Post by: PNWCOONASS on October 21, 2008, 06:45:34 AM
For those of you who remember me, I finnally made it back to the PNW after a long 7 month deployment.
I bought a Knight bighorn last week, but sportsmens was out of powder. I did a search and saw that 100-110 grains (using 30/50 combination) of powder using pellets would be a good load with a 310 grain bullets. I live over in Port Orchard, any one have a good spot that you could point me to for powder and bullets...
I'm trying to get ready for elk and deer late season. It's almost panic time...
thanks pete
Post by: Selkirk on October 21, 2008, 07:02:08 AM
Post by: CP on October 21, 2008, 08:02:43 AM
The T/C Maxi Hunter 275 grain grouped best - 2 ½ inches @ 100 yards
The 385 gr Hornady Great Plains Bullet grouped pretty well. 2 ¾ inches @ 100 yards.
The 410 gr Hornady GPB was inaccurate – over 5 inches @ 100 y
The Knight 310 grain sabot was the worst – over 6 inches @ 100 Y
The Great Plains bullets kick like a mule, especially the 410gr.
PS – What’s a (30/50 combination) ?
Post by: p-ohana on October 21, 2008, 08:10:57 AM
Post by: bucksnort on October 21, 2008, 10:12:30 AM
Post by: HawkenBob on October 21, 2008, 11:12:23 AM
Now I buy at Sportco and use American Pioneer brand. Wonderful stuff. I can get near 40 shots without a cleaning. Actually I have never gumed it up yet to were it did not shoot.
Anybody else try it? I love the tubes it comes in. Once empty I refill using there bulk. My time between shots is pretty impressive. And for hunting the tubes would be awesome for carring extras.
Post by: DBake on October 21, 2008, 11:31:33 AM
I just picked up a Bighorn a few days ago for a 2nd ML rifle. I popped a scope on it and did a little range work on Sunday. Results are below. All were shot with 100 grains of triple 7 and the #11 nipple. It’s a pain to disassemble and clean but it’s lighter than my .54 round ball shooter and more accurate at 100 yards. I recommend that you use loose powder instead of the pellets, loose is cheaper and lights easier.
The T/C Maxi Hunter 275 grain grouped best - 2 ½ inches @ 100 yards
The 385 gr Hornady Great Plains Bullet grouped pretty well. 2 ¾ inches @ 100 yards.
The 410 gr Hornady GPB was inaccurate – over 5 inches @ 100 y
The Knight 310 grain sabot was the worst – over 6 inches @ 100 Y
The Great Plains bullets kick like a mule, especially the 410gr.
PS – What’s a (30/50 combination) ?
Combination of 50 grain pellets and 30 grain pellets to equal total grainage. For example, to get 130 grains, you would use 2 50's grains and 1 30 grain. To get 90 grains, you would use 3 30's.
I am surprised that you did not have good success with the 310 grain Knight saboted bullet, especially with a Knight rifle.
Did you use any lube with the Hornady GPB? I am hesitant of using a non saboted bullets.
Post by: CP on October 21, 2008, 11:40:31 AM
I talked to Knight customer service and he thinks my barrel is too tight for the black sabot (the petals deform on loading). He is mailing me some of the looser fitting orange ones. Pretty good customer service.
The GPB comes pre-lubed with a waxy type lube. I added some bore butter at first but it isn’t necessary. The T/C is pre-lubed with bore butter.
Post by: bucksnort on October 21, 2008, 11:42:18 AM
Post by: marc10000 on October 21, 2008, 04:50:01 PM
I just picked up a Bighorn a few days ago for a 2nd ML rifle. I popped a scope on it and did a little range work on Sunday. Results are below. All were shot with 100 grains of triple 7 and the #11 nipple. It's a pain to disassemble and clean but it's lighter than my .54 round ball shooter and more accurate at 100 yards. I recommend that you use loose powder instead of the pellets, loose is cheaper and lights easier.
The T/C Maxi Hunter 275 grain grouped best - 2 ½ inches @ 100 yards
The 385 gr Hornady Great Plains Bullet grouped pretty well. 2 ¾ inches @ 100 yards.
The 410 gr Hornady GPB was inaccurate – over 5 inches @ 100 y
The Knight 310 grain sabot was the worst – over 6 inches @ 100 Y
The Great Plains bullets kick like a mule, especially the 410gr.
PS – What’s a (30/50 combination) ?
The GPB have hollow bases and the 100 grain powder charge expands the base of the bullet into the rifling grooves in the bore. It produces more friction and more pressure. The heavy GPB shooting 100 grains of propellant are getting close to the max pressures that are recommended.
I would get a Lymans Black Powder Manual. When you read about charges, bullet weights, chamber pressures it will make you change some habits. I'm lucky I didn't blow myself up when I first started. Thank God TC Black Diamonds have quality barrels that can take it!
Post by: shag on October 21, 2008, 07:07:26 PM
Post by: DBake on October 21, 2008, 10:28:26 PM
I just picked up a Bighorn a few days ago for a 2nd ML rifle. I popped a scope on it and did a little range work on Sunday. Results are below. All were shot with 100 grains of triple 7 and the #11 nipple. It's a pain to disassemble and clean but it's lighter than my .54 round ball shooter and more accurate at 100 yards. I recommend that you use loose powder instead of the pellets, loose is cheaper and lights easier.
The T/C Maxi Hunter 275 grain grouped best - 2 ½ inches @ 100 yards
The 385 gr Hornady Great Plains Bullet grouped pretty well. 2 ¾ inches @ 100 yards.
The 410 gr Hornady GPB was inaccurate – over 5 inches @ 100 y
The Knight 310 grain sabot was the worst – over 6 inches @ 100 Y
The Great Plains bullets kick like a mule, especially the 410gr.
PS – What’s a (30/50 combination) ?
The GPB have hollow bases and the 100 grain powder charge expands the base of the bullet into the rifling grooves in the bore. It produces more friction and more pressure. The heavy GPB shooting 100 grains of propellant are getting close to the max pressures that are recommended.
I would get a Lymans Black Powder Manual. When you read about charges, bullet weights, chamber pressures it will make you change some habits. I'm lucky I didn't blow myself up when I first started. Thank God TC Black Diamonds have quality barrels that can take it!
What is your bullet/powder combo?
Post by: marc10000 on October 21, 2008, 11:29:18 PM
Generally you shoot heavier charges with lighter bullets, (saboted bullets). You shoot lighter charges with heavier bullets. The heavy conicals have weight and this energy at rest (potential energy) has to be overcome. It takes longer to get the bullet moving and all the while the breech pressures are building, so you back off the amount of powder you use.
Most Muzzle loaders try for breech pressures from 10,000 to 20,000 PSI, some of the older guns and the older Italian guns are only safe to 10,000. Guns like the bighorn are proofed higher like 25,000. If you put 120 grains of powder behind a 430 grain conical you can push the pressures upwards of 20,000 PSI and that is a lot of pressure.
I shoot 100 grains with lighter saboted bullets and 65-80 grains with big heavy conicals. Somebody once said that you can kill any deer in North America with 65 grains of black powder. To each his own and I hope I'm not sounding like a know it all, but be careful! Happy hunting
Post by: stumprat on October 22, 2008, 03:55:06 PM
Post by: CP on October 23, 2008, 11:25:23 AM
But after making the above non-recommendation Knight goes on to recommend the 440 grain HYDRA-CON by Parker products. Both Knight and Parker recommend 100 grains of FF as the starting load for this massive slug. I haven’t tried the Hydra-con and don’t intend to, over an ounce of lead seems a bit excessive.
I like the GPB, but I wish they made it in a lighter version.
I also wish that I could get the groups that they rest of you are with the sabots. So far though I’m not, but I’ll keep working on it.
Post by: Sagedawg on October 23, 2008, 12:07:48 PM
Sage
Post by: CP on October 23, 2008, 12:28:26 PM
http://www.parkerproductionsinc.com/agora/agora.cgi?product=Bore_Size&ppinc=1a
Post by: marc10000 on October 23, 2008, 02:36:42 PM
Hollow based bullets tend to kick a lot.
Post by: marc10000 on October 23, 2008, 08:54:49 PM
60gr 1143 fps
90gr 1360 fps
120 1521 fps
So at some point you have to wonder about diminishing returns. Keep in mind that terminal velocity @100yds is only a few 100 fps less than muzzle velocity. In the old days the Black Powder .45-70 was a 500 grain bullet with 70 grains of black powder. It effectively handled all game even Buffalo.
Shooting a 450 grain slug at 1100 fps is really an effective round. It's actually faster than your average .40SW bullet at muzzle velocity, and 100yds downrange is still faster than .45ACP at muzzle velocity. Also at 65 grains it's comfortable to shoot and extremely accurate, or at least much more accurate. Just some of my thoughts on the subject. Happy hunting!
Post by: CP on October 24, 2008, 07:23:20 AM
Post by: marc10000 on October 24, 2008, 07:56:33 AM
Post by: sss5358 on November 12, 2008, 12:27:03 PM
I shoot an older TC Thunderhawk with 110 grains of double F 777 against a 360 grain Keith nose soft lead sabot made by precision rifle. Probably to late to be experimenting though. But you may want to after the season is over.