Post by: HunterofWA on August 17, 2016, 04:43:13 PM
Post by: jackelope on August 17, 2016, 04:45:03 PM
Post by: Timberstalker on August 17, 2016, 04:55:20 PM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 17, 2016, 04:59:26 PM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 17, 2016, 04:59:53 PM
Would this be your first deer?
First with a bow. 2nd total
Post by: Tbob on August 17, 2016, 05:06:03 PM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 17, 2016, 05:11:51 PM
Post by: Bullkllr on August 17, 2016, 05:15:05 PM
Post by: badnewskruse on August 17, 2016, 05:47:38 PM
Post by: elkinrutdrivemenuts on August 17, 2016, 05:52:20 PM
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Post by: jackelope on August 17, 2016, 06:05:12 PM
Leave the females for the children to learn on.
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Especially with all the great late season blacktail opportunities.
Post by: pd on August 17, 2016, 06:43:43 PM
It is not my place to advise others, but here is another thing to think about. Elk are very much herd animals, and females (cows, both nursing and dry) spend their whole lives with other females, and immature males (bulls). Where you live the herds can be anywhere from 5 to 25 in size. The thing about cows with calves is this: If the mother cow dies, another cow will adopt the calf. For this reason, I don't feel that bad about targeting cows. Blacktail are another story, they don't live in large herds like elk, and I am not so certain that an orphaned fawn (especially one born this year) would be adopted by another doe if the fawn's mother died.
I do agree with the point that your doe in question is very skinny and small. It is great that she regularly appears in your special spot, especially during the daylight.
Life is full of choices, and the decisions you make both reflect your character, and reinforce that character.
Post by: Bob33 on August 17, 2016, 07:36:03 PM
The thing about cows with calves is this: If the mother cow dies, another cow will adopt the calf. For this reason, I don't feel that bad about targeting cows. Blacktail are another story, they don't live in large herds like elk, and I am not so certain that an orphaned fawn (especially one born this year) would be adopted by another doe if the fawn's mother died.There is some evidence indicating that deer do this as well.
Post by: fishnfur on August 17, 2016, 07:59:09 PM
Fawns can be completely weaned and survive without milk by 10 weeks of age (2½ months), but does often wean them at 12 to 16 weeks (3 to 4 months). It's not uncommon for hunters to see a May or June born fawn still nursing, or attempting to, in October (20-plus weeks).
That doe will leave her fawn while she's in estrous. If you can find her then, hold out for Mr. Big whom will be coming by shortly. Don't feel bad for the fawn if you choose to harvest the doe though. It will be ready to join the other locals for the winter survival test. Heck, you could harvest the fawn too and have the venison equivalent of veal!
Post by: csaaphill on August 17, 2016, 08:57:16 PM
Post by: PastorJoel on August 17, 2016, 09:15:32 PM
Post by: coachcw on August 17, 2016, 09:33:51 PM
Post by: WildBear on August 17, 2016, 09:46:27 PM
Post by: csaaphill on August 17, 2016, 10:10:34 PM
Post by: Jpmiller on August 18, 2016, 09:07:31 AM
I am sure that not having mom around hurts survival chances but from having watched firsthand deer that I can identify on sight grow up orphaned I don't feel bad in the least when I do take out mom.
To me hunting is about both having fun and eating wild game. I love looking at antlers but I love eating venison more. A deer in the freezer is worth a herd of world class bucks in the field in my book. At the end of the day do what is in line with your personal hunting goals. If you're looking for a deer harvest take the first legal animal. If you're looking for a buck wait for a buck and so on.
Post by: HunterofWA on August 18, 2016, 09:21:04 AM
Post by: jackelope on August 18, 2016, 09:32:27 AM
Post by: CP on August 18, 2016, 10:08:31 AM
Post by: Rainier10 on August 18, 2016, 10:19:30 AM
If you wanna boost the population in the area don't shoot. If there's any remorse then don't shoot , if you can hunt the late season don't shoot. If your familly needs the meat for survival then shoot . By November that fawn won't need her nearly as much. :twocents::yeah:
Post by: HunterofWA on August 18, 2016, 09:22:04 PM
Bucks will breed multiple does. If you have an excess # of does, then from a management standpoint it wouldn't be a bad idea to kill some does. If you want to boost the # of deer in the area, then don't shoot. If you are just looking for meat then kill the deer. If you want to kill a buck, then don't shoot the doe....at least not until later on in the season. Odds are if you're hunting over your bait sites or your food plots, you'll have plenty of opportunity to shoot a doe. Maybe wait for one without a fawn or an obviously older doe to shoot. That one in the 1st picture looks to be young and has a fawn.
Thanks for the tip!
Post by: HunterofWA on August 19, 2016, 02:28:24 PM
Post by: Jonathan_S on August 19, 2016, 03:06:16 PM
I just thought of this: If the doe is kinda skinny wouldn't that mean that they isn't enough food around? to many deer?
Deer are more thin in the summer, looks perfectly healthy to me. If it's legal and you want to shoot it, then do it.
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on August 19, 2016, 04:03:51 PM
I just thought of this: If the doe is kinda skinny wouldn't that mean that they isn't enough food around? to many deer?Lactating does are normally thin in the summer, they are putting all their excess energy into getting their fawns as large as possible. The bigger the fawn, the better its chances of survival to grow up and breed. In fall, lactating does' physiology shifts to putting on fat to prepare for the demands of growing fawns and surviving winter, and only excess energy goes into lactation. Fawns don't need milk after around 3 months age for survival, but if the doe is on a high nutritional plane lactation can occur well into winter. If you are seeing skinny does after October, there is possibly a shortage of feed, but it can also indicate parasite loads, disease or other stressors.
I have no issues with your choice to kill the doe or not. If you would be happy to do so, and not regret not being able to hunt later in the season, go for it. I once tagged out on a doe in September to concentrate on elk, and found myself in late October, during an open season, rifle in hand watching a 32" 4x4 mule deer and 5 smaller bucks. That doe was my second deer ever, and that was the first time I thought about trade-offs, and kind of wished I'd held off. However, the next year I killed a yearling buck before 8am September 1, and was perfectly happy about it all season. There is no ethical reason to hold off, but I'd probably hold off myself for a bigger doe or a fat yearling buck, purely from a meat quality/quantity perspective.
Post by: HunterofWA on August 19, 2016, 05:32:56 PM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 24, 2016, 09:48:20 AM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 25, 2016, 07:46:31 AM
Post by: fishnfur on August 25, 2016, 08:58:11 AM
Post by: Elmer Fletch on August 25, 2016, 11:01:43 AM
Post by: Jpmiller on August 25, 2016, 11:28:39 AM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 25, 2016, 11:35:56 AM
Post by: fishnfur on August 25, 2016, 11:52:37 AM
Post by: Fish4Fun on August 25, 2016, 11:58:23 AM
Post by: sirmissalot on August 25, 2016, 12:34:26 PM
Post by: pd on August 25, 2016, 12:55:59 PM
Have you considered finding a different spot for you bait? If there are no bucks, and only does with fawns, I would find new spot with some buck activity. Just my :twocents:
Respectfully, I completely disagree with this. You have a gold mine here. BT does will not wander far during the rut, especially with fawns around. The bucks will come to them, just be patient. Keep that camera up, and let's see what happens. My prediction is the bucks will be thickest in that spot Nov. 1st through 10th. Let us know how this works.
By the way, this doe looks a lot better than the last one. I think the fawn is weaned, and the mother is putting on weight. If you bought the archery tag, sure, take her. Or, take a chance and buy the rifle tag, and take a fatter doe or a nice buck in October. (In 564 you can take any deer.) Using your bow in October with a rifle tag is a really good option.
Post by: Elmer Fletch on August 25, 2016, 01:24:18 PM
I completely agree with you, bucks will start showing up looking for those does first couple of weeks of November. My impression is that he will be hunting archery seasons, and not wait until late rifle. Me and my brother have two spots with food, one is getting hit up with bachelor bucks and few does, the other one only does and fawns. You won't see bucks at my brothers spot until late october, november. My spot is a hot spot in September. In October the bucks vanish, and then they are back in November. I am talking about whitetails here. We are on 42 acres as well. So, in my opinion, 2nd camera and spot would not hurt.Have you considered finding a different spot for you bait? If there are no bucks, and only does with fawns, I would find new spot with some buck activity. Just my :twocents:
Respectfully, I completely disagree with this. You have a gold mine here. BT does will not wander far during the rut, especially with fawns around. The bucks will come to them, just be patient. Keep that camera up, and let's see what happens. My prediction is the bucks will be thickest in that spot Nov. 1st through 10th. Let us know how this works.
By the way, this doe looks a lot better than the last one. I think the fawn is weaned, and the mother is putting on weight. If you bought the archery tag, sure, take her. Or, take a chance and buy the rifle tag, and take a fatter doe or a nice buck in October. (In 564 you can take any deer.) Using your bow in October with a rifle tag is a really good option.
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Post by: Rainpaddle on August 25, 2016, 02:00:31 PM
Let me know what you think. She still has a fawn with her but she's coming really consistently during shooting light. I want to know what your thoughts are so that if I don't get an opportunity at a buck...
And you want Disney to do a remake of Bambi?
Rob
Post by: pd on August 25, 2016, 02:06:32 PM
I completely agree with you, bucks will start showing up looking for those does first couple of weeks of November. My impression is that he will be hunting archery seasons, and not wait until late rifle. Me and my brother have two spots with food, one is getting hit up with bachelor bucks and few does, the other one only does and fawns. You won't see bucks at my brothers spot until late october, november. My spot is a hot spot in September. In October the bucks vanish, and then they are back in November. I am talking about whitetails here. We are on 42 acres as well. So, in my opinion, 2nd camera and spot would not hurt.Have you considered finding a different spot for you bait? If there are no bucks, and only does with fawns, I would find new spot with some buck activity. Just my :twocents:
Respectfully, I completely disagree with this. You have a gold mine here. BT does will not wander far during the rut, especially with fawns around. The bucks will come to them, just be patient. Keep that camera up, and let's see what happens. My prediction is the bucks will be thickest in that spot Nov. 1st through 10th. Let us know how this works.
By the way, this doe looks a lot better than the last one. I think the fawn is weaned, and the mother is putting on weight. If you bought the archery tag, sure, take her. Or, take a chance and buy the rifle tag, and take a fatter doe or a nice buck in October. (In 564 you can take any deer.) Using your bow in October with a rifle tag is a really good option.
Understood. I will defer to your knowledge of white-tailed deer (I know nothing about them). The OP is in an "any deer" area for both the archery and rifle tag. The rifle season is the 2nd Saturday to Halloween (longer than the eastside). The rut really starts to pick up at the end of October, extending to the first week or two of November (no open season then). This is always a difficult decision for BT hunters. And for the OP, he has a classic dilemma. Does he go for the "bird in the hand" (does consistently in his secret spot now) and buy a bow tag, and hunt all September, or does he gamble and buy the rifle tag, and hunt 3 weeks in October, hoping for some nice bucks.
The OP and I have a different situation. I have a lot of good bucks on camera, only a few does, no fawns. I should probably hunt the bow season. He has a lot of does with fawns on camera, no bucks. I would suggest that he hunt the rifle season. But this is his decision, only he can make it.
Post by: HunterofWA on August 26, 2016, 07:59:51 AM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 26, 2016, 08:03:23 AM
Post by: Jpmiller on August 26, 2016, 09:43:09 AM
Post by: HunterofWA on August 26, 2016, 05:45:42 PM
Hope they get the system back up so you can purchase it.
I haven't really kept up on the whole site crash so... could you shine a little light on that subject? Does it mean I can't even go to Fred Meyer and buy it there?
Post by: bearpaw on August 26, 2016, 05:52:00 PM
Hope they get the system back up so you can purchase it.
They are supposed to be back online Aug 30...
Post by: pd on August 26, 2016, 06:35:11 PM
Last year during rifle season we had 6 does coming to the apples and then we had 6 bucks show up that we had NEVER even thought existed, so I'd like to hunt the modern firearm season with a bow, but the season is so short that I think I want to just buy the archery tag and then hunt the nov 23 - the end of december
So that is where my 6 bucks went; you baited them to your apple pile!
Yep, unbelievable what BT bucks will do during the rut. Some monsters just appear out of nowhere, and then disappear again.
Post by: HunterofWA on August 27, 2016, 07:56:51 AM
Post by: throttlejocky20 on August 30, 2016, 08:36:48 AM