Post by: kentrek on July 22, 2015, 08:18:49 AM
I was considering the olympus air but am open to the other options
This camera would be used for mtn climbing and bivy style hunting so weight/bulk is a concern
What do you guys think ? Anyone have any experience? Is the technology just not there yet ?? Am I better off with a good point and shoot ??
Was thinking a 300+/- budget
Post by: Magnum_Willys on July 22, 2015, 08:38:09 AM
Post by: kentrek on July 22, 2015, 04:07:58 PM
I'm a bit concerned with battery life tho aswell as image quality...it would be nice to be able to blow up a picture with out pixelation
I really like the idea but am skeptical since I don't have much camera knowledge
Post by: Netminder01 on July 22, 2015, 04:33:58 PM
Post by: Bob33 on July 22, 2015, 04:45:49 PM
Post by: kentrek on July 22, 2015, 05:21:29 PM
If that's the case would I be better off getting a more compact point an shoot style camera ? Or would the added lense make up enough for my phones lack of sensor to compete with the rookie photographer cameras ?
Thank you very much for the input
Post by: Bean Counter on July 22, 2015, 06:16:39 PM
A camera sensor's size is one of the most important contributors to image quality. The sensors in phones are much smaller than those in high quality DSLRs.
^ To Obi-Wan you will listen.
Lenses matter, but that doesn't mean you can put a $10,000 lens in front of a cell phone and beat a consumer level DSLR with a kit lens in all circumstances. Maybe a few for the sake of discussion, but not most. Yes, glass matters: if you put a coke bottle in front of a $7,000 Pentax medium format camera you're going to get a crappy image.
That said, not all megapixels are created equal. 20mpx spread out over a full frame sensor will have larger photo sites than 20mpx on an APS-C / "crop" sensor, and same for crop compared to our phone's tiny sensor. Larger photo sites collect more photons, which means higher signal to noise ratio, dynamic range, etc. So you should consider a) your budget b) how large you want to print and c) how likely you're willing to wait for the perfect light where dynamic range or noise can be a concern in the golden hour or the blue hour.
Since you mention mountain climbing, I take it you mean you want to shoot landscapes? If its primarily landscapes, and space is a concern as you say, I'd look into a mirrorless camera. APS-C if you have more money, micro 4/3rds if you're more strapped for cash. I love my DSLRs because they're a jack of all trades: chasing the kids, wildlife, sports, weddings, landscapes, etc. but in order to get that versatility it means a huge body for the controls to be spaced out, plus that huge flopping mirror as Sony's hokus pocks, voodoo EVF crap just doesn't cut the mustard IMHO. I'm carrying my bulky DSLR and heavy lenses and putting up with the inconvenience because I want the best image quality I can get.
Post by: Bean Counter on July 22, 2015, 06:27:08 PM
For $300 you're probably going to do best by being patient and buying used on Craigslist. It could be that the best option is to just use your phone :twocents:
Post by: kentrek on July 22, 2015, 06:46:33 PM
In the 300-400 range what would you suggest ?? I definitely do alot of landscapes & panoramics along with trophy shots with fish and big game....low light is a concern as well....i also do a fair bit of digiscoping while scouting
I've gone through more than a couple cheap point and shoots that tend to fall short of my expectations....i would like this next camera to be a quality purchase that will maybe help transition me into some higher end photography
Thanks again !
Post by: kentrek on July 22, 2015, 06:53:22 PM
Post by: Bean Counter on July 22, 2015, 08:08:01 PM
So bean you think I'd be better off forgetting the phone idea then ?? I'd like to be able to have nice 8x10 prints on the wall of my best pictures....i doubt I'd ever get bigger then that
Your phone certainly can make a great 8x10" print.. IF the scene is well lit, AND there is low contrast (sun is behind you and you're ok not grabbing the actual sunset), AND nothing in the frame (animals, tree branches, people) is moving.
I haven't used one of those lens attachments for a phone. Part of the reason for an interchangeable lens is for your creative control as the operator. Shutter speed and aperture settings are inherent functions of the lens whereas ISO is a function of the sensor. Seems hokey to me as most cameras especially my dumb iPhone don't let me change settings and instead chose it for me automatically. A droid or a hack app might assume more intelligence on the part of the user :chuckle: I would suggest a few of the photo forums for research such as dpreview.com, photo.net, or photography-on-the.net to ask around.
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In the 300-400 range what would you suggest ?? I definitely do alot of landscapes & panoramics along with trophy shots with fish and big game....low light is a concern as well....i also do a fair bit of digiscoping while scouting
Digiscoping! :tup: That's a shining example of when and where glass matters. If I have my $2,500 5d Mark III and my $1,000 200mm lens (currently the longest in my lineup) and you're standing next to me with a quality spotting scope (effectively a 1,000mm+ lens), $25 bracket, and your camera phone (small sensor and all), guess whose going to get the better shot? Sure, I can zoom in on my image to an extent, but necessary magnification is all about the lens. So.. if you already have a nice spotter, a new camera might not be replacing it anytime soon.
I haven't looked and can't imagine any quality names I've heard that are in the $300-400 range, especially new, that will markedly beat your camera phone. Technology is great. Some of today's cell phone cameras are better than the first generation of DSLRs. But physics being what it is, there is only so much you can do before the plain and simple physics of glass and sensor matter.
If you have some time, are patient, willing to buy used, you could get very lucky (50%+ off original MSRP) on a used Fuji or Olympus, who seem to dominate the compact camera market in my observation. A first generation Fuji x100 might be had for a few hundred more than your current budget, and would give you markedly better image quality than a phone and most pocket cameras. If you want an ILC (interchangeable lens camera) you could look into the Olympus OM-D EM-10 or 5. I believe the 5 has some weather sealing and the 10 does not. Make sure to save some budget for a wide lens!
If you decide you're willing to forego some space and want the versatility of a DSLR, you could consider the Nikon D3100 or the Canon t3i. The kit lens, stopped down a few apertures, with a circular polarizer, will blow all of the above away. Like the mirrorless options listed above, this assumes you're willing to take the time to get out of automatic and start learning how to assume creative control over the machine. Who buys a sports car with an automatic transmission? Until you get to Canon's flagship offerings, the 1Dx or the 7D Mark II, you don't get a lot of weather sealing. If you want to use it in rain and dust, you might look at Pentax's offerings, whose cameras include more than 80 weather seals :yike:
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I've gone through more than a couple cheap point and shoots that tend to fall short of my expectations....i would like this next camera to be a quality purchase that will maybe help transition me into some higher end photography
Thanks again !
I think you've answered your question here. If I said I'm glassing all day long and not seeing any game and I've tried the gamut of Simmons, Alpen, Big 5, etc level binoculars, what kind of responses would I get on here?
Yikes so I really need to up my budget or get lucky used ?? What kind of budget would you recommend ?
The sky is the limit for landscapes. I love my full frame camera because of the reasons I've beaten to death above. My 6d, which I bought for $1,500, can now be had for $1,100. I'll put on a 16-35mm f/4L IS ($1,000), and a quality circular polarizer ($100) and if my shots suck, as they often do, its 100% my fault. I have no excuses for crappy photos so I really ought to get better :sry:
Post by: kentrek on July 22, 2015, 08:22:37 PM
Thanks for your time bean :tup:
Post by: Bean Counter on July 22, 2015, 08:23:09 PM
When I was at the Petrified Forest National Park, I walked by a couple of stones that I want to frame as leading lines into the hills beyond. so I snapped a shot with my camera phone... and came back at sunset with my DSLR. For the sake of instruction, I wish I would have taken the midday image with my DSLR and the sunset photo with the camera phone just to show what a difference light can make...
Post by: Bean Counter on July 22, 2015, 08:23:47 PM
Awesome....this is a new world ! Il chew on that information for a bit an come back with more questions I'm sure
Thanks for your time bean :tup:
Cheers buddy :brew:
Post by: Bofire on July 22, 2015, 08:29:44 PM
Carl
Post by: NOCK NOCK on July 22, 2015, 08:32:44 PM