Post by: bbarnes on April 07, 2013, 07:26:23 AM
at the Fish and Game Commission Hearing on Hoof Rot. The meeting is to be held
at 8:00 am, in the, Natural Resources Building – 1111 Washington Street SE
Olympia, WA.
Elk in Washington are facing a pandemic out break of Hoof Rot. They need your help!!!
All Hunters Should Be Concerned With;
o The WDFW selling licenses and permits to hunt sick animals.
o Hunters using preference points and buying permits to hunt diseased elk.
o The Public not being told about the outbreak of hoof rot, until now.
o What health and safety risks are there with eating hoof rot affected meat?
The WDFW, identified hoof rot as a concern in the 1990s. Internal WDFW documents dated
November 2011, indicate senior WDFW biologist were aware of, and concerned with, the rapid
spread of hoof rot in SW Washington. Yet there was no mention of it in the Big Game
Regulations or the Report to the Governor. Public knowledge of the animal’s compromised
health in affected GMUs would have let hunters make decisions about hunting potentially sick
animals, before putting in permits. Instead, WDFW states, “we have a large healthy heard”; when
in reality, we have a pandemic outbreak of hoof rot and related diseases; covering over 10+
counties, and 21+ GMU’s, affecting over 55% of the elk.
Don’ Sit This One Out!
If you can’t attend the meeting email comments to: commission@dfw.wa.gov or
tami.lininger@dfw.wa.gov
please cc: Bruce Barnes, Mt. St Helens Rescue, barnes.b@comcast.net, and Mark Smith, Mt. St
Helens Preservation Society, ecoparkman@mac.com so we have copies of them.
If you have any questions on the hearing agenda contact, Tami Lininger, Executive
Assistant, Washington Fish & Wildlife Commission, Phone: (360) 902-2267,
WEB: http://www.wdfw.wa.gov/commission (http://www.wdfw.wa.gov/commission)
If you have any additional question concerning our actions, hoof rot, or how you can help
further, contact; Bruce Barnes, 360-513-3874 or Mark Smith, 360-749-4050.
The Elk, thank you in advance for your prompt attention to this matter!
Some
Post by: sakoshooter on April 07, 2013, 11:27:15 AM
Post by: bbarnes on April 07, 2013, 09:25:44 PM
Post by: dreamunelk on April 07, 2013, 10:12:31 PM
I am not trying to argue or insult you. I have read most of your posts regarding this and have tried to understand. I just get the feeling you have no answers but, some how are making an appeal to authority with out providing and proof of the authority. Understandably you are concerned just like everyone else.
Are your trying to stop hunting in SW Washington?
Do you want a knee jerk reaction? It takes time to understand the ecology of the unknown.
Really there are lot of diseases, bugs, and ......... that affect our wildlife. They will not harm you. That is why you don't know about them. If you think they are going to figure it out in a few days you have been watching to much TV.
If you take a look at what is going on there are experts from the top universities that specialize in wildlife diseases as well as experts from other countries who work with red deer involved in this.
Again not trying to pick a fight or insult you. I would just like some evidence for the hysteria you seam to be trying to create.
Post by: bbarnes on April 07, 2013, 11:21:52 PM
Over the past 23 years, (since 1990), we have witnessed Hoof Rot increase from one Game Management Unit (GMU) in Pacific county to over 21 GMU’s over 10 counties, effecting thousands of elk in SW Washington.
The Washington State Department of Fish and Wildlife, (WDFW) report http://wdfw.wa.gov/conservation/health/hoof_rot/ (http://wdfw.wa.gov/conservation/health/hoof_rot/) states simply that they do not know what is causing it, nor do they have any plan to contain or treat this now pandemic disease, WDFW estimate over 55% of all elk in the 10 counties covering over 3.4 million acres are effected. WDFW further state that due to lack of funding they are unable to determine the cause or come up with any plan for treatment of the disease. All this, despite the involvement of Washington State University, Colorado State and the WDFW Staff. The report also states that they are allocating limited funds towards this problem.
Causes and Effect,
Hoof Rot in almost all cases effects animals in poor body condition who are run down, low on minerals, have poor habitat conditions or are under extreme stress. During elk captures in 1995, near Mount St Helens, biologist reported that captured elk were in poor all over body condition. The eruption, and subsequent mismanagement, lead to over population and poor habitat, resulting in an overall unhealthy elk herd. The WDFW contributed greatly, with a lack of an effective management plan.
In 1998, and 2006 we witnessed some of the largest winter die offs in State history, with hundreds of elk starving to death.
The WDFW along with the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation invested over 1million dollars in 10 years trying to increase habitat, only to have a net loss.
The WDFW has increased the length hunting seasons in the GMU’s around the Monument to over 157,000 hunter days a year. While this was designed to lower the elk herd size, instead it “ran” the elk (avoiding hunters) from September to February. This resulted in additional extreme stress, further contributing to the ill health and overall poor body conditions that have resulted in the elk herds increasingly diseased state.
From 1995 to date, the WDFW has been aware of the increasing presence of hoof rot. Curoiously, from 1998 to 2012 in the “Governors Status and Trend Report”, prepared by the WDFW Director, Assistant Director and Big Game Manger, there is no mention of Hoof Rot at all.
The 2009, Mt St Helens Herd plan, does mention hoof rot, but only as a disease that develops from the poor body condition of the herd, and essentially no mention of the increasing presence of the disease.
Nor, was there any mention of Hoof Rot, in the 1998 - 2012, Hunting Regulations. Yet, during the 2012 elk season hunters who shot elk with hoof rot were told to “use their nose” to determine if the meat was safe to eat.
The Game Commission was notified of the public concern at their February 9th 2013 meeting, where we were assured that the WDFW was “aware and working on the problem”. A quick glance on the WDFW Hoof Rot Web sight on that date, clearly stated, that “they have no idea what is causing the hoof rot, nor do they have a plan for containment or treatment”.
We feel that the WDFW has violated the public trust by not disclosing the presence of hoof rot in the SW Washington elk herds. The lack of this disclosure can only be seen to sell hunting license for revenue, with no concern for he resource or public safety.
Treatment,
While there are over 40 different known types of hoof rot, there are only three methods of treatment that have been identified. “Topical”, treatment that is put on the outside of the hoof. “Oral”, mixtures of feed, containing antibiotics and minerals, as well as high quality nutrition. Lastly, by injection of antibiotics and minerals as appropriate. A combination of all three of these treatment modalities, has proven to be effective in other locations, at treating the affected animals, and preventing other at risk animals from getting the disease; research overwhelmingly indicates, that it is rather “unimportant” to research the exact cause of the disease, that a combination of these treatments will essentially treat affected animals and prevent the further spread.
Almost all research since the 50’s has indicated that “hoof rot” is an opportunistic disease, that appears in an unhealthy herd. To continue to manage the elk in SW Washington under the same plan that has been “not working” for over 18 years, will ensure, that the elk herd will continue to become increasingly diseased. Further, no concurrent treatment and containment plan being introduced, while they study the disease, only ensures the spread of the disease.
WDFW, needs to become pro-active, and attack this disease with proper resources and immediately develop and implement a plan for control and cure if they are to be successful in stopping it before 100% of the herd becomes involved.
Post by: bbarnes on April 07, 2013, 11:29:47 PM
Post by: dreamunelk on April 08, 2013, 07:26:35 AM
As for the die off, it is text book disturbance ecology. Read a text book on this and you will find that this is what should be expected from the eruption. It is how populations work. Could it have be abated a little? Should it? Was there a human effect? Something I struggle with at times. I not sure that stopping the natural processes is the correct way of managing wildlife.
Again you are not providing peer reviewed information. I understand you are concerned. Tying to insight hysteria is not the answer.
Have to get to work.
Post by: DaveBTS on April 08, 2013, 08:11:00 AM
Post by: bbarnes on April 08, 2013, 08:39:20 AM
Post by: jumpin on April 08, 2013, 09:35:09 AM
I cant figure out why this isnt the hottest topic on any outdoors related forum.
Ive had a bad feeling about this for quite a few years. :yike:
Post by: bobcat on April 08, 2013, 09:56:46 AM
One of the main problems is that this is a reactionary disease. Certain pesticides being used along the coast range kill beneficial bacteria. This in turn has reduced the levels present in said elk herds. Therefore, they can't fight off the detrimental bacteria strains. WDFW know this. I presented these findings over 10 yrs ago in my reports. Private timberlands are just that, private. WDFW doesn't have legal recourse on such properties.
If it was proven that pesticides used by timber companies are detrimental to wildlife, I'd be willing to bet the state WOULD have some way to force them to change their ways. Maybe it wouldn't be the WDFW but perhaps the Department of Ecology or the Department of Natural Resources.
I just can't imagine that there are no laws that could prevent the widespread use of chemicals on the landscape that is harming our state's native wildlife. There is no doubt in my mind that whatever it is that is causing the poor health of elk must also be detrimental to blacktail deer and other wildlife as well.
Post by: Fullabull on April 08, 2013, 12:32:34 PM
Would be interesting to see a map of exact kill locations to see what the pattern is...
Post by: bobcat on April 08, 2013, 12:37:02 PM
Post by: mtman on April 08, 2013, 12:55:50 PM
Post by: buckfvr on April 08, 2013, 12:58:28 PM
One of the main problems is that this is a reactionary disease. Certain pesticides being used along the coast range kill beneficial bacteria. This in turn has reduced the levels present in said elk herds. Therefore, they can't fight off the detrimental bacteria strains. WDFW know this. I presented these findings over 10 yrs ago in my reports. Private timberlands are just that, private. WDFW doesn't have legal recourse on such properties.
If it was proven that pesticides used by timber companies are detrimental to wildlife, I'd be willing to bet the state WOULD have some way to force them to change their ways. Maybe it wouldn't be the WDFW but perhaps the Department of Ecology or the Department of Natural Resources.
I just can't imagine that there are no laws that could prevent the widespread use of chemicals on the landscape that is harming our state's native wildlife. There is no doubt in my mind that whatever it is that is causing the poor health of elk must also be detrimental to blacktail deer and other wildlife as well.
Our government signs off on Monsanto products that are proven to make humans sick all over the world.......do you really think they care about some elk here in Wa. ????? COngress writes laws to protect companies like Monsanto and big Timber company ventures......one here in our state. Dont look for this state or this country for that matter, to do whats right even when they know the cause. :twocents:
Post by: elk247 on April 08, 2013, 01:38:37 PM
Nice work bb, I certainly wish that more people would take the time and stand up for what they feel is the right thing to do.I only found out how widespread it was this year. Im also extremely concerned. Thank for all you guys have done to keep this issue in conversation. BB i know you are doing much more than that and I dont think you have any agenda but to help Elk and hold people accountable. Amen brother.
I cant figure out why this isnt the hottest topic on any outdoors related forum.
Ive had a bad feeling about this for quite a few years. :yike:
Post by: kentrek on April 08, 2013, 01:54:18 PM
What part of St. Helens are they seeing this?
Would be interesting to see a map of exact kill locations to see what the pattern is...
:yeah: i also do not blame this issue on the natural pop explosion caused by the mtn....the mtn has been very resistant toward this and if anything it could lead to a solution...
the problem came from the lower elevations..
kinda makes a guy think there could be a higher concentration of "something" at these lower elevations...could these chemicals be flowing down stream and geting built up in certain areas ? :rolleyes:
just my :twocents:
Post by: elk247 on April 08, 2013, 02:00:36 PM
Post by: Curly on April 08, 2013, 02:35:17 PM
One of the main problems is that this is a reactionary disease. Certain pesticides being used along the coast range kill beneficial bacteria. This in turn has reduced the levels present in said elk herds. Therefore, they can't fight off the detrimental bacteria strains. WDFW know this. I presented these findings over 10 yrs ago in my reports. Private timberlands are just that, private. WDFW doesn't have legal recourse on such properties.
If it was proven that pesticides used by timber companies are detrimental to wildlife, I'd be willing to bet the state WOULD have some way to force them to change their ways. Maybe it wouldn't be the WDFW but perhaps the Department of Ecology or the Department of Natural Resources.
I just can't imagine that there are no laws that could prevent the widespread use of chemicals on the landscape that is harming our state's native wildlife. There is no doubt in my mind that whatever it is that is causing the poor health of elk must also be detrimental to blacktail deer and other wildlife as well.
Yep. DOE and DNR would be all over that if any studies can show chemicals such as roundup is causing problems.
Even though timber companies own private land where they grow and harvest their timber, they are required to adhere to timber harvest rules set by DNR. And any chemicals used I would think would come under the jurisdiction of the Dept of Ecology. Even the various counties might have other rules timber companies have to adhere to.
Just seems like the problem of hoof rot started after the State (DOE) implemented more restrictions on burning. Timber companies used to burn the clearcuts, now they spray them. ???
Post by: Bigshooter on April 08, 2013, 02:48:25 PM
Post by: DaveBTS on April 08, 2013, 03:18:57 PM
Post by: Curly on April 08, 2013, 03:32:41 PM
All the products being used, with the exception of arsenic, are the best chemicals for forestry application. Many come from government companies.
Yeah, but how sure are they that the chemicals are actually safe? Just asking, cuz I don't know. :dunno:
Post by: kentrek on April 08, 2013, 03:39:33 PM
All the products being used, with the exception of arsenic, are the best chemicals for forestry application. Many come from government companies.
Yeah, but how sure are they that the chemicals are actually safe? Just asking, cuz I don't know. :dunno:
:yeah: esp over the coarse of years and years ?? alil fat isnt bad,but after years and years of unhealthy eating that fat builds up in spots like your heart or in the forests case,lower elevations and boom its a problem..but only after x amount of years
yes i compared the build up of fat to that of the "potential" build up of these chemicals...
Post by: bobcat on April 08, 2013, 03:42:08 PM
Unfortunately, animals can't read.
Post by: bobcat on April 11, 2013, 12:07:02 AM
This topic is listed on the agenda for 10:00 a.m. I think I will try to be there for this, and hopefully the rest of the day.
Here's a summary of what this topic is about, and notice it says "particularly on the 10.5 million acres of state and private forestands."