Post by: bigtex on January 28, 2015, 10:19:31 AM
Out of the current law the revenue that gets diverted to the state general fund is $39.76. Under the bill the state portion would be $173.76. This means $133.60 of each ticket for this offense would go to State Parks.
There are an average of 541 citations for this offense written every year in WA. If all of those offenders paid their ticket under the proposed bill State Parks would get around $72,000. However, only about 63% of those cited paid their fines which means Parks would get about $45,000. These figures also do not include reduced penalties ordered by judges.
Littering over a cubic foot of litter is a crime, however many county prosecutors don't prosecute criminal littering offenses and tell LEOs to just cite for this offense.
The bill is sponsored by Representatives Pike, Moeller, Fitzgibbon, Bergquist, Gregerson, Ormsby, Ryu, and Tharinger
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?year=2015&bill=1160 (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?year=2015&bill=1160)
Post by: trophyhunt on January 28, 2015, 10:24:28 AM
Post by: bearpaw on January 28, 2015, 12:20:54 PM
Post by: bigtex on January 28, 2015, 12:31:11 PM
100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
Post by: bearpaw on January 28, 2015, 01:21:28 PM
100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
Perhaps the language of this bill should be modified so that the level of offense is lower to make it easier for prosecutors but the fine is much higher for more than 1 cubic foot?
Post by: Skinnyguts on January 28, 2015, 05:46:16 PM
I say just lill em. Anyone who breaks any law whatsoever for any reason just get shot on site, right now. Leavr it up to the cop to just shoot whoever he wants. That way no one will be left to break laws. Then the "good guys" can get on with being productive in life rather than spending thier lives trying to figure out how to take more from people who earned it.
I am sure you have broken some petty law that hardly anybody even knows about, lets start with you.
Post by: CementFinisher on January 28, 2015, 06:06:00 PM
Post by: bigtex on January 28, 2015, 06:16:21 PM
is this the littering while hunting thing or does it apply to everyone?Everyone. It's the current law.
Post by: Gopher on January 28, 2015, 06:59:01 PM
Post by: CementFinisher on January 28, 2015, 08:25:09 PM
Post by: bigtex on January 28, 2015, 08:32:49 PM
Here's the current law (RCW 70.93.060)Perhaps the language of this bill should be modified so that the level of offense is lower to make it easier for prosecutors but the fine is much higher for more than 1 cubic foot?100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
-Littering under a cubic foot $103 citation (under this bill it would be $410)
-Littering over a cubic foot, but less than a cubic yard is a misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering over a cubic yard is a gross misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering items that are potentially dangerous is a $1,025 citation
My idea/proposal would raise the penalty for the under a cubic foot offense, as well as decriminalizing the 1 cubic foot-yard offense. By decriminalizing this offense it would make the offense a ticket which means the prosecutor doesn't get involved. I propose making this offense a $1,025 citation similar to littering items that are potentially dangerous.
If we start to decriminalize some of these important but lesser offenses it makes it easier for officers to actually handle them. In my view, if it is basically unheard of for someone to get jail time for an offense, then the offense shouldn't be a crime but rather an infraction (ticket). I highly doubt someone will go to jail for littering under a cubic yard (or at all), fishing without a license, using a rake on a huckleberry bush, and the list goes on. But as of right now these are all criminal offenses which require prosecutor support. If you decriminalize those offenses it makes officers actually able to write tickets for them, as well as decrease the amount of backlog of cases in the prosecutors office. You can even decriminalize them and institute a minimum fine, such as this bill does with littering under a cubic foot.
Post by: SemperFidelis97 on January 28, 2015, 08:54:49 PM
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 29, 2015, 07:42:51 AM
Post by: Gopher on January 29, 2015, 07:25:26 PM
Post by: bowbuild on January 29, 2015, 10:09:52 PM
Here's the current law (RCW 70.93.060)Perhaps the language of this bill should be modified so that the level of offense is lower to make it easier for prosecutors but the fine is much higher for more than 1 cubic foot?100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
-Littering under a cubic foot $103 citation (under this bill it would be $410)
-Littering over a cubic foot, but less than a cubic yard is a misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering over a cubic yard is a gross misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering items that are potentially dangerous is a $1,025 citation
My idea/proposal would raise the penalty for the under a cubic foot offense, as well as decriminalizing the 1 cubic foot-yard offense. By decriminalizing this offense it would make the offense a ticket which means the prosecutor doesn't get involved. I propose making this offense a $1,025 citation similar to littering items that are potentially dangerous.
If we start to decriminalize some of these important but lesser offenses it makes it easier for officers to actually handle them. In my view, if it is basically unheard of for someone to get jail time for an offense, then the offense shouldn't be a crime but rather an infraction (ticket). I highly doubt someone will go to jail for littering under a cubic yard (or at all), fishing without a license, using a rake on a huckleberry bush, and the list goes on. But as of right now these are all criminal offenses which require prosecutor support. If you decriminalize those offenses it makes officers actually able to write tickets for them, as well as decrease the amount of backlog of cases in the prosecutors office. You can even decriminalize them and institute a minimum fine, such as this bill does with littering under a cubic foot.
Can you define litter for us? Is grass clippings litter?? Would a gum wrapper your 5 yr. old throws out a car window fit your $1025 fine? If you shoot a deer and can't retrieve it because the landowner won't let you, could you be charged with littering? Just because he/she doesn't let you retrieve it, doesn't mean they wanted it there. Let's not forget we may have a lead ball or arrow on his/her land as well. Just curious. :dunno:
Post by: bigtex on January 29, 2015, 10:31:00 PM
Under state law "Litter" means all waste material including but not limited to disposable packages or containers thrown or deposited as herein prohibited and solid waste that is illegally dumped, but not including the wastes of the primary processes of mining, logging, sawmilling, farming, or manufacturing.Can you define litter for us? Is grass clippings litter?? Would a gum wrapper your 5 yrs. old throws out a car window fit your $1025 fine? If you shoot a deer and can't retrieve it because the landowner won't let you, could you be charged with littering?Here's the current law (RCW 70.93.060)Perhaps the language of this bill should be modified so that the level of offense is lower to make it easier for prosecutors but the fine is much higher for more than 1 cubic foot?100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
-Littering under a cubic foot $103 citation (under this bill it would be $410)
-Littering over a cubic foot, but less than a cubic yard is a misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering over a cubic yard is a gross misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering items that are potentially dangerous is a $1,025 citation
My idea/proposal would raise the penalty for the under a cubic foot offense, as well as decriminalizing the 1 cubic foot-yard offense. By decriminalizing this offense it would make the offense a ticket which means the prosecutor doesn't get involved. I propose making this offense a $1,025 citation similar to littering items that are potentially dangerous.
If we start to decriminalize some of these important but lesser offenses it makes it easier for officers to actually handle them. In my view, if it is basically unheard of for someone to get jail time for an offense, then the offense shouldn't be a crime but rather an infraction (ticket). I highly doubt someone will go to jail for littering under a cubic yard (or at all), fishing without a license, using a rake on a huckleberry bush, and the list goes on. But as of right now these are all criminal offenses which require prosecutor support. If you decriminalize those offenses it makes officers actually able to write tickets for them, as well as decrease the amount of backlog of cases in the prosecutors office. You can even decriminalize them and institute a minimum fine, such as this bill does with littering under a cubic foot.
"Potentially dangerous litter" means litter that is likely to injure a person or cause damage to a vehicle or other property. Examples are glass, lit cigarettes, diapers, etc.
For your examples:
-Grass clippings is litter.
-A gum wrapper is under a cubic foot so the fine under current state law is $103. If this bill passes it would be $410.
-In order for someone to charged/convicted of littering you actually have to place/deposit the item(s). So if you shoot a deer and the landowner won't let you retrieve it then obviously you are not illegally placing the deer there. Now if you have a deer carcass in the back of the truck and dump it off at the local DNR gate then yes you are littering.
Post by: bigtex on January 29, 2015, 10:35:08 PM
So, what happens if I guy doesn't pay that infraction? Send it to a collection agency? No consequence like if he doesn't pay a traffic ticket and they suspend his driver's license. Ignore a criminal ticket and you get a warrant issued for your ass.Unfortunately when it comes to non-traffic infractions there's not really consequences for not paying the ticket. Technically you can be charged with the crime of not paying the ticket, but prosecutors are so busy handling the "real crimes" they don't have the resources to go after the guy who didn't pay his littering ticket. For fish and wildlife infractions if you fail to pay the infraction it is considered a conviction in terms of having your fishing/hunting license privileges suspended.
Post by: Special T on January 29, 2015, 11:06:57 PM
Raising this fine reminds me of how the state raised the tobacco sin tax and pissed it all away.
Post by: bowbuild on January 30, 2015, 09:18:30 AM
Under state law "Litter" means all waste material including but not limited to disposable packages or containers thrown or deposited as herein prohibited and solid waste that is illegally dumped, but not including the wastes of the primary processes of mining, logging, sawmilling, farming, or manufacturing.Can you define litter for us? Is grass clippings litter?? Would a gum wrapper your 5 yrs. old throws out a car window fit your $1025 fine? If you shoot a deer and can't retrieve it because the landowner won't let you, could you be charged with littering?Here's the current law (RCW 70.93.060)Perhaps the language of this bill should be modified so that the level of offense is lower to make it easier for prosecutors but the fine is much higher for more than 1 cubic foot?100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
-Littering under a cubic foot $103 citation (under this bill it would be $410)
-Littering over a cubic foot, but less than a cubic yard is a misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering over a cubic yard is a gross misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering items that are potentially dangerous is a $1,025 citation
My idea/proposal would raise the penalty for the under a cubic foot offense, as well as decriminalizing the 1 cubic foot-yard offense. By decriminalizing this offense it would make the offense a ticket which means the prosecutor doesn't get involved. I propose making this offense a $1,025 citation similar to littering items that are potentially dangerous.
If we start to decriminalize some of these important but lesser offenses it makes it easier for officers to actually handle them. In my view, if it is basically unheard of for someone to get jail time for an offense, then the offense shouldn't be a crime but rather an infraction (ticket). I highly doubt someone will go to jail for littering under a cubic yard (or at all), fishing without a license, using a rake on a huckleberry bush, and the list goes on. But as of right now these are all criminal offenses which require prosecutor support. If you decriminalize those offenses it makes officers actually able to write tickets for them, as well as decrease the amount of backlog of cases in the prosecutors office. You can even decriminalize them and institute a minimum fine, such as this bill does with littering under a cubic foot.
"Potentially dangerous litter" means litter that is likely to injure a person or cause damage to a vehicle or other property. Examples are glass, lit cigarettes, diapers, etc.
For your examples:
-Grass clippings is litter.
-A gum wrapper is under a cubic foot so the fine under current state law is $103. If this bill passes it would be $410.
-In order for someone to charged/convicted of littering you actually have to place/deposit the item(s). So if you shoot a deer and the landowner won't let you retrieve it then obviously you are not illegally placing the deer there. Now if you have a deer carcass in the back of the truck and dump it off at the local DNR gate then yes you are littering.
Well for as much as a lot of these guys try to come across as model citizens, I would venture to say a lot of them have dumped brush or lawn clippings. I doubt they have in mind serious fines like you would like for lawn clippings, or a singular piece of paper. Most all of us don't like dumpers of trash on forest lands, or purposely throughing trash out the window. Your $1025 fine may sit well with you, but is just a revenue booster that can be used for accidental situations, and some officers would care less. >:(
Post by: Gopher on January 30, 2015, 06:30:23 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 30, 2015, 06:36:06 PM
Tell that to the guy who just had his house burned down because of some knothead tossed his lit cigarette out the window and it caught the whole place on fire. Or to the kid who stepped on a broken bottle on the bottom of the lake or stream after somebody pitched it from their float tube. I would think that once you are on the receiving end of that $1025 ticket you'll use your ashtray from then on.....I think the cigarette example is addressed differently. (more harshly than typical litter)
Post by: bigtex on January 30, 2015, 08:31:09 PM
You do realize the $1,025 I said I would like to see is for litter between a cubic foot and a cubic yard. Right now you that offense is up to a $1,000 criminal fine and 90 days in jail for that offense. I said make it a $1,025 ticket. Your idea of littering a piece of paper =$1,025 is incorrect.Well for as much as a lot of these guys try to come across as model citizens, I would venture to say a lot of them have dumped brush or lawn clippings. I doubt they have in mind serious fines like you would like for lawn clippings, or a singular piece of paper. Most all of us don't like dumpers of trash on forest lands, or purposely throughing trash out the window. Your $1025 fine may sit well with you, but is just a revenue booster that can be used for accidental situations, and some officers would care less. >:(Under state law "Litter" means all waste material including but not limited to disposable packages or containers thrown or deposited as herein prohibited and solid waste that is illegally dumped, but not including the wastes of the primary processes of mining, logging, sawmilling, farming, or manufacturing.Can you define litter for us? Is grass clippings litter?? Would a gum wrapper your 5 yrs. old throws out a car window fit your $1025 fine? If you shoot a deer and can't retrieve it because the landowner won't let you, could you be charged with littering?Here's the current law (RCW 70.93.060)Perhaps the language of this bill should be modified so that the level of offense is lower to make it easier for prosecutors but the fine is much higher for more than 1 cubic foot?100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
-Littering under a cubic foot $103 citation (under this bill it would be $410)
-Littering over a cubic foot, but less than a cubic yard is a misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering over a cubic yard is a gross misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering items that are potentially dangerous is a $1,025 citation
My idea/proposal would raise the penalty for the under a cubic foot offense, as well as decriminalizing the 1 cubic foot-yard offense. By decriminalizing this offense it would make the offense a ticket which means the prosecutor doesn't get involved. I propose making this offense a $1,025 citation similar to littering items that are potentially dangerous.
If we start to decriminalize some of these important but lesser offenses it makes it easier for officers to actually handle them. In my view, if it is basically unheard of for someone to get jail time for an offense, then the offense shouldn't be a crime but rather an infraction (ticket). I highly doubt someone will go to jail for littering under a cubic yard (or at all), fishing without a license, using a rake on a huckleberry bush, and the list goes on. But as of right now these are all criminal offenses which require prosecutor support. If you decriminalize those offenses it makes officers actually able to write tickets for them, as well as decrease the amount of backlog of cases in the prosecutors office. You can even decriminalize them and institute a minimum fine, such as this bill does with littering under a cubic foot.
"Potentially dangerous litter" means litter that is likely to injure a person or cause damage to a vehicle or other property. Examples are glass, lit cigarettes, diapers, etc.
For your examples:
-Grass clippings is litter.
-A gum wrapper is under a cubic foot so the fine under current state law is $103. If this bill passes it would be $410.
-In order for someone to charged/convicted of littering you actually have to place/deposit the item(s). So if you shoot a deer and the landowner won't let you retrieve it then obviously you are not illegally placing the deer there. Now if you have a deer carcass in the back of the truck and dump it off at the local DNR gate then yes you are littering.
Post by: ICEMAN on January 30, 2015, 11:14:20 PM
Actually, in Icemanland, violators would have their vehicles confiscated, sold at auction and the fine taken out of the sale price of the vehicle; remainder of sale price of vehicle returned to the owner after 6 months.
Post by: stevemiller on January 31, 2015, 12:12:40 AM
RESTART THE CHAIN GANGS
Post by: bigtex on January 31, 2015, 08:56:54 AM
How does it work, only one ticket can be written per trash pile? Can't write two tickets for 2 cubic feet?Yes only one ticket per trash pile. Your example of getting pulled over for speeding and then the officer finding other violations doesn't match up with the littering example.
I know multiple tickets can be written. I won't mention the name of a guy I worked with a few years back because it might embarrass him, but Richard had just settled in here from Brooklyn. He had an attitude. One day he showed up late and beet red. I swear the vein on his forehead was about to rupture. He explained how he got pulled over for speeding in a residential zone, couldn't convince the officer-- hand gestures, anything to speed things up, the officer took his time walked around the car and found a bunch of extras to ticket, bill was over $600.
Seems more than one ticket can be written.
One trash pile is a single violation. But if you get pulled over for speeding, but aren't wearing a seatbelt, no insurance, and expired registration would be the potential of 4 violations.
Post by: bowbuild on January 31, 2015, 10:44:14 AM
You do realize the $1,025 I said I would like to see is for litter between a cubic foot and a cubic yard. Right now you that offense is up to a $1,000 criminal fine and 90 days in jail for that offense. I said make it a $1,025 ticket. Your idea of littering a piece of paper =$1,025 is incorrect.Well for as much as a lot of these guys try to come across as model citizens, I would venture to say a lot of them have dumped brush or lawn clippings. I doubt they have in mind serious fines like you would like for lawn clippings, or a singular piece of paper. Most all of us don't like dumpers of trash on forest lands, or purposely throughing trash out the window. Your $1025 fine may sit well with you, but is just a revenue booster that can be used for accidental situations, and some officers would care less. >:(Under state law "Litter" means all waste material including but not limited to disposable packages or containers thrown or deposited as herein prohibited and solid waste that is illegally dumped, but not including the wastes of the primary processes of mining, logging, sawmilling, farming, or manufacturing.Can you define litter for us? Is grass clippings litter?? Would a gum wrapper your 5 yrs. old throws out a car window fit your $1025 fine? If you shoot a deer and can't retrieve it because the landowner won't let you, could you be charged with littering?Here's the current law (RCW 70.93.060)Perhaps the language of this bill should be modified so that the level of offense is lower to make it easier for prosecutors but the fine is much higher for more than 1 cubic foot?100% in favor, Washington is the most littered state in the northwest, no excuse for it. LEO should emphasize writing tickets for littering.:yeah:
And prosecutors should actually prosecute those who litter in an amount of criminal statutes. It's not right that someone can go out and dump their entire bed of their pickup which under state law is a gross misdemeanor, but only be given the ticket for under a cubic foot of litter simply because the county prosecutor doesn't want to spend the $ on criminal littering cases.
-Littering under a cubic foot $103 citation (under this bill it would be $410)
-Littering over a cubic foot, but less than a cubic yard is a misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering over a cubic yard is a gross misdemeanor which means the prosecutor must be involved
-Littering items that are potentially dangerous is a $1,025 citation
My idea/proposal would raise the penalty for the under a cubic foot offense, as well as decriminalizing the 1 cubic foot-yard offense. By decriminalizing this offense it would make the offense a ticket which means the prosecutor doesn't get involved. I propose making this offense a $1,025 citation similar to littering items that are potentially dangerous.
If we start to decriminalize some of these important but lesser offenses it makes it easier for officers to actually handle them. In my view, if it is basically unheard of for someone to get jail time for an offense, then the offense shouldn't be a crime but rather an infraction (ticket). I highly doubt someone will go to jail for littering under a cubic yard (or at all), fishing without a license, using a rake on a huckleberry bush, and the list goes on. But as of right now these are all criminal offenses which require prosecutor support. If you decriminalize those offenses it makes officers actually able to write tickets for them, as well as decrease the amount of backlog of cases in the prosecutors office. You can even decriminalize them and institute a minimum fine, such as this bill does with littering under a cubic foot.
"Potentially dangerous litter" means litter that is likely to injure a person or cause damage to a vehicle or other property. Examples are glass, lit cigarettes, diapers, etc.
For your examples:
-Grass clippings is litter.
-A gum wrapper is under a cubic foot so the fine under current state law is $103. If this bill passes it would be $410.
-In order for someone to charged/convicted of littering you actually have to place/deposit the item(s). So if you shoot a deer and the landowner won't let you retrieve it then obviously you are not illegally placing the deer there. Now if you have a deer carcass in the back of the truck and dump it off at the local DNR gate then yes you are littering.
No I didn't...when you said "as well" you did not give a amount, so I thought you were combining both as one.
Post by: floatinghat on February 02, 2015, 08:44:29 AM
How would the volume be measured? Would a large balloon inflated that got away from a kid at a park be considered greater than a cubic foot? Don't get me wrong I think litter laws need to be enforced however, I think of the court time the could be tied up and wonder if it is worth the change to current penalties?
Post by: bigtex on February 02, 2015, 09:47:56 AM
How would the volume be measured? Would a large balloon inflated that got away from a kid at a park be considered greater than a cubic foot? Don't get me wrong I think litter laws need to be enforced however, I think of the court time the could be tied up and wonder if it is worth the change to current penalties?The measurements are already in law and have been in law for decades. The measurements are exactly that, under a cubic foot = class 3 infraction, 1 cubic foot to 1 cubic yard= misdemeanor, over a cubic yard = gross misdemeanor.
Post by: bigtex on February 09, 2015, 04:15:42 PM