Post by: jstone on April 04, 2017, 08:24:53 PM
Post by: Mfowl on April 05, 2017, 12:08:39 AM
Post by: mountainman on April 05, 2017, 12:39:45 AM
Post by: Bucks2Ducks on April 05, 2017, 06:01:37 AM
Post by: nwwanderer on April 05, 2017, 06:14:50 AM
Post by: Mfowl on April 05, 2017, 08:04:21 AM
Post by: Special T on April 05, 2017, 12:31:47 PM
Import laws are different in BC and a customer had a RH drive Hilux imported. Got 35mpg on a 4wd pickup. Said it was death to try and pass some one on a 2 lane.
Post by: elkaholic123 on April 05, 2017, 12:57:53 PM
Post by: shadowless_nite on April 05, 2017, 02:48:31 PM
It's coming this fall possibly, it will have same engine as the Nissan Titan diesel.
This is still just rumor.... and at this point in the year I would consider it as something definitely not gonna happen this year. 2018 models usually hit showroom floors starting around may.
Post by: Special T on April 05, 2017, 02:59:01 PM
Post by: timberfaller on April 05, 2017, 07:59:50 PM
Post by: Reidus on April 05, 2017, 08:21:59 PM
Post by: fowl smacker on April 05, 2017, 08:55:54 PM
Post by: bullfisher on April 05, 2017, 09:05:55 PM
The Toyota CEO once said "why would I hinder our gasoline engine sales in the U.S with a competitors motor". Which is obsurd because they've been selling diesel motors over seas for decades.
The Nissan Titan Cummins is just another V8 diesel to me, nothing special. The greatest diesel pickup engine ever made, in my opinion, was squashed thanks to California's emisions BS.
Less power and less mpg's means more diesel burned per mile. How is that better emissions?
Post by: Elkaholic daWg on April 05, 2017, 09:11:27 PM
http://www.motortrend.com/news/toyota-hilux-by-arctic-trucks-in-iceland/
Post by: mountainman on April 05, 2017, 09:33:02 PM
Toyota has been selling diesels to other countries for years. :bash:yep, driven them in S. Africa
Post by: mountainman on April 05, 2017, 09:33:53 PM
Just got a new Tundra last weekend. The regional manager has no idea when or if there will be a Tundra diesel available in the US. If you're hearing it, it's a rumor.rumor going around for a few years now..
Post by: shadowless_nite on April 05, 2017, 10:33:31 PM
Just got a new Tundra last weekend. The regional manager has no idea when or if there will be a Tundra diesel available in the US. If you're hearing it, it's a rumor.rumor going around for a few years now..
A few years is a understatement.... it's been more than a decade now. There were rumors since before the first tundra revamp in 2007.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 06, 2017, 08:03:46 AM
Post by: Special T on April 06, 2017, 09:22:17 AM
Post by: shadowless_nite on April 06, 2017, 10:20:32 AM
I looked into this once before. Imported cars to Canada that we can't get here don't magically become improbable here. The only way to work around the issue is to drop a motor in a USA vehicle. Probably easier to take a rig from here up to Chilliwack to have a heart transplant and bring back to the USA.
There's a way to bring em here, how? I'm not 100% sure. But based on the high influx of older diesel toyotas now appearing on craigslist since all the good stuff is finally 25years old, there are already people capitilizing on this and a few other niche care markets in the area.
Downside to picking up a jdm diesel toyota stateside is the fact that they are older so maintanance costs and repairs must be done on your own. Dealer won't be much help ordering parts or servicing your rig. And majority of the toyota guys out there be it technicians or average Joes aren't too knowledgeable about jdm toyota engines. If you are mechanically inclined and resourceful then this is a non issue.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 06, 2017, 10:32:32 AM
I looked into this once before. Imported cars to Canada that we can't get here don't magically become improbable here. The only way to work around the issue is to drop a motor in a USA vehicle. Probably easier to take a rig from here up to Chilliwack to have a heart transplant and bring back to the USA.
Isn't it an age issue? An aquiantance brought a diesel 4x4 mitsu van to us some time agi
Post by: Special T on April 06, 2017, 10:33:32 AM
When you run the numbers you can only justify a conversion for coolness factor, because the numbers don't work for saving time or $.
Since I own a Jeep Cherokee one of the conversions I've seen several times is a Mercedes 5cylender diesel swap that seems to be successful. As cool as this is it is also just for coolness factor unless you find a sweet deal on a parts rig and are going to do all the wrench bending... your time is worth something..m
Post by: Special T on April 06, 2017, 10:36:03 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 06, 2017, 12:13:41 PM
Post by: Night goat on April 06, 2017, 04:12:59 PM
Toyota has been selling diesels to other countries for years. :bash:
I find this interesting...
You can already get the engine most likely used in the hilux trucks, for sure the diesel Land cruiser. It's called a Yanmar 6LP, uses the same block as the Toyota trucks and land cruisers, same bolt pattern and everything, just need an automotive (varible vs constant feed) injection pump, exhaust and intake manifold radiator and engine mounts, and most likely an intercooler as the yanmar is aftercooled, needs a bell housing adapter for a transmission. It's a 24valve turbo inline six, makes like 300-350 something like that, even comes from yanmar with a Toyota valve cover. It would be a project, but, all the parts are available off the shelf
Post by: bullfisher on April 06, 2017, 05:44:31 PM
And a 302cu built right would out perform any living diesel which would fit into a Toyota. Just cool factor still has appeal.I dont think so... maybe in a drag race. Even the little 4bt yota swaps will tug more and get better mileage doing it.
Post by: Special T on April 06, 2017, 06:08:03 PM
Post by: Night goat on April 06, 2017, 06:28:31 PM
And a 302cu built right would out perform any living diesel which would fit into a Toyota. Just cool factor still has appeal.I dont think so... maybe in a drag race. Even the little 4bt yota swaps will tug more and get better mileage doing it.
A 5.0......More power than a [similar displacement] diesel? Must be huffing gasoline or something.... More rpm? Sure. More torque? Maybe if it were supercharged with a massive fuel pump and giant loping cam.
If I were to do an engine swap on an older Toyota truck my engine of choice would be the Mercedes OM617.95. it's the engine out of the 240D sedans, and can be had super cheap, it's a 5 cylinder turbo, makes about 170ftlbs of torque and while it's less than say a jeep 4.0, which makes 225ftlbs @190hp, the 2.5l jeep makes 135 ftlbs max at 100hp when tuned and running properly. Any old R series toyota engine will be lucky to make 130hp but will probably stay around 100 ftlbs so, for a 1000$ Mercedes diesel, it's probably the most economical engine swap out there, I'd bet for 3500 you could turn a clapped out Pos yota into a German powered super economical diesel pickup that will exceed 300,000miles if properly maintained
The om617 is a super popular swap for YJ (square headlight) jeeps, and the 4bt is an awesome engine, however the 4bt, isn't designed as a passenger vehicle engine, it's an industrial engine, and, paired with being a pig (weight wise) they aren't balanced to operate at low rpm, so, while the power is there, doing low rpm offroad stuff, they are known to vibrate whatever they are bolted to like a mofo, but the crank balances out at mid to higher rpms and smooth out like any diesel with a load, but, low rpm crawling and trail riding, there are better options, to be fair however, it is still my engine of choice for when I do my Wrangler next summer
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 06, 2017, 10:51:57 PM
Diesels and bushy beards are just popular right now.
Post by: bullfisher on April 07, 2017, 06:17:16 AM
A well built streetable 302 would probably weight less and start at 150 hp/250ft lbs around 2500 rpm and can roll up to 275hp / 350ft lbs.. Better yet no high pressure pumps injectors and all the other ticky tacky dieseljunk to fail. Also, if you went injected you'd have a nice smooth power band without all the vibration, lag and low hp at high rpm when needed...
Diesels and bushy beards are just popular right now.
wow......
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 07, 2017, 06:48:45 AM
A well built streetable 302 would probably weight less and start at 150 hp/250ft lbs around 2500 rpm and can roll up to 275hp / 350ft lbs.. Better yet no high pressure pumps injectors and all the other ticky tacky dieseljunk to fail. Also, if you went injected you'd have a nice smooth power band without all the vibration, lag and low hp at high rpm when needed...
Diesels and bushy beards are just popular right now.
wow......
Well built, not crazy build. Talk about a weight ratio. If your diesel is for a crawler, weight is a important. Don't neglect the transmission which goes behind it either. I didn't see a single diesel powered sand / desert racing truck. Lots of aluminum and turbos.
Post by: Night goat on April 07, 2017, 11:24:26 AM
A well built streetable 302 would probably weight less and start at 150 hp/250ft lbs around 2500 rpm and can roll up to 275hp / 350ft lbs.. Better yet no high pressure pumps injectors and all the other ticky tacky dieseljunk to fail. Also, if you went injected you'd have a nice smooth power band without all the vibration, lag and low hp at high rpm when needed...
Diesels and bushy beards are just popular right now.
Must be a troll.... That's just too outrageous to actually take seriously.
But just in case...
....I'm a diesel mechanic, but what do I know.
A diesel will get 2x-8x the fuel economy of a gas engine, especially a torque-y low rpm, with a proper regear, matched to the engine and tire size, a properly geared diesel will drag your 5.0 (obviously a Ford guy) backwards and up hills all day long while that gasser small block just will spin tires and make alot of noise. The reality is that because of the nature of diesel engines (the most reliable engines in the world btw), you can take a significant drop in horsepower and still have an engine pump out plenty of torque, while having amazing milage, and again, with a regear, you will be able to crawl over anything at basically idle and still get 25-30mpg highway
Butttttt
Just for fun, let's compare apples to apples
5.0L Ford 302, and the new Cummins 5.0L diesel
Fast Specs
Engine: Cummins ISV5.0
Displacement: 5.0L
Bore and Stroke: 94 mm x 90 mm
Cylinders: 90-degree V-8
Block: Compacted graphite iron
Heads: Aluminum
Pistons: Aluminum
Valvetrain: DOHC, four valves per cylinder
Horsepower: 275 hp @ 3,200 rpm
Torque: 560 lb-ft @ 1,600 rpm
Induction: Single-wastegated variable-geometry Cummins Turbo Technologies turbocharger
Fuel System: High-pressure common-rail, Bosch CP4.2 injection pump, piezo injectors
Peak Injection Pressure: 29,000 psi
Emissions Equipment: EGR, DPF, SCR
Engine Dry Weight: 804 pounds
Aftertreatment System Weight: 95 pounds
Now for the Ford, and I chose the new 5.0 out of the new mustang, which is a mild factory performance motor
Base Engine Size: 5.0 L
Base Engine Type: Gas
Cam Type: Double overhead cam (DOHC)
Cylinders: V8
Horsepower: 435 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 400 ft-lbs. @ 4250 rpm
Turning Circle: 37.8 ft.
Valve Timing: Variable
Valves: 32
And I figure a dressed small block with pumps and manifolds and whatnot, ready to drop in, probably weighs around 475-550lbs
My point is that the Ford 5.0 has to make 435 horsepower to create that 400some ft/lbs at 4000+ rpm, where the diesel makes 275 horsepower and 560 ft/lbs at 1600rpm, basically the Cummins makes 4x the torque at 4x less rpm, granted the 300lbs weight difference, it kinda cancels out the weight trade-off
So
What's the more powerful engine?
Post by: bullfisher on April 07, 2017, 12:36:39 PM
We are getting off topic here, but for reality sake remember this. There are no gas powered big rigs, no gas powered heavy equipment or machinery and its not that way because beards and diesels are in right now. It's because they can burn less fuel to achieve more torque at a lower rpm, thus drastically increasing the life span of the motor. They are also notoriously simpler in design. The 5.9l cummins has about 200 fewer moving parts.A well built streetable 302 would probably weight less and start at 150 hp/250ft lbs around 2500 rpm and can roll up to 275hp / 350ft lbs.. Better yet no high pressure pumps injectors and all the other ticky tacky dieseljunk to fail. Also, if you went injected you'd have a nice smooth power band without all the vibration, lag and low hp at high rpm when needed...
Diesels and bushy beards are just popular right now.
wow......
Well built, not crazy build. Talk about a weight ratio. If your diesel is for a crawler, weight is a important. Don't neglect the transmission which goes behind it either. I didn't see a single diesel powered sand / desert racing truck. Lots of aluminum and turbos.
A light, snappy sand rail deserves a gas motor. And there is a place for the 5.0l. But saying they have more power and less maintanance than a diesel of equal size is opposite of the truth.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 09, 2017, 10:46:10 PM
A well built streetable 302 would probably weight less and start at 150 hp/250ft lbs around 2500 rpm and can roll up to 275hp / 350ft lbs.. Better yet no high pressure pumps injectors and all the other ticky tacky dieseljunk to fail. Also, if you went injected you'd have a nice smooth power band without all the vibration, lag and low hp at high rpm when needed...
Diesels and bushy beards are just popular right now.
Must be a troll.... That's just too outrageous to actually take seriously.
But just in case...
....I'm a diesel mechanic, but what do I know.
A diesel will get 2x-8x the fuel economy of a gas engine, especially a torque-y low rpm, with a proper regear, matched to the engine and tire size, a properly geared diesel will drag your 5.0 (obviously a Ford guy) backwards and up hills all day long while that gasser small block just will spin tires and make alot of noise. The reality is that because of the nature of diesel engines (the most reliable engines in the world btw), you can take a significant drop in horsepower and still have an engine pump out plenty of torque, while having amazing milage, and again, with a regear, you will be able to crawl over anything at basically idle and still get 25-30mpg highway
Butttttt
Just for fun, let's compare apples to apples
5.0L Ford 302, and the new Cummins 5.0L diesel
Fast Specs
Engine: Cummins ISV5.0
Displacement: 5.0L
Bore and Stroke: 94 mm x 90 mm
Cylinders: 90-degree V-8
Block: Compacted graphite iron
Heads: Aluminum
Pistons: Aluminum
Valvetrain: DOHC, four valves per cylinder
Horsepower: 275 hp @ 3,200 rpm
Torque: 560 lb-ft @ 1,600 rpm
Induction: Single-wastegated variable-geometry Cummins Turbo Technologies turbocharger
Fuel System: High-pressure common-rail, Bosch CP4.2 injection pump, piezo injectors
Peak Injection Pressure: 29,000 psi
Emissions Equipment: EGR, DPF, SCR
Engine Dry Weight: 804 pounds
Aftertreatment System Weight: 95 pounds
Now for the Ford, and I chose the new 5.0 out of the new mustang, which is a mild factory performance motor
Base Engine Size: 5.0 L
Base Engine Type: Gas
Cam Type: Double overhead cam (DOHC)
Cylinders: V8
Horsepower: 435 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 400 ft-lbs. @ 4250 rpm
Turning Circle: 37.8 ft.
Valve Timing: Variable
Valves: 32
And I figure a dressed small block with pumps and manifolds and whatnot, ready to drop in, probably weighs around 475-550lbs
My point is that the Ford 5.0 has to make 435 horsepower to create that 400some ft/lbs at 4000+ rpm, where the diesel makes 275 horsepower and 560 ft/lbs at 1600rpm, basically the Cummins makes 4x the torque at 4x less rpm, granted the 300lbs weight difference, it kinda cancels out the weight trade-off
So
What's the more powerful engine?
We were comparing a old swap out motor I thought? Not new. And a 5 cylinder was mentioned. Now, simplicity of install and operation on a 4x4 being considered, no major electronics, computers, wiring harnesses etc...and price. You can build a cheap 302, normally aspired high power motor cheap. To buy a running diesel with turbo(let alone amodern block, turbo, pumps, computer etc) its going to be a $10,000 engine from your specs. I know some guys who build gas ford motors for $10k that wouldn't be fit for anything but a small tire drag car.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 09, 2017, 10:51:51 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 09, 2017, 11:03:06 PM
Post by: Special T on April 10, 2017, 07:36:42 AM
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 10, 2017, 10:30:53 AM
Mercedes In 1978, the OM617.950 was mated with the Mercedes-Benz W116 to produce the North American market-only 300SD, the world's first production turbodiesel sedan. Power originally was 111 hp / 82 kW @ 4200 rpm, torque 228 nm @ 2400 rpm. From October 1979 - 121 hp / 89 kW @ 4350 rpm, torque 230 nm @ 2400 rpm.[4]
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
Performance tuner parts available? Never seen a hot rod Mercedes haha 😊
Post by: Special T on April 10, 2017, 11:33:01 AM
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Post by: bullfisher on April 10, 2017, 11:58:14 AM
This thing is hilarious!
Post by: Mudman on April 10, 2017, 12:16:16 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 10, 2017, 12:23:39 PM
Oil burners are KING! Its that simple. Gas eng are great but don't expect them to compare for industrial use.
Absolutely never argue that at all. I watched some show where they put a 4 banger cat motor in something. Didn't look like it was moving fast but, put a big cloud of black smoke up for sure. The hilux v-8 sound pretty cool. Lots of cool videos of guys who have them built up down under.