Post by: janttihunter on May 19, 2013, 03:24:31 PM
Post by: JPhelps on May 19, 2013, 03:31:11 PM
Now the perceived rut from the weather and moon may be evident.
Post by: Pigfuz on May 19, 2013, 03:43:53 PM
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on May 19, 2013, 03:47:09 PM
Post by: elk247 on May 19, 2013, 04:00:58 PM
Nope, the rut is based on photo periods (length if day). Now the perceived rut from the weather and moon may be evident.This is exactly right. Like JP said the perceived rut is what you guys are noticing. Those cows are bred on time. That's why the woods are shut down the last week of September and the first week of October typically.
Post by: bone head on May 19, 2013, 09:52:12 PM
Post by: JLS on May 19, 2013, 10:14:40 PM
location, weather, moon all have a factor in the rut.
They have an affect on observeable rut activity, but as far as the actual rut itself they have no bearing. Cows come into estrus at the same time every year based on photoperiod. If the timing of the rut varied, you would have calves dropping at different times each year. That would be a bad thing for calf survival and cows coming back into estrus when they should.
The majority of the cows will be in estrus and be bred in the middle of September regardless of the weather, moon, etc.
When it's hot, dry, full moon in the middle of September you won't have much observeable rut activity because the bulk of it is going on at night.
Post by: rtspring on May 19, 2013, 10:20:30 PM
Post by: huntnnw on May 20, 2013, 12:28:10 AM
Another issue with the rut is the area you hunt..if it lacks bulls your going to have a quiet hunting season
Post by: RoyBoy on May 20, 2013, 12:29:28 AM
Its all about the length of hours in a day, cooler temps! The moon just gives them more chance of activity at night.
exactly. there not worried about the moon just makes it easier to feed at night
Post by: TommyH on May 20, 2013, 04:08:15 PM
Yeah early october is best. I cant wait!! :IBCOOL:
:yeah: My adivice is for everyone to wait till then! :chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: Bigshooter on May 20, 2013, 06:01:03 PM
Clear as mud?
Post by: bucklucky on May 20, 2013, 06:32:42 PM
Post by: JLS on May 20, 2013, 07:47:09 PM
I was always under the impression that rut was always set by when the first sunday of september was. If the first sunday was close to the 1st then the rut was early, and if the first sunday was closer to the 7th then it would be later. But then you had to factor in rain. If it rained before the 1st no matter the day of the week then that would push the rut back by a week. But if it didn't rain until after the first that meant the rut would be early. And then the last thing you have to look at is what time you get out of bed and into the woods. If you're not in the woods before daylight then the rut probably won't start until after the season is over. But if you're in the woods before daylight each day then we will probably have an early rut.
Clear as mud?
:chuckle:
You forgot to factor in how many miles driven, and how rough the roads are.
Post by: TommyH on May 20, 2013, 10:09:44 PM
I was always under the impression that rut was always set by when the first sunday of september was. If the first sunday was close to the 1st then the rut was early, and if the first sunday was closer to the 7th then it would be later. But then you had to factor in rain. If it rained before the 1st no matter the day of the week then that would push the rut back by a week. But if it didn't rain until after the first that meant the rut would be early. And then the last thing you have to look at is what time you get out of bed and into the woods. If you're not in the woods before daylight then the rut probably won't start until after the season is over. But if you're in the woods before daylight each day then we will probably have an early rut.
Clear as mud?
You nailed it there!!! :chuckle:
Post by: billdo5 on May 21, 2013, 07:51:46 AM
Heres a list of what i believe to be the biggest the factors if the bulls are bugling or not... 1 being the greatest.
1. weather
2. competition
3. surroundings/location
Post by: brianb231 on May 21, 2013, 08:13:56 AM
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 21, 2013, 08:41:30 AM
Hunters misinterpret the rut.. The rut happens the same time, the weather factor ur talking about has to do with how vocal they are during the rut, not if they are in it or not... And if there isnt a lot of competition between bulls (due to the lack in numbers) then you wont hear to many bugles.
Heres a list of what i believe to be the biggest the factors if the bulls are bugling or not... 1 being the greatest.
1. weather
2. competition
3. surroundings/location
Oh my goodness :yike:
I agree with Billdo :chuckle:
Post by: billdo5 on May 21, 2013, 08:59:45 AM
Post by: headshot5 on May 21, 2013, 12:07:00 PM
Quote
Heres a list of what i believe to be the biggest the factors if the bulls are bugling or not... 1 being the greatest.
1. weather
2. competition
3. surroundings/location
And soon to be...
4. wolves :'(
Post by: billdo5 on May 21, 2013, 02:59:56 PM
Im not a yuppy and i dont live in the city like u :chuckle: :'(Sorry for being hostile.. i got my bull 10minutes away from my house this year... :dunno:
Just because they arent bugling doesnt mean they are not in the rut please read the whole thread thx byeee
Post by: Wiley on May 21, 2013, 03:30:30 PM
Post by: 6x6in6 on May 21, 2013, 04:06:43 PM
Nope, the rut is based on photo periods (length of day).
Now the perceived rut from the weather and moon may be evident.
:yeah:
Post by: deaner on May 21, 2013, 04:14:18 PM
:chuckle:
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on May 21, 2013, 04:53:30 PM
Post by: jackelope on May 22, 2013, 08:49:21 AM
Keep it on topic.
Post by: jbeaumont21 on May 22, 2013, 08:59:07 AM
http://www.theamericanoutdoorsman.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=71:the-elk-rut&catid=38:big-game&Itemid=96 (http://www.theamericanoutdoorsman.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=71:the-elk-rut&catid=38:big-game&Itemid=96)
Post by: billdo5 on May 22, 2013, 09:00:43 AM
"There is not much variance in the timing of the elk rut from northern British Columbia to southern New Mexico. Although the rut is photoperiodic (dependent on the number of hours of light per day) the timing of the rut in each area is dependent on spring weather that is warm enough to allow the calves to survive. Generally speaking this results in the rut occurring earlier in at northern latitudes than it does at southern latitudes."In redneck terms please??? :chuckle:
http://www.theamericanoutdoorsman.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=71:the-elk-rut&catid=38:big-game&Itemid=96 (http://www.theamericanoutdoorsman.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=71:the-elk-rut&catid=38:big-game&Itemid=96)
Post by: Broken Arrow on May 22, 2013, 09:11:33 AM
Post by: billdo5 on May 22, 2013, 09:13:00 AM
Post by: PolarBear on May 22, 2013, 09:20:19 AM
Post by: Broken Arrow on May 22, 2013, 09:33:35 AM
Post by: billdo5 on May 22, 2013, 09:47:01 AM
Post by: Broken Arrow on May 22, 2013, 10:13:30 AM
Post by: billdo5 on May 22, 2013, 10:14:14 AM
Its not rocket science. Even when elk are quite, if you get in their kitchen and you sound like a challenge then they are going to sound off....all good hunters know this. I think that most folks are referring to, is not hearing any of the locator bugles in the am or pm. I have been astounded by folks who during September, will randomly call in a drainage, here nothing call back and assume the elk are not there.Then why do some bulls come in quiet and others freak out explain that are u an elk??? This year i got in ones kitchen and he was bugling back and racking $hit then with a different bull he didnt make a sound but was racking $hit... I believe it has to do with 1. Weather 2. Competition 3. Location/area
Post by: Broken Arrow on May 22, 2013, 10:21:25 AM
Post by: billdo5 on May 22, 2013, 10:24:38 AM
Post by: Broken Arrow on May 22, 2013, 10:29:25 AM
Post by: JPhelps on May 22, 2013, 10:38:53 AM
Its not rocket science. Even when elk are quite, if you get in their kitchen and you sound like a challenge then they are going to sound off....all good hunters know this. I think that most folks are referring to, is not hearing any of the locator bugles in the am or pm. I have been astounded by folks who during September, will randomly call in a drainage, here nothing call back and assume the elk are not there.Then why do some bulls come in quiet and others freak out explain that are u an elk??? This year i got in ones kitchen and he was bugling back and racking $hit then with a different bull he didnt make a sound but was racking $hit... I believe it has to do with 1. Weather 2. Competition 3. Location/area
All bulls are different. One drainage can be on fire and the next one over may be dead (elk in both).
* Is a cow in estrus in one herd and not the other
* Competition from satellite bulls (the larger and more comparable the sattelite bull the more action there seems to be)
*Did the bull just move Into the area and is rounding up cows
*How many Satellite bulls are around that talk a lot
*The elk are elk and we may not know the reasons they do what they do.
One of the most vocal and aggressive bulls I've ever seen was a heavier 4x4 herd bull running the show. When all other elk seemed to be settled down his was letting the world know where he was. I think it Is kind of the same thing as a young guy beating his chest because of his accomplishment (sound familiar :chuckle:)
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 22, 2013, 10:40:05 AM
When all other elk seemed to be settled down his was letting the world know where he was. I think it Is kind of the same thing as a young guy beating his chest because of his accomplishment (sound familiar :chuckle:)
:chuckle: :chuckle: good one.
Post by: billdo5 on May 22, 2013, 10:47:06 AM
Post by: JPhelps on May 22, 2013, 10:55:41 AM
A bull challenge bugling on his way in is usually in fight mode, a quiet bull is nervous or just interested in what the other elk are doing. The calling sequence put out can alter the mood of the bull as well.
Straight cow callers very rarely get a bull slobbering mad and fired up like a calling sequence with a challenge bugle in it. With that said honestly I dont know why elk do what they do 100% of the time. I just keep it simple and use the same tactics 90% of the time and let the cards fall as they will.
Post by: billdo5 on May 22, 2013, 10:58:53 AM
Post by: sirmissalot on May 22, 2013, 11:01:55 AM
Straight cow callers very rarely get a bull slobbering mad and fired up like a calling sequence with a challenge bugle in it.
Stop it Jason, all this talk about fired up slobering bulls is going to really cut into my productivity today :chuckle: September can't come soon enough!
Post by: D-Rock425 on May 22, 2013, 01:35:17 PM
How does that have anything to do with what im saying mr phelps? Just saying my opinion on what i believe... sorry im a world class call maker like urself:ban:
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on May 22, 2013, 05:57:01 PM
When all other elk seemed to be settled down his was letting the world know where he was. I think it Is kind of the same thing as a young guy beating his chest because of his accomplishment (sound familiar :chuckle:)
:chuckle: :chuckle: good one.
Thought it might just be me... My concerns have been affirmed.
The elk rut is the best time of year ever. October 1st they'll start sounding off.
Post by: Elkstuffer on May 23, 2013, 08:26:13 PM
location, weather, moon all have a factor in the rut.
They have an affect on observeable rut activity, but as far as the actual rut itself they have no bearing. Cows come into estrus at the same time every year based on photoperiod. If the timing of the rut varied, you would have calves dropping at different times each year. That would be a bad thing for calf survival and cows coming back into estrus when they should.
The majority of the cows will be in estrus and be bred in the middle of September regardless of the weather, moon, etc.
When it's hot, dry, full moon in the middle of September you won't have much observeable rut activity because the bulk of it is going on at night.
Very well put JLS!
Post by: Bullkllr on May 23, 2013, 09:34:07 PM
:yeah: I recall a situation where I had (all in the same small corner of a drainage)Its not rocket science. Even when elk are quite, if you get in their kitchen and you sound like a challenge then they are going to sound off....all good hunters know this. I think that most folks are referring to, is not hearing any of the locator bugles in the am or pm. I have been astounded by folks who during September, will randomly call in a drainage, here nothing call back and assume the elk are not there.Then why do some bulls come in quiet and others freak out explain that are u an elk??? This year i got in ones kitchen and he was bugling back and racking $hit then with a different bull he didnt make a sound but was racking $hit... I believe it has to do with 1. Weather 2. Competition 3. Location/area
All bulls are different. One drainage can be on fire and the next one over may be dead (elk in both).
* Is a cow in estrus in one herd and not the other
* Competition from satellite bulls (the larger and more comparable the sattelite bull the more action there seems to be)
*Did the bull just move Into the area and is rounding up cows
*How many Satellite bulls are around that talk a lot
*The elk are elk and we may not know the reasons they do what they do.
One of the most vocal and aggressive bulls I've ever seen was a heavier 4x4 herd bull running the show. When all other elk seemed to be settled down his was letting the world know where he was. I think it Is kind of the same thing as a young guy beating his chest because of his accomplishment (sound familiar :chuckle:)
a smallish 5 point going off every few minutes and chasing everything that looked or sounded like an elk, a 4 point that did not respond to any calling- and was actually mounting a cow, a 6 point and another bull that came in slow and silent, and 2 spikes oblivious to the whole situation.
Post by: janttihunter on May 25, 2013, 07:04:02 PM