Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 10:22:32 AM
I shoot a 300 weatherby in a Mark V, the lightweight version. My dad and I shoot the same rifles, and same loads, and have struggled to get decent groups but have manged to find a load that is OK to us, which still only gets around 1 inch groups at 100 yards. Its not bad but I would really like to tighten it up.
I wanted to try Rbros after reading so many good things about him, but I spoke with him last year and he told me he didn't have the tooling for weatherby actions, and was going to be focusing on full rifle builds anyhow.
My next thought was to try Benchmark. I emailed them and heard back from Chris, he has told me they can do everything I need. Awesome.
Is there anyone else I should consider? Maybe someone a little closer, although I really don't mind the drive up there since from everything I have read, it will be done right.
There are a lot of things I think could be improved on this rifle, and I am not against getting a new barrel, however I was considering trying to accurize the rifle and see what kind of improvements we can get with the factory barrel, hoping that I can do this in two stages just to help the wallet out. Thoughts?
Post by: kentrek on November 01, 2013, 10:38:11 AM
Post by: DRobnsn on November 01, 2013, 10:43:17 AM
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 10:47:46 AM
I'm open to ideas of all sorts though. I do not need a 1,000 yard rifle. I want to be completely confident at up to 500 yards is all, and currently I am not.
My dad has a Cooper chambered in 220 swift that I shot a 300 yard group the other day that a quarter could darn near cover, shooting off a bipod. I've really been wanting a Cooper ever since he got that rifle :chuckle: maybe thats a better option :dunno:
DRobnsn I am shooting a 180 Barnes TTSX. When we first started developing loads we tried several bullets, but really wanted to make the Barnes work so we stuck with that. A 1 inch group is as good as we have ever got out of any load and any bullet combination.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on November 01, 2013, 10:51:54 AM
Post by: Bob33 on November 01, 2013, 10:59:39 AM
My dad has a Cooper chambered in 220 swift that I shot a 300 yard group the other day that a quarter could darn near cover, shooting off a bipod.With all due respect, most rifles can (occasionally) shoot a group of that size, but not every time! I suspect if you fired a few more groups you would find that most did not match that performance.
If that is your standard you will most likely need to start over.
A more realistic standard for a 300 magnum is probably 1/2 to 3/4 MOA, and that's more than adequate for big game to 500 yards and beyond. After all, a 1 MOA rifle should in theory place the shots in a 5" circle at 500 yards, which in theory means that the shots are within 2.5" of the aim point (+ 2.5", -2.5").
Ammunition can play a very large role in group size. I've seen many rifles that would shoot some loads into an inch or less, while the same rifle and shooter would group over 2" with different ammuntion.
A good barrel is probably the best place to start, and you won't go wrong with Benchmark.
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 11:06:17 AM
If I could get a 3/4 MOA with this rifle I would be absolutely tickled.
Post by: Bluesdude on November 01, 2013, 11:10:18 AM
I shoot a Weatherby Vanguard Sub-Moa in 300wsm. I had a muzzle brake installed, a trigger job to 2.5 lbs and handload Berger VLD 185s using Norma Brass and 67 grains of Hodgen 4781 powder. My gun touches paper at 200 yards now after extensive shooting and playing with bullet weight and powder. I havent shot mine past 600 as the BDC retical is limited to that yardage. I am comfortable to 500 as long as wind isnt a big factor.
Todd
Post by: snowpack on November 01, 2013, 11:13:42 AM
If the gun is factory and not bedded you could look into doing a bed job with something like Devcon.
Post by: JLS on November 01, 2013, 11:17:16 AM
Post by: jackelope on November 01, 2013, 11:41:40 AM
Post by: Bill W on November 01, 2013, 11:49:22 AM
I shoot a Model 70 Featherweight 7mm Mauser and I had a choice between two different loads. One averaged 1.1MOA and the other was at best 1.5MOA. I settled on the 1.5MOA as I wanted a tad more throttle power. I've used this rifle to shoot deer out to 525 yards in field conditions and never had a miss attributable to the load or the equipment. Two deer were missed in 30 years of use and the reason was hasty shots at running deer and starting out with the scope not turned back down after glassing at 9X power.
If I was only trying to improve rifle accuracy by 1/4 MOA I'd spend my money on trigger time and buy components for more shooting time. If jackrabbits were still legal game I'd focus on them.
Post by: coachcw on November 01, 2013, 11:55:47 AM
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 12:13:00 PM
I just can't imagine most people trying to work up this many loads just to get a solid 1 inch group? The only bullets we have left to test (that I would shoot) are the Swift Scirroco and a nosler partition. We tried the accubonds, they were my second favorite to the barnes.
And before someone suggests copper fouling, I learned that lesson already and I'm quite certain that isn't the issue, although my groups really do open up fairly quick with these barnes.
Coach this barrel is nowhere near floated, that is one of the things I was hoping to have done
Post by: RadSav on November 01, 2013, 12:20:50 PM
how clean are your first two shots ? whetherby dosnt float the barrel on the lightweights ? I free'd mine up and the three and four shot groups improved :tup:
That's a good question! Many of the Remington and Ruger guns I've had will shoot sub MOA in two shot groups. Shoot a third too quick and it climbs leaving 1.5".
I'm surprised that you improved things by floating the lightweight barrel coach. Was that in a Wby Magnum offering? 26" whippy barrel free floated has never worked out for me unless full length bedded neutral.
Post by: JLS on November 01, 2013, 12:24:38 PM
Also, using the powder charge that you arrived at for accuracy, take those loads and play with the seating depth and see if you can fine tune it a little more.
Post by: Bob33 on November 01, 2013, 12:25:42 PM
When fall rolls around, he's got a shelf full of great ammunition...and nothing to use it on. He spends no time scouting or researching new places to hunt. He spends no time meeting landowners, or building relationships with existing contacts.
He then bemoans how "fortunate" I am to have so many hunting opportunities, which probably exceed his by a factor of 10 to 1.
After a while I concluded that he must in some obscure manner enjoy this paradox. More power to him.
I'll take my 1.25" MOA guns and kill critters at any reasonable distance I care to shoot. If it's too far for that (which is somewhere north of 500 yards for deer or larger game), then I can get closer, or pass and keep hunting.
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 12:52:14 PM
Maybe a cheap alternative might be to try one of those Limbsaver doohickeys that go on the barrel. I don't use one, but I seem to recall reading that they do indeed work.
Also, using the powder charge that you arrived at for accuracy, take those loads and play with the seating depth and see if you can fine tune it a little more.
We tried messing with seating depths, it really didn't make much of a difference as with weatherbys we can't even come close to touching the lands.
I've never had luck with the Limbsaver barrel deresonators, I did have one on this rifle when I first got it but never saw a difference even when I tried to "tune" it.
Bob, I am tagged out here in washington, have one hunt coming up in two weeks in Montana, then I will have all winter to tinker with things. If I could get a consistent 1.25 MOA out of this rifle I'd be happy, but I cannot. I don't plan on longrange hunting, but my style of hunting I do get shots at 300-400 yards on a regular basis. Getting this rifle as accurate as I can certainly can't hurt anything.
Post by: threedwizard on November 01, 2013, 12:53:37 PM
Post by: RadSav on November 01, 2013, 01:05:46 PM
You've heard all great advice here. I agree with full float on the barrel, it really helped my .340 Weatherby. I shoot the Barnes TTSX and R21 and they are great. Shoots excellent groups and the bullet is a hammer. Here's my last sight in earlier this year at 200 yards. No complaints here, and my other Weatherby's all shoot this well. Stick with it, the 300 WBY is a great caliber.
You shoot that with the Ultra Light floated? Or is it a heavier barrel floated? If that's the Ultra Light floated that is mighty impressive!
Post by: jay.sharkbait on November 01, 2013, 01:06:24 PM
You've heard all great advice here. I agree with full float on the barrel, it really helped my .340 Weatherby. I shoot the Barnes TTSX and R21 and they are great. Shoots excellent groups and the bullet is a hammer. Here's my last sight in earlier this year at 200 yards. No complaints here, and my other Weatherby's all shoot this well. Stick with it, the 300 WBY is a great caliber.
Wasn't R21 discontinued in the 70's?
Post by: coachcw on November 01, 2013, 01:14:02 PM
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 01:18:44 PM
how clean are your first two shots ? whetherby dosnt float the barrel on the lightweights ? I free'd mine up and the three and four shot groups improved :tup:
I'm going to try this at the range tonight coach you may be onto something, my last 300 yard groups have been bugging me and I may have been looking past this
Post by: RadSav on November 01, 2013, 01:26:27 PM
I floated my .270 ultra light and it shoots lights out
24" Win or 26" Wby?
Post by: Bob33 on November 01, 2013, 01:32:22 PM
The bedding job was, politely speaking, horrible. I free floated it, and accuracy improved but not to a point where I was satisified.
I finally gave up and had it rebarreled with a Benchmark barrel. I'm very happy with it now.
Post by: mrolen on November 01, 2013, 01:34:17 PM
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 01:39:42 PM
FWIW: I have a Weatherby Ultra Light in 257 Wby. Out of the box I could not get it to shoot consistently well.
The bedding job was, politely speaking, horrible. I free floated it, and accuracy improved but not to a point where I was satisified.
I finally gave up and had it rebarreled with a Benchmark barrel. I'm very happy with it now.
I have the same rifle as well, same thing I've never been impressed with the accuracy.
Do you have a picture of it? I sure like the ultra light weight barrel on these rifles, how heavy of a barrel did you go with? I'd even consider a 24" my 26 with a muzzle break (on the 300) sure gets in the way at times
Post by: threedwizard on November 01, 2013, 01:44:47 PM
Post by: coachcw on November 01, 2013, 01:52:02 PM
sell it and start over if that is an option. there are better platforms to start from like remington or a tikkayu don't work on tikas just shoot them
Post by: RadSav on November 01, 2013, 01:54:53 PM
I have a 1 lb. of Reloader 21 here on my bench. Mark V stainless stardard barrel 24". Not an Ultra light, but shouldn't matter much. It took 8 different loads to find the sweet one, and I have the bullet just touch the lands. Builds a lot of pressure, but nothing dangerous. Have shoot over a hundred of these loads in the past decada.
Cool! I didn't know the 340 was offered in a 24" barrel. I also thought it was forbidden to load the TTSX closer than .050" off the lands :dunno: Surprised you were able to reach the lands with the extended Weatherby free bore. I was thinking of getting a 240 Wby for kicks but decided against it due to the free bore issues as I've never had much luck with loads that far off the lands.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on November 01, 2013, 01:56:42 PM
I have a 1 lb. of Reloader 21 here on my bench. Mark V stainless stardard barrel 24". Not an Ultra light, but shouldn't matter much. It took 8 different loads to find the sweet one, and I have the bullet just touch the lands. Builds a lot of pressure, but nothing dangerous. Have shoot over a hundred of these loads in the past decada.
With that OAL does the round feed in the magazine?
Post by: mrolen on November 01, 2013, 02:21:12 PM
sell it and start over if that is an option. there are better platforms to start from like remington or a tikkayu don't work on tikas just shoot them
sure ya do throw away the old stock replace it with a nicer one then shoot the barrel out and replace it :chuckle:
Post by: Bob33 on November 01, 2013, 02:26:58 PM
I don't have a photo handy. The barrel contour matched the original barrel.FWIW: I have a Weatherby Ultra Light in 257 Wby. Out of the box I could not get it to shoot consistently well.
The bedding job was, politely speaking, horrible. I free floated it, and accuracy improved but not to a point where I was satisified.
I finally gave up and had it rebarreled with a Benchmark barrel. I'm very happy with it now.
I have the same rifle as well, same thing I've never been impressed with the accuracy.
Do you have a picture of it? I sure like the ultra light weight barrel on these rifles, how heavy of a barrel did you go with? I'd even consider a 24" my 26 with a muzzle break (on the 300) sure gets in the way at times
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 02:28:11 PM
Post by: snowpack on November 01, 2013, 02:42:09 PM
Post by: LEN on November 01, 2013, 02:50:31 PM
LEN
Post by: RadSav on November 01, 2013, 02:51:22 PM
If you get it too accurate wouldn't you have to change your username? :o
:chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: Nice!
Post by: sirmissalot on November 01, 2013, 03:02:58 PM
If you get it too accurate wouldn't you have to change your username? :o
As unfortunate as it sounds I earned this name so its here to stay.
That said, I miss much less nowadays, normally when I would it was because of severe buck, bull, or bear fever :chuckle: obviously no matter what kind of fancy rifle you are shooting, that one is hard to fix without some experience and age. I did miss my buck on the first shot this year... I was so excited when he came out I miss ranged him. I still get the fever just not as bad.
Post by: RadSav on November 01, 2013, 03:08:30 PM
I swore I would never by a Wannaby when ROY and I had words many moons ago at the Reno gun show. Long story short I had cash in hand for a REALLY nice Wannaby and he just walked away to some suit. Well I have worked out loads on many of them and when the great looking and feeling 30378 came along I just had to spend the $$$. Had it trued, floated, trigger at munimum and cryoed and developed loads got to 5" at about 600 yards and no better, so I sold the gun and I felt it should do 3" or so no frikkin way. So my advice is to get a known good gun that will do what you want, There are lots of gun makers out there that can and will do the job for little more than trying to make a Wannaby shoot. Do a little research and there are several rounds in the beltless cases that are what the long range guys use(competition) that are a lot better suited to the job than the Wannaby case and as long as you hand load already your in. JMO " Something like a silk purse and a sows ear with the wannaby"
.833 minute @ 600 yards with a sporting/hunting gun and the out of whack 30-378 sounds pretty dang good to me!
Post by: threedwizard on November 01, 2013, 03:34:18 PM
Post by: LEN on November 01, 2013, 03:40:59 PM
LEN
Post by: WoodlandShooter on November 05, 2013, 09:43:55 AM
I've been wanting to do this for a couple years now, and I want this winter to finally be the year.
I shoot a 300 weatherby in a Mark V, the lightweight version. My dad and I shoot the same rifles, and same loads, and have struggled to get decent groups but have manged to find a load that is OK to us, which still only gets around 1 inch groups at 100 yards. Its not bad but I would really like to tighten it up.
I wanted to try Rbros after reading so many good things about him, but I spoke with him last year and he told me he didn't have the tooling for weatherby actions, and was going to be focusing on full rifle builds anyhow.
My next thought was to try Benchmark. I emailed them and heard back from Chris, he has told me they can do everything I need. Awesome.
Is there anyone else I should consider? Maybe someone a little closer, although I really don't mind the drive up there since from everything I have read, it will be done right.
There are a lot of things I think could be improved on this rifle, and I am not against getting a new barrel, however I was considering trying to accurize the rifle and see what kind of improvements we can get with the factory barrel, hoping that I can do this in two stages just to help the wallet out. Thoughts?
Benchmark did all the work on my Weatherby MKV. If you do send it to them make sure they cut the chanfer on the breach to allow feeding of OTM bullets..if not, they will catch and not feed!!!!
Other than having to polish that area on my rifle to get it to feed, the thing shoots like a dream. with me running it, I can get it just under 0.5MOA....with someone with better training...I have no doubt it can do better.
Post by: sirmissalot on November 05, 2013, 09:54:23 AM
I shot again on Sunday and again I am still not pleased with the groups I can get currently. It's probably much closer to 2 MOA. That was shooting off a bench in a vise, which it's been a while since I've done that normally I practice the way I hunt which is prone off a bipod. I am going to plan on taking it up to benchmark after this last hunting trip and having them go through it and most likely do a new barrel as well.
What are thoughts on doing a 24 inch barrel instead of the 26? With the muzzle break on this gun it sure is long and I don't mind sacrificing a little speed for maneuverability.
Post by: WoodlandShooter on November 05, 2013, 10:02:57 AM
Thanks woodland, that's what I wanted to hear.
I shot again on Sunday and again I am still not pleased with the groups I can get currently. It's probably much closer to 2 MOA. That was shooting off a bench in a vise, which it's been a while since I've done that normally I practice the way I hunt which is prone off a bipod. I am going to plan on taking it up to benchmark after this last hunting trip and having them go through it and most likely do a new barrel as well.
What are thoughts on doing a 24 inch barrel instead of the 26? With the muzzle break on this gun it sure is long and I don't mind sacrificing a little speed for maneuverability.
I do all my shooting of of a bipod, my 0.5 MOA group (five shots) is actually from a prone position with bipod.
This rifle weighs ~14 pounds as pictured...the reality is...if you want an accurate weapon, it's gonna be heavy.
I have a 27" tube on this rifle...the brake makes follow up shots a breeze...
If you stick with the 300Roy, well, I would go with the longer tube...you have serious long range potential there...190 grain SMKs would be well used...and possibly some 220's Super Sonic range should be close to a mile.
Straight Shooter Supply in Bend Oregon has also build some Mark V's into real shooters also
Post by: sirmissalot on February 11, 2014, 09:24:14 AM
I have three bullets I am interested in shooting
Barnes TTSX, or more like the new LRX
Accubond
Berger
I already have a box of the berger 185's from my last round of load development so I'm going to stick with those, but as far as the others would I be better off with 180 (the barnes LRX is actually 175) or 200 grain? The only reason I ask, is I have read that some others have had better luck getting the 300 weatherby to shoot well with a heavier bullet, than I lighter bullet. I'm not too concerned with a higher BC bullet, and I realize the 180 if I put it in the right spot will do the job just fine on anything animal considering I'm only talking about a 500 yard max range on this rifle, simply asking about others experience as far accuracy goes.
Post by: buckhorn2 on February 11, 2014, 09:48:10 AM
Post by: BULLBLASTER on February 11, 2014, 10:15:29 AM
Post by: sirmissalot on February 11, 2014, 10:20:52 AM
Post by: lhrbull on February 11, 2014, 10:42:30 AM
Post by: Deathgrip on February 11, 2014, 08:48:31 PM
Post by: Ziptie on February 12, 2014, 02:18:07 PM
I also discovered that the way I was absorbing the recoil was affecting my accuracy with the 300 in the beginning. It took practice to absorb the recoil consistently with the lighter rifle. Love the 300 take into the woods every year.
Good luck
Post by: coachcw on February 12, 2014, 06:01:13 PM