Post by: stevemiller on September 23, 2013, 05:57:54 PM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on September 23, 2013, 06:08:06 PM
I also ignored the internet drama queens..
Post by: szairborne on September 23, 2013, 06:11:01 PM
Shayne
Post by: h20hunter on September 23, 2013, 06:15:35 PM
Post by: Hilltop123 on September 23, 2013, 06:32:04 PM
Post by: Hilltop123 on September 23, 2013, 06:38:37 PM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on September 23, 2013, 06:41:46 PM
I always full length sized for the auto loaders. Neck sizing the just wasn't as reliable for me.
Post by: stevemiller on September 23, 2013, 06:42:31 PM
Post by: 6.8mmARHunter on September 23, 2013, 06:46:51 PM
I reload for mine in 6.8 spc. Never had any problems. Just make sure you measure and trim your cases, they will stick if not correctly sized. Only other issue is OAL for putting rounds into mags.
Shayne
+1 :yeah:
A couple of addition things to consider:
1. Some use a bullet with a cannular and crimp the bullet (to avoid setback).
2. Some also use small base dies (resizes MORE to facilitate smoother autoloading).
I'm not sure if you wouldn't be wasting your time. Some swear by it, some say it's a waste of time.
sam
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 23, 2013, 09:51:48 PM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on September 23, 2013, 10:00:32 PM
NOBODY MOVE!.........What is 6mmx6.8? Who? and are reamers available?
The main thing I've found with .223 cases is to trim them constantly. I've never seen cases "grow" as much as .223/5.56 cases do. I've gotten into the habit of trimming all my cases, because some are mine, and some I've picked up. Some guys get a special Swager to remove the primer pocket crimp in some cases. Me, I just use a countersink bit in my cordless drill to remove the crimp. A quick buzz and it's done. I used to think I was being an animal doing this, but I looked at some of the Black Hills reloads, and some of them are chamfered so deeply I don't know how the primer stays in! I've always full-length resized my AR brass. .223 cases are so plentiful that it doesn't really matter to me if the case life is shorter. I always find more than I lose anyway. I use Ramshot Xterminator for bullets up to 55 grain, and Tac for heavier bullets. That IMR 8208 XBR might be good too, but I've not tried it in my .223s. In my 20 LBC and 6mmX6.8 SPC it's great! I've got to get on the IMR (Hodgedon) site and get the latest load data for it. There's more now than there was when it was newly reintroduced. When I started reloading for my .17 Fireball, all the data said that IMR 4198 was the powder that gave the best accuracy in that round, and after trying several powders, I found that they were right!
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 23, 2013, 10:22:46 PM
ALLRIGHT STOP!
NOBODY MOVE!.........What is 6mmx6.8? Who? and are reamers available?The main thing I've found with .223 cases is to trim them constantly. I've never seen cases "grow" as much as .223/5.56 cases do. I've gotten into the habit of trimming all my cases, because some are mine, and some I've picked up. Some guys get a special Swager to remove the primer pocket crimp in some cases. Me, I just use a countersink bit in my cordless drill to remove the crimp. A quick buzz and it's done. I used to think I was being an animal doing this, but I looked at some of the Black Hills reloads, and some of them are chamfered so deeply I don't know how the primer stays in! I've always full-length resized my AR brass. .223 cases are so plentiful that it doesn't really matter to me if the case life is shorter. I always find more than I lose anyway. I use Ramshot Xterminator for bullets up to 55 grain, and Tac for heavier bullets. That IMR 8208 XBR might be good too, but I've not tried it in my .223s. In my 20 LBC and 6mmX6.8 SPC it's great! I've got to get on the IMR (Hodgedon) site and get the latest load data for it. There's more now than there was when it was newly reintroduced. When I started reloading for my .17 Fireball, all the data said that IMR 4198 was the powder that gave the best accuracy in that round, and after trying several powders, I found that they were right!
It's a fairly new wildcat cartridge--a 6.8 SPC case (.270) necked down to 6mm. (.243) I got the barrel from Black Hole in Moses Lake and after 8 months I sent them a nasty email, and a week later I got it. Ammo is available commercially, but it's over a buck a round, so I made my own. I had a 6.8 SPC anyway, so brass wasn't a problem. IT'S A SCREAMER! :tup:
Post by: crazysccrmd on September 23, 2013, 10:23:45 PM
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 23, 2013, 10:29:51 PM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on September 23, 2013, 10:36:20 PM
Any numbers on 105-107 vld's?
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 23, 2013, 11:12:16 PM
So far, the 58 grain Hornadys with IMR 8208 XBR powder seems to be the ticket!
Post by: Fisherdave10 on September 24, 2013, 12:44:28 AM
Now I size my brass in an RCBS X-die and I don't have to trim. The longer cases stay at least .010" below the maximum case length now.
Get a Lee Factory Crimp Die. Case length does not matter and it is extremely easy to setup. It is a fantastic product.
Varget is a great powder, but is a little slow for 55gr bullets. The extruded shape of the powder can make progressive loading a little bit bumpy...
I like Ramshot TAC. Because it is spherical, it meters well and is relatively economical. I really need to find a few more pounds...
Post by: Blacklab on September 25, 2013, 09:28:21 PM
Post by: Fl0und3rz on September 26, 2013, 09:27:48 PM
How important is cup pressure in the ar's for cycling.better to be higher or lower?
About the best I have seen on the topic to answer your question.
http://www.ar15barrels.com/prod/operation.shtml (http://www.ar15barrels.com/prod/operation.shtml)
Short answer is it depends and neither. There tends to be a sweet spot that depends on rifle configuration.
Post by: stevemiller on September 26, 2013, 09:54:04 PM
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 26, 2013, 10:00:51 PM
You might also look into mag primers for the thicker walls. To lessen the chance of slam fires. :twocents:
I've never had a slam fire. Shot many rounds with CCI and Wolf primers. Sometimes get a mark in the primer of an unfired chambered round due to the "floating firing pin", but oddly enough, never a slam fire. I've seen the #41 primers that are designed for the AR but haven't used any. They probably have an extra thick primer cup. :twocents:
Post by: jay.sharkbait on September 26, 2013, 10:12:47 PM
You might also look into mag primers for the thicker walls. To lessen the chance of slam fires. :twocents:
I've never had a slam fire. Shot many rounds with CCI and Wolf primers. Sometimes get a mark in the primer of an unfired chambered round due to the "floating firing pin", but oddly enough, never a slam fire. I've seen the #41 primers that are designed for the AR but haven't used any. They probably have an extra thick primer cup. :twocents:
I've never had a slam fire either
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 27, 2013, 08:57:11 AM
no slams yet but did have one jam (sideways)crushed the case and when mag emptied bolt stayed forward.this did not happen when firing hornady 55gr. vmax.what would you say the prob. may be? :dunno:
Not enough pressure to make the bolt carrier/bolt go back far enough to eject the empty and activate the lockback. The .223 was designed around the 55 grain bullet. Lightest bullet I've loaded is 50 grain, and they functioned fine. :twocents:
Post by: Fl0und3rz on September 27, 2013, 09:09:07 AM
no slams yet but did have one jam (sideways)crushed the case and when mag emptied bolt stayed forward.this did not happen when firing hornady 55gr. vmax.what would you say the prob. may be? :dunno:
Not enough pressure to make the bolt carrier/bolt go back far enough to eject the empty and activate the lockback. The .223 was designed around the 55 grain bullet.
That'd be my guess as well. My data shows that to be about 3150 fps out of a 20" 1/7 barrel, which is mid-range for the Sierra data. Also, as a point of reference, the velocity for M193 is around 3150 fps for a 55 grain bullet, so I would expect those specs to produce a higher pressure than what you are using. I'd consider bumping up the charge before I would consider any other causes.
Post by: stevemiller on September 27, 2013, 10:18:50 AM
Post by: Blacklab on September 28, 2013, 04:35:30 AM
Post by: brokenvet on September 28, 2013, 08:40:16 AM
I shoot the AR, m14 & the M1 garand and I have only one slam fire and that was due
To a primer not fully seated.
Hornady reloading manual 7th or 8th Edition has specific loading data for the service rifle.
Post by: gasman on September 28, 2013, 12:07:07 PM
Used Hornady V max, in 55gr and 24.7 grains of TAC powder.
We will see how it works :dunno:
I did have to Swagger some of the brass, the Tula and Rem brass were Ok but the others I had need to be swagged. It was first time swagging primer pockets and a learning experience for me :DOH:
Post by: Blacklab on September 28, 2013, 05:44:00 PM
55 GR. BAR TSX FB Hodgdon CFE 223 .224" 2.180" 24.7 3065 44,600 PSI 27.4 3317 54,000 PSI
55 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon CFE 223 .224" 2.200" 26.0 3133 43,300 PSI 27.8 3329 51,300 PSI
(Click on any icon below to return to that product)
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 28, 2013, 10:44:54 PM
Post by: Fl0und3rz on September 29, 2013, 04:27:31 AM
I've heard that the pressures are higher in the military 5.56 ammo to make sure they cycle the action in an AR type gun in battle. I load for accuracy, and that's usually about the middle of the load table. Even loads at the bottom of the load table have never failed to cycle in my AR rifles. :twocents:
That's a good point of reference. What are the specs of the rifle? With tolerances (or possible out of spec parts) at the buffer, buffer spring, bolt, carrier, key, gas tube and gas port stacking in the wrong direction, a weak load - speculating - might provide insufficient pressure to cycle the AR.
I'd like to say that mine have been 100% reliable with 45-55 grain bullets with mid to lower end loads, but that is not the case for me, and it was exacerbated at lower temperatures (e.g., a load that cycled reliably in mid-day, mid-summer heat failed to cycle in early morning temperatures). With M193 level loads tested concurrently, they cycle fine. Just another data point.
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on September 29, 2013, 07:59:59 AM
Post by: Brownie28 on September 29, 2013, 12:30:37 PM
I always FL resize and check case length.
lC brass, win SR primers, varget, hdy SP , loaded to .010 under mag length and I get this
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm634%2Fdemondoza%2F20130821_161246.jpg&hash=d0549f70f63801e5b27f902794ddcda1097ed585)
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm634%2Fdemondoza%2F20130821_163721.jpg&hash=297f407e0cf9fe89960991da6fd44c2c02281305)
Post by: Hilltop123 on September 29, 2013, 01:09:07 PM
I use 26 gr varget with 60gr hornadySP and get Awesome groups.Barrel specs.? Just curious..
I always FL resize and check case length.
lC brass, win SR primers, varget, hdy SP , loaded to .010 under mag length and I get this
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm634%2Fdemondoza%2F20130821_161246.jpg&hash=d0549f70f63801e5b27f902794ddcda1097ed585)
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm634%2Fdemondoza%2F20130821_163721.jpg&hash=297f407e0cf9fe89960991da6fd44c2c02281305)
Post by: Blacklab on September 29, 2013, 04:11:55 PM
Post by: Brownie28 on September 29, 2013, 05:01:35 PM
This is Marie laveu
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm634%2Fdemondoza%2F79D38EF3-6C7C-4C8E-8311-0E750D83AC94-607-0000004C321DC8D1_zps8cd2eca7.jpg&hash=bcf83684b53efc306af4aadcdc3572729f2ddfc2)
Post by: fowl smacker on October 05, 2013, 07:05:16 PM
I have some Sierra 107 grain bullets, some Speer 85 grainers, and Barnes 62 grain Varmint Grenades, but haven't tried any of them yet. You can get the barrel in 1 in 10 or 1 in 9 twist. I specified 1 in 9, so it should stabilize the heavier bullets OK. If it does, I may snap up the Berger VLDs at the gun shop...
So far, the 58 grain Hornadys with IMR 8208 XBR powder seems to be the ticket!
I would not use the heavier bullets with a 1 in 9" twist, max bullet weight for that twist should be 73 gr. You would want a 1 in 7" or faster for anything 90gr and up.
I've reloaded a lot for my AR's both 1 in 9 and 1 in 7. I highly recommend the Lee fl die for the AR platform. You also want to stay a couple grains lighter on the powder from max load on a bolt action .223. My best load for 1 in 9" is 55gr Hornady vmax pushed by 24.6 gr of varget, and my best for 1 in 7" twist is a 69gr sierra match king hpbt (not a hunting round) pushed by 25.3 gr of varget. Hope this helps.
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on October 07, 2013, 07:17:25 AM
I have some Sierra 107 grain bullets, some Speer 85 grainers, and Barnes 62 grain Varmint Grenades, but haven't tried any of them yet. You can get the barrel in 1 in 10 or 1 in 9 twist. I specified 1 in 9, so it should stabilize the heavier bullets OK. If it does, I may snap up the Berger VLDs at the gun shop...
So far, the 58 grain Hornadys with IMR 8208 XBR powder seems to be the ticket!
I would not use the heavier bullets with a 1 in 9" twist, max bullet weight for that twist should be 73 gr. You would want a 1 in 7" or faster for anything 90gr and up.
I've reloaded a lot for my AR's both 1 in 9 and 1 in 7. I highly recommend the Lee fl die for the AR platform. You also want to stay a couple grains lighter on the powder from max load on a bolt action .223. My best load for 1 in 9" is 55gr Hornady vmax pushed by 24.6 gr of varget, and my best for 1 in 7" twist is a 69gr sierra match king hpbt (not a hunting round) pushed by 25.3 gr of varget. Hope this helps.
This is a 6.8SPC necked down to 6mm. Standard load for the 6.8SPC is 110-115 grain bullets. I agree with the .223 info.
Post by: Jekemi on October 23, 2013, 01:36:25 PM