Post by: Billy Fudd on April 26, 2014, 07:38:18 AM
Post by: billythekidrock on April 26, 2014, 07:46:42 AM
Do a search here and you will find lots of threads on it.
Post by: bobcat on April 26, 2014, 08:01:27 AM
http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/pdfs/businesses/recreationalaccess/Longview-Hotline-Message.pdf (http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/pdfs/businesses/recreationalaccess/Longview-Hotline-Message.pdf)
Post by: Billy Fudd on April 26, 2014, 08:14:48 AM
Post by: Bow tech hunter on April 26, 2014, 08:37:00 PM
Post by: teegansdad on April 29, 2014, 12:30:20 AM
Post by: Eli346 on April 29, 2014, 04:27:33 AM
Post by: fowl smacker on April 29, 2014, 04:45:14 AM
Post by: fisher67 on April 30, 2014, 06:43:35 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 30, 2014, 07:12:51 PM
Post by: vaz,,66 on May 01, 2014, 01:42:25 PM
Quote
Beginning August 1st, 2014, the St. Helens Tree Farm will start a new recreational access program.
You can go to www.WYRecreationNW.com (http://www.WYRecreationNW.com) for full details on the program starting May 19th. These
are the basics:
We will sell up to 15,000 permits online for $150. Each permit will be good for the permittee,
legally married spouse, and children and grand children 18 years old and younger. A permit is
required for motorized and non-motorized access. These permits will be valid from August
1
st, 2014 through January 31st, 2015 and are required to access the majority of the tree farm
during that time frame.
Permits will be sold online starting Monday, June 23rd
at 6:00 PM through September 30th
.
We will offer through an online bidding process, up to twelve areas for lease. The lease will
provide the lessee and lessee’s designated friends and family exclusive recreational use of the
area.
Lease bidding will start Monday, May 19th
and end Thursday, June 5th
at 6:00 PM.
We will not require a permit to access most corridors to state land and fisheries.
Some areas will still have free access as in the past.
You can return to the previous menu by pressing the “star” symbol or 0 to start over.
Post by: snowpack on May 01, 2014, 01:54:42 PM
With all the issues they are having down there they can stick it ...Keep paying to hunt diseased animals ... :dunno: I do not understand it ... Just me :chuckle:probably be different if it was antler disease.
Post by: fisher67 on May 11, 2014, 08:42:33 AM
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on May 11, 2014, 08:48:37 AM
does anyone have more details about this yet? trying to find out if its all areas and how they plan on regulating it.
QuoteBeginning August 1st, 2014, the St. Helens Tree Farm will start a new recreational access program.
You can go to www.WYRecreationNW.com (http://www.WYRecreationNW.com) for full details on the program starting May 19th. These
are the basics:
We will sell up to 15,000 permits online for $150. Each permit will be good for the permittee,
legally married spouse, and children and grand children 18 years old and younger. A permit is
required for motorized and non-motorized access. These permits will be valid from August
1
st, 2014 through January 31st, 2015 and are required to access the majority of the tree farm
during that time frame.
Permits will be sold online starting Monday, June 23rd
at 6:00 PM through September 30th
.
We will offer through an online bidding process, up to twelve areas for lease. The lease will
provide the lessee and lessee’s designated friends and family exclusive recreational use of the
area.
Lease bidding will start Monday, May 19th
and end Thursday, June 5th
at 6:00 PM.
We will not require a permit to access most corridors to state land and fisheries.
Some areas will still have free access as in the past.
You can return to the previous menu by pressing the “star” symbol or 0 to start over.
Post by: Screaminreelz on May 12, 2014, 11:07:35 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 12, 2014, 11:33:35 AM
Post by: cem3434 on May 12, 2014, 12:52:36 PM
May 19.
Leases go up for bid May 19th, but the permits don't go on sale for about another month after that if I remember correctly. Rumor has it that all of the permits are going up this year as well. :bash: I am done hunting the westside and I am starting to focus my money on other states.
Post by: Screaminreelz on May 12, 2014, 01:44:23 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 12, 2014, 02:16:33 PM
Here's a question for you. Do we get keys to the gates then if we pay to play? Doubtful I know but that would be the only thing that would make this worth it for me.
That information hasn't been released yet. They say their website will be updated May 19th. Vail and Pe Ell tree farms both issue a gate key with the access pass. The Aberdeen tree farm will not. The Vail key only opens two gates, one on the NE side and one on the SW side. Maybe St. Helens will be similar. We don't even know yet what parts of St. Helens will require a pass.
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Post by: Bullkllr on May 12, 2014, 02:44:39 PM
Here's a question for you. Do we get keys to the gates then if we pay to play? Doubtful I know but that would be the only thing that would make this worth it for me.
Kind hard to imagine they would issue 15,000 keys. How does you with a key and 14,999 other keyholders make it worth it? :dunno:
Post by: elkkillin5 on May 12, 2014, 04:23:01 PM
Post by: SI Eagle on May 12, 2014, 04:53:15 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 12, 2014, 04:55:05 PM
Are they going to allow camping on the Weyco property?
Don't know that yet either.
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Post by: fireweed on May 12, 2014, 05:20:45 PM
http://tdn.com/lifestyles/weyerhaeuser-access-fee-stirs-frustration-among-residents-hunters/article_af75826a-d704-11e3-a4a1-0019bb2963f4.html (http://tdn.com/lifestyles/weyerhaeuser-access-fee-stirs-frustration-among-residents-hunters/article_af75826a-d704-11e3-a4a1-0019bb2963f4.html)
Post by: fisher67 on May 12, 2014, 07:02:06 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 12, 2014, 08:10:43 PM
anyone know what happens if we dont buy a permit? any hunter knows we will be up the mountain before anyone monitors the gates. are they really going to check all the rigs that come down that place?
You get charged with trespassing.
Post by: HntnFsh on May 12, 2014, 08:34:37 PM
anyone know what happens if we dont buy a permit? any hunter knows we will be up the mountain before anyone monitors the gates. are they really going to check all the rigs that come down that place?
You get charged with trespassing.
Its funny that I have heard of people being charged with crminal trespass for being on Weyco property but I have never seen or heard of them going after all the local yokals that have free rein of Weyco land by hopping on their quads and following their trails out of their yards to all that land behind locked gates. Most of these places are so obvious its pathetic. Easy as pie to put a stop to it. But havent seen or heard them put any effort into it.
When they start issuing these permits will they start cracking down on those trespassers or will it be business as usual? My guess is business as usual. These places are all over the place. Cedar crk., salmon crk., Hurst rd., Tower rd., and on and on. Pretty frustrating. I hope like hell they let everybody know how they are going to handle that type of trespass in the future!
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 13, 2014, 05:49:13 AM
anyone know what happens if we dont buy a permit? any hunter knows we will be up the mountain before anyone monitors the gates. are they really going to check all the rigs that come down that place?
You get charged with trespassing.
Its funny that I have heard of people being charged with crminal trespass for being on Weyco property but I have never seen or heard of them going after all the local yokals that have free rein of Weyco land by hopping on their quads and following their trails out of their yards to all that land behind locked gates. Most of these places are so obvious its pathetic. Easy as pie to put a stop to it. But havent seen or heard them put any effort into it.
When they start issuing these permits will they start cracking down on those trespassers or will it be business as usual? My guess is business as usual. These places are all over the place. Cedar crk., salmon crk., Hurst rd., Tower rd., and on and on. Pretty frustrating. I hope like hell they let everybody know how they are going to handle that type of trespass in the future!
There was a thread not too long ago about a member being charged with trespass. :dunno: They can have their land. They're killing it and all the wildlife on it.
Post by: SI Eagle on May 13, 2014, 07:19:04 AM
Post by: Harbor_hunter on May 13, 2014, 07:37:16 AM
Are you going to need a permit if you draw a Margaret Tag?
I would think so.
Post by: ELKBURGER on May 13, 2014, 07:39:22 AM
Are you going to need a permit if you draw a Margaret Tag?I am not sure how much of the margaret belongs to wayerhauser....a bunch for sure. If you draw that tag and want to use their land then an access permit will need to be purchased. If you can get a hold of Agnew and get permission, perhaps you could hunt his land.
Post by: ELKBURGER on May 13, 2014, 07:47:18 AM
When looking at the available permits, the column just right of the hunt name is hunt notes. That letter code is explained on page 59. 'Q' refers to the need for an access permit in some private timberlands...aka wayerhauser. 'If you cant secure access in advance, do not apply for these hunts'. Thats WDFW's pre-warning and disclaimer when someone draws and complains about the 'lack of' or 'pay for' access.Are you going to need a permit if you draw a Margaret Tag?I am not sure how much of the margaret belongs to wayerhauser....a bunch for sure. If you draw that tag and want to use their land then an access permit will need to be purchased. If you can get a hold of Agnew and get permission, perhaps you could hunt his land.
Post by: bobcat on May 13, 2014, 07:51:29 AM
Are you going to need a permit if you draw a Margaret Tag?
Nobody knows the answer to that question yet.
Weyerhaeuser has said a permit will be "required to access the majority of the tree farm."
They also said "some areas will still have free access as in the past."
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Post by: fireweed on May 13, 2014, 08:05:28 AM
anyone know what happens if we dont buy a permit? any hunter knows we will be up the mountain before anyone monitors the gates. are they really going to check all the rigs that come down that place?
You get charged with trespassing.
Its funny that I have heard of people being charged with crminal trespass for being on Weyco property but I have never seen or heard of them going after all the local yokals that have free rein of Weyco land by hopping on their quads and following their trails out of their yards to all that land behind locked gates. Most of these places are so obvious its pathetic. Easy as pie to put a stop to it. But havent seen or heard them put any effort into it.
When they start issuing these permits will they start cracking down on those trespassers or will it be business as usual? My guess is business as usual. These places are all over the place. Cedar crk., salmon crk., Hurst rd., Tower rd., and on and on. Pretty frustrating. I hope like hell they let everybody know how they are going to handle that type of trespass in the future!
Pretty hard to keep people off HALF A COUNTY--especially the neighbors. I think its called civil disobedience.
Post by: Screaminreelz on May 13, 2014, 10:18:17 AM
When looking at the available permits, the column just right of the hunt name is hunt notes. That letter code is explained on page 59. 'Q' refers to the need for an access permit in some private timberlands...aka wayerhauser. 'If you cant secure access in advance, do not apply for these hunts'. Thats WDFW's pre-warning and disclaimer when someone draws and complains about the 'lack of' or 'pay for' access.Are you going to need a permit if you draw a Margaret Tag?I am not sure how much of the margaret belongs to wayerhauser....a bunch for sure. If you draw that tag and want to use their land then an access permit will need to be purchased. If you can get a hold of Agnew and get permission, perhaps you could hunt his land.
How can you secure a permit before securing a tag? Results for tags come out after permits access is available. Am I wrong?
Post by: bobcat on May 13, 2014, 10:23:03 AM
Results for the special permit drawing should be available at least one week prior to that.
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Post by: Nice Racks on May 13, 2014, 10:35:00 AM
Post by: Carnivore on May 13, 2014, 10:57:06 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 13, 2014, 11:06:44 AM
If someone were to buy a permit, does that guarantee you will not be locked out of the area during early archery for fire danger? Every year I have planned on hunting the Winston, they have shut the area down just before or just after opening. Nothing like spending $150 on a permit you can't use.
Once they shut it down, it's closed, permit or not. I don't believe they're refunding anything either.
Post by: bobcat on May 13, 2014, 11:13:03 AM
One option would be to wait until just before the season opens to buy your pass. You would just have to be sure to do it with enough time for it to get to you by mail.
They are selling the permits up to September 30th and I don't think there's any chance of them selling out.
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Post by: pianoman9701 on May 13, 2014, 11:26:06 AM
I would think they will be much more likely to leave their lands open since they will now have paying customers.
One option would be to wait until just before the season opens to buy your pass. You would just have to be sure to do it with enough time for it to get to you by mail.
They are selling the permits up to September 30th and I don't think there's any chance of them selling out.
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I'd be interested to find out how that worked in Vail and Pe Ell last year. I believe they got closed for fire danger in July and stayed closed until late September. Anyone?
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on May 13, 2014, 11:59:03 AM
Post by: Bhunter253 on May 13, 2014, 12:46:15 PM
Post by: chester on May 13, 2014, 12:48:28 PM
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Post by: pianoman9701 on May 13, 2014, 12:55:24 PM
Pe ell never closed to pass holders, they did require you carry an axe, fire extinguisher and shovel in your vehicle tho .
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Good info. Thanks! :tup:
Post by: Ingwe on May 13, 2014, 01:00:37 PM
Post by: Curly on May 13, 2014, 01:09:05 PM
regarding the companion card no they would not have buy a permit, however they aren't allowed to hunt for themselves without a permit.there's paperwork to fill out for weyco but they allow the companion. You're required during fire season to carry a shovel and fore extinguisher in you're vehicle we didn't get locked out a single day last year.
I'm surprised they would allow a companion in there without a permit. That is good that they do though. :tup:
Post by: HntnFsh on May 14, 2014, 05:38:10 AM
anyone know what happens if we dont buy a permit? any hunter knows we will be up the mountain before anyone monitors the gates. are they really going to check all the rigs that come down that place?
You get charged with trespassing.
Its funny that I have heard of people being charged with crminal trespass for being on Weyco property but I have never seen or heard of them going after all the local yokals that have free rein of Weyco land by hopping on their quads and following their trails out of their yards to all that land behind locked gates. Most of these places are so obvious its pathetic. Easy as pie to put a stop to it. But havent seen or heard them put any effort into it.
When they start issuing these permits will they start cracking down on those trespassers or will it be business as usual? My guess is business as usual. These places are all over the place. Cedar crk., salmon crk., Hurst rd., Tower rd., and on and on. Pretty frustrating. I hope like hell they let everybody know how they are going to handle that type of trespass in the future!
Pretty hard to keep people off HALF A COUNTY--especially the neighbors. I think its called civil disobedience.
Actually its pretty easy. Lots of trails right out of a persons backyard. That wouldnt take much detective work. So civil disobedience is the new word for criminal trespass huh?
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 14, 2014, 05:51:13 AM
Post by: NWHydroprint on May 14, 2014, 06:51:01 AM
Post by: bowhunterty on May 14, 2014, 08:35:56 AM
Post by: Screaminreelz on May 14, 2014, 09:49:51 AM
Is Weyco security enforcing the tresspassing or are they asking WDFW to enforce it? I'm just curious if one was to be stopped would it be Wecyo security holding you until WDFW shows up?
My understanding last year at the Vail gate they had both weyco security and game dept?
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 14, 2014, 09:54:37 AM
Post by: bobcat on May 14, 2014, 10:05:00 AM
In the thread where the guy was trespassed for recovering his elk after sunset, he was cited by a DFW gamie.
That wasn't Weyerhaeuser land, but I'd guess that WDFW will be enforcing the law if someone is found to be trespassing on Weyerhaeuser land.
Weyerhaeuser also seems to have plenty of their own security guards. I certainly would not want to risk hunting on Weyerhaeuser without the appropriate pass.
A trespassing citation has significant penalties, and I believe it may include loss of your right to hunt for a few years. :yike:
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Post by: pianoman9701 on May 14, 2014, 10:23:17 AM
Post by: BULLBLASTER on May 14, 2014, 10:37:46 AM
Yeah, our gamies should be spending their time protecting WEYCO's assets. The company does so much to benefit our state's hunters and wildlife after all. :bash::yeah: :bdid:
Post by: Screaminreelz on May 14, 2014, 11:29:15 AM
Yeah, our gamies should be spending their time protecting WEYCO's assets. The company does so much to benefit our state's hunters and wildlife after all. :bash:
HA that's funny right there!
Post by: Carnivore on May 14, 2014, 11:37:42 AM
Believe access permit holders in Pe Ell had access early archery hunt. Buddy bought the permit. Also have the late season if you got locked out of early season.Unfortunately, late season they take away the chance to shoot a branched bull. Last year is not a good measure because it was the only year in 3-4 years that the weather didn't have the whole area shut down early season....the year I went back to the East side for elk :(
This makes the choice even harder between east and west for a tag.
Post by: NWHydroprint on May 14, 2014, 12:18:21 PM
Post by: TikkaT3-270Shortmag on May 14, 2014, 12:38:06 PM
Post by: bowhuntersd on May 14, 2014, 02:27:50 PM
Post by: fireweed on May 14, 2014, 06:52:52 PM
This whole thing just pisses me off. :bash: :bash: . Weyco gets tax breaks for leaving their lands open to the public "X" amount of day a year. The only thing I can think of, is that the total $'s from the sale of permits ($2,250,00.00 just for the St. Helens tree farm) out ways the tax break they where getting for this property. :dunno:
They are hoping to keep double-dipping, tax breaks AND charge. They are playing chicken with the legislature. They figure the legislature is filled with "chickens" who won't even consider touching the sacred tax breaks.
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 14, 2014, 07:18:20 PM
Post by: fireweed on May 15, 2014, 12:16:26 PM
This will be a campaign issue for sure this November. it's still one person--one vote no matter how much cash business dumps in. Find out where the candidates stand and if they will consider putting in a bill to tie full tax breaks to free public access
Post by: bobcat on May 15, 2014, 12:29:22 PM
What it would mean is closed gates 100% of the time. The "access" would be walk in only, and that would be worse overall than having to pay a relatively small fee for drive in access anytime you want.
I do wish we could get some legislation passed that would allow the state to more easily obtain easements across private land in order to access landlocked public land.
Post by: hooker on May 15, 2014, 08:32:18 PM
One permit gets my family and grandkids access? My kids are all in their early twentys..
If I draw "say" a coweeman cow tag will I then beable to purchase a permit? I'm not interested unless we happen to draw a tag.
Thanks
H
Post by: bobcat on May 15, 2014, 08:42:45 PM
Ok,
One permit gets my family and grandkids access? My kids are all in their early twentys..
If I draw "say" a coweeman cow tag will I then beable to purchase a permit? I'm not interested unless we happen to draw a tag.
Thanks
H
Your permit would get you and your grandkids in, but not your kids since they're over 18. And to your second question, yes the St Helens access permits go up for sale after the results for the special permit hunts will become available, so you could buy the access permit if you are drawn for a Coweeman cow permit. They are offering 15,000 access permits, so I don't even think you'd have to worry about buying it right away. I don't see them selling out.
Post by: hooker on May 15, 2014, 08:50:16 PM
Thanks
Post by: bobcat on May 15, 2014, 08:52:45 PM
Post by: Ghost Hunter on May 15, 2014, 09:05:04 PM
Post by: arrowflinger on May 15, 2014, 09:28:12 PM
I will not be volunteering as a MH to help with clean-up or monitoring their woods ever again. Slap in the face. :bash:
Me neither!!
Post by: HntnFsh on May 16, 2014, 05:27:25 AM
The good news is: Margaret, Toutle, Coweeman, and Winston permits should be much easier to draw this year (if people are paying attention).
Do you think the access fees will keep enough people from applying that it will make a difference? I dont think it will. But we'll see.
Post by: Bookworm007 on May 16, 2014, 07:29:11 AM
Also they put a "Q" by mudflow...... can't you get in there from the Toutle side on state land? Regardless this really stinks, they are taking away an american past time because of a few bad apples. My camp has 6 guys in it and we will start hunting out of state before we pay Weyco any money to hunt a state resource.
Post by: bobcat on May 16, 2014, 07:33:56 AM
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Post by: pianoman9701 on May 16, 2014, 07:34:08 AM
Is this also going to effect the Lewis River unit? WDFW didn't put a "Q" by it in the regs so I am going to assume they won't be charging there? :dunno:
Also they put a "Q" by mudflow...... can't you get in there from the Toutle side on state land? Regardless this really stinks, they are taking away an american past time because of a few bad apples. My camp has 6 guys in it and we will start hunting out of state before we pay Weyco any money to hunt a state resource.
Much of Lewis River is NF. If the part you're planning to hunt is WEYCO, you'll probably need a permit. I don't think they've announced yet where the free access is.
Post by: bobcat on May 16, 2014, 07:42:15 AM
The good news is: Margaret, Toutle, Coweeman, and Winston permits should be much easier to draw this year (if people are paying attention).
Do you think the access fees will keep enough people from applying that it will make a difference? I dont think it will. But we'll see.
Yes I think so. But, that's why I said "if people are paying attention." How many people will apply for permits in those units like they always do, with no idea that if they draw, it will cost $150 to access the unit?
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 16, 2014, 07:56:30 AM
The good news is: Margaret, Toutle, Coweeman, and Winston permits should be much easier to draw this year (if people are paying attention).
Do you think the access fees will keep enough people from applying that it will make a difference? I dont think it will. But we'll see.
Yes I think so. But, that's why I said "if people are paying attention." How many people will apply for permits in those units like they always do, with no idea that if they draw, it will cost $150 to access the unit?
...if there are even permits left by the time they catch on.
Post by: bobcat on May 16, 2014, 07:57:55 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 16, 2014, 08:09:11 AM
Post by: bobcat on May 16, 2014, 08:12:23 AM
Unless... I wonder how many will be sold to non-hunters? Hadn't thought of that until now. ???
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 16, 2014, 08:15:32 AM
Post by: Nice Racks on May 16, 2014, 08:41:09 AM
Post by: fireweed on May 16, 2014, 09:06:44 AM
I've been hounding the Forest Service for a DECADE to get an easement. Now I'd have to pay a private company to get to a public trailhead.
Clearly access to (or through) these timberlands isn't all about hunting. Alienating other users doesn't help. Bringing all recreationists into the fold, and having our state reps hear from groups BESIDES hunters will help.
Post by: Big6bull on May 16, 2014, 09:13:32 AM
Post by: bobcat on May 16, 2014, 09:18:59 AM
As for draw odds, there's no doubt in my mind that drawing a Toutle or Margaret permit will be easier. Or even a Coweeman or Winston cow permit. How much public land is there in the Coweeman?
I know of several people who won't be applying for those permits this year because of the $150 access fee, and I'm one of them.
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Post by: funkster on May 16, 2014, 09:32:39 AM
If the gates are locked we have to drive 3 hours to the back end of the trails
Now I'd have to pay a private company to get to a public trailhead.
Seriously not trying to be a jacka$$ but if you really want to be heard, I wouldn't state you can gain public entry by driving to the back end to access a trail. And then state you now would have to pay a timber company for easier access. You're kinda contradicting yourself. It comes across as a personal problem instead of a everyone problem. :twocents:
Post by: fireweed on May 16, 2014, 01:22:55 PM
If the gates are locked we have to drive 3 hours to the back end of the trails
Now I'd have to pay a private company to get to a public trailhead.
Seriously not trying to be a jacka$$ but if you really want to be heard, I wouldn't state you can gain public entry by driving to the back end to access a trail. And then state you now would have to pay a timber company for easier access. You're kinda contradicting yourself. It comes across as a personal problem instead of a everyone problem. :twocents:
Like most long trails (or roads) it goes from point A to Point B. Shouldn't the public be able to get to both ends?
Post by: Bookworm007 on May 16, 2014, 07:16:52 PM
The good news is: Margaret, Toutle, Coweeman, and Winston permits should be much easier to draw this year (if people are paying attention).
Do you think the access fees will keep enough people from applying that it will make a difference? I dont think it will. But we'll see.
Yes I think so. But, that's why I said "if people are paying attention." How many people will apply for permits in those units like they always do, with no idea that if they draw, it will cost $150 to access the unit?
How many folks every year come on and say "I just drew XXXXXX tag and have never hunted there before" I think at least the first year there will be alot of folks who get a rude surprise.
Post by: BowForElk on May 17, 2014, 12:00:39 AM
I'm actually afraid of what might happen if they try to force the timber companies into allowing free access.
What it would mean is closed gates 100% of the time. The "access" would be walk in only, and that would be worse overall than having to pay a relatively small fee for drive in access anytime you want.
I do wish we could get some legislation passed that would allow the state to more easily obtain easements across private land in order to access landlocked public land.
$150.00 may seem like a relatively small fee but for some thats the difference in hunting or not. Adding that with costs of licenses, permits, etc its tough on someone thats barely making ends meet. I know the "if you can't afford it, you can't do it" but its a pretty sad day when your too broke to hunt because of pay to play costs.
Also its 150.00 now, whats it gonna be next year? or 5 years? Its absolutely ridiculous.
And as far as the state land thats up there you should be able to get to it via winston crk rd from mossy rock up north. MY guess is they are gonna have to put up a bunch more gates as to allow you to get to the state land but not anywhere else?
Seems like it could be a pretty big issue to just say F you too bad. :dunno:
and I wouldn't mind at all if they closed it all down to walk in only if it was still free. thats how early archery season always was. They wouldn't open the gates til after modern went in.
Post by: BowForElk on May 17, 2014, 12:19:44 AM
I dunno if you guys know about the governors "Blue Ribbon Task Force on Parks and Outdoor Recreation" but this might be another avenue for us to pursue.
http://www.rco.wa.gov/boards/TaskForce.shtml (http://www.rco.wa.gov/boards/TaskForce.shtml)
Also here is another link to a page where the entire state is posting things they want changed or preserved.
Engage Outdoor Washington
http://www.engageoutdoorwashington.com (http://www.engageoutdoorwashington.com)
Post by: Bullkllr on May 17, 2014, 08:35:24 AM
and I wouldn't mind at all if they closed it all down to walk in only if it was still free. thats how early archery season always was. They wouldn't open the gates til after modern went in.
In my opinion, it'll be a zoo in there during early archery, since gates will likely all be open. Not for me...
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 17, 2014, 11:04:17 AM
I wonder if "tree huggers" and groups like our friends from PETA can put a hurtin on us by buying up a large number permits.
If you don't buy one, what the tree huggers and PETA do won't affect you at all.
Post by: snowpack on May 17, 2014, 11:18:20 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 17, 2014, 11:28:37 AM
Post by: mpetersen on May 18, 2014, 10:28:14 AM
Post by: WDFW Hates ME!!! on May 18, 2014, 12:11:14 PM
Post by: Big6bull on May 18, 2014, 02:19:51 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 18, 2014, 02:31:07 PM
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Post by: CplRaines on May 18, 2014, 03:16:26 PM
the $150 access fee only gets you access, not camping. If you bid on and received one of the bid properties/leases, only then you would get camping privileges.
Post by: bobcat on May 18, 2014, 03:20:51 PM
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Post by: TheHunt on May 18, 2014, 03:53:03 PM
Should be interesting times... 15,000 people all camped on all the landings.
Post by: bobcat on May 18, 2014, 04:04:10 PM
My guess is camping won't be allowed with the high number of permits they are selling. Vail and Pe Ell are allowing camping but those access permits are much more limited. Hopefully we will find out tomorrow.
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Post by: TheHunt on May 18, 2014, 04:14:06 PM
Post by: Quarteredaway on May 18, 2014, 04:35:04 PM
and I wouldn't mind at all if they closed it all down to walk in only if it was still free. thats how early archery season always was. They wouldn't open the gates til after modern went in.
[/quote]
I will pay for the pass if they make it walk in only for all weapons... it would certainly increase the quality of game
Post by: Bullkllr on May 18, 2014, 04:38:42 PM
and I wouldn't mind at all if they closed it all down to walk in only if it was still free. thats how early archery season always was. They wouldn't open the gates til after modern went in.
I will pay for the pass if they make it walk in only for all weapons... it would certainly increase the quality of game
[/quote]
That's exactly what I was thinking. If they allow vehicle access, the whole place turns into a zoo.
Post by: CplRaines on May 18, 2014, 06:20:46 PM
http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/Businesses/RecreationalAccess/Washington (http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/Businesses/RecreationalAccess/Washington)
Read the PDF file I attached.
Post by: cem3434 on May 18, 2014, 06:21:12 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 18, 2014, 06:52:25 PM
Looks pretty straight forward to me that no camping is allowed other than the areas listed in Pe Ell. https://www.wyrecreationnw.com/StartHere/TermsConditions.aspx (https://www.wyrecreationnw.com/StartHere/TermsConditions.aspx)
That must be last year's rules. Camping is being allowed in Vail this year, and as I said, the rules for the St Helens access permit has not been made available yet.
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Post by: bobcat on May 18, 2014, 06:56:08 PM
Here's where I read the no camping.
http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/Businesses/RecreationalAccess/Washington (http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/Businesses/RecreationalAccess/Washington)
Read the PDF file I attached.
Those are the general rules for the St Helens tree farm before the access permit becomes a requirement.
Vail has always been no camping as well, but now with it being access by permit only, they are allowing camping.
So St Helens could be the same way, but we won't know until Weyerhaeuser updates their website. Which was promised to be done on May 19th.
Post by: RadSav on May 18, 2014, 07:34:47 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 18, 2014, 07:36:11 PM
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Post by: Stump on May 18, 2014, 07:56:21 PM
Post by: RadSav on May 18, 2014, 08:07:26 PM
Interesting.
I thought so! That whole extreme weather thing has me a bit irritated. Since it looked as though the pass would finally allow us in during early archery season. Now that no longer looks to be the case.
The other thing I found interesting was my passwords for the site worked perfectly last week. Now they no longer work. Looks like I have to fill out all that dang stuff again :bash:
Post by: bobcat on May 19, 2014, 12:32:34 AM
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Post by: RadSav on May 19, 2014, 05:24:51 AM
Post by: bobcat on May 19, 2014, 09:06:40 AM
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Post by: bobcat on May 19, 2014, 09:41:30 AM
If you don't know where this is, it's just north of highway 504, and west of the town of Toutle, off a road called George Taylor Road.
1,266 acres and bidding starts at $1,266. Maybe I should get ten guys to put in $126.60 each. Great elk area, lots of mature bulls. :tup:
Post by: RadSav on May 19, 2014, 10:21:54 AM
Anyone seen the lease area they're calling "700 Road?" It's in the Coweeman unit, we always got into lots of elk in there during the late muzzleloader season. Also lots of wild turkeys in there.
How long ago was that? It looks as though it has gown up a good amount in recent years. Unless you can catch an elk in the road you won't have to worry about judging distance...first pin or all pins! Same thing :chuckle: Too bad there is no late archery season in there.
Post by: bobcat on May 19, 2014, 10:33:28 AM
Post by: Curly on May 19, 2014, 10:38:13 AM
Post by: RadSav on May 19, 2014, 10:40:11 AM
It's been a few years but I'm certain that area is still full of elk. Great genetics in that area as well! It is pretty thick but a guy could put up several tree stands and do pretty well.
Probably end up priced at about $500 per tree stand...if you can find enough trees that mature! Definitely one of the better Eastern locations for those looking for their WA slam
Post by: Curly on May 19, 2014, 10:42:03 AM
Post by: headshot5 on May 19, 2014, 10:43:27 AM
Quote
1,266 acres and bidding starts at $1,266. Maybe I should get ten guys to put in $126.60 each. Great elk area, lots of mature bulls.
Quote
Sounds like you're trying to sell the lease for Weyco.
Sounds to me like he is looking for 9 guys. :chuckle:
Post by: fireweed on May 19, 2014, 10:50:14 AM
Every single Lease posted in the Longview area so far is guaranteed to have neighbor issues (aka P!$$ off the locals). They are all in semi-residential areas with farms and homes all around. 906003 there are at least two other easement holders on roads that have the right to go through there any time they want. The 700 road lease has easements through it and blocks soil conservation land. These are all bad news and destined (or designed?) to create even more hostility with the locals.
Post by: TheHunt on May 19, 2014, 11:35:03 AM
The only way this will work is if there is a large group willing to play. I would assume that a large group with Archery, Muzzlestuffers and modern would be the ticket.
Post by: RadSav on May 19, 2014, 11:44:22 AM
Post by: bobcat on May 19, 2014, 11:48:11 AM
Post by: Curly on May 19, 2014, 11:50:25 AM
Post by: RadSav on May 19, 2014, 12:01:37 PM
Might as well change the name of W WA to North Texas.........
The big difference being if N.Texas has a hoof rot issue they wouldn't wait eight years and 50% animal loss until it hit the news before trying to look into the problem. And then if a specialist from the center for disease control offered to help N. Texas would gladly except instead of trying to discredit him.
Now in Washington it's costing us ten fold to hunt herds with 50% fewer animals. Or pay the same price to hunt dumb little spikes on the east side. But at least we have an awesome point system for drawing good bull tags :rolleyes:
Post by: Curly on May 19, 2014, 12:13:31 PM
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 19, 2014, 01:13:41 PM
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on May 19, 2014, 01:25:26 PM
Might as well change the name of W WA to North Texas.........
The big difference being if N.Texas has a hoof rot issue they wouldn't wait eight years and 50% animal loss until it hit the news before trying to look into the problem. And then if a specialist from the center for disease control offered to help N. Texas would gladly except instead of trying to discredit him.
:yeah: Although 50% is being generous IMO
Now in Washington it's costing us ten fold to hunt herds with 50% fewer animals. Or pay the same price to hunt dumb little spikes on the east side. But at least we have an awesome point system for drawing good bull tags :rolleyes:
Post by: fireweed on May 20, 2014, 02:47:33 PM
Longview Daily News editorial board talks about Weyco permits.
Post by: RB on May 20, 2014, 05:17:41 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 20, 2014, 05:22:22 PM
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Post by: RGB on May 21, 2014, 08:26:03 AM
Post by: kentrek on May 21, 2014, 09:31:11 AM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.
:bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash:
Post by: bobcat on May 21, 2014, 09:35:50 AM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.
Yes I noticed that, but isn't some of that eastern portion of the Margaret unit part of the National Forest but not within the Monument boundary?
Either way, if I were to draw Margaret I would just pay the $150 and hunt Weyerhaeuser. However, I won't be drawing Margaret since I switched to an east side elk tag this year, along with hundreds of other hunters who normally hunt the west side.
Post by: kentrek on May 21, 2014, 09:50:27 AM
Post by: kentrek on May 21, 2014, 09:52:45 AM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.
Yes I noticed that, but isn't some of that eastern portion of the Margaret unit part of the National Forest but not within the Monument boundary?
An no...pretty much everything behind cold water is monument...I think all the way up to miners creek :dunno:
Post by: bobcat on May 21, 2014, 10:06:53 AM
St Helens isn't looking so bad at only $150 for 6 months of access.
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Post by: Bookworm007 on May 21, 2014, 10:43:22 AM
Wow! I just noticed one of the areas in Oregon (Mollala tree farm) costs $550 for a permit, and the permit is only good for one month!
St Helens isn't looking so bad at only $150 for 6 months of access.
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It is still a kick in the balls when that permit will cost more than buying a combo Elk, Deer Cougar, Bear license and a handful of special apps. I mean heck Weyco is making more money off us than WDFW (Maybe I shouldn't say that out loud Fish and Game might get ideas :bash: ) Also does that permit allow you to camp? Collect firewood? A Christmas Tree? I would buy the Weyco permit without blinking if I could camp in a designated area or collect a cord of firewood from fallen timber. This is the end of an era. Hunting on this side of the state will never be the same. :twocents:
Post by: bobcat on May 21, 2014, 10:50:48 AM
Vail and Pe Ell permits do allow camping.
But of course they are much more limited in number, and more expensive.
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Post by: fireweed on May 21, 2014, 11:13:56 AM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.I think (hope?) this is a typo on the WDFW's part and I have a call into the Monument manager to find out. I think it should say the portion of 524 the Monument within the administrative closure is closed to hunting--that would be a small slice above Coldwater Lake. Will post what he says.
Post by: bowhunterty on May 21, 2014, 11:26:07 AM
Post by: Bullkllr on May 21, 2014, 11:29:25 AM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.
Yes I noticed that, but isn't some of that eastern portion of the Margaret unit part of the National Forest but not within the Monument boundary?
An no...pretty much everything behind cold water is monument...I think all the way up to miners creek :dunno:
Everything from private property east is monument. If true, this is a very significant change. I checked the website (which had hunting info in the past) and it is completely blank... :dunno:
http://www.fs.usda.gov/activity/mountsthelens/recreation/hunting (http://www.fs.usda.gov/activity/mountsthelens/recreation/hunting)
I would call and verify that. The forest service always had a portion closed by Coldwater Lake. Tha last two packets I received from WDFW showed this section. If the monument is closed to hunting then so would sections of Lewis River and Packwood Units.And Winston
Post by: bowhunterty on May 21, 2014, 12:36:20 PM
Post by: jbeaumont21 on May 22, 2014, 11:10:48 AM
WDFW WILDLIFE PROGRAM
Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife
600 Capitol Way North, Olympia, WA 98501-1091
wildthing@dfw.wa.gov
Dear Hunter:
Certain timber companies in western Washington have announced plans this year to begin requiring permits and charging fees to hunt on additional private forestlands where access restrictions were not previously in place. We are notifying you to make sure you are aware of these changes.
The game management units currently affected by new access requirements are GMUs 501, 506, 520, 524, 550, 556, 648, 651, 658, 660, and 672. Your special permit application history shows that you have previously applied for a special hunting permit in one or more of these areas.
We advise you to check timber company websites or hotlines soon for more information on the new landowner requirements. The website links below are for two companies that we are aware of that have changed their access policies this year.
http://greendiamond.com/recreation/ (http://greendiamond.com/recreation/)
http://weyerhaeuser.com/Businesses/RecreationalAccess/Washington (http://weyerhaeuser.com/Businesses/RecreationalAccess/Washington)
We are providing this information to help you plan for your hunt this fall.
In recent years, we have made a concerted effort to work with private timber companies throughout the state to expand hunter access to commercial timberlands. However, while we've had some success, WDFW does not have the legal authority to regulate private landowners' decisions about restricting access or charging fees to hunt on their land.
Sincerely,
WDFW
Wildlife Program
Post by: bobcat on May 22, 2014, 11:21:12 AM
Post by: ELKBURGER on May 22, 2014, 11:30:21 AM
I put the Coweeman down as my 4th option for a cow permit and just received the below email today. I have no intentions of buying a permit from Weyco, they can go **** themselves. So does that mean if I get drawn for the Coweeman I am basically screwed?If you draw the tag and choose to hunt weyco property w/o the permit opens you up to a trespass citation. I know there is some DNR land in the coweeman which requires a Discover Pass and hunting on DNR w/o a Discover can get you a citation as well. I dont know if there is any true public access w/o some sort of pass in the cow anymore.
Post by: jbeaumont21 on May 22, 2014, 11:54:31 AM
Thanks!
Post by: bobcat on May 22, 2014, 12:07:08 PM
Post by: jbeaumont21 on May 22, 2014, 11:41:58 PM
Post by: bobcat on May 23, 2014, 12:03:29 AM
Post by: Fullabull on May 23, 2014, 06:45:46 PM
Post by: fireweed on May 25, 2014, 12:09:59 PM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.I think (hope?) this is a typo on the WDFW's part and I have a call into the Monument manager to find out. I think it should say the portion of 524 the Monument within the administrative closure is closed to hunting--that would be a small slice above Coldwater Lake. Will post what he says.
Here's what the Monument Manager, Tom Mulder said about this closure: that it is probably a typo in the regs but he will double check because he was on assignment in another state part of the year and he want's to make sure that it wasn't changed while he was gone.
Post by: Bullkllr on May 25, 2014, 12:27:29 PM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.I think (hope?) this is a typo on the WDFW's part and I have a call into the Monument manager to find out. I think it should say the portion of 524 the Monument within the administrative closure is closed to hunting--that would be a small slice above Coldwater Lake. Will post what he says.
Here's what the Monument Manager, Tom Mulder said about this closure: that it is probably a typo in the regs but he will double check because he was on assignment in another state part of the year and he want's to make sure that it wasn't changed while he was gone.
Thanks for checking (just interested, not imagining I'll be hunting in there...). So even the Monument Manager is not sure...hmmmmm....
And yet it is interesting that at the same time the (hopefully) typo in the WDFW regs came out, the official NFS St. Helens' Monument website page with hunting access information is completely blank, with no information at all. Coincidence :dunno:
Post by: furbearer365 on May 25, 2014, 04:13:58 PM
Post by: RadSav on May 25, 2014, 04:32:02 PM
This is not going to be good. I put in for Margaret archery without even looking at that. I guess if they shut the east part down it is my own fault, but drawing a Margaret archery tag and not having the state land to hunt when they shut Weyco down is basically a tag in the garbage. Seems funny that the year they shut it down is the first year of the access permits. They put out tags that are now 100% Weyco land, charge $150 to access it, then shut it down for fire? We are all just pawns that are being toyed with by timber companies and the state. We area the only ones that don't benefit what so ever. SUX >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
That December 1-15 hunt is probably the better of the two if you want to kill a nice bull. You will still be out $150, but at least the tag doesn't need to hit the garbage Sept 22nd.
Post by: furbearer365 on May 25, 2014, 09:28:10 PM
This is not going to be good. I put in for Margaret archery without even looking at that. I guess if they shut the east part down it is my own fault, but drawing a Margaret archery tag and not having the state land to hunt when they shut Weyco down is basically a tag in the garbage. Seems funny that the year they shut it down is the first year of the access permits. They put out tags that are now 100% Weyco land, charge $150 to access it, then shut it down for fire? We are all just pawns that are being toyed with by timber companies and the state. We area the only ones that don't benefit what so ever. SUX >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
That December 1-15 hunt is probably the better of the two if you want to kill a nice bull. You will still be out $150, but at least the tag doesn't need to hit the garbage Sept 22nd.
For sure, i apologize to sound so extreme about it being a waste if early season is shut down. I didn't mean to be that extreme. What I was implying is the sole reason for putting in for the archery tag was to hunt the rut during bugling season. If I knew that land would be shut down for sure and state land wouldn't be an option, I would of just put in for ML or Rifle and hunted those seasons. But like I said, my fault for not reading up on every tag I put in for. I just never in a million years would of thought that the public land would be the one that would be a problem getting on. I kind of assumed that area was the only guarantee, but NOPE...
Post by: bobcat on May 25, 2014, 11:30:07 PM
Post by: Bullkllr on May 26, 2014, 07:28:21 AM
Post by: furbearer365 on May 26, 2014, 12:20:46 PM
I think he meant federal (Nat'l forest/monument) rather than "state".
:yeah: I usually just refer to public land as state land. I do know the difference between State, Federal, BLM ect... Just habit I guess. Probably should of referred to it as public as opposed to state. Either way, I still hope it was just a typo that it will be shut down..
Post by: fireweed on May 27, 2014, 08:45:40 AM
Anyone else notice that if you were planning to apply for a Margaret tag and hunt the east (non Weyerhauser) side of the unit, that the USFS took that option away from us this year. Hunt note "I" states that the USFS will not allow hunting on the portion of GMU 524 that is within the monument boundries. This was not in last years regs.I think (hope?) this is a typo on the WDFW's part and I have a call into the Monument manager to find out. I think it should say the portion of 524 the Monument within the administrative closure is closed to hunting--that would be a small slice above Coldwater Lake. Will post what he says.
Here's what the Monument Manager, Tom Mulder said about this closure: that it is probably a typo in the regs but he will double check because he was on assignment in another state part of the year and he want's to make sure that it wasn't changed while he was gone.
CONFIRMED: Hunting pamphlet is INCORRECT.
The hunters’ pamphlet is incorrect. The only area of the Margaret unit inside the Monument where hunting is not allowed is the south-facing slope along the north side of Coldwater Lake, where no off-trail hiking is permitted. This is the same restriction that has been in place for years, so there is no change in hunting restrictions from previous years.
Mitch Wainwright
South Zone Wildlife Biologist
Mt. Adams R.D.
Mt. St. Helens R.D.
42218 NE Yale Bridge Rd.
Amboy, WA 98601
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on May 27, 2014, 09:01:54 AM
If not, could be a potential headache for someone otherwise until or if it got straightened out.
Post by: fireweed on May 27, 2014, 09:10:40 AM
Are they going to notify WDFW so they can add it to the list of corrections for this years book?Yes, USFS is following up with WDFW>
If not, could be a potential headache for someone otherwise until or if it got straightened out.
Post by: RB on May 27, 2014, 09:40:03 PM
Post by: RadSav on May 27, 2014, 10:00:51 PM
I missed the part about the leases how long are the leases going to be good for? If a group leases one of the areas will they be guaranteed to keep it as long as they pay the same price year after year or will each area go up for re-bid every year?
We've lost 50% of the elk herd in the past three years, spraying continues and we have another 440 cow tags offered between Winston, Toutle and Margaret in 2014 plus early and late archery season. So there probably won't be any elk left, if there is even a season, there next year :( But to answer your question I do not know for sure. The way I read the information online it sounds as though it will go up for auction each year.
Post by: bobcat on May 27, 2014, 10:06:24 PM
Post by: RadSav on May 27, 2014, 10:29:23 PM
They will want to put each lease back up for bids every year so they can get the highest possible price. Of course if there are no elk left, the price will most likely go down. Hmm... Maybe they'd be better off doing the leases for three years, or five, that way they can get people locked in to a lease with nothing but sick elk, or no elk at all.
Could be a good thing if they raise enough money on the leases. Might make them think twice about spraying every creature on earth with poison.
Sorry, I had to laugh when I was typing that one too :chuckle: In my best Judy Tenuta voice, "Yeah, that could happen!"
Post by: fireweed on May 28, 2014, 11:35:29 AM