Post by: bow4elk on September 28, 2008, 09:53:08 AM
I'm no expert, but I like to hunt from a treestand and hang my rattling antlers from a cord and jig them off the ground. This keeps the sound down low where it would really be and adds the sounds of brush moving. You can hold them above ground and lightly twitch the cord for light tickling sounds as well. I like to use fawn and doe bleats and end a rattling sequence with some grunts.
WA bow season opens 11/20, which is after peak rut making it tough to coax in deer so I also like still hunting on rainy day without a lot of wind. I focus on alder patches and transition areas between reprod, big timber and alder thickets.
Still hunting for a book buck...
Post by: Bofire on September 28, 2008, 11:25:52 AM
Carl
Post by: saylean on September 28, 2008, 11:31:31 AM
Good luck~
Post by: deerslyr on September 28, 2008, 11:44:27 AM
Post by: HardCorpsHuntr on September 28, 2008, 06:47:03 PM
I tried hard, but couldn't get used to the style needed to succeed. I like the semi-open type county.
My first buck was a forky blacktail off my grandfather ranch in Cali. when I was 12. It's time for another one.
IMO a four point blacktail is the toughest deer to consistently harvest.
Post by: BC CHASER on September 28, 2008, 07:42:50 PM
When hunting relatively flat areas I find that they will bed in the thickest patches of alder, devils club or reprode. Same thing hunt it slow and glass. It might seem funny glassing in such thick areas but a lot of the time the older bucks will sit tight if they feel they have been undetected. I have walked past them not knowing that they were there only to turn around and have them split. Sitting on well used trails works too. I like to find a relatively open areas with a ton of fresh sign on hillsides to sit in. I have treestand hunted for them several times and get frustrated when I see them and cannot move to them. Rattling does work and grunting as well. Last year I did a quick little hunt after work and we jumped a deer. I pulled out the grunt tube and grunted him right back to us. I shot him a 30 yards.
If you can get into an area that has been clearcut and gets little or no pressure you can glass them. A lot of times the will bed in them as well. Look over it real well. Don't just spend 15 minutes glassing it. I will sit and glass a 10 acre clearcut for a few hours. Look for tines above the brush, most the time that is all you will see if you see them at all. When glassing I like to picture myself being in the clearcut walking through it real slow. Hold as still as you can while glassing as well. It is a lot easier to pick up their movement when you are as still as possible. I will not hunt on bluebird days either. I will only hunt on days right after a rain, while it is raining or cold and lots of over cast. I could go on for days. I hope this will help you out a little. I hope you enjoy the game, once you figure them out you will be hooked and produce nice deer every year! Good luck!
Post by: PolarBear on September 28, 2008, 07:54:32 PM
Im no expert either :) I like to still hunt the old growth when its piss pourin...Ive got most my deer that way.+1
I also prefer to hunt the timber and thick stuff during rain or a full out trash mover. I have never been a big fan of clearcuts for mature bucks. Go in deep and look for small trails in and out of really thick stuff.
Post by: Alchase on September 29, 2008, 01:32:35 PM
All I can add is get in the thick and look for the little patches of light in the middle of the forest. Glass carefully and watch for ear flicks or tail movement. Glass every moving leaf, it might be the ear of a bedded buck. And be prepared to be totally soaked through, lol
Post by: Houndhunter on September 29, 2008, 01:46:22 PM
Post by: workstohunt on September 29, 2008, 02:11:35 PM
I am no expert, but have killed a couple blacktails.
The single best advice I can offer---
Invest in a GOOD pair of binoculars(I use cabelas 12X50). It doesn't matter if your hunting timber or the clearcuts---use them. ALL THE TIME!!
Most big blacktails don't move in the daytime, you have to find them in their beds. Younger bucks will at least get up a couple of times during the day, and if your looking, you will find them.
Good Luck!
Post by: heavy hauler on September 29, 2008, 10:52:15 PM
Post by: Buckoholic on September 29, 2008, 10:59:51 PM
Post by: Crunchy on September 30, 2008, 08:18:17 PM
Post by: mwhite on September 30, 2008, 11:30:18 PM
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi67.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fh291%2Fmtmkwhite%2FMark010.jpg&hash=403f5a141883ba409fcc23dfd4bd1d89ec6c2def)
Post by: longstevo on October 03, 2008, 05:33:25 PM
I believe each hunter has their own technique that works for them. Not one is always right, and not one is always wrong.
The number #1 factor in successful deer hunting, and I think almost everyone will agree here, is time in the woods. The more time you spend in the woods, the more chances you'll have. If you don't go out, you won't see anything. Duh! :bash:
That being said, the tactics that I've been successful, or almost successful (I've done more shooting than killing) is still hunting oaks and clearcuts when there's no snow. But once the snow falls, I hit the old growth and hunt between clearcuts. I've seen bucks every year doing that. But like I said, I do way more shooting that hitting. ;)
Althought I shot my biggest buck ever from the road! 8)
Post by: bow4elk on October 03, 2008, 06:19:20 PM
Post by: rasbo on October 06, 2008, 12:19:46 PM
Post by: 12Gauge on October 06, 2008, 04:03:35 PM
Post by: Atroxus on October 23, 2010, 01:44:20 PM
Post by: robodad on October 23, 2010, 01:48:11 PM
At the risk of sounding like a moron...what is reprod? :dunno:
Same as "Dog Hair" !!
Post by: 280ackley on October 23, 2010, 02:22:03 PM
At the risk of sounding like a moron...what is reprod? :dunno:
Same as "Dog Hair" !!
Same as "Jack Firs"
Post by: 280ackley on October 23, 2010, 02:24:08 PM
At the risk of sounding like a moron...what is reprod? :dunno:
reproduction
Post by: longstevo on October 25, 2010, 04:34:55 PM
The nasty stage of reproducing clearcuts where you can't see six feet in front of you, much less hunt it effectively.
Post by: 1morebuck on October 25, 2010, 05:06:05 PM
My tactic is a mix of all. Pre-rut I am glassing early mornings and late evenings. Rut time (now) I love getting a pissed of Grey Ghost to commit to some estrus scent and a grunt tube. Also, finding a single dow without a fawn is a big sign for me, and if I can I will watch her all day if she looks close to estrus. :twocents:
Post by: bobcat on November 17, 2010, 10:44:36 PM
Post by: G.R.K on November 17, 2010, 11:00:33 PM
Post by: longknife on November 18, 2010, 09:49:57 AM
Post by: Blacktail99 on November 18, 2010, 09:13:18 PM
Post by: Atroxus on November 19, 2010, 05:40:23 AM
Post by: bobcat on November 19, 2010, 06:00:47 AM
Post by: krout81 on November 19, 2010, 06:52:30 AM
Post by: Atroxus on November 19, 2010, 07:16:57 AM
Hunting for "meat" is no different, just shoot the first legal deer you see. :dunno:
Right, I should have just left it at "beginner" hunters. In my case at least my level of knowledge seems to be below what most articles assume the reader to be at. A lot of what I read seems to be targeted at hunters who grew up hunting and already have a good foundation of knowledge to build from. For a hunter who is a late starter such as myself(this is my first year hunting at age 37) who never got to learn from family/friends growing up it can be frustrating at times trying to find information tailored to beginning hunters. This site has been a great resource, but even here I sometimes have a hard time getting a straight answer to some of my more basic questions. For example when I asked what "reprod" was awhile back and got about 4 or 5 smart ass answers before someone actually explained what the term meant. I even asked once somewhere what types of things deer look for in clear cuts to eat and never got an answer. :dunno:
Post by: Curly on November 19, 2010, 07:48:07 AM
If you don't have a lot of patience to be going out and not seeing any deer time after time, just wait until the last week of the season to go out looking for bucks. And if you get skunked that week, then you've got 4 days during late buck (going on right now) where most of the leaves are off the trees and you can see a little better.
Just think of the first couple weeks of rifle season as scouting time. If you think of it as scouting then maybe you won't get too discouraged by not seeing bucks. Just try to find well used deer trails and deer sign, because you will likely not find the deer out during daylight hours anyway. Just try to find a lot of sign and get ready to be in an area with lots of deer when the last week of the season comes around (rut time). You may find one the first couple weeks (while "scouting") and just think of that as a bonus.
Anyway, that is my :twocents: and that is probably overcharging you. ;) I haven't killed a lot of blacktails but I think I am starting to get to know those sneaking little *censored*s a little better now...........
Post by: Yeti on November 19, 2010, 08:06:39 AM
I know these are bowhunting books but they are great resources.
Another great thing is go sit at borders or something smililar and read all the hunting magazines you can, (i take my wife along cause she can read all the girly magazines and to her it seems like a date). Its free to sit there and read. So is the internet.
Outside of all the reading you do, nothing NOTHING beats spending time in the field, hiking, scouting. 60% of the hunt is preaseason. 20% is during season and the other 20% is after the kill. Some prolly argue a 70/20/10 split. Preseason starts as soon as this season ends.
Post by: Atroxus on November 19, 2010, 08:44:40 AM
Blacktails are just a real pain in the ass. You have to have patience and some luck. You may not get one every year and the first couple weeks of the rifle season, most of the bucks are just going to be nocturnal anyway.
If you don't have a lot of patience to be going out and not seeing any deer time after time, just wait until the last week of the season to go out looking for bucks. And if you get skunked that week, then you've got 4 days during late buck (going on right now) where most of the leaves are off the trees and you can see a little better.
Just think of the first couple weeks of rifle season as scouting time. If you think of it as scouting then maybe you won't get too discouraged by not seeing bucks. Just try to find well used deer trails and deer sign, because you will likely not find the deer out during daylight hours anyway. Just try to find a lot of sign and get ready to be in an area with lots of deer when the last week of the season comes around (rut time). You may find one the first couple weeks (while "scouting") and just think of that as a bonus.
Anyway, that is my :twocents: and that is probably overcharging you. ;) I haven't killed a lot of blacktails but I think I am starting to get to know those sneaking little *censored*s a little better now...........
I plan on making one more foray last day of late deer season. I found an area with some fresh deer sign, I don't know yet whether it was does or not though I suspect at least one set of tracks was a doe. Haven't actually *seen* any deer in that area though. Am hoping rut will still be going on last day and I will luck across a hormone addled buck that is too dumb to live, but legal to shoot. ;)
Post by: steen on November 19, 2010, 12:48:29 PM
My 2010 blacktail and the first one I've gotten o a morning hunt, hence the pictures in the daylight.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi757.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fxx215%2Fsteen_photos%2FChristys%2520hunts%2F0082.jpg&hash=02d0861befcc12da8d486890d336428014e5e393)
Post by: Atroxus on November 19, 2010, 02:22:31 PM
All of the anwsers to your "reprod" question were legitamite. Not a one seemed smart alecky to me...
When someone asks what a term means, just giving them different terms that means the same thing isn't very helpful. It wasn't till 4 or 5 posts down that somone actually posted that reprod was new growth. The posts before it just seemed to me to be showing off how much more they knew than me, or rubbing my nose in the fact that I didn't know that bit of "basic" information. If someone asked me what a computer monitor was, I wouldn't turn around and tell them it is a screen, I would tell them it's the part of the computer that displays the images....unless I was trying to be a smart ass. ;)
Post by: woodrat on November 19, 2010, 03:04:45 PM
I'm also teaching myself late in life. I'm 45 and last year was the first time I ever bought a hunting license and got out there. Last year I saw no bucks at all during the season, just a couple of does. I walked all over the place, and tried hunting a local clearcut that I can walk to from home, but everyone and his brother was driving up there 40 times a day and the deer were not going to budge in the daylight. I also hunted part of elk season last year, and saw a couple of deer, but no elk.
This year, I did a little bit, but not enough, pre season scouting, and then missed opening blacktail weekend for work. But I got out at least part of every day for the last half of the early season. Saw two bucks; one was running over the top of me chased by dogs, but I couldn't shoot because two other hunters were downrange of that shot. The other was a spike who never moved onto the property where I had permission to shoot him until after it was too dark to shoot.
I hunted every single day of elk this year, and actually saw elk on two different days. One time I managed to track them for seven hours and even caught up to them once, but had no decent shot on the bull. The other group got into the timber before I could figure out where exactly they went and I couldn't sort the tracks out correctly.
I'm home right now to refill my thermos and then I'll head out again. All the deer and fresh deer sign I was seeing during elk season are gone now. The places where they were a week ago are empty. I found some fresh tracks this morning, of a doe and youngster that I saw a couple of days ago, but today's tracks were headed OUT of the timber in the early AM and headed into some horrible reprod jungle where they could last for weeks without coming out, so I doubt I'll see them again today. But the key I think is to just keep being out there, as much as you possibly can.
The book that I've been reading is "trophy blacktails" by scott haugen. Yeah, it has the word "trophy" in the title, but there's a lot of good general info in there that I didn't know before. You would think that a deer that has a well beaten track right through my driveway and garden would not be that hard to hunt, but so far I haven't succeeded in bringing one home. I have noticed though, that even the "experienced" hunters don't always connect, and a lot of the "experienced" hunters that I've run into in the field are moving way too fast, barely looking around, and basically just hoping to blunder into one standing in the open during shooting hours. I've never run into another soul working the timber, just the roads.
I've been doing all of this alone, and with only what I observe while I'm out there and what I read in books. Some of what I've seen in the magazines is stuff I practically could have written myself, based on what I've seen and read elsewhere. It amazes me that people can collect a paycheck for regurgitating the obvious and listing off the GMUs, which are pretty well listed already in the regs.
Good luck!
Post by: Blacktail killer on November 19, 2010, 06:04:48 PM
Post by: Blacktail killer on November 19, 2010, 06:05:55 PM
Post by: billythekidrock on November 20, 2010, 07:18:41 AM
All of the anwsers to your "reprod" question were legitamite. Not a one seemed smart alecky to me...
When someone asks what a term means, just giving them different terms that means the same thing isn't very helpful. It wasn't till 4 or 5 posts down that somone actually posted that reprod was new growth. The posts before it just seemed to me to be showing off how much more they knew than me, or rubbing my nose in the fact that I didn't know that bit of "basic" information. If someone asked me what a computer monitor was, I wouldn't turn around and tell them it is a screen, I would tell them it's the part of the computer that displays the images....unless I was trying to be a smart ass. ;)
I have to agree. I thought all the answers were stated in an honest and friendly manner. If you knew what the term "dog hair" meant and someone told you that it was also called "jack firs" then you would have known what it was. No one knew or assumed that you didn't know the other terms.
Often the terms are regional or localized. Sometimes they are unique to a small group of people.
We often hunt in or near the "wiggly's" and most people outside my group of hunting partners don't have any idea that I am talking about about lots of young alders or willows, but could be amost anything that is small, "wiggles" and obscures a shot, but where there is visibility.
Is this advanced hunting terminology? No, just local or vague vernacular to get a descriptive point across in conversation.
Post by: billythekidrock on November 20, 2010, 07:47:15 AM
I have seen several guides on tactics for trophy hunters, but not much for beginning hunters or meat hunters. Most of the info I can find seems to assume that you already know a bit about hunting deer.
So how can we help you get caught up? How much of a beginner are you? You said that you are teaching yourself but you don't mention what other transferable skills you may have.
Can you read a map? Not just North and South but can you tell elevation? Peaks from valleys on a topo? Do you hike or already have camping gear? Have you shot much in the past or are you new to shooting as well?
If you are serious about hunting blacktails then you will need to be out in the woods as soon as the season is over (next weekend) and do some scouting for next year. Take notice of where you see animals and sign. Follow the tracks and see where they go and what they are doing on the way. Write all this down in a journal with gps locations and digital photos if possible.
This winter you will want to read Blacktail Trophy Tactics I & II by Boyd Iverson. Then read any other book on bt hunting you can find. Don't worry about the word "trophy" or about learning all of the terminology right off the bat. But by reading these books you will pick up terms and generalities that are talked about here. It will also help us understand how or where to help you in a different manner than we are acustomed to teaching.
In the early spring hit the same areas weekly and see what you find. If they are not there then go look for them and write it all down again.
Stay on top of them because they will change habits around July/August. Just because you don't see them doesn't mean they aren't there.
Believe me, it can be just as hard for me to teach a new person as it is for a new person to learn. Some of us who have been doing it a long time forget how long it took us to learn what we know and we take that knowledge for granted and often assume that others know the basics. Heck, most of us have forgotten more than we know anymore.
Post by: woodrat on November 20, 2010, 12:56:19 PM
Where they seemed to go was across the street and into the deep, thick 20' tall reprod jungle, where there is plenty to eat, safe places to sleep, and where I can barely move around if I try to go in after them. I'll get out again this evening and some tomorrow, hopefully the weather will have calmed down by then and they'll be moving out of there. I haven't heard a rifle shot up there in the last three days, even though there have been people hunting. mostly though, people are truck hunting the areas where they can drive, and it seems like even the ones that walk in behind the gates still stay on the roads all the time, looking at clearcuts. FWIW, I have never seen a buck in a clearcut in daylight hours during hunting season. I know it must happen occasionally, but in all the glassing of clearcuts I've done in the last two seasons, I've yet to see one. During elk season? Sure!
Post by: billythekidrock on November 20, 2010, 02:14:24 PM
BTKR, just as an add on here, You said for this guy to scout as soon as the seasons over this weekend, remember archery starts up the 24th ;)
Yes, but I am assuming that he hunts modern and if he wants to get a deer during next years late buck hunt then he should be out as soon as he can. If they are there this November, they should be there next November. Basically make the best use of his own down time.
Post by: stumprat on November 20, 2010, 02:20:29 PM
Post by: tip on November 20, 2010, 02:27:31 PM
The season opens here (bow) on the 24th. Would calling be effective after the 24th of Nov? How about doe bleats?
Post by: billythekidrock on November 20, 2010, 02:36:57 PM
Post by: stumprat on November 20, 2010, 02:39:11 PM
The key is never be afraid to try something different.
Post by: stumprat on November 20, 2010, 02:50:12 PM
I'm following this thread closely! This is my first year hunting blacktail on the west side, so these tips are great. I'm with most of you guys and will shoot the first legal deer I come across (its 'any deer' in my gmu).
The season opens here (bow) on the 24th. Would calling be effective after the 24th of Nov? How about doe bleats?
The best tip that I can give you for calling deer. Is to call with confidence. Calling blacktails has mixed results. And if you are not confident. You will not be as alert.
When it works. It can catch you totally off guard.
Calling with an expectation of success is the key ingrediant.
Post by: billythekidrock on November 20, 2010, 02:53:26 PM
I think i've learned more about blackies from this thread than all the info combined i could find elsewhere on the internet... good stuff.
Great.
Can you tell us a little about what you have learned and how it relates to what you are or are not doing? This may help some of us explain things better in the future.
Post by: tip on November 20, 2010, 02:55:17 PM
Post by: woodrat on November 20, 2010, 03:13:57 PM
Post by: AKBowman on November 20, 2010, 04:51:14 PM
I think i've learned more about blackies from this thread than all the info combined i could find elsewhere on the internet... good stuff.
Great.
Can you tell us a little about what you have learned and how it relates to what you are or are not doing? This may help some of us explain things better in the future.
One thing that I have learned from this site is that just becuase you have a nice or a few nice BT bucks patterned during the summer and fall does not mean they will be in those patterns come hunting season. I also have found that the deer in 454 rut later (or longer) than they do in previous areas I have hunted (636) where they seem to rut in late October and are done by late arhcery season.
I plan on doing a lot more calling this year and staying persistent with it until the end of the first week of december. After that I would have had 8 or so days in the field and at that poitn I will stand hunt until the end of the year or I tag out.
I have a few pics of the button buck from last year but cant get them posted b/c the file size is too big. I can email them to someone if they know how to resize.
Good luck to all and thanks again
Post by: SW Blacktail on November 20, 2010, 06:11:21 PM
The first stormy afternoon I still hunted to the stand dragging a doe urine rag behind me and then rubbed a tarsal gland on a few alders with rubs & hung it from a string soaked in doe urine to an alder branch in a shooting lane about 15 yards from the stand. (Have your buddy's save all tarsal glands from bucks killed during modern. Some are stinkier than others depending on how rutted out the buck was. Put them in the freezer until you need them for late season.) After getting settled into the stand and while admiring the rubs below I gave a super low soft grunt, waited a few minutes then started softly rattling...then got fairly aggressive with it for just a couple minutes. Just as I hung the horns up I could hear grunts coming from behind me in the reprod (on the other side of the reprod was an impenetrable swamp). He came in fast and pissed off, head down, ears back looking for a fight. He immediately circled to the right and hooked out in front of me behind some alders and started intensely rubbing. I had no shot and couldn't believe how fast it all happened, I had only been in the stand for about 10 minutes and I had a 18" 3X3 with eyeguards at less than 15 yards. I got to watch him rub and act tough for about 5 minutes then he left the exact same way he came in. Never giving me a shot op. Right before dark a spike popped in looking super scared and immediately left.
The next evening hunt I did the same thing except for some stupid reason I tied the doe urine rag & tarsal gland to the bottom of my treestand platform (always wear gloves when handling these stinky things). I did a repeat rattling sequence from the day before with some soft grunts. This time within 5 minutes of hanging up the horns the spike squirted in to take a quick look then immediately got out of there. A few minutes later I started to hear something else coming...sure enough within a few minutes the same 3 point came in directly behind me outta the reprod but this time he stood directly under my platform and continued to grunt as the doe urine rag dripped in front of him. :bash: :bash: Stupid place to hang a rag. Once again no shot. Extremely frustrated to say the least at that point. Had to wait till well after dark for him to leave and let me sneak out of the stand.
Day 3 was stormy as well, I had another treestand set up about 40 yards away as a crow flys on the same alder swath within sight of the other stand (this stand was for my camera man who was hunting out of state at the time). I figured I'd mix it up and try to get a different angle on the trail out of his bed. I safely hung all scents well away from the platform and went through the procedure again. Nothing came in right away, I listened intently for 2 hours and kept thinking I heard a deer sneaking in. I kept talking myself out of it thinking it was just the sound of rain on dead leaves. Then right before dark the noise I had been hearing materialized under me...it was the damn spike. I thought for sure it was the 3 point stealthing in. The spike turned and headed directly under my platform, in my crazed frustration I emptied a bottle of doe in heat urine on his back. Kinda felt bad after the fact, the poor little *censored* probably got raped :chuckle: :chuckle:
Figured I'd let the spot cool off for a week or so, when I came back a survey crew had found both my stands and they mysteriously disappeared off private property. Of course the survey crew denied it and the landowner was apologetic but my stands are long gone as is the amazing chunk of ground I had permission to hunt. Now million dollar homes border the swamp where the reprod and timber were. Oh well I had a lot of fun and learned some valuable information over the years hunting that spot which allowed me to be successful in the future.
Post by: washelkhntr on November 20, 2010, 06:17:25 PM
in my crazed frustration I emptied a bottle of doe in heat urine on his back. Kinda felt bad after the fact, the poor little *censored* probably got raped
Now that is funny. :chuckle:
Post by: coachcw on November 20, 2010, 06:36:56 PM
Post by: krout81 on November 20, 2010, 10:26:01 PM
Well put, I have always gone to the same places year after year for blacktail. They are all within 30 square miles. There are a few spots that I have killed blacktail on the same trail, and other years I dont see any sign on the same trail. Any year that I have hunted blacktail late season archery I have gotten one. Never the same place 2 years in a row. One year I got nice doe saw a monster take off just 100 yards past the one I just shot. I went in there for 3 years looking for deer never saw 1. They are tricky animals you think you got them pinned down and then pow they are gone like the wind.
Post by: Phantom Gobbler on November 20, 2010, 10:45:27 PM
Post by: tip on November 21, 2010, 10:15:30 PM
Post by: stumprat on November 21, 2010, 11:33:58 PM
Post by: krout81 on November 21, 2010, 11:35:29 PM