Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Elk Hunting => Topic started by: Duckslayer89 on August 10, 2015, 07:31:08 AM

Title: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Duckslayer89 on August 10, 2015, 07:31:08 AM: Hunting the backcountry I've always packed meat out as soon as we kill an animal and it takes a few days off the hunt before we can get back in to try and fill more tags, what about just keeping meat in an ice cold stream fully submerged for a week? Is it any different than letting it hang in cool weather? Thanks for the advice been rolling this idea over for a while...
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: rtspring on August 10, 2015, 07:43:57 AM: I have hung mine to cool for a few hours, then put it in big black bags and put into a creek for a few days. Never had a problem
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on August 10, 2015, 07:50:34 AM: I've never done it but would if the situation arised. Have read on the NET about people ageing there meat this way. I'd do it as Rtpsring stated after cooled then into garbage bags and into stream.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Bob33 on August 10, 2015, 07:54:36 AM: If I did it, I would put the meat in plastic bags. Sitting in water for hours on end is not the best thing for meat.

Remember that meat should be kept below 40 degrees. Meat above 40 can develop bacteria that grows exponentially.

If the stream is cold enough, this could work for a short period of time.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on August 10, 2015, 09:12:36 AM: I have done this but bone the meat out and use one gallon Ziploc freezer bags. Purge as much air as possible. Depends how cold the water is, also find a shaded area that doesn't get sun.

If you are at higher elevations and it gets cold at night, I've also hung quarters/whole deer in the evening, in the day they go in the shade on the tarp with sleeping bags and pads on top, hang back up in the evening. Have had this work well for up to 5 days when it was 30s-40s at night and highs in the 60s-70s.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: wapiti hunter2 on August 10, 2015, 09:45:25 AM: It works. just keep the water off the meat. The heavy duty contractor bags from the local hardware store work well. Not the cheep flimzy ones but the real heavy duty ones.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: swashington2128 on August 10, 2015, 12:21:18 PM: I have been looking into this also for an Alaskan Moose Hunt. What I have found as a recommendation is to put the meat in plastic bags and then put that in dry sacks sealed well. Place them in the river with rocks on top. near impossible for wolves, yotes, or bears to find them and easy to grab and go when ready.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Duckslayer89 on August 10, 2015, 01:09:43 PM: What about no bags and just keeping it in quarters? But then you still have backs traps ect. Sounds like the bags are necessary and will last up to a week if chilled well. Any other advice welcomed! Thanks for the help guys!
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: MR5x5 on August 10, 2015, 02:27:18 PM: Super general guidelines for meat in the field:

Below 40 for two weeks
Below 50 for one week
below 65 for three days
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Jonnyjammer on August 10, 2015, 02:32:15 PM: Quote from: MR5x5 on August 10, 2015, 02:27:18 PM
Super general guidelines for meat in the field:

Below 40 for two weeks
Below 50 for one week
below 65 for three days
this would be good to know,can you give a source from where it came?
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Bean Counter on August 10, 2015, 02:58:17 PM: Dunking an unprotected drumstick into water: :bdid:

Think of all the bacteria growth :puke:

Some guys don't actually put the meat into the water, but build a bridge of felled logs over the stream, and put the meat on the logs. The cool running water underneath helps keep it cool. If you can cover the meat to keep the sun off this would seem to be a big winner.

On tempertures, remember that the ambient temp doesn't always have to be below 40 in order for it to be safe for several days. if it gets into the 30s at night, you can get the meat so cold that it can safely survive daytime temps in the mid 50s if its hung in the shade. I've done it and been fine.

In any case, make sure you open up the back hams so air can vent all the way in to the bone and cool the core of the quarter. There's a TON of heat in there and even if its snowing you can get some spoilage.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: grundy53 on August 10, 2015, 02:59:53 PM: Quote from: Duckslayer89 on August 10, 2015, 01:09:43 PM
What about no bags and just keeping it in quarters? But then you still have backs traps ect. Sounds like the bags are necessary and will last up to a week if chilled well. Any other advice welcomed! Thanks for the help guys!
No way.

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Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: sagerat1 on August 10, 2015, 04:10:02 PM: Many years ago my partner shot a spike. It was pretty warm and it was opening day, so we in our infinite wisdom put the quarters in the creek during the day and let them hang at night. Bottom line, after 3 days the butcher refused to cut it in his shop. We were able to salvage very little meat.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: MR5x5 on August 10, 2015, 04:15:09 PM: Quote from: Jonnyjammer on August 10, 2015, 02:32:15 PM
Quote from: MR5x5 on August 10, 2015, 02:27:18 PM
Super general guidelines for meat in the field:

Below 40 for two weeks
Below 50 for one week
below 65 for three days
this would be good to know,can you give a source from where it came?

From a Dwight Schuh article on meat care:

"Once you get all body heat out of a carcass, air temperature is almost irrelevant. Commercial butchers age beef for up to two weeks at 40 degrees, and they quick-age beef for three days at 65 degrees. Guided by that continuum, I believe if you can cool meat to 65 degrees, you have roughly three days to get it into a cooler. If you can cool the meat to 40 degrees, you have up to two weeks."
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Jonnyjammer on August 10, 2015, 04:18:02 PM: how cold would a running mountain stream be?
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Bofire on August 10, 2015, 04:22:09 PM: :) I have seen a BUNCH of August bears put into streams for 2-3 days, Just the gutted bear with hide on. Metheany creek has prolly cooled 50-60 bears or a bunch more. The creek over by Bradleys old cabin on West Boundry Road has cooled a bunch also. Ask BTKR or BearmanRick about it.
Carl
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: fillthefreezer on August 10, 2015, 04:34:05 PM: i would say dont plan on it this year. imo, i havent found any streams cold enough to give me any confidence. typical years, yes.
i would drop it in to take the initial heat out and make my cooler ice more effective.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Labredog on August 10, 2015, 05:44:19 PM: Creeks and contractor bags are great for a quick cool down of meat, I always have the meat in a game bag so the meat doesn't touch plastic, (slimy and some bags can put an off taste in the meat). Always hang the meat at night , that dry outer skein on the meat is what helps to keep the nasty bacteria from ruining your hard earned dinner. The idea with the covered stick bridge over a cool creek is great and works well if you don't have big contractor bags or enough depth to sink the bags in.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: kevinlisa06 on August 11, 2015, 09:24:45 PM: The spike I shot 2 seasons ago on opening morning was quartered on the hill and packed out. Once back at camp we hung it in a tree. On Monday the temps warmed up so we placed the quarters in the creek next to camp. We had sheets wrapped around all the quarters not plastic yes a bit of dirt got in the meat but hardly any. We left the quarters in the creek for about 2 hours to get the temp down on the meat. We used a tarp to block the sun from our game pole then came home Friday and butchered it Saturday and Sunday great tasting meat and hardly any waste no more than normal.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: coldsteel3d on August 12, 2015, 09:44:12 AM: I forget exactly who told me of this but ultimately it came from a couple old timers that have been killing elk for years and years. These guys would cool their game in the creek until it became a light pink color and they swore that it is the best eating meat ever. It rinses a lot of the blood out of the meat and these guys swore by the way the burger and steaks come out doing it that way. I have never and probably will never try it but whoever it was telling me this did try it and said it was good but not enough to try it or I would probably remember who it was and probably of tried it!
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Stein on August 12, 2015, 09:55:13 AM: Quote from: MR5x5 on August 10, 2015, 04:15:09 PM
Quote from: Jonnyjammer on August 10, 2015, 02:32:15 PM
Quote from: MR5x5 on August 10, 2015, 02:27:18 PM
Super general guidelines for meat in the field:

Below 40 for two weeks
Below 50 for one week
below 65 for three days
this would be good to know,can you give a source from where it came?

From a Dwight Schuh article on meat care:

"Once you get all body heat out of a carcass, air temperature is almost irrelevant. Commercial butchers age beef for up to two weeks at 40 degrees, and they quick-age beef for three days at 65 degrees. Guided by that continuum, I believe if you can cool meat to 65 degrees, you have roughly three days to get it into a cooler. If you can cool the meat to 40 degrees, you have up to two weeks."

The question is how long will it take you to cool it to 65? Cooling an entire animal to 65 degrees next to the bone (or thickest part of the meat) in a reasonable time (under a day) takes temperatures much cooler than 65. In August, that pretty much means you need to find a cooler or cold stream pretty quickly.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: Duckslayer89 on August 12, 2015, 12:22:12 PM: Quote from: coldsteel3d on August 12, 2015, 09:44:12 AM
I forget exactly who told me of this but ultimately it came from a couple old timers that have been killing elk for years and years. These guys would cool their game in the creek until it became a light pink color and they swore that it is the best eating meat ever. It rinses a lot of the blood out of the meat and these guys swore by the way the burger and steaks come out doing it that way. I have never and probably will never try it but whoever it was telling me this did try it and said it was good but not enough to try it or I would probably remember who it was and probably of tried it!
Me and my dad left half a blackstrap on accident in the stream next to our camp for 2 days while packing a cow out. We came back to continue hunting and ate the back strap when it was light pink like that and we both agreed it was the best meat we've ever had he still talks about it all the time.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: CAMPMEAT on August 12, 2015, 12:26:23 PM: Just shoot your animal the last 10 minutes of your week long hunt, just like on TV, simple. :tup:
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: birddogdad on August 12, 2015, 12:30:15 PM: have always been taught NOT to soak meat in water. Think the concern was introduction of bacteria from the water for one.. However, bagged properly, a cold stream would make a very good cooler. Have placed milk jugs in creeks on trout adventures and even in hot weather, had milk for coffee for a week!

clearly not an expert on this topic , just not (IMO) something I would consider to "wet down" my game...
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: White Pass Outfitters on August 12, 2015, 03:36:10 PM: Due to all the bacteria in water, I would not put my meat directly in the water unless its in a game bag and then a dry sack. I have chilled many Elk this way. Just make sure you get the meat chilled before you call a packer to take it out.
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: zwickeyman on August 12, 2015, 04:24:44 PM: I usually bone out the meat and get in tag bags to cool down. then place in a plastic bag, then inside a dry bag then place in stream or glacier. the longest I have ever done this before packing out is 5 days and it kept the meat just fine with temps at night in the 40's and days in the 70's
Title: Re: Keeping meat in streams?
Post by: CaNINE on August 12, 2015, 04:32:02 PM: I have not submerged any meat in water to promote cooling, but I have built small timber frameworks over flowing water and placed the meat in game bags just above water level. The air flow and cooler temperatures help cool the meat. I've kept elk quarters that way for a couple of days when I've need time to for solo pack outs. It's important to keep the framework high enough to not get wet or splashed by water but low enough to take advantage of the cooler temps.