Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 08:26:51 AM
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PROPOSAL FOR SPRING SEASON PERMIT BLACK BEAR HUNTS UTILIZING BAIT STATIONS
OVERVIEW
The purpose of this proposal is to establish guidelines allowing spring, damage control special permit black bear hunters to establish and utilize bait stations to aid in the taking of bear in areas determined to be causing sufficient damage to warrant a special hunt draw and spring season.
WHO CAN BAIT?
Only those hunters who have successfully drawn a WDFW special permit for one of the established spring black bear damage permit hunts may purchase a Bait Station Permit, to place, maintain and hunt over a bait station for spring black bear.
Hunters must have passed a WDFW approved Hunter’s Safety course or qualify for the Hunter’s Safety Course exception by having been born before January 1, 1972, and have all proper licenses, permits and transport tags to hunt black bear in the State of Washington prior to establishing a bait station.
BAIT STATION GUIDELINES
Bait stations may be established no earlier than 15 days before opening day of the respective season.
Hunters may not attach any device, barrel, box or other container holding bait material to any tree (standing dead, down falls & stumps excluded), in a way that damages or may cause damage during mounting, use or removal.
Bait containers must be attached or secured in such a manner that they are easily removable at the close of the permit hunter’s season or conclusion of hunt, no permanent bait or feeding stations are permitted.
Bait containers may be a single metal or plastic barrel not larger than 55 gallon sized, wooden box, or made from natural materials found on site. No tires are allowed.
At the conclusion of the permit holder’s hunt or no later than five (5) days after the close of the respective season, the area must be returned to as close to natural as possible by removing all bait containers, non-consumed bait material, and any material used to conceal the hunter’s observation location (stand material, blind, etc.).
BAIT MATERIALS
Bait may consist of any natural or commercially processed meats, vegetables, fruits or grains (wastage and unlawful use of game animals, birds and fish laws apply). Bait may not contain any metal, plastic, paper, Styrofoam, glass or any other substance which may harm or injure an animal feeding from the bait station.
If commercial processed substances such as breads, doughnuts, cakes, or other pastry items are used, the commercial wrappers must be completely removed from each product before being placed in the bait container or the area around it.
Natural or processed honey, molasses, jams, jellies or similar substances may be used as an additive or attractant in or around a bait station.
Restaurant or other cooking oils or grease may not be used at a bait station.
BAIT STATION PERMITS
Only successful spring bear permit hunters may purchase a WDFW Bait Station Permit.
For each bait station that a hunter wishes to establish, he/she must have a separate WDFW Bait Station Permit, and the permit number must be attached to each bait station so to be visible to WDFW or other authorized person upon physical inspection of the site.
WDFW Bait Station permits are available for purchase from the Olympia Headquarters only. Only successful, special permit draw spring black bear hunters are eligible and may purchase Bait Station Permits.
Bait Station Permits are $10.00 each and are valid fifteen (15) days before the opening day of the special permit season and expire five (5) days after the end of the respective spring permit hunt end date.
Bait stations in place, whether active or not, 16 or more days prior to the established opening date of a spring bear special permit hunt or after the expiration date on the Bait Station Permit shall be considered to be in violation of the prohibition of baiting bears as defined in Washington R.C.W. 77.15.245.
Hunting over a bait station without a valid, spring bear special hunt permit and a valid Bait Station Permit in the hunter’s name, shall be considered to be in violation of the prohibition of baiting bears as defined in Washington R.C.W. 77.15.245.
PLACEMENT OF BAIT STATION
Bait stations cannot be placed closer than 50 yards from any natural body of water or natural running stream, creek or river.
Bait stations must be at least 100 yards from any traveled road, public or private, regardless of surface or use, or established hiking, horseback riding, bicycle or other off road vehicle use trail.
Bait stations may not be placed within 500 yards of any dwelling, regardless of whether it is a private residence or commercial building.
Bait stations illegally placed on private property, may be removed by the property owner and the permit holder’s Bait Station Permit may revoked by WDFW.
Post by: Jingles on August 14, 2014, 08:45:29 AM
Post by: Dhoey07 on August 14, 2014, 08:49:54 AM
I realize this is a good first step to opening spring bear hunting to all statewide however I have problems with it being restricted to those that draw and purchase the special permits. Just getting a little tired of all the special Permits for those that have mega bucks......
Spring bear special permits do not bring in mega bucks, in fact they are the most sensible permit to put in for because you don't have to purchase anything after you get drawn. With saying that, it would be nice if it was an open season and no draw required :twocents:
Post by: D-Rock425 on August 14, 2014, 08:50:43 AM
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 09:05:47 AM
I realize this is a good first step to opening spring bear hunting to all statewide however I have problems with it being restricted to those that draw and purchase the special permits. Just getting a little tired of all the special Permits for those that have mega bucks......
Spring bear special permits do not bring in mega bucks, in fact they are the most sensible permit to put in for because you don't have to purchase anything after you get drawn. With saying that, it would be nice if it was an open season and no draw required :twocents:
Jingles, I am not sure where you are getting the idea this is a mega bucks permit? It isn't like the sheep or moose tags/permits, it is the same, cost wise, as applying for an antlerless deer or elk special permit.
It would be an awesome management tool I just don't think wdfw will let it pass.
I agree, it is a long shot, but then again, if enough people actively show and voice support for it, who knows??
Post by: superdown on August 14, 2014, 09:11:30 AM
Quote
Restaurant or other cooking oils or grease may not be used at a bait station.What would be the reason for not using this? :dunno:
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 09:21:56 AM
QuoteRestaurant or other cooking oils or grease may not be used at a bait station.What would be the reason for not using this? :dunno:
Just thinking about the landowner and any possible objections they may have as to what may be placed on their property and have minimal impact for them, while still being a strong attractant to bear. Just like the no damage to live trees part and removal at end of hunt/season.
Thanks for asking, hope that makes sense.
Post by: h20hunter on August 14, 2014, 09:26:10 AM
Post by: lokidog on August 14, 2014, 09:27:04 AM
QuoteRestaurant or other cooking oils or grease may not be used at a bait station.What would be the reason for not using this? :dunno:
If cooking oils reach surface water they can still have negative impacts on insect populations and other environmental impacts whereas a donut is pretty harmless.... They also stick around a lot longer and could be considered to be "baiting" a location long after the season.
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 09:30:29 AM
I think it is very well written, clear and understandable.
Thank you!
Post by: trophyhunt on August 14, 2014, 09:47:43 AM
I think it is very well written, clear and understandable.:yeah: hope they consider it at wdfw!
Post by: bearpaw on August 14, 2014, 10:18:32 AM
I don't see any legal way the Wildlife Commission can approve a baited spring bear hunting season for sporting purposes. The only way bear baiting permits might work, I believe there is an exemption for agents of the state to bait or use hounds, therefore this should be written as a public safety bear removal permit or timber damage bear removal permit and only issued in areas where timber damage or nuisance bear are being reported by landowners.
I strongly support baiting and hounds, but any solution will have to comply with state law to even be considered.
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 10:51:44 AM
That is why I chose the spring damage permit hunts, since they are supposedly intended to mitigate damage to trees.
Post by: headshot5 on August 14, 2014, 11:12:30 AM
Quote
Baiting is prohibited by state law due to Initiative 655 that was passed by WA voters in 1996. Only another Initiative or legislative action can change that.
I don't see any legal way the Wildlife Commission can approve a baited spring bear hunting season for sporting purposes. The only way bear baiting permits might work, I believe there is an exemption for agents of the state to bait or use hounds, therefore this should be written as a public safety bear removal permit or timber damage bear removal permit and only issued in areas where timber damage or nuisance bear are being reported by landowners.
I strongly support baiting and hounds, but any solution will have to comply with state law to even be considered.
Did anything come from the ruling in Jefferson County a few years ago where it was ruled that I-655 violated the Washington State Constitution. I believe it violated Section 19 of the WSC. I hadn't heard they appealed that case or what happened.
Post by: bearpaw on August 14, 2014, 11:21:00 AM
That is what I had in mind, similar to the changes they made with the pilot program to use hounds to hunt cougar.
That is why I chose the spring damage permit hunts, since they are supposedly intended to mitigate damage to trees.
I quickly glanced at your post and missed your "Overview". :tup:
I hope H-W members will send messages of support for this proposal.
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 03:18:35 PM
That is what I had in mind, similar to the changes they made with the pilot program to use hounds to hunt cougar.
That is why I chose the spring damage permit hunts, since they are supposedly intended to mitigate damage to trees.
I quickly glanced at your post and missed your "Overview". :tup:
I hope H-W members will send messages of support for this proposal.
Thank you!!
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on August 14, 2014, 03:36:26 PM
Baiting is prohibited by state law due to Initiative 655 that was passed by WA voters in 1996. Only another Initiative or legislative action can change that.
I don't see any legal way the Wildlife Commission can approve a baited spring bear hunting season for sporting purposes. The only way bear baiting permits might work, I believe there is an exemption for agents of the state to bait or use hounds, therefore this should be written as a public safety bear removal permit or timber damage bear removal permit and only issued in areas where timber damage or nuisance bear are being reported by landowners.
I strongly support baiting and hounds, but any solution will have to comply with state law to even be considered.
So they already issue bait permits for timber land. I believe phelps had a video where brushchimp and his father killed a few nice bears on bait on timber land. As much as I support the above I would have to say your first post was probably right. Seems they already have a way around it for timber land tree damage. Need to get a bill put together so the average joe can do it.
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 04:28:48 PM
Post by: bear hunter on August 14, 2014, 05:48:11 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 14, 2014, 06:13:06 PM
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on August 14, 2014, 07:56:51 PM
Links to those??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3xQ1pSQ-54&list=UU1ESDfeuLYNQR1X3bLCWlZA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3xQ1pSQ-54&list=UU1ESDfeuLYNQR1X3bLCWlZA)
Post by: billythekidrock on August 14, 2014, 08:03:40 PM
Baiting is prohibited by state law due to Initiative 655 that was passed by WA voters in 1996. Only another Initiative or legislative action can change that.
I don't see any legal way the Wildlife Commission can approve a baited spring bear hunting season for sporting purposes. The only way bear baiting permits might work, I believe there is an exemption for agents of the state to bait or use hounds, therefore this should be written as a public safety bear removal permit or timber damage bear removal permit and only issued in areas where timber damage or nuisance bear are being reported by landowners.
I strongly support baiting and hounds, but any solution will have to comply with state law to even be considered.
I am pretty sure this exemption is what allowed them to give baiting permits to Master Hunters.
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on August 14, 2014, 08:45:40 PM
Links to those??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3xQ1pSQ-54&list=UU1ESDfeuLYNQR1X3bLCWlZA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3xQ1pSQ-54&list=UU1ESDfeuLYNQR1X3bLCWlZA)
Thank you! :tup:
Post by: csaaphill on August 17, 2014, 08:23:31 PM
Baiting is prohibited by state law due to Initiative 655 that was passed by WA voters in 1996. Only another Initiative or legislative action can change that.:yeah:
I don't see any legal way the Wildlife Commission can approve a baited spring bear hunting season for sporting purposes. The only way bear baiting permits might work, I believe there is an exemption for agents of the state to bait or use hounds, therefore this should be written as a public safety bear removal permit or timber damage bear removal permit and only issued in areas where timber damage or nuisance bear are being reported by landowners.
I strongly support baiting and hounds, but any solution will have to comply with state law to even be considered.
seems to me then we need to have something on petition then to undo that initiave, but nothign so far has ever been introduced I wonder why?
1996 to now is a pretty long time
Post by: bigtex on August 17, 2014, 08:48:30 PM
Baiting is prohibited by state law due to Initiative 655 that was passed by WA voters in 1996. Only another Initiative or legislative action can change that.
I don't see any legal way the Wildlife Commission can approve a baited spring bear hunting season for sporting purposes. The only way bear baiting permits might work, I believe there is an exemption for agents of the state to bait or use hounds, therefore this should be written as a public safety bear removal permit or timber damage bear removal permit and only issued in areas where timber damage or nuisance bear are being reported by landowners.
Bearpaw is correct. The only entity that can open bear baiting for the "common joe" is the legislature or another initiative, WDFW can't do it on their own.
Post by: floatinghat on August 18, 2014, 03:16:44 PM
Again, more people in the field to help local economies buying gas, food, etc. Maybe I am all wet as I don't hunt bear but seams simple enough.
Post by: fireweed on August 18, 2014, 05:17:48 PM
After seeing what went down this spring they need to definitely get someone who can guide them to proper management .. If the timber companies want to low the population in certain areas then there is only 2 ways to do it ..One is allow hound hunting and two is to place bait stations and let the hunters bait their on station .. In one area I know where they had spring bear tags and only filled a couple they went ahead and opened a few gates so bear hunters could get in and hunt .. I know of 5 bear killed so far in August and that's about all they killed in the spring hunt :dunno: something is bugging them to open up the gates they have :yike:
Timber companies that charge fees or lock out legal bear hunters should absolutely NOT be granted special bear damage permits, or spring bear seasons designed to reduce bear damage to timber. They should only get these special tags/seasons if they have their land open free of charge to legal bear hunters. The state is not acting the interest of the sportsmen or wildife if they just give out damage permits to companies that don't let hunters in to do the job for free.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 18, 2014, 05:26:51 PM
Why not increase the number of permits in these areas? It would increase revenue for the state and remove a greater number of bears. My guess is they have some understanding of the number of animals that need to be harvested. Combined with historical success percentages should provide for a reasonable estimate for the number of permits?they did in my area but still did not kill any bear :dunno: well ..they killed a couple but near as they thought they would !
Again, more people in the field to help local economies buying gas, food, etc. Maybe I am all wet as I don't hunt bear but seams simple enough.
One more thing ..We all talk about helping out the economy and supporting local businesses ..BUT THEY COULD CARELESS .. The only people that are supposed to make money is the state ...Plain and simple ..take this from a business owner :dunno: :chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 18, 2014, 05:29:11 PM
I do not think baiting applies to private timber companies :dunno: they give out hound permits :dunno:Baiting is prohibited by state law due to Initiative 655 that was passed by WA voters in 1996. Only another Initiative or legislative action can change that.
I don't see any legal way the Wildlife Commission can approve a baited spring bear hunting season for sporting purposes. The only way bear baiting permits might work, I believe there is an exemption for agents of the state to bait or use hounds, therefore this should be written as a public safety bear removal permit or timber damage bear removal permit and only issued in areas where timber damage or nuisance bear are being reported by landowners.
I strongly support baiting and hounds, but any solution will have to comply with state law to even be considered.
I am pretty sure this exemption is what allowed them to give baiting permits to Master Hunters.
Post by: floatinghat on August 18, 2014, 06:03:31 PM
After seeing what went down this spring they need to definitely get someone who can guide them to proper management .. If the timber companies want to low the population in certain areas then there is only 2 ways to do it ..One is allow hound hunting and two is to place bait stations and let the hunters bait their on station .. In one area I know where they had spring bear tags and only filled a couple they went ahead and opened a few gates so bear hunters could get in and hunt .. I know of 5 bear killed so far in August and that's about all they killed in the spring hunt :dunno: something is bugging them to open up the gates they have :yike:
Timber companies that charge fees or lock out legal bear hunters should absolutely NOT be granted special bear damage permits, or spring bear seasons designed to reduce bear damage to timber. They should only get these special tags/seasons if they have their land open free of charge to legal bear hunters. The state is not acting the interest of the sportsmen or wildife if they just give out damage permits to companies that don't let hunters in to do the job for free.
Don't know about all the areas but I think some of the permits are 8/1-12/31 so they would be open to spring bear.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 18, 2014, 06:21:20 PM