Post by: cowboycraig on December 14, 2013, 09:53:57 PM
There is a woman full time out in front of the store pushing signatures for 594. I see this as PCC's agreement with 594.
I let them know I will never spend another $ at PCC and will encourage everyone else I know who believes in the Bill of Rights to do the same. In the end if enough money will be lost, they will chase tyranny off their parking lot. I encourage everyone to drop them an email or call and let them know not another $ until PCC supports the Constitution. If PCC believes this will lose them money and get them bad press, the wench is gone. And hopefully not other PCC's will allow this.
Address: 2749 California Ave SW, Seattle, WA 98116
Phone:(206) 937-8481
Customer contact form https://secure.pccnaturalmarkets.com/feedback/index.php?store=West%20Seattle (https://secure.pccnaturalmarkets.com/feedback/index.php?store=West%20Seattle)
Please please please send them an email and let them now "Not another dollar until they support the Constitution or at least take a neutral stance on 2nd Amendment if belief in the whole of the Constitution is too offending to them.
Craig
Post by: hunterrcc on December 14, 2013, 10:19:28 PM
Post by: cowboycraig on December 14, 2013, 10:23:02 PM
done message sent even though I don't shop there...
Thanks very much. Think a little bad press and loss of $ will get PCC to support the Constitution. Or at least be neutral. I like shopping there, and would miss it. But I cannot shop at a store that allows petitions to limit our unalienable rights.
Post by: Bob33 on December 14, 2013, 10:48:28 PM
Post by: cowboycraig on December 14, 2013, 10:56:08 PM
Unfortunate but not at all surprising. Seattle store. Many liberal agendas.
I agree. But losing $ and bad press will keep PCC supporting the Constitution. Please send them a note.
Post by: deerhuntr4885 on December 14, 2013, 11:48:02 PM
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 12:20:57 AM
I don't know what PCC is but if it is store open to the public then they have no choice in allowing petitioners on their property. It is an established right under the law and is called public participation in govt. The only time it can be restricted is with a restraining order and specific persons must be listed as prohibited on the property. It is also not all that easy to enforce.
Makes sense. Still hope that if an establishment doesn't make the petitioner feel welcome, they may be on their way. Can only hope. Or maybe if the petitioner knows it is hurting the stores income and reputation they may scurry off. Could always make a point of giving her a hard time but think that would just screw me over somehow.
Post by: Knocker of rocks on December 15, 2013, 06:26:14 AM
I don't know what PCC is but if it is store open to the public then they have no choice in allowing petitioners on their property. It is an established right under the law and is called public participation in govt. The only time it can be restricted is with a restraining order and specific persons must be listed as prohibited on the property. It is also not all that easy to enforce.
Makes sense. Still hope that if an establishment doesn't make the petitioner feel welcome, they may be on their way. Can only hope. Or maybe if the petitioner knows it is hurting the stores income and reputation they may scurry off. Could always make a point of giving her a hard time but think that would just screw me over somehow.
That could land you in trouble.
http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/initiatives/faq.aspx (http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/initiatives/faq.aspx)
The basic demographics are against you here, railing to PCC about a liberal initiative gatherer on their property is going to fall on deaf ears. PCC is the favorite store of all Seattle liberals. This isn't a battle really worth fighting because it is a complete fait acompli.
The gatherer probably asked for permission from PCC, because it is PCC. The legal right to gather signatures probably would not extend to PCC, but a company would best be cautious in interpreting their obligations or lack of.
http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/pdf/AGO_on_Political_Activity_at_Shopping_Centers.pdf (http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/pdf/AGO_on_Political_Activity_at_Shopping_Centers.pdf)
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 07:32:26 AM
I don't know what PCC is but if it is store open to the public then they have no choice in allowing petitioners on their property. It is an established right under the law and is called public participation in govt. The only time it can be restricted is with a restraining order and specific persons must be listed as prohibited on the property. It is also not all that easy to enforce.
Makes sense. Still hope that if an establishment doesn't make the petitioner feel welcome, they may be on their way. Can only hope. Or maybe if the petitioner knows it is hurting the stores income and reputation they may scurry off. Could always make a point of giving her a hard time but think that would just screw me over somehow.
That could land you in trouble.
http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/initiatives/faq.aspx (http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/initiatives/faq.aspx)
The basic demographics are against you here, railing to PCC about a liberal initiative gatherer on their property is going to fall on deaf ears. PCC is the favorite store of all Seattle liberals. This isn't a battle really worth fighting because it is a complete fait acompli.
The gatherer probably asked for permission from PCC, because it is PCC. The legal right to gather signatures probably would not extend to PCC, but a company would best be cautious in interpreting their obligations or lack of.
http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/pdf/AGO_on_Political_Activity_at_Shopping_Centers.pdf (http://www.sos.wa.gov/elections/pdf/AGO_on_Political_Activity_at_Shopping_Centers.pdf)
Thanks for the good info. Ya, doubt PCC will ever have free copies of the Constitution by the cash register. But they lost some money and a shopper. Never know, enough people saying "I will never shop there again" at least lets PCC know their politics are costing them. If an actual loss in revenue was seen at the register and could be connected to 594, I am sure somehow that signature gatherer would go find another parking lot to troll.
Post by: Knocker of rocks on December 15, 2013, 07:39:31 AM
Never know, enough people saying "I will never shop there again" at least lets PCC know their politics are costing them. If an actual loss in revenue was seen at the register and could be connected to 594, I am sure somehow that signature gatherer would go find another parking lot to troll.
It's not their politics, they are probably being cautious in their interpretation of state law.
Why don't you collect 591 sigs in their parking lot?
Post by: Bob33 on December 15, 2013, 07:41:17 AM
Post by: Knocker of rocks on December 15, 2013, 07:57:06 AM
Or maybe they do. The state has not prepared a list of stores that are "town squares" and those that are not. But it is very likely that PCC extends this privilege to all gatherers just so they do not become embroiled in legal wranglings over whether or not they are a town square.
The OP should have politely asked whether he would be allowed to get 591 sigs, but he lost this ability when he told them he would never spend another dime there :bash:.
Know the facts before you jump off the pier
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 08:21:53 AM
It seems like the interpretations of state law allow reasonable access of private property to signature gatherers in the case of shopping malls, because these have become "quasi public town squares". This privilege doesn't seem to extend to smaller stand-alone stores because they do not meet the "town square" metric.
Or maybe they do. The state has not prepared a list of stores that are "town squares" and those that are not. But it is very likely that PCC extends this privilege to all gatherers just so they do not become embroiled in legal wranglings over whether or not they are a town square.
The OP should have politely asked whether he would be allowed to get 591 sigs, but he lost this ability when he told them he would never spend another dime there :bash:.
Know the facts before you jump off the pier
You make perfect points. If I was going to gather signatures would goto cabelas before PCC. Guess cannot blame someone for going where the getting is good. Have considered signature gathering but so far my political actions for the 2nd amendment have been different methods. I have collected signatures for non-2nd amendment issues and it is a hard job. Everyone hates you, they just sign to get you out of their face. And that is the sad part, most people will sign anything. Part of why this pcc thing bothered me was it is bad politics. Also if you watch only pathetic looking people sign. So heartbreaking to watch people rip up the Constitution right in front of my face. What future does America have when people want to give up their rights? The government isn't a bad as people with a smile saying "have you signed the petition to give up your natural rights yet?" Maybe I should live in TX Seattle gets me down.
Post by: Bob33 on December 15, 2013, 08:28:19 AM
People Petition to Confiscate Guns From Tea Party Supporters and Repeal the Second Amendment (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2diNojgJF9c#ws)
Post by: Knocker of rocks on December 15, 2013, 08:30:49 AM
So all parties must be careful of what part of the Bill of Rights you support, and when.
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 11:37:56 AM
Some people will sign anything.
People Petition to Confiscate Guns From Tea Party Supporters and Repeal the Second Amendment (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2diNojgJF9c#ws)
It is a sad and true reality. Of course this is in CA. Venice Beach I think.
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 11:41:00 AM
It seems that the State Supreme Court also viewed signature gathering as a constitutional right.
So all parties must be careful of what part of the Bill of Rights you support, and when.
I believe in gathering signatures being a Constitutional right for sure. Even for 594. Companies realize (I think) it may cost them money, or make them money, if they encourage it on their property. Guess once public land starts, we really cannot hold a company responsible for bias.
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 11:58:27 AM
Post by: T-Dozzer on December 15, 2013, 03:25:28 PM
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 03:36:49 PM
Message sent.Thanks!
Post by: Dave Workman on December 15, 2013, 05:55:36 PM
Initiative 591 signature gatherers would have just as much right to be there but it would be far less productive.
How do you know this?They might gather as many signatures.
Post by: cowboycraig on December 15, 2013, 06:11:11 PM
Initiative 591 signature gatherers would have just as much right to be there but it would be far less productive.
How do you know this?They might gather as many signatures.
Good point. Have not seen 100% of the people signing. Maybe they would sign 591?
Post by: ghosthunter on December 15, 2013, 06:24:58 PM
done message sent even though I don't shop there...
:yeah:
Post by: hunterrcc on December 16, 2013, 09:30:30 AM
Dear Mr. @@@@@,
The lady with the petition on gun control asked me if she could stand in front of my store and I told her no. To my knowledge she is standing on the public sidewalk, which runs along the side of our building for which I have no control over. PCC Natural Markets as a company nor myself personally are involved in anyway politically regarding the gun initiatives.
Corinne Caldwell
Store Director
West Seattle PCC Natural Markets
206-937-8481
"One person with passion is better than forty people merely interested."
— E. M. Forster
Post by: cowboycraig on December 16, 2013, 10:22:55 AM
Here is my response from her.
Dear Mr. @@@@@,
The lady with the petition on gun control asked me if she could stand in front of my store and I told her no. To my knowledge she is standing on the public sidewalk, which runs along the side of our building for which I have no control over. PCC Natural Markets as a company nor myself personally are involved in anyway politically regarding the gun initiatives.
Corinne Caldwell
Store Director
West Seattle PCC Natural Markets
206-937-8481
"One person with passion is better than forty people merely interested."
— E. M. Forster
Thanks for contacting PCC. It is all about money :)
If PCC thinks it will lose money or get bad press, they will keep that lady away from the store and over on her sidewalk (that is a ways from the front of the store).