Post by: Sabotloader on May 18, 2015, 01:42:10 PM
For some time now I have been trying to knurl bullets to shoot without a sabot or full bore from one my Knight ULite. I have been rolling the bullets between to files creating a knurled bullet. This seemed to work very well on copper/lead bullets like the Speer .50x300 gr. Gold Dot and on Barnes XPB bullets, both their 50x275 and 50x325. Copper is so much softer than the brass of the Lehigh bullets.
The problem I am had is when knurling the brass bullets I have to apply so much pressure to knurl the bullet I often get different lifts on the knurling. Some of the bullets have a barely enough lift to keep them from just falling down the barrel others fit what I would call perfect and still others I have to use a short starter to get them started. The odd thing is between the ones that are loose to the bullets that are tight I really do not see a difference in accuracy.
Alleyooper-GM54-120 and I some discussions on how I might solve the problem - economically. There are many tools you can purchase to complete the job or even a tools that you use in conjunction with a lathe to get the job done. But all of these have one thing in common - EXPENSIVE - well expensive for me and the amount I would use it.
Well last night thinking about the problem - I thought of what I might try a - a simple tubing cutter! It worked but it was somewhat tedious because it would not hold the bullet very stable.
This morning I called Lehigh Dave and bounced the question of him. I talked about using the tubing cutter but that I could not really keep the base of the bullet stable when turning the bullet in the tubing cutter. He was somewhat surprised that I had thought of and used the cutter, but was very quickly telling me that I 'displacing and raising the brass on each side of the cutting wheel - essentially increasing the diameter. I guess what gave me the thought was Lehigh's original Sabotless bullet.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv130%2Fsabotloader%2FLehigh50calSabotless.jpg&hash=f084e142e202965715f0f0474366e9afe5345613) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sabotloader/media/Lehigh50calSabotless.jpg.html)
Basically I was doing the same thing but with a lot less lift. You can see I have indexed the knob of the tool to get approximately the same lift for each cut. The Allen wrench serves as the tool to turn the bullet in the cutter.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv130%2Fsabotloader%2F5-Indexed%2520knob.jpg&hash=7632caa8dea74a527042e15cbdf5766fa769a986) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sabotloader/media/5-Indexed%20knob.jpg.html)
In our conversation Lehigh Dave suggested using a 'Might Mite" cutter because it has to full length wheels to stabilize the bullet. Well after that conversation - I headed to the store and found this cutter. The way it was built was exactly as Lehigh Dave described although while at the store I found that not all of these small cutters have the full length stabilizing wheels. This is Model 104 Ridgid Cutter
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv130%2Fsabotloader%2F2%2520-%2520Cut%2520tool.jpg&hash=8d51f001dacc489ed8f31a043bca8e2481e1643a) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sabotloader/media/2%20-%20Cut%20tool.jpg.html)
After I got back to the house could not resist giving it a try - work perfect... It is a little like reloading center fire shells with the older presses I have. It is slow but it works and it is not like I am going to do hundreds of bullets.
I did end up indexing the knob of the cutter to achieve the lift I wanted. I ended up with a size of .502 of the bullet. The bullet without knurling at the area between the Lehigh knurls measures .499 to .4995. With the .502 diameter od the cut knurls It seems to about correct to fit my bore. I will nor more later in the week. My problem is that I only have 9 bullets - got some more on order.
This composite might show more than I can explain.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv130%2Fsabotloader%2FComposite_1.jpg&hash=f7f820434812a5a72d51c6d8528514e432f75e91) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sabotloader/media/Composite_1.jpg.html)
For those wondering about a gas seal - I use a MMP sub bridge under the bullet.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv130%2Fsabotloader%2FBridgeComposit.jpg&hash=12c9b9e035a19c002690de1fddf83ca48a5f2a20) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sabotloader/media/BridgeComposit.jpg.html)
I do apologize for the length of this - writing is really not a strength of mine...
Post by: MountainDevil54 on May 27, 2015, 09:42:33 AM
Post by: Chesapeake on May 28, 2015, 06:35:54 PM
Post by: Sabotloader on May 29, 2015, 09:02:09 AM
Think I'd chuck up an Allen bit in a cordless drill to do the turning part.
That certainly could be done... I did run into a slight problem in my efforts... if was working so well that I actually over did the knurling. I got the knurling to tall so they are EXTREMLY difficult to load in the Knight but are very close to a perfect fit in the White 504 - so all is not lost
Post by: oneshot12 on May 29, 2015, 01:13:11 PM
Post by: Sabotloader on May 29, 2015, 02:13:43 PM
has there been that much difference in the grouping ??? at 50 to 100 yard ??? how about trying to get that second shot in if needed any issue with the speed loaders
Well... I really do not know why but there really has not been a loss or gain of accuracy. I can load a knurled bullet that slides down really easy or one that is tight going down and shoot them. Really can not tell any loss or gain of accuracy.
This target shows one of the shoots using the Lehigh .500x350 gr. CF bullet. They were knurled between two files on the bench. Some of them loaded very easily others were tighter but the groups were very respectable.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv130%2Fsabotloader%2FTargets%2FTarget500x350gr.jpg&hash=09dc45034dcf0c0ac66b986246f4506bb5e491af) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sabotloader/media/Targets/Target500x350gr.jpg.html)
This target from another shoot shows even the velocity among the bullets stayed fairly consistent. I noted that shot #5 was a very tight push down the bore.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv130%2Fsabotloader%2FTargets%2FULiteTarget1-23.jpg&hash=eb89efba0bf4ed63e787d444c670772163bd8f30) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sabotloader/media/Targets/ULiteTarget1-23.jpg.html)
So it is real possible that I am searching for some thing I really do not have to have a lot of concern over.
Post by: oneshot12 on May 29, 2015, 06:31:29 PM