Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Elk Hunting => Topic started by: LeviD1 on April 23, 2015, 09:03:05 PM

Title: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 23, 2015, 09:03:05 PM: So I have been hunting elk for about 6 years now archery. The last 2 years more intently and taking almost the entire season off. Where I hunt in NE Washington there is a lot of area and seemingly few elk. I practice my calling pretty much all year. Every year we get answers within 150 yards and usually each year get within 40 yards but it is soooo thick that there isn't much shot opportunity past 20 yards. I know its hard to give much advice based on this information, but I guess it just seems like I should have been able to connect by now. I know elk hunting is very hard. It just seems like from reading posts of people getting an elk every year or every other year that I must be doing something wrong. We try and use the wind to the best of our advantage. Any advice I would really appreciate. There are quite a few wolves in the general area also so that does not help. I am excited for the season dates to be later because where I hunt it always seems to really turn on for us after the 10th so I am hoping to finally be able to get my first elk. I am just confused on what I need to do better I guess.

Thank you,
Levi
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: Big6bull on April 23, 2015, 09:14:15 PM: I think I was in your shoes not long ago. Your getting close to the "breakthrough" . You need more of those close encounters to learn what and how to react especially in tight thick quarters where shot opertunities are few and hard to come by. Maybe reach out to other units with a little better numbers but other than that stick to it and don't give up go further... :twocents:
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 23, 2015, 09:44:22 PM: I just dont know any other archery hunters. My dad is who hunts with me currently but he doesn't archery hunt himself because his shoulder is shot. I have a buddy who is showing interest in starting to want to archery hunt since he moved cda so I'm hoping he starts so I can call for him in some more elk dense woods.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: 3dvapor on April 23, 2015, 09:53:29 PM: I have been in your shoes dont give up. Best advice is find an area with good bull to cow ratios possibly in idaho. This will lead to multiple encounters sometimes in the same day. I rely heavily on calling and will practice constantly before the season with the notion i never sound good enough. My hunting partner and i hunt as a team with the rule it isnt your turn to shoot until the other person shoots even if it takes all season. I honestly dont even carry my bow. Ill use his if he shoots and bulls are still active. This makes both of us trying our hardest for the other. Also i cant stress how aggressive you need to get on bulls in heavily hunted areas before they will commit to coming in. Keep at it!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: CAMPMEAT on April 23, 2015, 09:54:19 PM: Have pops get behind you about 100 yards and have him bugle. That might get the elk to come to your lap.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: RadSav on April 23, 2015, 09:55:56 PM: Thick brush elk calling can be tough. It can be even tougher if you are the caller and the shooter. Pressured elk don't stick around if they respond and do not see, smell or hear more than just a bugle. Often times in these situations the bull will not be comfortable getting close without visual or noise verification that there is an elk there. I have been on a few of these where everything changes if the caller starts walking away breaking branches and kicking rocks amidst soft calls and other social behaviors. As if the caller had become intimidated by the new challenger and was pushing his cows away.

On the coast we would often carry a fishing reel used to move vine maples between the bull and the caller. Seemed if a bull came to the spot he expect there to be elk and there was nothing that was the most startling. But show him they are moving away, or that they are not waiting in ambush would make the bull more offensive and brazen.

Third thing that has worked for us in the past was to let the bull back off. When he does he has established that the point where he last stood as a safety zone. Have the shooter move up to shooting range of that last stand and then have the caller start up again. Quite often the bull will return to that exact same spot to once again survey the situation. Only this time the shooter has a clear view and easy shot.

Nothing in elk hunting works every time. There are usually more failures than successes. The one thing most real good elk hunters have in common is they put themselves in a position to get more opportunities to fail. And then when the odds finally do fall in their favor they don't miss. I know great elk hunters whose success ratio is about one out of every three set ups. I also know some great elk hunters whose success ratio is about one in every ten or twelve set ups. One works harder than the other each year, but they both succeed. Just keep pushing forward until you find out where your success ratio ends up.

I took a friend out opening day back in the late 80's. It was a hot August start and the elk were timid and unresponsive. But we somehow managed to mess up a set in the morning and then another in the afternoon. I noticed with each failure he got more excited, smiling and giggling just a little more. I asked him why he was so darn happy about missing and he told me, "My success ratio is 1 in 4. I only need to mess up one more and I Will Be King!" He was "King" before noon the next day :chuckle: Sometimes it's all about attitude!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: buglebrush on April 23, 2015, 09:57:32 PM: The NE is tough. Nasty terrain, and just not a lot of elk. Don't give up. There is plenty of guys who strike out around here.

Have you invested in some of elkNuts stuff? If I tag out early I may even be able to take you a day. Stay in touch come September.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: Firedogg on April 23, 2015, 10:01:46 PM: As that bull moves in you really need to move to a postion that you have cover in but also gives you lanes to shhot through. It makes no sense to work a bull in if you have a wall between the two of you.

I would also consider going to a different area with higher numbers of bulls. Where you are at might be close and cinvenient, but if the elk numbers are not that great your success rate will be pretty low.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: zike on April 23, 2015, 10:42:47 PM: Quote from: Firedogg on April 23, 2015, 10:01:46 PM

I would also consider going to a different area with higher numbers of bulls. Where you are at might be close and cinvenient, but if the elk numbers are not that great your success rate will be pretty low.

Like Idaho!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: buglebrush on April 23, 2015, 11:20:50 PM: Quote from: zike on April 23, 2015, 10:42:47 PM
Quote from: Firedogg on April 23, 2015, 10:01:46 PM

I would also consider going to a different area with higher numbers of bulls. Where you are at might be close and cinvenient, but if the elk numbers are not that great your success rate will be pretty low.

Like Idaho!

I would consider Montana if I was looking out of state.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: 4fletch on April 24, 2015, 12:58:57 AM: Learning to call will give you a great advantage in harvesting. Get some dvd s learn how to call ASAP then ASAP get out a start cow calling. When you get a answer mimic the cows n calves. Many times I have called herds in so if they sound like they are coming in ( calls getting closer) back off so you do t get busted. No need to let them know that humans are wanting to eat them. They get smart real quick. PM sent
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: Jonathan_S on April 24, 2015, 06:19:11 AM: Take some of this advice with a grain of salt :chuckle: if you're on elk in the NE you are doing it right.

If you do everything right you still have a pretty low chance of killing elk in the North East. It's unlike anywhere else in the state for elk hunting. In my experience
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: rtspring on April 24, 2015, 06:35:50 AM: Just never give up! I got 28 years of doing it! Its not easy.

#1 piece of advice I can give is, elk season is short, so use those long months in between to practice, get in shape, and spend time in your hunting area. Elk dont vanish, but they dang sure hide very well..

Best of luck..
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: steelnducks on April 24, 2015, 06:55:37 AM: Just keep doing what your doing. Make sure to research all your elk sounds don't just learn how to make them learn what they are saying. Close encounters eventually turn in to blood trails and meat on your back. Good luck and keep it up.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 24, 2015, 06:56:40 AM: Thank you for all the replies. I appreciate it. Im glad to read that other people think NE WA is hard to hunt. I spend a lot of time in the area I hunt and have multiple bulls on cams all summer long and always think I know where they are going to be. Usually in a general area sort of. There's so much area up there that they will be somewhere one morning and the next just vanish it seems like. I gues I just wish it was like in the videos you watch where you have 4-5 different bulls bugling all in the same area, not just hoping there's 1 on a ridge haha
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 24, 2015, 06:59:00 AM: Quote from: steelnducks on April 24, 2015, 06:55:37 AM
Just keep doing what your doing. Make sure to research all your elk sounds don't just learn how to make them learn what they are saying. Close encounters eventually turn in to blood trails and meat on your back. Good luck and keep it up.

That is one thing I'm really working on this year. Whats sucks is usually my dad is the one calling and he doesnt care much for trying to learn it all....
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: trophyhunt on April 24, 2015, 07:30:10 AM: Doing it on your own, the calling, and shooting sequence is tough but rewarding. The one thing I've had to learn the more I archery hunt with friends is, you really are more successful and it's much easier with a partner. Your partner needs to be as good as you are to maximize your groups success. You are doing the right thing to get better already, putting boots on the ground and getting out there and trying! Keep at it and try to find a good partner with the same passion and willingness to learn everything you can on elk. I've always been a lone hunter in my past with rifle and muzzy, it's a hard transition to allow a partner to hunt where I hunt. I guess I'm selfish with my elk hunting, but I need to get past that if I want my elk hunting partner and I to be successful as possible with archery. Good luck, and where your hunting sounds tough, but who knows, you could end up sticking a pig up there!!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: huntnnw on April 24, 2015, 07:31:08 AM: Exactly if your on elk around here your doing something right. I run into your same issues around here and it's just part of it. Keep at it the more encounters sooner or later you will get one in a open window. Some guys wait for wide open shots around here and you will eat a lot of tags. My last 3 bulls were shot in very tight windows that many would not take. If I hadn't shot I woulda ate my tags those years
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 24, 2015, 08:47:43 AM: Quote from: buglebrush on April 23, 2015, 09:57:32 PM
The NE is tough. Nasty terrain, and just not a lot of elk. Don't give up. There is plenty of guys who strike out around here.

Have you invested in some of elkNuts stuff? If I tag out early I may even be able to take you a day. Stay in touch come September.

I have not bought any elkNuts stuff. Unsure what stuff it is. I am transitioning this year to diaphrams calls and getting better as I practice cause I feel thats where I'm going to get my most realistic sounds. I have bought quite a few of Phelps calls so far.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: funkster on April 24, 2015, 08:49:04 AM: LeviD1, congrats on even finding the elk, you're doing something right! If I can lend any advice, it's to focus on the small things. Number 1 thing for successful elk hunting is to always have the wind in your favor. It's sounds like you're also having the same problem most elk hunters have when calling, the inevitable 40-50 yard hang up. As you know, being the caller and shooter isn't going to be very productive in thick brush. You're going to have to have someone fall back 50 yards and do the calling. Elk have built in GPS that can pin point a call to with in feet. I feel if you have you're wind right and drop back a caller, you will connect soon! Stay at, you're close man!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: coachcw on April 24, 2015, 08:57:34 AM: daylight to dark , remember what doesn't work , always use the wind .
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: kentrek on April 24, 2015, 09:03:50 AM: People are saying getting your caller behind you 50-100 yards....that might work but in my experience in the thick stuff I usually get less hang ups when the caller is just out of sight from the bull..so that could mean 5-30 yards from the shooter...don't be afraid to call just off to the side of the shooter..you gotta be able to see your shooter ! Figure out a way to communicate so you can really move in on a bull..don't waste time

Also bulls like to circle you when displaying so set up accordingly....either have the shooter account for the wind or the up hill advantage...try to approach the bull at his level

Don't let him think you have the advantage

Just my thoughts
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: buglebrush on April 24, 2015, 09:11:54 AM: Quote from: LeviD1 on April 24, 2015, 08:47:43 AM
Quote from: buglebrush on April 23, 2015, 09:57:32 PM
The NE is tough. Nasty terrain, and just not a lot of elk. Don't give up. There is plenty of guys who strike out around here.

Have you invested in some of elkNuts stuff? If I tag out early I may even be able to take you a day. Stay in touch come September.

I have not bought any elkNuts stuff. Unsure what stuff it is. I am transitioning this year to diaphrams calls and getting better as I practice cause I feel thats where I'm going to get my most realistic sounds. I have bought quite a few of Phelps calls so far.
www.elknut.com
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: funkster on April 24, 2015, 10:34:31 AM: Quote from: kentrek on April 24, 2015, 09:03:50 AM
Also bulls like to circle you when displaying so set up accordingly....either have the shooter account for the wind or the up hill advantage...try to approach the bull at his level

This is very good advice!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: trophyhunt on April 24, 2015, 10:59:28 AM: Quote from: funkster on April 24, 2015, 10:34:31 AM
Quote from: kentrek on April 24, 2015, 09:03:50 AM
Also bulls like to circle you when displaying so set up accordingly....either have the shooter account for the wind or the up hill advantage...try to approach the bull at his level

This is very good advice!
It is! We had a muzzy tag one year and I had seen a 370+ cascade elk in the area before our hunt. On the day of the hunt we went to the area and had a bull circle us twice! It was just thick enough to never see the bull but I bet it was the big smart one, he wouldn't bugle but just make strange bull sounds. He would start to bugle but just stop after the low beginning sound. Never did kill him, after the second time he circled us, he was gone.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on April 24, 2015, 11:22:56 AM: All good advice above. I'd like to add that after over 30 years of hunting elk, I came across an innovative piece of gear last year that I'll always have with me on future archery elk hunts. I hunt a bit in the early WA season but spend the last two weeks in either N Idaho or N MT, both are alder choked nighmares but hold an elk or three. I found out last September just how well this little decoy works when in tight to elk. It may be something worth considering for your upcoming hunt in your NE area.

http://www.poisonarrowgear.com/
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: dscubame on April 24, 2015, 11:37:50 AM: Quote from: Phantom16 on April 24, 2015, 11:22:56 AM
All good advice above. I'd like to add that after over 30 years of hunting elk, I came across an innovative piece of gear last year that I'll always have with me on future archery elk hunts. I hunt a bit in the early WA season but spend the last two weeks in either N Idaho or N MT, both are alder choked nighmares but hold an elk or three. I found out last September just how well this little decoy works when in tight to elk. It may be something worth considering for your upcoming hunt in your NE area.

http://www.poisonarrowgear.com/

Good advice.
The reason the bull would "circle" is because he is trying to get eyes on what he is interested in (the calling). So using a decoy like this will allow him to get eyes on and stop the circling so less chance you will get winded.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: coachcw on April 24, 2015, 05:25:45 PM: a side hill approach can be quiet productive. :tup:
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on April 24, 2015, 05:42:17 PM: Quote from: coachcw on April 24, 2015, 05:25:45 PM
a side hill approach can be quiet productive. :tup:

Yes sir, and a nice play on words... quite slippery of you coach.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: coachcw on April 24, 2015, 08:42:04 PM: 8) I like the caller far enough behind shooter to be able to move unseen to pull bull past shooter . Should be able to see shooter though.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: SNIPER10 on April 24, 2015, 10:52:35 PM: You may find some value in visiting my website, ironmindhunting.com. I run classes that will significantly shorten your learning time on calling in bulls and having control of your shot at the moment of truth. If nothing else, at least listen to my podcasts on sharpsticks.tv. Those that can learn through the mistakes of others are vastly more effective than those that can only learn through trial and error. Life is too short to not know this stuff!!!!

Joel Turner
2x RMEF PRO DIVISION WORLD ELK CALLING CHAMPION
IRONMIND HUNTING
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: Elknut1 on April 27, 2015, 06:37:26 AM: Levi, you mention you commonly have elk respond to you at 150 yards or so, what sounds are you using for contact, bugles, cow calling? Once in to the 40 yard realm, what sounds are you now using where they are hanging up in the 40 yard range? I believe this is where the issue is. We hunt extremely thick cover as well & may be able to shed some light on the matter. Thanks.

ElkNut1
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 27, 2015, 09:57:46 AM: I will use locate bugles to find one a lot of times on a whole different ridge so we make our way obe there when we get a response. Once we close the distance a bit within a few hundred yards locate again and try and get within 150-100. Let out some cow calls and see if he responds to those at all if not then let out a shorter bugle with grunts. If he responds again try and get within 100 yards for sure and bugle and thrash a tree and grunt. We have had bulls run in at us doing this. Most the time hang up but sometimes run in and I have had one within 20 ft just came out on the other side of thick trees so I couldn't see him at all.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: kentrek on April 27, 2015, 10:29:55 AM: Sounds like your having a pretty fun time on the woods !

While I know elk nut is going to respond with some awesome info il pitch a couple of my thoughrs

While you have a great routine for your tacklebox..your basically "waiting" to come across a bull with an attitude that matches your routine...while there's nothing wrong with this and killing elk that are that aggravated is freaking awesome, I think you might improve your odds with matching your routine to the bull

I Personaly dont have any experience with elk nuts products but I bet they will help cut down the learning curve to being able to this

Good luck :tup:
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on April 27, 2015, 11:02:44 AM: As Kentrek mentioned, I'm sure Paul/Elknut will chime in shortly but after reading through the thread here's a couple of my observations. You're transitioning to diaphrams this year; that is money in the bank. I have found that the internal reed calls are great for location bugles and can oftentimes get answers when diaphram calls can't, but, you lose versatility when in close unless you're really, really good with an internal reed tube (Glen Berry is one of the very few guys I have heard that can make multiple elk sounds on an internal reed tube). You mentioned you bugle w/grunts sometimes when you get in close; I would recommend not doing that in most situations. Grunts are adversarial in nature and will more often than not, send a bull packing. Remember, the rut is all about the cows (finding cows, keeping cows, breeding cows, protecting cows from strangers). Bulls are all about the cows and will seldom coming running in to a locator, or, a grunting bull! Now, back to when you're in close to a bull. If you're giving some sweet cow sounds and a bull "chuckles" back at you, he's telling you he wants you to joing him... do it. Cut the distance, set up, and give the same sweet cow sounds... oftentimes, he will come closer to you "if" you have cut the distance and are moving towards him. If he's a herd bull, he most likely won't leave his harem so you'll have to whizz in his wheaties to dislodge him. I won't cow call my way into a herd bull but instead after he's located, cut the distance to less than 70 yards (same applies to dogging a moving herd to bed; stay close and when they stop....) and call to his cows using a calling cows to him bugle.. Joel Turner has a great podcast on this exacty type of strategy/bugle. Equate this to sitting in a bar and having a guy across the room hollering at your girlfriend/wife... kinds of makes you want to go stomp him, yes? Just a few late morning thoughts... break's over, back to work for me ;)
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: JPhelps on April 27, 2015, 11:25:29 AM: Levi,
In my opinion the BIGGEST MISTAKE made when calling elk is the intermittent calling between when you locate them and where you should setup (80-100 yards).

Here is a short article I wrote as a response to the biggest mistake when calling elk.
“LOCATION CHECK”

The urge to hear or check on a bull as you move in may be the archery elk hunter’s Achilles’ heel. There is nothing cooler than listening to a bull bugle BUT it may hurt your chance at notching a tag.

Every year I get hundreds and hundreds of questions asking what to do, scenarios that didn’t work out, and failed attempts on hunters trying to kill a bull they heard. It typically goes like “Well I got a bull to bugle from 400 yards away moved towards him and bugled again and nothing. Then we moved another 50 yards and bugled and now the bull has moved away 100 yards…..”

RESIST the urge to bugle once you have located a bull. Make your best guess to his location, check the wind and put your nose to the ground and try and get within of 100 yards of where you think his location is. Ideally he will continue to bugle as you are moving in and allow you to pinpoint his location but if not try to get to where you think he is before making a peep.

I equate this scenario to a guy sitting in the back of a bar with his wife/girlfriend. If someone walks in the door and yells at you from across the room you may reply back but as they get closer and you feel they are a threat you have the ability to leave and avoid conflict and the possibility of losing your lady friend. BUT if that same guy walked across the room and didn’t say a word until he was in your face you are left with no choice but a confrontation.

I also try to avoid “shadowing” a herd. The elk are faster then we are, it is obvious they are going somewhere else and my experience tells me it is going to be a tough bull to kill. Instead I will try and silently get in front of them or if the pressure is low in the area maybe wait and try and get in front of them the next day.

Locate a bull, don’t make a peep until you are in the red zone (<100 yards) and hammer him with a challenge bugle is my standby. As with anything in hunting all rules are regularly.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on April 27, 2015, 11:48:55 AM: According to last year's game harvest report, general season archers had 5.3% success in the Northeast; so statistically you are about 1/3 of the way to your first harvest (one elk every 19 years). 947 archers killed 38 bulls and 16 cows. On a bright note, just over 25% of all the elk killed general season are 6+ point bulls. You are hunting low density, high security elk. There is good age structure in the population. I would be encouraged that you are starting out finding bulls every year.

Mr. Phelps' advice is spot on IMHO, especially if you are trying to kill the herd bull. I do have one different take on shadowing a herd; I've done it 4 times, no calling, and staying at least 200-300 yards downwind of the herd, where satellite bulls have heard me and also come in silently to the sound of my sneaking feet - I presume to see if I was a breedable cow away from the herd bull. When a bull is bugling aggressively, it is often because he is warning off satellites - especially if you aren't what he is bugling back at.

One other thing to consider, because thick country elk are so challenging to get a shot at, is to scout like crazy for funnels, pinchpoints and microresources where elk are likely to appear sooner or later, where you can cut shooting lanes, and have ground blinds or tree stands set up: wallows, mineral licks, trail intersections, breaks in cliff faces, etc. It's not as exciting as calling them in, but a lot of these guys who kill every year have a specific kill location: a wallow that is active every year, a mineral lick (or a bait pile or salt block).
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on April 27, 2015, 11:55:20 AM: Also, a few helpful stats for narrowing down where to concentrate. Hunted elk in forested habitat show preference for areas a mile or more from the nearest open road; landscapes with less than 1 mile of open road per square mile; preference for valleys and basins without open roads; and are most frequently found during daylight hours 1/3 of the way downslope from the ridgetop, 2/3 of the way up from the bottom.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: JPhelps on April 27, 2015, 12:30:35 PM: Doublelung, 100% agree with the difficulty in finding a good spot to setup to get the shot. In my opinion is the biggest deciding factor on sending an arrow at a bull vs. Not getting a shot off.

A lot of times we end up an unfamiliar spot on the hill to setup that is inevitably less than ideal. Being able to read the lay of the land, knowing if you need to move to a better spot to setup, have a good read on the wind, etc.... are the most important decisions to make.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: Elknut1 on April 28, 2015, 08:00:01 PM: Levi, thanks for the response! Many here have given great responses for various encounters & how to handle them. First I want to say you are doing many things right! You are so close to adapting & re-adjusting your techniques to fit the encounters you are experiencing. I really like how you are locating elk through location bugling, this too is my number one way to locate & find elk in any state we hunt. Yes cow calls can locate elk but volume of that type of calling isn't as far reaching!

You mentioned that most bulls are found through your bugling, awesome! Don't worry about grunts or chuckles at the end of a location bugle as in most cases they are not necessary or heard by distant elk when locating them. I agree that by far bugling is the best measure in finding where elk are during ones hunt.

I'd like you to try something new here, it's an aggressive approach but I know you can do it! The results can be surprising & magical at times. This is designed more for the very tight country you are hunting.

Although good setups are crucial to avoid hung up bulls your present encounters discussed are more about wind direction & YOUR next move. So many times we too get "Hung Up" that feeling we want bulls to do all the work at coming our way to our calling but there are times we must turn the tables & go to the bulls & I mean all the way to spitting distance in heavily timbered or brushed country, how? You do this with quick thinking & a solid plan! I have injected this type of calling strategy many times with killing results! In turn I've shared this simple strategy with others & they too have benefited.

Here is something to consider on your next encounter once a bull is located in the thick stuff & he's responded to you locator bugle & you have his aprox location & distance. Get to a 100 yds or so of him, once there only use cow calling as you go right at him. Use higher volume cow calls excitedly at first so he can hear you then soften the calls as you cut the distance in getting closer. Many times as you do this it excites the bull & he calls to you via short one note bugles & chuckling, he's asking you to come over his way & join him. Good thing is that it doesn't matter if he's a herd bull or a satellite, he's showing interest! Too, you do not have to worry about being quiet, feel free to pound the ground & break sticks on your way to him, he thinks it's the cow choosing him over the other bull she was with & is coming his way! Whether this bull bugles or not as you call & go at him is not a big deal as you already have a good idea where he is! This situation is non intimidation to the bull when compared to going at the bull bugling a challenge. A cow coming his way is always a welcome recruit! (grin)

So next time you're in this situation in the tight stuff go straight to the bull cow calling, you will be amazed how he anchors himself there awaiting your entrance, in most cases he starts raking a tree or brush anticipating your arrival & displaying for you as he shows what he has to offer! ! Knock an arrow once in the 40 yard range & not before for safety reasons, slip in in on him keeping the cover between you & where he is. We've taken many bulls taking the action to him. Of course there are other ways to take bulls but in the really tight stuff as you described this is priceless & deadly. We've taken many great bulls with this exact method. Hope this helps in your education bud!

ElkNut1
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: coachcw on April 28, 2015, 08:18:40 PM: Good info elk nut ..... aND I will add as you close keep moving to his down wind elk will always try to wind even another elk as they close in . As you get close get tricky and call behind you and to the side . Amazing when he breaks for you how he can pin point your location. If he starts to move your way slip to the down wind side a bit and get quiet this is when he will seal his fate.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: huntnnw on April 28, 2015, 10:15:41 PM: one tactic I have used around here alot is to charge a cow and intentionally bust her if you know where the bull is...as you know how thick it is around here the herd gets spread out and cant see each other in many places. When I charge the cow Ill let out a high pitch screaming bugle busting stuff as I run at her, the bull hears this commotion and usually gets fired up and will come right to you be ready as you stop alot of the time the bull will come fast! Mind you dont push a cow if you think she will run to the where the bull is.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 28, 2015, 10:24:10 PM: Thank you for the responses! I definatly will take all this info to heart and try them out if the situation arrives!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: Elknut1 on April 29, 2015, 06:58:11 AM: Coachcw, thanks!

In the technique I described cow calling your way to the bull, you do this quickly, you do not setup anywhere in-between & cast ones sounds. If you start your cow calling approach at 100 yards & head his way you do this rather quickly almost running at him for 50 yards or so then slow down & stop all calling around the 40 yard or so distance from the bull but continue right at him. Keep a sharp eye out for any other elk on your approach, it's easy to be so focused on the bulls bugling that you can get tunnel vision. (grin) Once at that 40 yard mark nock an arrow & continue forward, this happens quick & the bull generally stays put right where he is as this cow (you) comes his way not giving him the chance to move much at all her way, this pretty much takes the issue of him moving down wind on you because you are on him so quick.

This is what makes it an aggressive move & very deadly, you don't give the bull a chance to react! All the while as you close the distance he thinks it's the cow coming as he called her to him, you're basically giving him what he's asking for! (grin)

This technique is not designed for a bull coming your way after you called to him. This is designed for bulls that stay in the same spot & will bugle back at you but not move your way such as Levi's issue was. Sure you can stay & get in a screaming match but the bull usually wins those unless the hunter takes fast action & takes it to him!

The cool thing about this technique is it doesn't matter how you made contact with this bull that won't move. Doesn't matter if you are bugling & raking 40 yards from him & he won't budge your way. (he generally has cows is why he won't come) All you do is switch gears & go straight to excited cow calling as if there was a cow there all along & she is now choosing the other bull that she wants to be with. This will anchor the real bull in his tracks as you cover the needed ground in a matter of seconds, yes sir he thinks it's a cow now coming to him. Things can happen quickly & ice water in your veins is a good thing to have at this time of the high adrenalin rush you will experience! (grin)

ElkNut1
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: coachcw on April 29, 2015, 12:08:52 PM: Im gonna try that just for fun ! thanks ... I know last year I was cow calling and climbing a steep face right before dark . working right past rag horn bulls before I could get to the herd bull a satilite came running down the hill right to me . face off at three feet thank god for a tree or I may of had tracks across my face . I always lean towards being aggressive way more productive.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: whacker1 on April 29, 2015, 03:22:37 PM: Great info Elknut, Coach, Doublelung, huntnw, jphelps, and others.

Keep it coming
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: coachcw on April 29, 2015, 03:34:04 PM: one thing I've found is when a guy finds a big bull he gets over patient and waits to long . just go for it before something changes !
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: GoPlayOutside on April 29, 2015, 04:04:54 PM: Levi...keep at it.

Learn your location inside and out. Over the years, you will learn from all of your past encounters in that same area.
I have been hunting my same (heavily hunted) location for 17 years now. I have learned how to maximize my opportunities by knowing where they nap, feed, hide, drink, funnel, etc.

I personally don't like to call in this particular area, because it's so heavily hunted with soooo many calls and callers. I like to sit and overlook my favorite areas...then, I have a better idea of where the herd is....then, move in quietly and try to get in front of the grazing herd.

Good Luck!
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: LeviD1 on April 29, 2015, 05:54:56 PM: Quote from: GoPlayOutside on April 29, 2015, 04:04:54 PM
Levi...keep at it.

Learn your location inside and out. Over the years, you will learn from all of your past encounters in that same area.
I have been hunting my same (heavily hunted) location for 17 years now. I have learned how to maximize my opportunities by knowing where they nap, feed, hide, drink, funnel, etc.

I personally don't like to call in this particular area, because it's so heavily hunted with soooo many calls and callers. I like to sit and overlook my favorite areas...then, I have a better idea of where the herd is....then, move in quietly and try to get in front of the grazing herd.

Good Luck!

Oh I will never stop :tup: I was hooked after my first year. I plan on hitting it even harder this year before season hiking and exploring. I think one of the main problems is that I have not ever seen a cow and have only had 1 picture of 1 cow on cam the past 4 years. I have heard cows though 2 seasons ago that were with a bull. I need to find them.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: Elknut1 on April 30, 2015, 06:02:57 AM: coach, you're going to get a real kick out of running right at elk while cow calling excitedly, make sure to vary the volume as you get closer, you will be shocked no matter if it's an unseen herd, cow, spike or bull of any size how they let you walk right to them. I've lost track years back on how many times I've used this where necessary! (grin)

huntnnw, I've used that exact approach on occasion, have you had a chance to listen to the Podcast "One Last Bugle" I did a couple weeks ago? If not check it out as you may enjoy it, we took a very nice bull with your exact description in running at the cows. You may enjoy it! (grin) Here's a link! https://soundcloud.com/elknut1/elknut-talks-elk-podcast-one-last-bugle

ElkNut1
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: coachcw on April 30, 2015, 06:51:41 AM: I have trailed behind a group calling and walked right up behind them . once I was in thick cover doing this and they turned back to me and almost ran me over . at full draw I had a calf sniffing my belt as I stuck the cow right behind it.
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on April 30, 2015, 07:02:56 AM: My first encounter with a bull was the same scenario. I was walking up the trail cow calling and little did I know the bull was parallel to me following me along the ridge. He walked out at ten yards and spun before I could release. I was just calling to tell my brother to hurry up :chuckle:

Great advice guys. :tup:
Title: Re: How do I become a more successful elk hunter?
Post by: magnumb on May 03, 2015, 09:48:15 AM: Learning their escape routes is no less important than learning their 'first light' or feeding patterns.

I've killed 3 bulls within 60-70yds. of each other along the same path in the last several years.........all having just blown out from the other side of the valley after serving as target practice for 'how not to shoot'.

If I can get to this spot within the ten minutes it takes these animals to ascend my side of the mountain, I'm usually rewarded with the opportunity. As I get a bit older, my usual jaunt from where I spend most of my earlier huntin' hours takes a bit longer....... :).

Seems I'm gonna need to somehow learn to 'anticipate' a bit better or learn to effectively take the 'ole 'Texas Heart Shot'...........kiddin'....can't go there.