Post by: Bofire on December 28, 2015, 05:34:33 PM
Carl
Post by: jnevs23 on December 28, 2015, 05:42:02 PM
Post by: Buckewe on December 28, 2015, 05:43:21 PM
Post by: Duckslayer89 on December 28, 2015, 05:45:00 PM
Post by: papisjeep on December 28, 2015, 05:49:33 PM
most lockers spin tires equally
Post by: jackelope on December 28, 2015, 05:53:24 PM
most limited slips uses clutches and sense slippage then lock up
most lockers spin tires equally
:yeah:
Lockers are pretty much both axles/wheels are locked up all the time.
Detroit Locker, etc. Popular in hot rod, race car, drag car scenarios. Both tires are grabbing, hooking up and launching, but you don't have to worry about turning. Turning with a locker sucks.
Air lockers are cool, where you can engage and disengage them when needed.
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on December 28, 2015, 05:54:55 PM
most limited slips uses clutches and sense slippage then lock up
most lockers spin tires equally
This :tup: My 68 Chevelle did not have a POSI rear end so I went with a Yukon Locker last spring... made a WORLD of difference with that 454 churning. In the end, it was less expensive to go the locker route than to buy an old POSI rear and have it rebuilt, and, it is arguably stronger than a POSI?
Here's a brief description of the Yukon setup:
Features
•Hook up with the ultimate mechanical positive-locking differential—Yukon Gear & Axle Grizzly Lockers
•Perfect for street, off-road, drag racing, circle track
•Provides 100% power to both tires while allowing disengagement for turns
•Inner clutch teeth feature a larger base radius, improves strength over back-cut designs
•Larger teeth avoid breakage against shock-loading and during axle breaks
•Crafted using state-of-the-art equipment and manufacturing techniques
•All internals are hand fitted, for faster engagement
•Forged 8620 case & 8620 triple-alloy internals for maximum strength
•Quality construction and patent-pending design greatly reduce the chance of common locker failures
•Proudly assembled in the USA
Post by: jackelope on December 28, 2015, 05:56:11 PM
Wouldn't that be limited slip if it could alternate tire speed? I thought POSI was same as having a locker but I'm no mechanic
With a locker both wheels will spin at the same speed. With a posi it allows the wheels to turn at differenthe speeds. When turning the inside wheel needs to turn slower than the outside . I'm sure someone will give you a more technical answer.
Limited slips allow 1 tire to spin at a different speed than the other IE when you go around a corner...the inside tire is not spinning at the same speed as the outside tire. In a low traction situation, the clutches in the rear diff will lock the 2 axles up turning both rear wheels together for added traction. They sort of give a little until the power is put to them.
Post by: Shank on December 28, 2015, 06:24:09 PM
Chrysler term is sure grip
Jeep tru-trac
Blah blah blah
"LSD" are some form of traction adding device to the diff, be it clutches, or gear type, or what have you. It's the hop you feel on wet roads going around corners. They are factory installed because they are driver friendly and do give and allow the wheels to spin independently.
If your really stuck a LSD will help, but will end up just spinning the tire with the least amount of traction.
A locker is....well a locker
Meaning both axle shafts are locked
Both tires spin the same speed regardless of anything....and if they do spin at different speeds....you have problems!
When your really stuck... Both tires will spin..even if one is in the air
They are not factory installed (with a couple exceptions) due to there handling characteristics. Noisy, tire wear/scrubbing, excessive loads on drivetrain components. And unpredictable handling...
That's what I think I know about the two
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Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on December 28, 2015, 06:31:16 PM
Post by: Bofire on December 28, 2015, 07:13:27 PM
thanks
Post by: Skillet on December 28, 2015, 07:52:40 PM
A locker is a positive locking device, using either air pressure or a dog and ratchet design. Detroit Lockers are famous for their ratcheting sound when turning around corners.
A spool is a third member that permanently locked the axles together by design.
A poor man's spool is simply welding the spider gears together.
Post by: Bofire on December 28, 2015, 08:07:52 PM
Carl
Post by: Pinetar on December 28, 2015, 08:22:49 PM
When I have them all locked up it steers just fine.
Post by: Special T on December 28, 2015, 08:37:11 PM
LSD require wheel spin on one tire to engage the clutch in the rear end. Going around a corner under load wont engage but lighting them up will. You can tow a trailer with a LSD. Many are particular about the kind of rear end oil and additives used to get the proper ammount of slip and engagement. I know this because one of my dodge one ton trucks had an LSD that I blew the rear end in because I used the wrong oil additive. Do NOT use a detroit, Lock Right spool or other mecha ical locker if towing a load. You will eat up your rear end and tires. An air locker like an ARB or cable actuated OX locker or eletric acuated locker like found in some newer toyota and lexus suvs are the best of all worlds for on/off road.
If this is a mostly road truck get an air/cable locker for the best of both worlds.
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Post by: jackelope on December 28, 2015, 09:39:58 PM
What is the rear end in my truck? 2015 2500HD chev?? It says on the window sticker "locker" rear end it comes with the trailer tow package. so is that just a name for an old "posi" track or "limited" slip type rear end?
thanks
Look at the option codes in the bottom of the glove box. Limited slip is g80. Is it listed there?
Post by: Magnum_Willys on December 28, 2015, 10:14:39 PM
G80 - Limited Slip - Gov Locker: GM limited slip that has a spinning weight that engages a pawl that will lock the axle shafts if one side starts spinning faster than the other. Also called Gov-Bomb since it can be subjected to heavy forces at times.
LSD/Posi - Auburn, Power-Lock, Trak-lock: Clutch type - Always locks axles but clutches allow slip around corners - but also allow slip if one tire in air or on ice. Slip can be overcome with tapping breaks to a degree. The discontinued Power-lock had the advantage of clutches locking harder as the load increased.
Airlocker - Like a spool but can be unlocked to be an open rearend. Problematic at times due to air leaks and have to live with spool characteristics when locked.
An air-locked Detroit would be perfect but alas it doesn't exist.
Offroad I like a Detroit in the rear and a power-lock up front.
On-road I run an Auburn LSD in the rear of my Ram 1500
Even with lockers you need a winch sometimes !
Post by: Pinetar on December 28, 2015, 11:23:10 PM
Post by: Shank on December 29, 2015, 07:30:31 AM
Detroit Locker - both tires lock together except corners where outside tire can ratchet free to turn faster than inside tire. Best for anything hardcore where a tire may come off the ground which limited slips dont do so well. No clutches to wear, generally bulletproof except when turning with heavy trailer loads at slow speed.Beautiful looking truck!
G80 - Limited Slip - Gov Locker: GM limited slip that has a spinning weight that engages a pawl that will lock the axle shafts if one side starts spinning faster than the other. Also called Gov-Bomb since it can be subjected to heavy forces at times.
LSD/Posi - Auburn, Power-Lock, Trak-lock: Clutch type - Always locks axles but clutches allow slip around corners - but also allow slip if one tire in air or on ice. Slip can be overcome with tapping breaks to a degree. The discontinued Power-lock had the advantage of clutches locking harder as the load increased.
Airlocker - Like a spool but can be unlocked to be an open rearend. Problematic at times due to air leaks and have to live with spool characteristics when locked.
An air-locked Detroit would be perfect but alas it doesn't exist.
Offroad I like a Detroit in the rear and a power-lock up front.
On-road I run an Auburn LSD in the rear of my Ram 1500
Even with lockers you need a winch sometimes !
Told the wife one of these days I'd like to build one, for here to cruise around in
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Post by: bhawley76 on December 29, 2015, 08:04:23 AM
Post by: Born2late on December 29, 2015, 08:23:34 AM
Post by: Bofire on December 29, 2015, 10:06:55 AM
Carl
Post by: b23 on December 29, 2015, 01:26:14 PM
Circle track cars like DL's because when you're pushing the car around the pits it's an open rear end and MUCH easier to push a car around with a DL than a spool but out on the track it's mostly a spool. I say mostly because a DL reacts a little different on corner entry than does a spool but once you get used to it a DL gives you the best of both worlds, except the DL has quite a bit more rotating weight than does a spool.
A true Detroit Locker wouldn't really be the most user friendly unit for a daily driver. If you must have a locker type rear carrier in your daily driver something like an air locker is going to be much more friendly to drive.
As for the electronic "Locker" units that come from the factory in the Toyota or Jeep, I'm not exactly sure how they work, electromagnetic maybe. I've got one in my Toyota Tacoma and the Jeep Rubicon I had before the Tacoma had them front and rear. They work fine but unfortunately, both, will only engage if you're in four low and when I had my Rubicon locked up all the way around, you could hardly steer the d*mn thing, it just wanted to go straight.
Limited slip differentials, depending on the unit, are definitely better than open diffs but they're certainly not a locker. I had a friend that shimmed the springs in the limited slip unit he had in his old style Bronco and it worked very well but it also wore out the disks much faster too.
Post by: huntandjeep on December 29, 2015, 04:57:33 PM
Post by: b23 on December 29, 2015, 08:35:02 PM
A poor man's spool is simply welding the spider gears together.
Many years ago my folks had an aquaintance who was an older fella that was a member of the Yakima Ridge Runners. I got to talking to him about jeeping and what we each thought were the best years, best motors, best differentials, etc. and he asks me if I've ever heard of a "Lincoln Locker". Having never heard of such a thing I said a what?! He was kind of a jokester and he could tell I didn't have a clue what he was talking about so he played it up like I was an idiot for not knowing what the he11 a "Lincoln Locker" was so I finally asked him, ok what the heck is a Lincoln Locker. He says well, a Lincoln locker is just like a Miller Locker or a Hobart Locker. Ok, now I'm full on confused but I'm dying to know what these things are, when it hits me. Ohhhh, I get it you weld up the spider gears with a Lincoln, Miller, or Hobart welder and that's your "Lincoln Locker".
Post by: BigGoonTuna on December 30, 2015, 04:46:23 PM
with a limited slip(or posi as they're usually called) you get more traction than an open diff, but never really a full lock up like a detroit.
the trick to driving with a locker is to get off the throttle(or push in the clutch if you drive a real truck) when you go into a corner. that lets the outside wheel unlock and ratchet. makes getting into parking spaces interesting sometimes.
Post by: gonehuntin68 on January 01, 2016, 08:46:27 AM
most limited slips uses clutches and sense slippage then lock up
most lockers spin tires equally
This :tup: My 68 Chevelle did not have a POSI rear end so I went with a Yukon Locker last spring... made a WORLD of difference with that 454 churning. In the end, it was less expensive to go the locker route than to buy an old POSI rear and have it rebuilt, and, it is arguably stronger than a POSI?
Here's a brief description of the Yukon.
Features
•Hook up with the ultimate mechanical positive-locking differential—Yukon Gear & Axle Grizzly Lockers
•Perfect for street, off-road, drag racing, circle track
•Provides 100% power to both tires while allowing disengagement for turns
•Inner clutch teeth feature a larger base radius, improves strength over back-cut designs
•Larger teeth avoid breakage against shock-loading and during axle breaks
•Crafted using state-of-the-art equipment and manufacturing techniques
•All internals are hand fitted, for faster engagement
•Forged 8620 case & 8620 triple-alloy internals for maximum strength
•Quality construction and patent-pending design greatly reduce the chance of common locker failures
•Proudly assembled in the USA
I also have a 68 chevelle. Coolest muscle car ever. :)
Post by: b23 on January 02, 2016, 01:26:47 PM
I also have a 68 chevelle. Coolest muscle car ever. :)
I'm not really even a GM guy but I'd have to 100% agree.
Probably the biggest baddest "production" muscle car ever built was the 1970 Chevelle with the LS6 454. Those things were a monster!