Hunting Washington Forum
Equipment & Gear => Guns and Ammo => Topic started by: RailRob on January 30, 2009, 03:45:34 PM
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so I have heard that on wood stocks if you sight in your rifle when its hot, and hunt or shoot when its cold it can be off. Does the wood stock expand and contract that much? what about free float barrels? does this not apply to a free floating barrel?
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Not sure about hot and cold days, but if you get a wood stock really wet it could warp. So a free floated barrel would help, unless the warping got so bad that it was putting excesive pressure in the barrel.
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Everything effects accuracy even on the best custom jobs..........barometric pressure, humidity, temperature, wind you name it.
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well I understand that..just curious about this specific question...thats all.. thanks
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There shouldn't be enough difference to matter in your point of impact when going from one temperature extreme to another, with a wood stock or a synthetic. If there is a big difference, then there is something wrong with your rifle. Generally I wouldn't expect a variation of more than 1/4 inch at 100 yards, and if you're only talking about accuracy for hunting big game, it's just not enough to worry about.
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ws just thinking a few years back when I started hunting and getting different opinions.. and was thinking today about if it would affect a free float barrel
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I totally disagree with what has been said. A pure wood stock (non laminate) does change from different weather conditions. The only time this would be an issue is when you have forearm contact past the recoil lug more then an inch or two. The lighter weight the barrel the more the affect can be. If the barrel is free floating then the impact on accuracy is limited greatly if not eliminated. Bedding does affect accuracy, and if you have extremes then torque can occure. This can be minimized by a fully sealed stock...most are not, floated barrel, bedded action. How to you eliminate that the most? Simple...metal bedding block, action bedded in epoxy, and free floated barrel. Some can say well "I never had it happen to me and I hunted the jungles of South America on monday and the North Pole on Tuesday. I killed by animals with one shot." So you did, but did you bench the rifle in a vise to see if there was a difference? Well no but it worked. Agreed it worked and could be accurate, but there was a difference that was noticeable if your rifle was accurate enough to actually tell.
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I didn't say weather has no affect and nobody else did either. So I'm not sure how you "totally disagree with what has been said." :dunno:
I said if it has a noticeable affect then there is something wrong with the rifle. At least to me, if going from one temperature to another affects the point of impact a noticeable amount, there IS something wrong with the rifle...meaning it needs to be free floated, bedded, sealed, whatever it takes.
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From the stand point that the previous comments were generalized, and did not cover the specific issues with stocks. Barometric, Humidity, Temperature affect wood, but unless you at +120 or -50 true sythetics (not molded plastic) the affect is almost zero. The affect on bullet flight is much greater then the affect on accuracy from the rifle. Just a difference of opinion nothing intended to offend.
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My understanding is that where the wood touchs the barrel can change. This changed the harmonics of the barrel. If moisture swells the stock it could push more ont eh barrel and change the point of impact. My own experience and theories are that it is not significant enough to make a difference at hunting range unless you are way out there.
There are things you can do to ensure that your rifle is the same, like torquing the screws, free floating the barrel, checking the seating of bolts etc. Personally I dont go through all that stuff.
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From the stand point that the previous comments were generalized, and did not cover the specific issues with stocks. Barometric, Humidity, Temperature affect wood, but unless you at +120 or -50 true sythetics (not molded plastic) the affect is almost zero. The affect on bullet flight is much greater then the affect on accuracy from the rifle. Just a difference of opinion nothing intended to offend.
Understood!
That's why I would always go with a synthetic stock if possible.
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If your looking to get the most out of any rifle, match or hunting. Have the action at least bedded if not pillar and bedded and make sure your barrel is free floated from the recoil lug or the end of the bedding forward. I like to be able to take two crisp dollar bills on top of one another, wrap them around the barrel and be able to slide them freely under the barrel(Between the stock and barrel) all the way back to the bedding or recoil lug without any obstructions.
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It is just not weather that can affect your accuracy. If you are shooting a small pencil barrel, like on ultra lite rifles. After 2 or 3 shots at most, the barrel heats up and will flex, in some direction. If you do not have any clearance between barrel and stock, it will contact the stock, and change the point of impact.
Above was stated using 2 crisp dollar bills. I use two normal business cards, to check clearances, on the rifles I bed.
I also use Devcon to bed the recoil lug area. It is as strong as steel, and on hard recoiling guns, will save a wood stock from cracking, if there is a weak spot in the wood.
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cool, thanks..
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The short answer is yes. The practical answer is that in most "hunting" situations, the effect probably isn't worth worrying about. If you shooting a lot over say 400 yards, you may want to look for a different stock to reduce that variablility.
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I have heard alot about this in the past.
Has anyone actually measured how far off a gun did fire at 100yards from a soaked stock? I know we have argued this around my campfire, usually somones excuse for missing game..... :chuckle:
So, anyone ever measure or can quantify what is being discussed. I cant imagine a gun being off by very much.... How much has been observed?
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I just don't see how a piece of dry wood that is sealed with stain can absorb moisture. I coulde see a little shrinkage on synthetics in extreme cold but not anything we experience here in WA.
Brandon
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The easiest way to explain this, is to use an analogy. Ever have a wood deck? Sealed with whatever? Did any of the decking warp???? Humidity and moisture will warp a stock, over time. You keep it in a moisture controlled environment all year long (to keep the metal from rusting) then you take your weapon out in a wet, humid environment, that wood is going to absorb some moisture, no matter what. How much it absorbs may be minimal, however, in extreme cases, it will warp the wood. Mainly the free float is what is important. The glass bedding in the barrel channel is just waterproofing for the wood (for those that can not seem to remember to clean and dry out the firearms). The bedding is mainly for the action, and recoil lug area.
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I just don't see how a piece of dry wood that is sealed with stain can absorb moisture. I coulde see a little shrinkage on synthetics in extreme cold but not anything we experience here in WA.
I've been hastling my mule-headed father in law to put a synthetic stock on his old Rem. 700 for the past 10 years. He won't... because he likes the way the wood one looks. Well, last year he hunted that rifle hard for blacktails... he had it out in the rain and fog on the last day of the late season. I went over to their house right after he got home and the rifle was leaning in the corner on the porch. I picked that thing up and it must have weighed 10 pounds... this is a 8.5 pound rifle when it comes out of the safe. Don't know if it effected the accuracy at all... but I know an extra 1.5 pounds of water (about 1/4 GALLON) ain't ever a good thing. I just put the new stock on it last weekend!
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I'll mess with all of you know. How many knew that Remington believes a contact point on sporter weight barrels helps them shoot better. Remingtons with sporter weight come with a forwards contact point. Just to mess with the whole process a little. I have also had a couple rifles that settled their groups with fore end pressure.
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Ya folks seem to think that free floating is the answer to getting better accuracy but it can cause problems, some barrles need pressure on the barrel to shoot right.
