Post by: bearpaw on January 30, 2016, 01:05:25 PM
http://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/gun-shots/first-look-new-65-300-weatherby-magnum-cartridge
I'm curious if anyone has any experience or knowledge regarding this new cartridge?
Post by: Bill W on January 30, 2016, 01:09:14 PM
Post by: bearpaw on January 30, 2016, 01:26:09 PM
Post by: coachcw on January 31, 2016, 06:54:35 AM
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 31, 2016, 07:57:12 AM
Post by: yorketransport on January 31, 2016, 08:17:24 AM
Now if you really want to get a 6.5 bullet moving you can give the 6.5 Badger or 6.5 RUM a try. Why shoot 140s at 3400fps when you can hit that with a 160 with a better BC? :chuckle:
Post by: jackelope on January 31, 2016, 08:34:20 AM
Post by: bobcat on January 31, 2016, 08:45:27 AM
Post by: kentrek on January 31, 2016, 08:56:43 AM
My concern with a cartridge like this would be the very short barrel life. Shoot a couple hundred rounds, then it's time to buy a new barrel and pay a gunsmith to install it. No thanks. Just not my thing I guess.
Prolly get 600-900 rounds out of it...for most people shooting factory ammunition that will be plenty for a hunting gun
reloaders and target shooters are a bit different tho ;)
Post by: yorketransport on January 31, 2016, 08:58:34 AM
Andrew is the RUM a necked down .300 rum case?
Yup. The 6.5 Badger that BiggerHammer designed is off of an improved version of the shorter 338 RUM case. After tweaking the case taper and shoulder angle it ends up with the same capacity as an unmodified RUM case. The big advantage is that the shorter 338 RUM case allows the Badger to work as a repeater on a Rem 700 action with the long VLD bullets. The 6.5 RUM will have the same capacity and ballistics but it can't' run as a repeater without seating the bullets deeper.
I'm getting 3430 fps with a 160gr Matrix VLD from my 30" 6.5 Badger in the right conditions. The biggest problem is that US869 is about the only suitable powder and 869 is incredibly temperature sensitive. I get the 3430 when temps are above 55*. When it's colder than that velocities start dropping. I was getting 3360 fps with the same load when I chronographed them at 34*.
I have a 270 RUM reamer sitting on my bench that may be a bit better than the 6.5 versions. I think that the 270 version will allow the use of more stable stick powders without having the powder bridging problems that the 6.5 has. I had a 1-10" twist 270 RUM that would throw 140 ballistic tips at nearly 3600 fps but it didn't do well with heavier bullets. I'm waiting to build another one off of a 1-8 twist blank. Too many projects and not enough time though!
My concern with a cartridge like this would be the very short barrel life. Shoot a couple hundred rounds, then it's time to buy a new barrel and pay a gunsmith to install it. No thanks. Just not my thing I guess.
This is why the Savages are so nice. I can have a new barrel cut for about $350 and threaded on in less than 10 minutes. Plus the Weatherby should last at least 800 rounds, probably more if you take care of it. That's a couple years of long range shooting and probably a life time as a hunting rifle. When you think about how much money it would cost to shoot 800 rounds through that gun, replacing a barrel every 4 years doesn't seem too bad. :twocents:
Post by: grundy53 on January 31, 2016, 09:37:49 AM
My concern with a cartridge like this would be the very short barrel life. Shoot a couple hundred rounds, then it's time to buy a new barrel and pay a gunsmith to install it. No thanks. Just not my thing I guess.That's a lifetime for most hunting rifles.
Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk
Post by: b23 on January 31, 2016, 10:38:04 AM
Andrew is the RUM a necked down .300 rum case?
Yup. The 6.5 Badger that BiggerHammer designed is off of an improved version of the shorter 338 RUM case. After tweaking the case taper and shoulder angle it ends up with the same capacity as an unmodified RUM case. The big advantage is that the shorter 338 RUM case allows the Badger to work as a repeater on a Rem 700 action with the long VLD bullets. The 6.5 RUM will have the same capacity and ballistics but it can't' run as a repeater without seating the bullets deeper.
I'm getting 3430 fps with a 160gr Matrix VLD from my 30" 6.5 Badger in the right conditions. The biggest problem is that US869 is about the only suitable powder and 869 is incredibly temperature sensitive. I get the 3430 when temps are above 55*. When it's colder than that velocities start dropping. I was getting 3360 fps with the same load when I chronographed them at 34*.
I have a 270 RUM reamer sitting on my bench that may be a bit better than the 6.5 versions. I think that the 270 version will allow the use of more stable stick powders without having the powder bridging problems that the 6.5 has. I had a 1-10" twist 270 RUM that would throw 140 ballistic tips at nearly 3600 fps but it didn't do well with heavier bullets. I'm waiting to build another one off of a 1-8 twist blank. Too many projects and not enough time though!My concern with a cartridge like this would be the very short barrel life. Shoot a couple hundred rounds, then it's time to buy a new barrel and pay a gunsmith to install it. No thanks. Just not my thing I guess.
This is why the Savages are so nice. I can have a new barrel cut for about $350 and threaded on in less than 10 minutes. Plus the Weatherby should last at least 800 rounds, probably more if you take care of it. That's a couple years of long range shooting and probably a life time as a hunting rifle. When you think about how much money it would cost to shoot 800 rounds through that gun, replacing a barrel every 4 years doesn't seem too bad. :twocents:
How close to engagement are you seating your bullets?
I ask because its been my experience US869 does funny things when it's not loaded with the bullets touching or within 10-15thou of touching. Whenever I start jumping them 30thou + or ++ I get BIG swings in ES. If you're shooting near max you'll likely have to reduce your load when you change your seating depth. If you're already seating them that close, disregard.
Post by: CAMPMEAT on February 07, 2016, 02:28:27 PM
Post by: yorketransport on February 07, 2016, 04:04:29 PM
The guys I know that shoot long-range once a month, shoot 90-100 each time. They use a bunch of different flavors of calibers just to see how they work...
If I were shooting the 6.5-300 Weatherby at that rate I'd just invest in a lathe and a pile of barrel blanks. :chuckle: Long range shooting is sort of like golf; it "requires" a different gun for every scenario. I usually drag a few different guns with me when I go out so I have something to shoot while the others are cooling down. It also gives me an excuse to shoot a smaller caliber when I get tire of being beat up by the big guns. :chuckle:
Post by: CAMPMEAT on February 07, 2016, 05:05:04 PM
The guys I know that shoot long-range once a month, shoot 90-100 each time. They use a bunch of different flavors of calibers just to see how they work...
If I were shooting the 6.5-300 Weatherby at that rate I'd just invest in a lathe and a pile of barrel blanks. :chuckle: Long range shooting is sort of like golf; it "requires" a different gun for every scenario. I usually drag a few different guns with me when I go out so I have something to shoot while the others are cooling down. It also gives me an excuse to shoot a smaller caliber when I get tire of being beat up by the big guns. :chuckle:
That's what I was getting at, burning up barrels. Here, you have to use the same guns throughout the shoot. Bolt gun, the an AR-15 or AR-10 course. Even a 22 sometimes.
Post by: bearpaw on February 07, 2016, 05:23:01 PM
Post by: TVHunts on February 07, 2016, 06:56:04 PM
A guy better be lucky on figuring out a round it likes quickly!
Post by: WoodlandShooter on February 08, 2016, 08:47:52 AM
Post by: bearpaw on February 08, 2016, 11:43:47 AM
Post by: BULLBLASTER on February 08, 2016, 12:23:43 PM
With that case I'd be looking on the heavy end. 142 ablr in factory ammo? Or 143 eld-x?
Post by: WoodlandShooter on February 08, 2016, 12:45:21 PM
assuming 3315 MV and standard conditions.
Post by: bearpaw on February 08, 2016, 01:40:51 PM
The ballistic coefficient on the 142 LRAC is crazy good!
Post by: WoodlandShooter on February 08, 2016, 02:15:37 PM
for example, the 150 in .277 is advertised at .625, while in practice, they are actually .582
Post by: bearpaw on February 08, 2016, 02:48:18 PM
Post by: bearpaw on February 10, 2016, 08:40:37 AM
Post by: b23 on February 10, 2016, 01:51:51 PM
I can't find any 6.5-300 wtby's for sale yet, but had a new idea, I've got a 300 wtby that needs a new barrel, I called Benchmark and asked about putting a 6.5 barrel on my 300, but they said there isn't a standardized reamer available yet. I was told to wait about 6 months and then check back. I'm going to wait a while and then check again to see if a standardized reamer is available. (Chris at Benchmark was extremely helpful, thanks much Chris!)
Since they 26 Nosler is a twin to a 6.5-300wby why not just do a 26 Nosler and not have to wait??
Post by: Reidus on February 10, 2016, 02:46:20 PM
Post by: bearpaw on February 10, 2016, 04:57:38 PM
Post by: jackelope on February 10, 2016, 05:17:43 PM
I think it's what the 26 Nosler should have been! If you're going for a hyper velocity 6.5, why not to with the fastest? I do wish they had gone with a better bullet in the 140 class. The A-Frame is a great hunting bullet but has the BC of a brick. It doesn't make much sense in a long range gun/cailber. Handload the better 140+gr bullets and it will be even better.
Now if you really want to get a 6.5 bullet moving you can give the 6.5 Badger or 6.5 RUM a try. Why shoot 140s at 3400fps when you can hit that with a 160 with a better BC? :chuckle:
:dunno:
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 10, 2016, 05:19:30 PM
Post by: bobcat on February 10, 2016, 05:29:17 PM
Post by: bearpaw on February 10, 2016, 05:31:59 PM
I think it's what the 26 Nosler should have been! If you're going for a hyper velocity 6.5, why not to with the fastest? I do wish they had gone with a better bullet in the 140 class. The A-Frame is a great hunting bullet but has the BC of a brick. It doesn't make much sense in a long range gun/cailber. Handload the better 140+gr bullets and it will be even better.
Now if you really want to get a 6.5 bullet moving you can give the 6.5 Badger or 6.5 RUM a try. Why shoot 140s at 3400fps when you can hit that with a 160 with a better BC? :chuckle:
:dunno:
I like the way he thinks! Is there factory brass available for the 6.5 badger or 6.5 RUM, or would I have to make brass?
Another one is the 6.5 STW. I was going to do a 6.5-300wby but with all the 7stw cases I have been buying I decided to go with the 6.5 STW. It and the 6.5-300wby will run pretty dang close to the same and both a little faster then the 26 nosler.
I read about it too, but would have to make brass and I don't have any stw like you! Somewhere I also read about a 270 RUM, necked down 7mm or 300 RUM brass. There are a ton of wildcats out there!
Let me ask this: what would be the downside of going with something that's a little more "standard" but still has plenty of speed and long range capability, such as the 7mm RUM?
:tup: I'm wanting to go with a cartridge that is available over the counter! I am also looking at the 7 RUM.
Post by: 2labs on February 10, 2016, 05:33:55 PM
Post by: Taco280AI on February 10, 2016, 05:39:33 PM
Post by: bearpaw on February 10, 2016, 06:00:55 PM
What's the barrel life? Swap it out with every box of ammo? :chuckle:
I don't care, I've got standard calibers already, I want something crazy fast where I hold dead on out to 400+, if it only last a few hundred rounds I'm fine with that! :dunno:
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 10, 2016, 06:03:24 PM
Another one is the 6.5 STW. I was going to do a 6.5-300wby but with all the 7stw cases I have been buying I decided to go with the 6.5 STW. It and the 6.5-300wby will run pretty dang close to the same and both a little faster then the 26 nosler.
I read about it too, but would have to make brass and I don't have any stw like you! Somewhere I also read about a 270 RUM, necked down 7mm or 300 RUM brass. There are a ton of wildcats out there![/quote]
There is a company that makes brass you can buy for it. It is just not in stock to often.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/578531/quality-cartridge-reloading-brass-65mm-stw-box-of-20
You can also make it from 8mm and 7 stw. With the 7stw brass you can just size, trim and load. So it's a pretty easy wildcat and brass is not to bad at 2-3.00 a case. Just food for thought.
Post by: jackelope on February 10, 2016, 08:28:50 PM
I think it's what the 26 Nosler should have been! If you're going for a hyper velocity 6.5, why not to with the fastest? I do wish they had gone with a better bullet in the 140 class. The A-Frame is a great hunting bullet but has the BC of a brick. It doesn't make much sense in a long range gun/cailber. Handload the better 140+gr bullets and it will be even better.
Now if you really want to get a 6.5 bullet moving you can give the 6.5 Badger or 6.5 RUM a try. Why shoot 140s at 3400fps when you can hit that with a 160 with a better BC? :chuckle:
:dunno:
I like the way he thinks! Is there factory brass available for the 6.5 badger or 6.5 RUM, or would I have to make brass?
I'm pretty sure that Biggerhammer and/or Yorketransport created the 6.5 Badger. Hopefully Yorke chimes in again and clarifies.
Post by: mountainman on February 10, 2016, 09:09:34 PM
Been around for awhile, short of a few tweaks to make it "original"..I think it's what the 26 Nosler should have been! If you're going for a hyper velocity 6.5, why not to with the fastest? I do wish they had gone with a better bullet in the 140 class. The A-Frame is a great hunting bullet but has the BC of a brick. It doesn't make much sense in a long range gun/cailber. Handload the better 140+gr bullets and it will be even better.
Now if you really want to get a 6.5 bullet moving you can give the 6.5 Badger or 6.5 RUM a try. Why shoot 140s at 3400fps when you can hit that with a 160 with a better BC? :chuckle:
:dunno:
I like the way he thinks! Is there factory brass available for the 6.5 badger or 6.5 RUM, or would I have to make brass?
I'm pretty sure that Biggerhammer and/or Yorketransport created the 6.5 Badger. Hopefully Yorke chimes in again and clarifies.
Post by: yorketransport on February 10, 2016, 09:58:40 PM
Been around for awhile, short of a few tweaks to make it "original"..
Pretty much. It's similar to Kirby Allen's 6.5 Allen Mag ballistically and dimensionally.
I like the way he thinks! Is there factory brass available for the 6.5 badger or 6.5 RUM, or would I have to make brass?Another one is the 6.5 STW. I was going to do a 6.5-300wby but with all the 7stw cases I have been buying I decided to go with the 6.5 STW. It and the 6.5-300wby will run pretty dang close to the same and both a little faster then the 26 nosler.
I read about it too, but would have to make brass and I don't have any stw like you! Somewhere I also read about a 270 RUM, necked down 7mm or 300 RUM brass. There are a ton of wildcats out there!
The 6.5 RUM is an easy round to load for and form brass, but no factory ammo. Same goes for the 270 RUM. Both of them just use 7mm RUM brass and can get necked down using either 270 WSM or 6.5 WSM dies. I actually have 270 RUM reamer sitting on my bench waiting for a 1-8" twist barrel.
Post by: mountainman on February 10, 2016, 10:00:11 PM
:yeah:Been around for awhile, short of a few tweaks to make it "original"..
Pretty much. It's similar to Kirby Allen's 6.5 Allen Mag ballistically and dimensionally.I like the way he thinks! Is there factory brass available for the 6.5 badger or 6.5 RUM, or would I have to make brass?Another one is the 6.5 STW. I was going to do a 6.5-300wby but with all the 7stw cases I have been buying I decided to go with the 6.5 STW. It and the 6.5-300wby will run pretty dang close to the same and both a little faster then the 26 nosler.
I read about it too, but would have to make brass and I don't have any stw like you! Somewhere I also read about a 270 RUM, necked down 7mm or 300 RUM brass. There are a ton of wildcats out there!
The 6.5 RUM is an easy round to load for and form brass, but no factory ammo. Same goes for the 270 RUM. Both of them just use 7mm RUM brass and can get necked down using either 270 WSM or 6.5 WSM dies. I actually have 270 RUM reamer sitting on my bench waiting for a 1-8" twist barrel.
Post by: bobcat on February 10, 2016, 10:12:40 PM
Post by: mountainman on February 10, 2016, 10:14:44 PM
Post by: yorketransport on February 10, 2016, 10:25:38 PM
So... can someone tell me, what will any of these wildcat cartridges do that a 7 RUM can't?
Be something other than a 7mm RUM. :dunno:
A 2001 Kia Rio with 300K miles on it will get you back and forth to work, so why own anything else? I personally don't like going to a parking lot and seeing 14 cars just like mine. I feel the same way about my guns. :twocents:
Post by: bobcat on February 10, 2016, 10:31:46 PM
I guess I don't get it. Bearpaw is looking for a flat shooting hunting rifle. What I was curious about is how much better is the 6.5-300 Weatherby than a more standard chambering like the 7mm RUM?
Ignoring the fact that the 6.5-300 Weatherby is just "different," how is it better other than that? Remember, he said he wants to be able to buy factory ammo.
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 10, 2016, 10:44:36 PM
So... can someone tell me, what will any of these wildcat cartridges do that a 7 RUM can't?
The 6.5-300 wby ballistic is pretty much a match with a 6.5 stw so here is some data for you to see a difference.
Same barrel length,same powder and bullets within 8 grains of each other.
7 RUM/POWDER US869/104 GRAINS/VELOCITY 3250 26" BARREL/BC .611 NLRA with a 150 grain bullet.
1000 yards drop -205in/velocity 1830fps/KE 1117 FT LBS
6.5 STW/POWDER US869/88 GRAINS/VELOCITY 3400 26" BARREL/BC .719 NLRA with a 142 grain bullet.
1000 YARDS DROP -171in/ velocity 2125fps/KE 1424 FT LBS
So with 15% less powder. At 1000 yards: I have 34" less drop/ 295 fps faster/ with 307 more ft pounds of KE. With the 6,5 STW over the 7 RUM.
That is a very big advantage over a 7 RUM for me.
Post by: yorketransport on February 10, 2016, 10:53:40 PM
So you're saying a 7mm RUM is comparable to a Kia?
I guess I don't get it. Bearpaw is looking for a flat shooting hunting rifle. What I was curious about is how much better is the 6.5-300 Weatherby than a more standard chambering like the 7mm RUM?
Ignoring the fact that the 6.5-300 Weatherby is just "different," how is it better other than that? Remember, he said he wants to be able to buy factory ammo.
It doesn't need to be better, just different. And yes, a 7mm RUM is kind of the Kia of the long range world. There are better options out there for people who are looking for specialized equipment. The 7mm RUM is a great caliber but it's not necessarily the best. I ran a 7mm RUM for long range shooting for a while and it worked great when I ran the 200 gr Wildcat bullets. I switched to the 6.5 Badger for my small bore long range gun and I've never missed the 7mm RUM.
Post by: jackelope on February 10, 2016, 11:04:47 PM
So you're saying a 7mm RUM is comparable to a Kia?
I guess I don't get it. Bearpaw is looking for a flat shooting hunting rifle. What I was curious about is how much better is the 6.5-300 Weatherby than a more standard chambering like the 7mm RUM?
Ignoring the fact that the 6.5-300 Weatherby is just "different," how is it better other than that? Remember, he said he wants to be able to buy factory ammo.
When did he say a 7rum was comparable to a KIA? Better yet, why on God's green earth would anyone say that?
Post by: bobcat on February 10, 2016, 11:11:38 PM
Post by: jackelope on February 10, 2016, 11:18:52 PM
Why would anyone say that? Well, it would be a better question for Yorke, since I'm not the long range guru. But, what he said is that it's "the Kia of the long range world."
It's a figure of speech. The plain, un-exciting, boring(all like a KIA is) cartridge of the long range rifle world. Id assume you've heard those sort of comparisons before.
Post by: bobcat on February 10, 2016, 11:21:49 PM
Post by: bearpaw on February 11, 2016, 05:14:31 AM
So you're saying a 7mm RUM is comparable to a Kia?
I guess I don't get it. Bearpaw is looking for a flat shooting hunting rifle. What I was curious about is how much better is the 6.5-300 Weatherby than a more standard chambering like the 7mm RUM?
Ignoring the fact that the 6.5-300 Weatherby is just "different," how is it better other than that? Remember, he said he wants to be able to buy factory ammo.
It doesn't need to be better, just different. And yes, a 7mm RUM is kind of the Kia of the long range world. There are better options out there for people who are looking for specialized equipment. The 7mm RUM is a great caliber but it's not necessarily the best. I ran a 7mm RUM for long range shooting for a while and it worked great when I ran the 200 gr Wildcat bullets. I switched to the 6.5 Badger for my small bore long range gun and I've never missed the 7mm RUM.
I read through one of your old topics on the 6.5 badger, I had forgotten how fast that cartridge is! :yike:
http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,153858.50.html
So now you've confused me even more about what I should have made! :chuckle:
How much trouble do you have making cases? I saw that it's a 338 RUM necked down.
What load and speed are you doing?
What do you think is the optimal barrel length?
Is there a barrel supplier who has a reamer?
Post by: yorketransport on February 11, 2016, 09:00:21 PM
I read through one of your old topics on the 6.5 badger, I had forgotten how fast that cartridge is! :yike:
http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,153858.50.html
So now you've confused me even more about what I should have made! :chuckle:
How much trouble do you have making cases? I saw that it's a 338 RUM necked down.
What load and speed are you doing?
What do you think is the optimal barrel length?
Is there a barrel supplier who has a reamer?
Making brass from 338 RUM isn't that bad if you've dealt with wildcats before. I take 338 RUM cases and neck them down using a 300 SAUM, 7mm WSM, 270 WSM and then a 6.5 Badger die. Then you anneal the brass, load it up with a fireforming load of Bullseye and Cream of Wheat with a toilet paper plug and shoot them in the garage to form the brass. :tup: Going from longer 7mm or 300 RUM brass is a bit more work but it can be done as well.
I haven't played around to much with the load development mostly because of the limited barrel life. I started with 26 Nosler max charges and worked up until I started seeing reduced gains in velocity per grain of powder. For the most part with US 869 I gain about 50 fps/per grain. Once the velocity increase per grain starts to drop down to about 15 fps/per grain I know that I've hit the practical limit of usable powder in the case. At that point I either go to a slower powder or just call it quits. The whole time I'm doing the incremental steps in powder charges I'm measuring case head expansion looking for any load that gives more than .004" in expansion. That's about the upper limit for me, but I know a lot of guys who will run them up to .005" case head expansion. I ended up right around 93 grains of US 869 with the 160gr Matrix bullets moving at about 3430 fps. This changes based on temperature though since 869 gets some significant velocity swings at different temps. BiggerHammer worked more with the bullets in the 140 range with his barrel.
My barrel is a 30" bull barrel that's 1" at the muzzle and I'm pretty sure that BiggerHammer's barrel is a 26" varmint contour. His plans were to use his a hunting barrel so he went a little shorter/lighter than mine. I didn't want to run a muzzle brake so I went with a pretty heavy barrel. My barrel is a rechamberd McGowen that started life as an 8 twist 6.5x284 I think. BH's is a Black Hole barrel. I wouldn't recommend the Black Hole barrel though. The polygonal rifling doesn't seem to be getting a good grip on the 160gr bullets at those speeds. It looks like the bullets aren't fully stabilizing.
As far as the reamer, I have a resize/rougher reamer and BiggerHammer has the finish reamer. Maybe you could shoot him a PM and ask him about it. :chuckle: Sorry, I couldn't resist.
Post by: bearpaw on February 11, 2016, 09:17:06 PM
Thanks for all the info, great learning process!
Post by: bearpaw on February 26, 2016, 04:39:43 AM
I haven't found any 6.5-300 dies in stock yet, does anyone know where they might be available?
If I can't find any 6.5-300 dies may have to go with the 340 which would be fine.
Post by: bobcat on February 26, 2016, 06:10:35 AM
Post by: high country on February 26, 2016, 06:50:16 AM
All from a real 6.5 junky.
Post by: birddogdad on February 26, 2016, 07:02:40 AM
Post by: b23 on February 26, 2016, 09:55:53 AM
I have a Mark V 300 Wtby that needs a new barrel so I sent a message to Weatherby asking if they do that. They returned a message that if I send my rifle in they will screw a new accumark barrel on it and I can even get a new accumark stock to properly fit the barrel. I went ahead and put in my order without specifying a caliber, still undecided between a 340 and a 6.5-300. I've already got the 340 reloading components so if I went with the 6.5-300 I would have to find reloading dies.
I haven't found any 6.5-300 dies in stock yet, does anyone know where they might be available?
If I can't find any 6.5-300 dies may have to go with the 340 which would be fine.
Why couldn't you use a 300 Wby bushing die with the appropriate 6.5 bushing???
Post by: high country on February 26, 2016, 08:41:27 PM
I have a Mark V 300 Wtby that needs a new barrel so I sent a message to Weatherby asking if they do that. They returned a message that if I send my rifle in they will screw a new accumark barrel on it and I can even get a new accumark stock to properly fit the barrel. I went ahead and put in my order without specifying a caliber, still undecided between a 340 and a 6.5-300. I've already got the 340 reloading components so if I went with the 6.5-300 I would have to find reloading dies.
I haven't found any 6.5-300 dies in stock yet, does anyone know where they might be available?
If I can't find any 6.5-300 dies may have to go with the 340 which would be fine.
Why couldn't you use a 300 Wby bushing die with the appropriate 6.5 bushing???
30 to 264 may be a bit of a stretch to resize without a 7 in there, but a 290ish bushing should able to pull it off.....good thinking.
Post by: dontgetcrabs on February 26, 2016, 09:18:34 PM
I have a Mark V 300 Wtby that needs a new barrel so I sent a message to Weatherby asking if they do that. They returned a message that if I send my rifle in they will screw a new accumark barrel on it and I can even get a new accumark stock to properly fit the barrel. I went ahead and put in my order without specifying a caliber, still undecided between a 340 and a 6.5-300. I've already got the 340 reloading components so if I went with the 6.5-300 I would have to find reloading dies.
I haven't found any 6.5-300 dies in stock yet, does anyone know where they might be available?
If I can't find any 6.5-300 dies may have to go with the 340 which would be fine.
Why couldn't you use a 300 Wby bushing die with the appropriate 6.5 bushing???
You can. I go from .308 to .264 all the time in one step. Heck I've gone .308 to .257 with no issues at all. :tup:
Post by: high country on February 26, 2016, 10:58:35 PM
Post by: jasnt on February 28, 2016, 07:11:18 AM
Post by: matt509 on March 09, 2016, 09:15:37 AM
1) Why with the temperature differential with US869; is this the only powder being used for these rounds? With velocity vs. temp variations of over 100 fps....that definitely rules it out for me. Especially for Long Range Hunting. I test my powders (well not any more, I know which powders are temp stable, and I stay with those) and stick with them for shooting.
2) In our experience we haven't found the 6.5 class of bullets to really care for any velocities over 3250-3300 fps. It seems they have a couple really sweet spots around 2750-2850 and 3100-3200 (In our precision rifle competitions, we are speed capped at 3200 fps).
3) Barrel life on any overbore cartridge, should not be a concern......It is going to burn up!! Faster burning powders, at higher velocities = It will burn up quicker.
I literally just went through this. I have somewhat of a different set of standards to choosing a wildcat. Long story short, I went 6.5 WSM; and here is why.
a) You can feed these full houses of Retumbo or H1000 (both of which are slower burning powders, minimizing throat erosion & both are extremely temp stable) and get decent velocities. I plan on pushing the Nosler 130 LR AB exclusively. I am aware the B.C. projections seem un doubtedly high, but Bryan Litz has done extensive testing on them. In his testing he found "when the projectile is properly stabilized (over 1.8 on the Miller stability chart) the advertised B.C. is within 2-3%). My set up, 8 twist barrel with velocities over 3100 fps, I achieve roughly 1.88-1.92 on the Miller stability.
b) How good of brass can I get? How big of a pain in the ass is this gonna be to make? Essentially, the 6.5 WSM is named the 6.5-300 WSM. You can purchase these dies from Midway, Brownells, Sinclair, etc. Already made, and you can usually find them in stock. I went with the Redding Full Length kit, as I am not a fan of the Lee dies. Now on to the brass. I looked at the SAAMI specs of the WSM family and started comparing prints. To my surprise the 300 WSM & 270 WSM are identical, other than neck diameter. Now, what kind of brass can I get? A quick Google search showed me that Bullets.com carries Norma 270 WSM brass, at not too bad of a price......Perfect I ordered 50 pieces, as this is a hunting rifle and 50 pieces should last a long time. Now the 270 actually carries an I.D. of .277", where as my 6.5 carries an I.D. of .264" = -.013" a simple one step neck down, with no neck turning, no donut, etc.
- Disclaimer-I hate brass prep!!! I will not turn necks, debur flash holes, anything other than sizing and trimming to length.
c) Since, I could find factory dies available, I knew there was a reamer out there. Now to find what gunsmith had it......I called my gunsmith, and alas....he owns one!!! Jackpot!!! Box it up, and send it over the mountain to him!! I should have this build back by the end of March, and have a load developed within a couple weeks. I will update as necessary.
**This build had a couple requirements for it.
1. Lightweight - I am going to weigh in at 8 lbs with scope, bipod, and full mag. I had a Proof Carbon Fiber barrel laying around in 6.5, A Manners carbon fiber elite stock with DBM already inletted, and a Tikka T3 action. I purchased a Vortex PST 6-24 as it weighed in at 28 oz, the lightest scope with all the features I was looking for.
2. I wanted a laser beam that maintained over 1000 ft/lbs of kinetic energy at 1000 yards. I used a 4" circle as my maximum point blank reference. So I will zero this rifle at 250 yards, which will put me 2" high at 150 yards; zeroed at 250; and fall out of my 4" circle (-2" from zero) at 300 yards. At 1000 yards, it will drop -187.2"; or 5.2 mils; will deflect 43" (1.2 mils) and still maintain 1083 ft/lbs.
Post by: yorketransport on March 10, 2016, 05:34:36 AM
Wow.....there are a couple things in here that really surprise me, and also a couple questions that I have.
1) Why with the temperature differential with US869; is this the only powder being used for these rounds? With velocity vs. temp variations of over 100 fps....that definitely rules it out for me. Especially for Long Range Hunting. I test my powders (well not any more, I know which powders are temp stable, and I stay with those) and stick with them for shooting.
The best answers to that are powder bridging and burn rate. When you burn that much powder in a relatively small bore, wide bodied case you get powder bridging issues which can cause erratic pressures. Think of dumping 95 grains of H1000 into a powder funnel with a .264 diameter hole. All of the powder jams up in the neck and it doesn't flow smooth. Now take a ball powder like US 869, H335 or something like that and do the same thing. The ball powders flow through like water.
US869 is about the slowest burning ball powder that will work in such a large capacity small bore case. Sometime you just have to use what works.
Post by: high country on March 10, 2016, 06:22:51 AM
Wow.....there are a couple things in here that really surprise me, and also a couple questions that I have.
1) Why with the temperature differential with US869; is this the only powder being used for these rounds? With velocity vs. temp variations of over 100 fps....that definitely rules it out for me. Especially for Long Range Hunting. I test my powders (well not any more, I know which powders are temp stable, and I stay with those) and stick with them for shooting.
2) In our experience we haven't found the 6.5 class of bullets to really care for any velocities over 3250-3300 fps. It seems they have a couple really sweet spots around 2750-2850 and 3100-3200 (In our precision rifle competitions, we are speed capped at 3200 fps).
3) Barrel life on any overbore cartridge, should not be a concern......It is going to burn up!! Faster burning powders, at higher velocities = It will burn up quicker.
I literally just went through this. I have somewhat of a different set of standards to choosing a wildcat. Long story short, I went 6.5 WSM; and here is why.
a) You can feed these full houses of Retumbo or H1000 (both of which are slower burning powders, minimizing throat erosion & both are extremely temp stable) and get decent velocities. I plan on pushing the Nosler 130 LR AB exclusively. I am aware the B.C. projections seem un doubtedly high, but Bryan Litz has done extensive testing on them. In his testing he found "when the projectile is properly stabilized (over 1.8 on the Miller stability chart) the advertised B.C. is within 2-3%). My set up, 8 twist barrel with velocities over 3100 fps, I achieve roughly 1.88-1.92 on the Miller stability.
b) How good of brass can I get? How big of a pain in the ass is this gonna be to make? Essentially, the 6.5 WSM is named the 6.5-300 WSM. You can purchase these dies from Midway, Brownells, Sinclair, etc. Already made, and you can usually find them in stock. I went with the Redding Full Length kit, as I am not a fan of the Lee dies. Now on to the brass. I looked at the SAAMI specs of the WSM family and started comparing prints. To my surprise the 300 WSM & 270 WSM are identical, other than neck diameter. Now, what kind of brass can I get? A quick Google search showed me that Bullets.com carries Norma 270 WSM brass, at not too bad of a price......Perfect I ordered 50 pieces, as this is a hunting rifle and 50 pieces should last a long time. Now the 270 actually carries an I.D. of .277", where as my 6.5 carries an I.D. of .264" = -.013" a simple one step neck down, with no neck turning, no donut, etc.
- Disclaimer-I hate brass prep!!! I will not turn necks, debur flash holes, anything other than sizing and trimming to length.
c) Since, I could find factory dies available, I knew there was a reamer out there. Now to find what gunsmith had it......I called my gunsmith, and alas....he owns one!!! Jackpot!!! Box it up, and send it over the mountain to him!! I should have this build back by the end of March, and have a load developed within a couple weeks. I will update as necessary.
**This build had a couple requirements for it.
1. Lightweight - I am going to weigh in at 8 lbs with scope, bipod, and full mag. I had a Proof Carbon Fiber barrel laying around in 6.5, A Manners carbon fiber elite stock with DBM already inletted, and a Tikka T3 action. I purchased a Vortex PST 6-24 as it weighed in at 28 oz, the lightest scope with all the features I was looking for.
2. I wanted a laser beam that maintained over 1000 ft/lbs of kinetic energy at 1000 yards. I used a 4" circle as my maximum point blank reference. So I will zero this rifle at 250 yards, which will put me 2" high at 150 yards; zeroed at 250; and fall out of my 4" circle (-2" from zero) at 300 yards. At 1000 yards, it will drop -187.2"; or 5.2 mils; will deflect 43" (1.2 mils) and still maintain 1083 ft/lbs.
It's not just you on the velocity windows. I contacted litz when I started into the 6.5's and he told me to push them around 2800- 2900. I have built several now and they do like it there for sure.
Post by: bearpaw on March 13, 2016, 05:58:30 PM
Post by: mountainman on March 13, 2016, 06:41:35 PM
Thanks for the comments everyone, I still haven't decided what I'm going to do. I might go ahead and rebarrel my Mark V to a 340 for now and wait a while to get more intel on the 6.5.an awesome round in itself my freind!
Post by: 2labs on March 13, 2016, 07:13:36 PM
Wow.....there are a couple things in here that really surprise me, and also a couple questions that I have.
1) Why with the temperature differential with US869; is this the only powder being used for these rounds? With velocity vs. temp variations of over 100 fps....that definitely rules it out for me. Especially for Long Range Hunting. I test my powders (well not any more, I know which powders are temp stable, and I stay with those) and stick with them for shooting.
2) In our experience we haven't found the 6.5 class of bullets to really care for any velocities over 3250-3300 fps. It seems they have a couple really sweet spots around 2750-2850 and 3100-3200 (In our precision rifle competitions, we are speed capped at 3200 fps).
3) Barrel life on any overbore cartridge, should not be a concern......It is going to burn up!! Faster burning powders, at higher velocities = It will burn up quicker.
I literally just went through this. I have somewhat of a different set of standards to choosing a wildcat. Long story short, I went 6.5 WSM; and here is why.
a) You can feed these full houses of Retumbo or H1000 (both of which are slower burning powders, minimizing throat erosion & both are extremely temp stable) and get decent velocities. I plan on pushing the Nosler 130 LR AB exclusively. I am aware the B.C. projections seem un doubtedly high, but Bryan Litz has done extensive testing on them. In his testing he found "when the projectile is properly stabilized (over 1.8 on the Miller stability chart) the advertised B.C. is within 2-3%). My set up, 8 twist barrel with velocities over 3100 fps, I achieve roughly 1.88-1.92 on the Miller stability.
b) How good of brass can I get? How big of a pain in the ass is this gonna be to make? Essentially, the 6.5 WSM is named the 6.5-300 WSM. You can purchase these dies from Midway, Brownells, Sinclair, etc. Already made, and you can usually find them in stock. I went with the Redding Full Length kit, as I am not a fan of the Lee dies. Now on to the brass. I looked at the SAAMI specs of the WSM family and started comparing prints. To my surprise the 300 WSM & 270 WSM are identical, other than neck diameter. Now, what kind of brass can I get? A quick Google search showed me that Bullets.com carries Norma 270 WSM brass, at not too bad of a price......Perfect I ordered 50 pieces, as this is a hunting rifle and 50 pieces should last a long time. Now the 270 actually carries an I.D. of .277", where as my 6.5 carries an I.D. of .264" = -.013" a simple one step neck down, with no neck turning, no donut, etc.
- Disclaimer-I hate brass prep!!! I will not turn necks, debur flash holes, anything other than sizing and trimming to length.
c) Since, I could find factory dies available, I knew there was a reamer out there. Now to find what gunsmith had it......I called my gunsmith, and alas....he owns one!!! Jackpot!!! Box it up, and send it over the mountain to him!! I should have this build back by the end of March, and have a load developed within a couple weeks. I will update as necessary.
**This build had a couple requirements for it.
1. Lightweight - I am going to weigh in at 8 lbs with scope, bipod, and full mag. I had a Proof Carbon Fiber barrel laying around in 6.5, A Manners carbon fiber elite stock with DBM already inletted, and a Tikka T3 action. I purchased a Vortex PST 6-24 as it weighed in at 28 oz, the lightest scope with all the features I was looking for.
2. I wanted a laser beam that maintained over 1000 ft/lbs of kinetic energy at 1000 yards. I used a 4" circle as my maximum point blank reference. So I will zero this rifle at 250 yards, which will put me 2" high at 150 yards; zeroed at 250; and fall out of my 4" circle (-2" from zero) at 300 yards. At 1000 yards, it will drop -187.2"; or 5.2 mils; will deflect 43" (1.2 mils) and still maintain 1083 ft/lbs.
It's not just you on the velocity windows. I contacted litz when I started into the 6.5's and he told me to push them around 2800- 2900. I have built several now and they do like it there for sure.
This is nice to hear, I'm building a Swede. And thinking pushing the 3k FPS. 2700 -2900 are pretty easy. With the 142 lrab.