Post by: cjjcb on October 21, 2014, 02:44:50 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on October 21, 2014, 02:47:20 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on October 21, 2014, 03:01:07 PM
Post by: 92xj on October 21, 2014, 03:17:19 PM
Post by: carlyoungs on October 21, 2014, 03:25:44 PM
Post by: runamuk on October 21, 2014, 03:32:16 PM
Post by: boneaddict on October 21, 2014, 03:33:56 PM
Post by: quadrafire on October 21, 2014, 03:34:19 PM
Post by: runamuk on October 21, 2014, 03:42:59 PM
I've witnessed them do it in the spring, but not now.what I have been told about those spring hazings is its to do bull counts except they start doing them as the antler drop has begun so is kinda ineffective :dunno:
Post by: Gringo31 on October 21, 2014, 03:43:33 PM
Helicopter hazing
Post by: Landowner on October 21, 2014, 11:06:51 PM
Post by: kevinlisa06 on October 21, 2014, 11:28:58 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: huntnnw on October 21, 2014, 11:30:20 PM
Post by: Buzz2401 on October 22, 2014, 06:22:16 AM
Post by: billythekidrock on October 22, 2014, 06:29:34 AM
Post by: rtspring on October 22, 2014, 06:42:17 AM
Probably 25 years ago..
One of the elk that was shot jumped the fence into Hanford and my buddy jumped the fence and went after the elk! Don't ever do that!! Trust me he had a bad day within minutes. He got his bull after about four hours of testing and the security force helping him put it down for good..
Post by: BAR C3 on October 22, 2014, 06:48:22 AM
The Spokane rez does this in the huck unitWhere did you hear that? Did you see it?
I can say I've witnessed it on the Olympic National Park by rangers and the game department. Not with helicopters and planes though. They shoot in air and honk to scare them back in park. Wrote an editorial about it in Peninsula Daily News in the 90's on it. As well as reported it to ONP head Ranger and they denied it. Made sure to mention that in editorial. :tup:
Post by: nw_bowhunter on October 22, 2014, 07:40:45 AM
I heard they use hellicoppters in the colockum to scatter the elk? :dunno:
I have seen this several times during early archery up by the reserve fence line. no doubt in mind what they were doing.
Post by: Sitka_Blacktail on October 22, 2014, 09:09:49 AM
Here is the early explanation by Fish and game I found online.......
"On Alaska’s Afognak Island in the October 1986, approximately 45 elk plunged over a 300-foot sheer cliff, landed in a chute and tumbled or slid to the beach. Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADFG) Wildlife Biologist, Larry VanDeele, examined the tangled mass of dead elk at the bottom of the cliff, and told the Roundup, "The best we can tell, it was hunter related." The report states the elk were seen on the cliff on about the day of the fall, there were numerous hunters in the area, some who put a "pincer" movement on the elk which culminated near the cliff when a barrage of two dozen or more shots were fired. The report concludes, "Without an actual eye-witness to the event, it cannot be positively stated that the accident did not occur earlier or in different circumstances than those described." VanDeele explains, "The only real predators on the island are humans. There are Kodiak brown bears there, but they’re not actively aggressive like grizzly bears. There are no wolves or coyotes on the island."
And here's a second report that mentions a possible airplane.
http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1986/Biologists-Try-To-Explain-Elk-Herd-s-Mysterious-Fall/id-6be1489da386636d7e8ca75598ce3707 (http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1986/Biologists-Try-To-Explain-Elk-Herd-s-Mysterious-Fall/id-6be1489da386636d7e8ca75598ce3707)
Post by: cjjcb on October 22, 2014, 09:37:59 AM
All I know is that they don't do that in the rimrock unit
Hey Buzz2401, How can you be so sure?
I'm surprised with all the responses. Makes me think it's possible or at least they use to...
Post by: PolarBear on October 22, 2014, 09:39:35 AM
Post by: D-Rock425 on October 22, 2014, 09:52:52 AM
Post by: Bob33 on October 22, 2014, 10:01:21 AM
Without additional information, anything more about intent is speculation.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on October 22, 2014, 10:11:49 AM
We have seen them at Matheny chasing elk into the park the day before archery season and again for modern rifle. Have also seen it at St Helens off the 99 road chasing them back into the park.I've seen them do that in Matheny too. Flying low along Sams River/Queets/Matheny Creek--a small plane and a helo. There were also guys with mopeds riding behind the gates to get down to the creeks. You would see the guys on the motorcycles after the helicopter passed. They had white ford rangers with fed gov plates that they put the motorcyles in the back of. Said they were out counting fish.
Post by: emac on October 22, 2014, 10:45:05 AM
Post by: motg9_6 on October 22, 2014, 12:06:27 PM
Post by: bigtex on October 22, 2014, 12:13:57 PM
A helicopter flies over elk herd, and the elk scatter. Those are observable facts.:yeah:
Without additional information, anything more about intent is speculation.
I've been hearing the helicopter story forever, and it's always a "black helicopter" oooh scary :rolleyes:
Truth is, anybody from your anti-hunting neighbor to PETA can go up in a helicopter and do whatever they want. And as Bob said, a helicopter flies over an elk herd and the elk scatter and everyone jumps to the conclusion it's WDFW?
Tell me this, do you think the only time helicopters scatter elk is during hunting season? Or is it ok to do it in July, but if it's November it's suddenly WDFW?
I've seen timber companies spray pesticides from planes and helicopters over clearcuts and later in the day it got reported that it was WDFW scaring the elk.
Who wants some cool-aid?
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on October 22, 2014, 12:17:19 PM
probably PETA. :chuckle:
Actually, that is not too far outside the realm of possibility.
One way to find out is to use the Freedom of Information Act. If it is a government agency that is doing this, there was an expenditure of public funds at some, if not all levels. Be it the lease or rental of aircraft, or the flight time & fuel of a department owned aircraft, it is all public money, and all open to disclosure if requested.
Making a request requires that the agency respond to the request and if they fail, there are actions that can be taken against them.
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on October 22, 2014, 12:20:19 PM
Who wants some cool-aid?
Can mine be grape please?????
:brew:
Post by: Elkrunner on October 22, 2014, 02:08:53 PM
Post by: Special T on October 22, 2014, 02:21:45 PM
probably PETA. :chuckle:
Actually, that is not too far outside the realm of possibility.
One way to find out is to use the Freedom of Information Act. If it is a government agency that is doing this, there was an expenditure of public funds at some, if not all levels. Be it the lease or rental of aircraft, or the flight time & fuel of a department owned aircraft, it is all public money, and all open to disclosure if requested.
Making a request requires that the agency respond to the request and if they fail, there are actions that can be taken against them.
FOIA must be very specific in order to get a responce and cost $50 or something like that...
It is highly likely that it is some one other than the WDFW.
About 10 years ago Peta got in thier inflatable zodiak and ran around the skagit river delta to protect the ducks from hunters by scaring them away. Unfortunatly for these mental midgets they went out on a calm day and drove through all the resting birds in the slews and refudge. Hunters were gift wrapped with early limits on an otherwise slow day of hunting.
It is my oppinion that whitnessed nefarious actions are likely the result of some bunny hugger operation, OR a private individual hazing animals for some reason.
Post by: woodswalker on October 22, 2014, 02:22:46 PM
I've asked WDFW local biologists and enforcement about this issue in the past. They get downright offended by any suggestion they have scattered herds before the modern season.
These are the same bios who are PROUD of making sure hunters dont get a crack at the migrating mulies in the Methow....
Post by: Goldy79 on October 22, 2014, 02:38:51 PM
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on October 22, 2014, 02:59:24 PM
probably PETA. :chuckle:
Actually, that is not too far outside the realm of possibility.
One way to find out is to use the Freedom of Information Act. If it is a government agency that is doing this, there was an expenditure of public funds at some, if not all levels. Be it the lease or rental of aircraft, or the flight time & fuel of a department owned aircraft, it is all public money, and all open to disclosure if requested.
Making a request requires that the agency respond to the request and if they fail, there are actions that can be taken against them.
FOIA must be very specific in order to get a responce and cost $50 or something like that...
It is highly likely that it is some one other than the WDFW.
About 10 years ago Peta got in thier inflatable zodiak and ran around the skagit river delta to protect the ducks from hunters by scaring them away. Unfortunatly for these mental midgets they went out on a calm day and drove through all the resting birds in the slews and refudge. Hunters were gift wrapped with early limits on an otherwise slow day of hunting.
It is my oppinion that whitnessed nefarious actions are likely the result of some bunny hugger operation, OR a private individual hazing animals for some reason.
That is not exactly correct.
Yes , it helps with specific dates, times, people, location, etc. but regardless, all FOIA requests MUST be responded to, in I believe 5 days or so. If not, there are very real monetary penalties that you can get from them for failing to respond.
It may take a little foot work, but for example, a request for any air flights by or for WDFW for example on such & such dates in whatever county, GMU, etc will be a solid starting point.
As for costs, I have not done this for a few years, but the request for the information and their response does not cost any more than a stamp and envelope to mail the request...now, if you want copies of their response, be it one page or 100, then yes, there usually a per page charge.
However, I believe you can request to come in and view the documents for free if you are willing to put in the time, then only pay for any copies you want, if any at all.
Post by: Band on October 23, 2014, 08:54:45 AM
I've asked WDFW local biologists and enforcement about this issue in the past. They get downright offended by any suggestion they have scattered herds before the modern season.I'll go toe to toe with any WDFW employee who claims they haven't done this. Years ago when I hunted the Bethel unit for modern firearm elk (before it went spike only) they spent a significant amount of time chasing the herd from huntable land to the off limits feeding station land the day before the opener. The snow was piling up and elk were all over the place. After the helicopter work they were scarce opening day. I believe the stories that many of you apparently do not believe because I've seen it first hand.
Post by: Jonathan_S on October 23, 2014, 09:11:06 AM
However, some guy tried telling me they do this in the NE :chuckle: yeah because they have to break up those enormous herds that are so easy to find.