
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Dbax129 on February 03, 2013, 07:13:59 PM: Ok. I guess just bigger than deer. The deer line I hunted last year once was about as big. 10' sapplings were stripped about like that picture... From the ground to about 4' I guess. That pick looks like maybe 6' or so. Thank you!
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: WaHeadhunter on February 03, 2013, 07:54:03 PM: Circumference of the tree makes difference too. A deer would go after this tree but would not mark it up as much.
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Giggles on February 03, 2013, 08:10:07 PM: About when does an elk start to rub, and how long will they continue to rub? I found quite a few rubs the 1st week of early archery this past year. Do elk generally rub in the same areas year after year?
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: ellensburgpo on February 03, 2013, 08:50:35 PM: (https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi160.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft176%2Fkoreacop142%2FElk%2FDSC00683_zps280916ae.jpg&hash=e6864f38cd61c9f1304c3072ad9c25272f7213c5)

(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi160.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft176%2Fkoreacop142%2FElk%2FDSC00682_zpsc63b4214.jpg&hash=70e920598aca2e6c3c44030ffb902aebbac92614)

Elk
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 03, 2013, 09:26:57 PM: You should see elk rubbing off velvet in mid August and then on through the rut. I see rubs in certain areas year after year like bedding areas and sort its not necessary the same bull year to year.
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Stizz on February 04, 2013, 03:39:53 PM: I've noticed similar types of rubbing territory behavior from elk. Not neccesarily as rub lines, but zones where a particular bull will frequently visit to rub. From what i've seen of this seems like a bull will have a core area where most of his rubbing activity will be (ie alder thickets, bedding areas, benches), especially during pre rut. Once cows go into heat it seems that the rubs are more sporadic, which makes sense as their focus turns to being where the cows are.
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: heavy hauler on February 04, 2013, 04:23:59 PM: you can scout this time of year, just look for old rubs. you may not see any elk now, but the rubs will let you know the bulls are there in sept/oct
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: mfswallace on February 04, 2013, 04:28:55 PM: Quote from: WaHeadhunter on February 03, 2013, 07:54:03 PM
Circumference of the tree makes difference too. A deer would go after this tree but would not mark it up as much.

Much bigger trees are rubbed by elk
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: HighCountryElk on February 04, 2013, 06:40:12 PM: Here is an elk rub I came across last season. It was at least 8' tall and the tree was 8-9" in diameter. Never did find the big guy that made it though. :'(
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Critter Ritter on February 04, 2013, 08:08:33 PM: In one of my honey holes there are a lot of elk rubs, a 15 by 15 yrd radius there are lots of little furs that have been destroyed by the bulls
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Elknut1 on February 05, 2013, 06:45:36 AM: Elk do not have distinct rublines like a whitetail will, of course whitetail & blacktails can live their lives out in very small areas in comparison to elk. During pre-rut especially deer can have these rublines & scrapes & refresh them regularly to let other deer in the area know they are around, it's applicable to both doe's & bucks. Elk rubs come about for different reasons but can live in very large areas. It's not uncommon for elk to cover 10-20 miles during rut phases. Bulls will rub velvet in Aug. & early Sept. Generally all rubbing is done by 1st week of Sept. during this early pre-rut stage bulls are generally congregated together so you will find these staging/displaying areas where there are tons of rubs & of all sizes. When you find rubs that are many years old & fresher ones alike this is an area frequented yearly! At this staging time bulls will size one another up & start to get the pecking order down as to who's dominant & who's not. (dominant/herd bull qualities)

Bulls will rake & thrash during challenges & intimidation. Bulls will also do the same when tending their cows or trying to attract cows they know are in the area, this raking is a displaying action to show cows what they have to offer & possibly be considered a breeder type bull when the time is right for cows to be bred. It's common for bulls to bugle at this time to instill their sound with who they are in an advertising manner. This can show cows at a distant without seeing them if the bull or bulls they are hearing are worthy of breeding them, cows want to be bred by dominant/powerful bulls to ensure good strong calves.

Too, it's common when a herd is in an area where they feed, bed & breed that they use a few different trails as they come & go, much is dependent on wind direction at this time of morning/evening traveling. As these group/groups head down these trails it's common for the herd bull to stop occasionally & rake/thrash a tree/trees/ brush as he's feeling urges of the oncoming rut. Any satellites or other bulls that are in the area can take these same trails in & out, some of these bulls will also rake during these travels. As you can see in a period of a week or two weeks quite a few rubs can take place & give the appearance of a rubline on these trails. Thing is elk will relocate as feed gets sparse or pressure pushes them, sometimes it's a mile away other areas it can be many miles or anything in-between. So unlike deer that make rublines/scrapes & refresh them during regular visits elk do not, they can move completely out of an area & not return for many weeks not being concerned in the slightest about refreshing anything.

ElkNut1
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Dbax129 on February 05, 2013, 09:35:21 AM: Wow, thank you very much for all of that good information!
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: Quackwhacker on February 05, 2013, 09:48:46 AM: Great information Elknut. Thanks

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Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: jody on February 05, 2013, 10:02:59 AM: Wow thank you that was very well said and easy to understand.
Title: Re: What' the difference?
Post by: janttihunter on February 09, 2013, 01:01:26 PM: Good info. Ive been coming across some areas with like 15 trees rubed in all sizes...Theres deer sign but also allot of elk sign in the area. I want to hunt the area for both but im having a hard time telling which one is which... I have found 5 similar areas in a 1 mile radius. So after reading your post thinking maybe elk? Do you think elk and deer would use the same area? Small bench on a hillside with repod that goes up about 700 ft in elevation then a really dense ridgline.