Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Deer Hunting => Topic started by: LittleJohn on November 01, 2015, 05:06:45 PM

Title: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: LittleJohn on November 01, 2015, 05:06:45 PM: Hey guys just was wondering everyone's thoughts on this.

The wife and I were out hunting with my buddy and his wife here in Montana this weekend. My buddy and his wife both tagged out on 4 point whitetails. We did the normal field dress and game carted them out to the truck.

We followed our friends home to help hang and skin. To my surprise my buddy said he doesn't skin his deer until he is ready to cut them up. He split the brisket and took out wind pipe and left hang.

It was 55 degrees as a high the last few days and 4o degrees as a low at night. I have never heard of anyone doing this. He said he has been doing it that way for 30 years and has never had a problem

Just wondering if anyone else does this

Thanks Guys

Just curious
John :)
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Ridgeratt on November 01, 2015, 05:10:44 PM: I'd guess it's a personal preference but I have not seen many sides of beef hanging with their jackets on. I get the coat off them as soon as I can. It's to easy to pull a hide while it's warm.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: 3nails on November 01, 2015, 05:21:24 PM: Yeah I don't know about that. IMO you need to get guts out, hide off, any remaining hair/dirt off and hanging asap. To hang for more than a couple days temps need to be no higher than mid 40's. I believe the lack of following these steps is why some people think venison is gamey. Cut and wrap yourself without ever sawing into a bone and removing all fat greatly helps with taste as well.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: 7mag. on November 01, 2015, 05:23:05 PM: It's much easier for bacteria to grow with the hide on. The hide traps heat. It's also easier to get the hide off if you do it right away.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: 7mag. on November 01, 2015, 05:23:53 PM: Quote from: 3nails on November 01, 2015, 05:21:24 PM
Yeah I don't know about that. IMO you need to get guts out, hide off, any remaining hair/dirt off and hanging asap. To hang for more than a couple days temps need to be no higher than mid 40's. I believe the lack of following these steps is why some people think venison is gamey. Cut and wrap yourself without ever sawing into a bone and removing all fat greatly helps with taste as well.

I completely agree.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Mark251 on November 01, 2015, 05:24:44 PM: Interesting.... I've always skinned a deer ASAP but it's just the way I was taught to do it many years ago. It might be worth a call to a butcher or a meat processing company to get their take on it.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: mp.hunter on November 01, 2015, 05:28:44 PM: My dad and I shot bucks in South Dakota one year. 65-70 degrees in November that year and all the people that were hunting the farm we were also hunting all hung there deer up and left the hides on. We couldn't believe it, saw 15-20 deer like that.

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Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: UBA on November 01, 2015, 05:30:15 PM: Quote from: 7mag. on November 01, 2015, 05:23:53 PM
Quote from: 3nails on November 01, 2015, 05:21:24 PM
Yeah I don't know about that. IMO you need to get guts out, hide off, any remaining hair/dirt off and hanging asap. To hang for more than a couple days temps need to be no higher than mid 40's. I believe the lack of following these steps is why some people think venison is gamey. Cut and wrap yourself without ever sawing into a bone and removing all fat greatly helps with taste as well.

I completely agree.

I second that. Get it off
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: lokidog on November 01, 2015, 05:30:47 PM: Once the animal is cool, it does not matter if the hide is on it or not. Kind of like the people that put insulated cups over their outside faucet to keep it from freezing. With no additional heat from the inside, it will stay the same temperature as the outside.

I think the side of beef analogy is off in that the hide is removed for sanitation reasons as well as cooling.

I've always left my hide on until I am ready to butcher as I don't like that dried out layer on my meat. One argument could be that the skin/hair could actually help keep it from getting as warm during the day if the cooler period is longer than the warm one.

:twocents:

Quote from: 7mag. on November 01, 2015, 05:23:05 PM
It's much easier for bacteria to grow with the hide on. The hide traps heat. It's also easier to get the hide off if you do it right away.

I agree with the removing it right away is easier, but I would disagree on the bacteria thing. If there are no penetrations in the skin, it is a sealed membrane. You might get some bacterial penetration around wounds and incisions, but, fortunately, skin is pretty impervious to bacteria.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: 7mag. on November 01, 2015, 05:38:01 PM: Quote from: lokidog on November 01, 2015, 05:30:47 PM
Once the animal is cool, it does not matter if the hide is on it or not. Kind of like the people that put insulated cups over their outside faucet to keep it from freezing. With no additional heat from the inside, it will stay the same temperature as the outside.

I think the side of beef analogy is off in that the hide is removed for sanitation reasons as well as cooling.

I've always left my hide on until I am ready to butcher as I don't like that dried out layer on my meat. One argument could be that the skin/hair could actually help keep it from getting as warm during the day if the cooler period is longer than the warm one.

:twocents:

Quote from: 7mag. on November 01, 2015, 05:23:05 PM
It's much easier for bacteria to grow with the hide on. The hide traps heat. It's also easier to get the hide off if you do it right away.

I agree with the removing it right away is easier, but I would disagree on the bacteria thing. If there are no penetrations in the skin, it is a sealed membrane. You might get some bacterial penetration around wounds and incisions, but, fortunately, skin is pretty impervious to bacteria.

I was referring to the trapping of heat, and the wound area. I've seen some wound channels that we didn't find until we skinned the animal. If we would have waited, we would have lost an entire quarter.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on November 01, 2015, 06:14:11 PM: I leave it on if hunting the east side till I get home, if I'm home and temps are low will let hang a couple days then skin it for a period in the fridge 4-7 days.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Magnum_Willys on November 01, 2015, 06:33:21 PM: In montana with windy zero degree days we leave hide on to avoid freezer burn. Not unusual to see animals with the hide on frozen in the back of the truck for days. I wouldn't want to do it above freezing though. At 55 degrees seems crazy.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Bob33 on November 01, 2015, 06:33:37 PM: With the entrails out, a hung deer can cool pretty quickly if the temperature is right. Once the animal is completely cool, the hide does no harm. In fact if night temperatures are cool, the hide can keep the meat cooler during the days until it is cut up. It can also protect from insects and dirt. I've left hides on a hung deer in cool weather for a couple days with no problems. As a general rule it is better to remove it.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: syoungs on November 01, 2015, 06:38:58 PM: We had a guy bring us one in to process 2 years ago with the hide on, wrapped in a blue tarp, under his trucks canopy, during rifle season, shot it on a saturday, brought it to us friday. Never seen such a rotten mess.

I've also had em come in hide on, where they has been taken care of, and not seen a problem. I personally get it off as soon as I'm back to camp and can hang it to skin.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: LittleJohn on November 01, 2015, 06:40:55 PM: Quote from: 3nails on November 01, 2015, 05:21:24 PM
Yeah I don't know about that. IMO you need to get guts out, hide off, any remaining hair/dirt off and hanging asap. To hang for more than a couple days temps need to be no higher than mid 40's. I believe the lack of following these steps is why some people think venison is gamey. Cut and wrap yourself without ever sawing into a bone and removing all fat greatly helps with taste as well.

Ive always been taught to bleed, gut, and skin asap. Trim all fat and don't saw any bone. I guess it depends on how you were taught. My dad is an old wet side logger and I guess thats how he was taught.

I just cut my wifes deer today. This is the 6th full day of hanging in the garage. Smelled sweet as pie.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: 700xcr on November 01, 2015, 06:53:10 PM: We always skin are game before gutting them if we can. That way less hair in the meat. We skin, gut and rinse with water. Then wipe down with paper towels. Then use mesh game bags. We let hang for 4 days before processing in 40 degrees. Then trim fat and debone meat. Trim silver skin so you have pure red meat. Less game tasting that way.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: grundy53 on November 01, 2015, 07:00:10 PM: Quote from: 700xcr on November 01, 2015, 06:53:10 PM
We always skin are game before gutting them if we can. That way less hair in the meat. We skin, gut and rinse with water. Then wipe down with paper towels. Then use mesh game bags. We let hang for 4 days before processing in 40 degrees. Then trim fat and debone meat. Trim silver skin so you have pure red meat. Less game tasting that way.
That's what we do too.

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Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Alchase on November 02, 2015, 10:09:24 AM: I think the single biggest factor on a deer tasting gamey, is how long the skin is on the meat after after dead. I skin as soon as possible.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Squidward on November 02, 2015, 10:16:41 AM: In the 70's my dad and his buddy went Mule hunting in WY, at the ranch they stayed. Some the locals had killed some bulls. these bulls were hung by the head from a cross beam. the hid was split down the back and up the belly neck, then left to hang. They told my dad and his partner that us Westerners took the hid off too fast. I still take the hid off as fast as I can to get the heat out. Squidward.

I did however see on one of the Discovery Alaska shows, they killed some caribou and left the hid on so it wouldn't cool too fast. they claimed if gets too cold too fast rigger couldn't set in. They claimed rigger helped the meat to break down. (make for tender-er meat.)
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Old Man Yager on November 02, 2015, 10:24:45 AM: I skin it quarter it and put it in my garage fridge same day. If it's cold enough in garage I might let it hang for a few, but it's been warm late in the year in WW, so I usually get it in the fridge right away.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: jackelope on November 02, 2015, 10:35:22 AM: Back east where it was actually cold during deer season, I never saw a deer hanging skinned. They were always with the hide on. I never skinned a deer out before butchering until I moved out west. Deer meat was always good. My take is that it totally depends on the weather. Here I don't think I've ever let them hang with the hide on for more than an hour or 2 before skinning and cleaning it up. I always put one of those full body sized game bags over the skinned carcass too.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: buckhorn2 on November 02, 2015, 10:36:09 AM: In Montana we skinned our in a friends yard he told us we should leave the hide on but we skinned it like we do on the westside 2 days later our deer were black from wind burn and we got hope we had to peel the skin off and it was like shoe leather now we leave the hide on but we go late and its usually cold.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Okanagan on November 02, 2015, 10:47:35 AM: Done it both ways, many times, and can't tell difference in meat quality if temperature is appropriate. Whether I skin deer right away:

1. Depends on temperature. Non-negotiable on that one.

2. Depends on time available, situation, and meat care facilities.

I've left hide on to keep it from freezing solid overnight, but that does not work in temps well below zero. I tend to bone it out if getting it to a vehicle is difficult, or bring it home and skin it within 24 hours if vehicle access is easy. But I have left deer unskinned for a week hanging outside in cold weather.

As usual, ain't no one way that fits all situations. Elk seem to spoil quicker than deer with hide on, so we tend to skin elk right away.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Smoke on November 02, 2015, 03:54:25 PM: in camp if it's warm I'll bone it out and get it in a cooler quick... if it's cool, I'll let it hang with the hide on till I get home, then skin it.. keeps the flys and bees off the meat..
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Buckmark on November 02, 2015, 04:10:52 PM: Hangem by the neck till it starts to slip/pull apart then you are good to go with skinnin and butcherin :chuckle:
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: h20hunter on November 02, 2015, 04:16:24 PM: :puke:
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: ghosthunter on November 02, 2015, 04:34:21 PM: Everybody I know , skins soon as posible.
Butcher told me if it is 40 degrees or up you are growing bacteria.

I go to greats lengths to keep all game cool and clean.

Shot my deer on Thursday 10:20 am. Drug it out hung it and skinned it by noon.
Wrapped it with game bags, and used some bug off stuff on it. Worked well.
Hung it tail up this time and stacked three blocks of ice in the chest ,body cavity to bring the temp below 40 over night.

Back of truck on tarp with eight blocks of ice. Four hours to butcher and got a that a boy for bringing in clean cool meat.

You get back what you take in. :twocents:
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: tgomez on November 02, 2015, 05:58:57 PM: I ALWAYS skin off the hide ASAP regardless of animal harvested. I guess that's just how we do it in the West. There is no reason to leave the hide on. I think it's a HUGE part of proper game cleaning. You want your meat to cool as fast as it can! :tup:
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: JakeLand on November 02, 2015, 07:01:30 PM: Well my 2 :twocents:is this I grew up on a working ranch and we would butcher and process all our own meat including all wild game.we had a drive in cooler ( for a forklift) and all animals were obviously gutted and cleaned pinned open and skinned ASAP my grandpa and dad said that meat when its cooling is like a sponge so whatever the hide was like is what would flavor the meat and none of our animals lived or rolled in GOOD seasoning
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: 300rum on November 03, 2015, 06:30:44 AM: I prefer to leave the hide on in Montana for the way home if I can. If the highs are in the low teens to negative when I take the animal, the animal will be just fine in the back of the truck. I will pull over and skin it on the way home, St. Regis or so, if it starts to get too warm.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Miles on November 03, 2015, 07:04:46 AM: In NH we would leave the hide on until it was time to cut the deer up. Hunting season there was normally in the low 30s but could be a lot lower as well. There were days were your hands would freeze if you tried to skin a deer. I can also remember bringing them into the heated garage just so they could thaw and you could get the hide off. We never had a deer spoil. It all depends on temps and location.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: birddogdad on November 03, 2015, 07:14:00 AM: in WA with elk season so close and 13 days following rifle deer, I bone and put the parts in my spare fridge in garage on all the shelves until I return from elk season every year... dry age a couple weeks.. remember, a "stinky" deer or elk, does not mean the meat has gone bad!

never hung with hide on in previous years, was taught that was not a good thing. guess only way to really know would be side by side hide on / off hang . try the meat after process and see if you can taste a difference?
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: runningboard on November 03, 2015, 07:29:11 AM: I always leave the hide on in cooler weather until the next day, sometimes for many days if cool enough, whitetail hides are not thick enough to hold in heat.

never had a problem with meat going bad or tasting "funny" by leaving the hide on until butchering. don't know if it's true but was told when younger that the skin pores tighten on the hair and it doesn't pull out a as easy so less hair on meat if you wait until it's cool to skin, my thought is that the meat is less moist to the touch and the hair will not stick to it as easy when cool during skinning.

elk? get it off ASAP, I always tell the kids in my Hunter Education classes that my elk are still kicking when I start skinning.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on November 03, 2015, 11:57:09 AM: Like Jackelope and Miles stated, until I moved west I never saw an animal hanging with the hide off. I've occasionally let one hang with the hide on overnight out here, and skinned in the morning, with no ill effects, but I generally either bone them out in the field, or skin and hang if temps are appropriate for just a couple days; if not, then quarters go in the garage fridge.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on November 03, 2015, 02:01:55 PM: As a general rule I always take the hide off. Even if not necessitated by transport, I usually do once its hung. But I have on a few occasions left hide on with no ill effects. Not something I will make a habit of, but not something foreign either.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: jstone on November 03, 2015, 02:20:31 PM: If the bucks are in the rut and yo leave the hide on a few days it will make the meat smell like rutty deer. Bad idea
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: predatorG on November 03, 2015, 09:20:38 PM: The one we got this year we left hide on and let it hang for 2 days because it was too warm to do any longer.

Our relatives back in Montana say they leave it skin on and let it hang a couple weeks until maggots start to show up right on the outside of skin. I've never tried it because it's too warm here, but there where it's low 40s or colder I might consider it. Damn good meat though.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: bobcat on November 03, 2015, 09:25:27 PM: If my deer hangs long enough and in warm enough temperatures that it's got maggots in the meat, sorry but I'd be throwing it in the garbage. :puke:
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: predatorG on November 04, 2015, 06:44:40 AM: Quote from: bobcat on November 03, 2015, 09:25:27 PM
If my deer hangs long enough and in warm enough temperatures that it's got maggots in the meat, sorry but I'd be throwing it in the garbage. :puke:

That's exactly my outlook on it. It's sounds nasty and like a terrible idea. The maggots might be BS but they do hang them for over a week.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: birddogdad on November 04, 2015, 07:34:49 AM: Quote from: bobcat on November 03, 2015, 09:25:27 PM
If my deer hangs long enough and in warm enough temperatures that it's got maggots in the meat, sorry but I'd be throwing it in the garbage. :puke:

:yeah:

why I put in fridge bob...oh, and make darn sure there are no flys inside when door gets shut...
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: huntingbaldguy on November 05, 2015, 02:23:50 AM: Wife and i gutted then hung my deer, then skinned it. Once skinned and hooves cut off, we washed it down with cold water, then sprayed with vinegar/water mix. Not that we really have a fly issue or that it was warm enough for them, but there was no issue really. People say bugs hate vinegar and it tenderizes the meat at the same time. Thought we would give it a try. It only hung for 24 hrs though, then we quartered and trimmed the carcass and had it in the fridge for another 4 days. Just finished today and the meat had no gamey smell to it at all.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: krout81 on November 05, 2015, 08:17:42 AM: I skin everything as fast as I can.
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Karl Blanchard on November 05, 2015, 08:47:14 AM: bone em in the field, bag em up and put them on ice in the cooler. IF its super cold out then bone em in the field, bag em up and just put them in the cooler with no ice. All this business of hanging, skin on and off, spraying meat, etc seems like a lot of work just to get to the same end result of boned out meat. Just my :twocents:
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Gobble on November 05, 2015, 08:57:25 AM: ALL my animals are skinned and boned out within an hour of being killed, then packed on ice in coolers. Cooling the meat down quickly provides the best table fare hands down and is the key to great tasting venison, no comparison. I learned this the hard way like everyone else, most all my animals now are cut into steaks and roasts, very little is made into hamburger because it was gamey :twocents:
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: Piscatory_5 on November 05, 2015, 09:51:17 AM: Never left hide on deer while hanging, and after this years deer being infested with ticks I cannot see how that would be a good idea. I removed hide when I hung the deer and didn't touch it until butchering 4 days later and after moving the hide the ticks were moving all over it. ICK!
Title: Re: HANGING DEER WITH HIDE ON ??
Post by: mossyhead on November 07, 2015, 09:50:05 PM: Quarter, skin , and bone out then in the cooler on ice with the drain plug open. Why pack out all of that bone and hide to turn around and discard anyway? I quarter both deer and elk with the guts in - it is much cleaner!