Hunting Washington Forum

Equipment & Gear => Guns and Ammo => Topic started by: Tony 270WSM on November 09, 2008, 11:21:11 AM

Title: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: Tony 270WSM on November 09, 2008, 11:21:11 AM: Was looking at the sales flyer for Cabela's and wonder what are the stregths and weaknesses of a pump vs semi-auto. I've shot a Remington 870 before and liked the feel of it. The Mossberg 835 is the same price. Which would you consider better and why?

Then theres the Remmy SPR 453 and a couple Tristar semi-autos. Why would you take a semi over a pump or the other way around?

Have shot a few pumps, but don't know the pros or cons of them and the semis. Any advice?
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: fishing is for fools on November 09, 2008, 11:26:46 AM: I like a pump for duck hunting because I'm good for one drop in the mud
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: ducks55 on November 09, 2008, 11:30:44 AM: I just switched from semi-auto to pump. I loved shooting my semi-auto because it was not as long between shots but as it got older it wouldnt eject sometimes. My new pump is great though, its a Mossberg 500. Pumps are alot cheaper than semi-autos and you can get a better quality pump for the same price as a lower end semi-auto. I paid $200 for my Mossberg 500 and it works great. My dad has the 835 and likes it too. Its really up to what you want to shoot and the price range youre looking in. Also look at different guns and pick the one that fits you best. Good luck finding a new one.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: road.kill on November 09, 2008, 11:53:20 AM: the remington 870 has been a trusted name in the shotgun world for a long time, i personally dont own one but know lots of people that do and they all like it
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: 300rum on November 09, 2008, 02:03:26 PM: If you like an 870 and want to go auto try an 11-87 or an 1100. I love the older 1100's for looks but have an 11-87 in 3.5". The 11-87 shoots and points just like an 870. It took probably 500 rounds to break in the 11-87, it had some trouble ejecting low base shells prior to 500, but i have no issues now. I have never had a failure with high base rounds, just the low base rounds until broken in. Keep the 11-87 clean, which is easy, you can clean the action in 5 minutes, and you will enjoy it if you like Remington shotguns.

I disdain mosbergs myself, I bought one when they first came out with the 3.5 12ga, 15-20 years ago :dunno: and it was junk, the receiver showed way too much wear way too quickly, within 1000 rounds. The finish and blue was terrible and I have noticed it on other mossbergs as well. In my mind there is no comparison.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: smdave on November 09, 2008, 02:07:32 PM: I like the pump because I go through way less shells when I am out hunting then when I take the SA. :)

Dave
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: 300rum on November 09, 2008, 02:09:47 PM: You may shoot less rounds but they don't die of heart attacks!
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: wadu1 on November 09, 2008, 02:27:25 PM: 270, I shoot the frorunner of the SPR 453, MP-153 Baikal when I got mine they were under $280. I have never had one go down on me, for the price you can use them to paddle when the motor goes south. I also will use a 1100 for decoying birds and I have a Tristar Viper that has not been in a blind yet. As for 870's out of 6 that I have owned I had one that worked all the time. If you are concerned about ammo cost, get it at the end of season and save it for next year. I still have a bunch I got at Wally-world for under half price.

:twocents:
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: boneaddict on November 09, 2008, 02:52:51 PM: I had an 870 and it had the smoothest action EVER. I sold it, the biggest regret ever, never sell a gun, and then bought a Browning Gold. Its a great gun but gets fouled fairly easy. Pros and cons. I like the pump as its less likely to jam. I think you lose a little power also with the auto.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: ducks55 on November 09, 2008, 06:06:51 PM: I agree on the older mossbergs being a little on the crappy side but I hust bought a new one yesterday and it seems to be built way better and for $200 you cant beat it. For a little more though an 870 would probably be a better option. The 1100 is what i had and it was an older model, it worked for years until it decided to retire this year. its really just based on what you like more than anything
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: Bofire on November 09, 2008, 06:30:06 PM: An 870 wingmaster and an express handle way different. look em over.
870 is the best pump gun built
Carl
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: Rick on November 09, 2008, 07:49:07 PM: I started bird hunting with a an 870. I used it for a long time and decided I wanted to shoot 3 1/2" shells. Sold the 870 and bought a Mossberg 835.

I HATED the 835. The ported barrel made it REALLY loud. I'd come back from hunting with ringing ears every time. I used it for about a year and sold it and bought another 870.

The 835 is even worse when you're standing next to someone shooting it. I won't even hunt with someone shooting an 835 anymore.

I think semi autos are a crutch for alot of guys. They can't shoot worth a crap,so they think throwing more lead will help them. :chuckle:
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: Gutpile on November 09, 2008, 08:10:08 PM: Quote
As for 870's out of 6 that I have owned I had one that worked all the time.
:rolleyes:

6 870`s and only one worked? Nothing would compell me to believe that. I'm calling bs. Sorry. 6???? Not one or two but 6? You just kept buying and buying until you found a good one? :liar:
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: jackelope on November 09, 2008, 08:17:04 PM: Quote
Which would you consider better and why?
the remington because it's a remington.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: Ray on November 09, 2008, 08:19:14 PM: I sold my first 870 back in 1994. Well I went and bought another one to replace it this year.

I also have a semi auto shotgun which is good. I will probably be using my 870 more than my semi auto though. The semi auto is not really that much of an advantage... It's the shooter that counts.

I couldn't think of any other shotgun than the 870 which has been used in so many different applications reliably. I'd even guess that there are more of these in circulation than any other shotgun.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: demontang on November 09, 2008, 08:29:06 PM: You cant go wrong with an 870. My personal 870 has over 1million rounds though it :yike:, and the ones at work probably have double that. The only time I have seen an 870 not work is when it was severely abused, and I'm talking thousands of round though it with out cleaning, thrown in the bed of the truck, rained on, and thrown in the mud for years, and then maybe it would have a mag extension come off, or some thing little like that. :twocents:

O and don't try and do that with a semi it will jam or not even cycle. :chuckle:
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: tlbradford on November 09, 2008, 09:27:50 PM: Don't discount an over/under. They swing and point better than most other types, are extremely reliable, allow for a fast follow-up, and are by far the easiest to clean. The only thing you give up is a third shot.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: CP on November 09, 2008, 09:43:04 PM: I like the original run of the Ithaca 37 feather light, my all time favorite. But autos have their place, both the Rem 1100 and Browning A5 have served me well. The Browning friction rings are a bit of a pain though.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: BUX-N-DUX on November 09, 2008, 09:53:36 PM: Hunted with 870 for 3 years, excellent gun, very dependable. If you are buying a pump this one is at the top of the list. Just bought Mossberg 935 semi-auto, only shot 2 boxes of shells. No complaints yet, other than the fact that i am still trying to pump it after every shot. Also have Benelli pump, used 1 season. Pretty good gun . Must be personal preference, but why choose, i like having both in the safe.
:mgun:
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: jeff100 on November 09, 2008, 11:34:06 PM: The Rem 870 is ONE OF the best pump guns ever made. I love mine. Had an 1100, loved it too but sold it to buy a Benelli. I hunt with a Benelli Montefeltro autoloader now, one of the best shotguns I own. My Rizini O/U is another favorite. Gave a Mossberg 500 to a relative, another one of the best pump guns ever made. Another favorite of mine is my Ithica 37 ultralight (bottom eject), the Ithica is another one of the best pump guns ever made. Then there's my Winchester 1300...considered one of the fastest pump guns made...and my...and....

Love em all...pumps, o/u, auto's. The only trouble with having all these shotguns is remembering what I'm shooting. Seriously. I don't know how many times I've pulled the trigger in the second shot at a bird, only to realize that day I took a pump in the field, and forgot to rack the next shot! Of the three, I shoot the auto's most because I have a bad neck, and the autos shoot softer, than the pumps or the O/U....that's also why I don't hunt with 12's anymore, aside from the fact that I don't need a 12 gage pattern anymore to take upland birds...

My 870 is the only 12 ga. I have left & it's setup as a combat shotgun. The rest of my hunting shotguns are 20's. Gonna start collecting/using 28 gauges next.....

So many shotguns, so little time.... 8)
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: Intruder on November 10, 2008, 08:20:16 AM: Quote from: Tony 270WSM on November 09, 2008, 11:21:11 AM
Was looking at the sales flyer for Cabela's and wonder what are the stregths and weaknesses of a pump vs semi-auto. I've shot a Remington 870 before and liked the feel of it. The Mossberg 835 is the same price. Which would you consider better and why?

Then theres the Remmy SPR 453 and a couple Tristar semi-autos. Why would you take a semi over a pump or the other way around?

Have shot a few pumps, but don't know the pros or cons of them and the semis. Any advice?

Of the guns you listed the 870 is likely the best quality and value. If memory serves me the SPR guns are Russian made and have had higher than average incidents of problems. The 835 is OK. I own 1 but wouldn't put it in the same class as the 870. Tri-Star are budget guns mostly made in Turkey. They are going to be similar to quality as the SPR from Rem.

As far as differences between pump and auto the biggest factors are recoil reduction, ease, and speed (cycling) of the autos. Pumps give you a lil more reliability especially in adverse conditions.

Regardless of style, manufacturer, gauge, etc., the most important thing with a shotgun is fit. Figure out your budget, take a look at the various guns that fall within it, and then go actually pick em up an shoulder em. See which one fits you best. I would dissuade you from buying low end autos and doubles if you're going to fire more than a few boxes of shells a year. For the 300-500 you'd spend on one of those you'd be far better served buying a higher end pump. From what I've witnessed (and unfortunately experienced), the money, time, and frustration spent on repairs of the budget guns usually eats up the initial savings.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: jeff100 on November 12, 2008, 12:23:50 AM: Quote
If memory serves me the SPR guns are Russian made

Yep, Rems SPR series are made by IZH in Russia. IZH has been making firearms for a couple of hundred years. I had a IZH27 O/U in 12 ga., which is the Rem SPR310 O/U. I think I paid $325.00 new at the time for my IZH27 (I bought it before Rem cut their deal). The shotgun was built like a tank, indestructible. I loved it. It shot well, the only thing I didn't like about it was it was heavy. I put a couple of thousand rounds thru mine and never had a problem. IMO it was an outstanding value for the money. I don't know if Remington has done anything to compromise the original firearm in their deal with IZH, I doubt it. Most people look down their noses at these guns, but if you can't afford a Beretta or Benelli, etc., these are great budget shotguns and you're not going to have to worry about whether or not they can take the abuse that comes from hunting, like snow/sleet/rain in a duck blind...no worries...

I know the original question was pump or auto. Personally I'd take one of these O/U over a pump any day as a hunting firearm.

Jeff
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: Intruder on November 12, 2008, 08:22:17 AM: Quote from: jeff100 on November 12, 2008, 12:23:50 AM
Quote
If memory serves me the SPR guns are Russian made

Yep, Rems SPR series are made by IZH in Russia. IZH has been making firearms for a couple of hundred years. I had a IZH27 O/U in 12 ga., which is the Rem SPR310 O/U. I think I paid $325.00 new at the time for my IZH27 (I bought it before Rem cut their deal). The shotgun was built like a tank, indestructible. I loved it. It shot well, the only thing I didn't like about it was it was heavy. I put a couple of thousand rounds thru mine and never had a problem. IMO it was an outstanding value for the money. I don't know if Remington has done anything to compromise the original firearm in their deal with IZH, I doubt it. Most people look down their noses at these guns, but if you can't afford a Beretta or Benelli, etc., these are great budget shotguns and you're not going to have to worry about whether or not they can take the abuse that comes from hunting, like snow/sleet/rain in a duck blind...no worries...
I know the original question was pump or auto. Personally I'd take one of these O/U over a pump any day as a hunting firearm.
Jeff

I will say I have no personal experience w/ either Tri-Star or the SPR guns. I know that some of the Russion stuff from Baikal (which I have shot) has a decent reputation so no doubt there are some decent low budget guns. And yes, they are build like a tank (or a cinder and mortar feces deposit dwelling :chuckle:). However, I personally know a gun dealer who has taken back several of the Rems.... I don't know if it was for a particular reason or just general problems. There is also ample evidence that both Khan and Huglu guns out of Turkey are notorious for problems. From what I'm hearing however, there have been decent improvements over the last couple years with them and I think they've also started making some higher end stuff.

That all being said, I would still advise caution when buying a budget O/U, S/S, or autos. For overall value and dependability an 870 Wingmaster will be tough to beat.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: GoldTip on November 12, 2008, 08:34:46 AM: I shoot both a Benelli SBE (original) and have an 870 wingmaster as well. Like them both, tend to gravitate more toward the Benelli, not sure exactly why, but maybe I shoot it a bit better. This past weekend took the 870 pheasant hunting, didn't shoot a thing but enjoyed packing it again. Seems to me with auto's, the more money you spend the more likely they are to work well for you on a regular basis, but with an 870 you get an essentially bullet proof gun for a very reasonable price.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: jeff100 on November 12, 2008, 01:18:30 PM: Quote
a cinder and mortar feces deposit dwelling

LMAO....thanks....I needed that....

This is probably a nit, but I never considered a 870 'Wingmaster' a budget shotgun. An 870 Express...you bet. But not a Wingmaster. MSRP on a Wingmaster is about $800.00. I always figure true retail approx 20% less MSRP. A Wingmaster isn't an expensive shotgun either, so far as shotguns go, but when most people are considering an 870, it's usually the low end Express model...
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: ABMGENERAL on November 13, 2008, 08:06:36 AM: im gonna throw my . :twocents: in here.

870 Probly the nicest on the cheap! Joes, $300 for a loaded model.

500 Mossy- Why do you think USMC uses them?? just a thought...

500 is looser but more reliable in extreme situations...

I have a 500 mossy that was a gift... its the only gun i have needed. i have killed a couple of everything with it. it doesn't have changeable chokes and doesn't take 3.5in shells... 2 reasons to leave the 500 with the shorty barrell and pistol grip and buy a nicer 870 for the field.
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: jeff100 on November 13, 2008, 08:52:57 AM: I really liked my 500 too. Shot a LOT of trap with it, hunted with it a lot too. It was my first pump gun. Gave it to my dad for 'homeland security' duty....I'll get it back one of these days...
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: steeleywhopper on November 13, 2008, 11:00:15 PM: I have had too many semi-auto's turn into single shots during the freeze up while duck hunting. I will always hunt with a pump for waterfowl and everything else for that matter. I tend to take more time and stay on the bird for the second shot. I used to miss more due to rushed shots with the auto. :twocents:
Title: Re: Shotguns... pump? Semi-auto?
Post by: jeff100 on November 14, 2008, 08:34:13 AM: Quote from: steeleywhopper on November 13, 2008, 11:00:15 PM
I have had too many semi-auto's turn into single shots during the freeze up while duck hunting. I will always hunt with a pump for waterfowl and everything else for that matter. I tend to take more time and stay on the bird for the second shot. I used to miss more due to rushed shots with the auto. :twocents:

I don't hunt waterfowl (yet), but am curious how double barrel shotguns fare in the freezing cold of a duck blind? For upland I love my doubles, they are THE FASTEST shotgun for one follow up shot. Period. For people who need more than one follow up shot, I've got two words for them, range practice.... ;)