Post by: JohnVH on June 14, 2017, 02:21:50 PM
Post by: Stein on June 14, 2017, 02:57:43 PM
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Post by: Buckmark on June 14, 2017, 03:08:09 PM
I have both a 10ft and 12ft alum (not smoker craft) that are around 150-160 and i can load and unload pretty easy
Post by: JimmyHoffa on June 14, 2017, 03:09:53 PM
Post by: CP on June 14, 2017, 03:37:46 PM
Post by: Mfowl on June 14, 2017, 04:38:51 PM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on June 14, 2017, 04:44:14 PM
Post by: Branden on June 14, 2017, 04:53:42 PM
We used an aluminum v hull once when I was little and we almost tipped it.
Regards, Branden
Post by: fish vacuum on June 14, 2017, 10:01:00 PM
Post by: JDHasty on June 15, 2017, 09:15:23 AM
I just wouldn't take kids out in any 10 footer I have been in.
Post by: Alchase on June 15, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
But the OP asked what the most stable boat in 10 - 12 ft range. for lake fishing.
I would pick Boston Whaler, Livingston, Sorenson
I had a 10 ft Livingston with a 15 HP yamaha on it that I took up to Point No Point all the time. I fished four adults out of it (on a lake) never once felt even the slightest tippy.
FYI, my 10 ft Livingston was the skiff off a 110 foot crab boat out of Newport, Or - Dutch Harbor, AK.
The Smokercraft Alaskan is a fantastic lake boat, or the sound on a very calm day. But for stability, the Smokercraft was not even close to the Livingston.
Post by: lokidog on June 15, 2017, 10:18:59 PM
From my experience, there is no way a 'v' bottom boat can come close to the stability of either of the two styles listed. They have other positives though.
Hope this helps.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 16, 2017, 08:10:15 AM
For stability, 12-14' Zodiac/Achilles/Bombardier inflatable cannot be beat. I used to salmon fish out of Westport with my 13 footer. Second choice would be the same size Livingston or similar boat, we have two twelve footers. The center "seat" is only a hassle when trying to get used to running a tiller engine. The negative to the Livingston is that they are pretty much designed for the weight of a two-stroke hanging off the back and the four-strokes of the same horsepower cause them to sit substantially lower in the stern. The negative for the inflatables is that they can get leaks, and rockfish spines can cause pinholes.Whaler smokes anything mentioned in stability, load capacity and highest rated powerhead. Also to mention, deck space. Can't haul much in an inflatable or a Livingston. Inflatables lose space on floor from the pontoons. Livingston has the hump in the floor. Whaler has a flat deck and can be filled to the brim with water and still floats :) V bottom boats in the 13' range are going to have very little difference in ride because the V isn't carried through to the transom. They aren't long or heavy enough to even make a V hull work. Ride won't be noticeably different until you get up to at least a 17' boat. Then flat bottom, v hull or a cat hull starts showing some efficiencies.
From my experience, there is no way a 'v' bottom boat can come close to the stability of either of the two styles listed. They have other positives though.
Hope this helps.
Post by: lokidog on June 16, 2017, 08:13:31 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 16, 2017, 08:15:52 AM
I forgot about Whalers, though it seems like the cost is substantially higher. I'd still rather be seven miles off the coast in my 13' inflatable than a 13' Whaler though. ;)
Not me. 50HP strapped to the back of my 13' whaler unswamped it many times and have made many long trips. My Uncle used it as his tow behind for 20 years before I got it when I was 7 years old.
Post by: PolarBear on June 16, 2017, 08:16:17 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 16, 2017, 08:19:30 AM
Inflatable w bigger powerhead.
https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/boa/6176983302.html
sweet ride....
Good deal here...
https://abbotsford.craigslist.ca/boa/6161046777.html
When crabbing, a Livingston is probably the most uncomfortable boat in the world. To start, it's hard to keep your footing with the hump in the floor. It's hard to pick up a pot and turn around because you have to juggle which side of the hump you want your feet on. you can't stand on the side so, lifting the pot over the bow isn't easy either if you use round commercial pots. I crabbed from a Livingston one summer and cursed it every day I didn't have my Whaler.
Post by: lokidog on June 16, 2017, 09:22:07 AM
Post by: Curly on June 16, 2017, 09:33:44 AM
I used a 13' Livingston for several years in my late teen/early 20 years. Started out with a center console (like the craigslist add) with a 9.9 Johnson and after the 9.9 got stolen it was replaced with a 20 hp Evinrude. It was a really good boat.
I used to put a 12' aluminum boat in the back of my pickup. That was a real pain having to transfer all the gear into the boat. I loved it when I was able to use the other boat/trailer and keep all the gear in the boat and just trailer it to the lake; made things way simpler. :twocents:
Post by: lokidog on June 16, 2017, 09:41:36 AM
Both the Livingston and Whaler would be sweet setups for what the OP plans to do. That is, if the OP can step up in boat size a little bit and go with a boat on a trailer instead of placing a small boat in the back of a pickup.
I used a 13' Livingston for several years in my late teen/early 20 years. Started out with a center console (like the craigslist add) with a 9.9 Johnson and after the 9.9 got stolen it was replaced with a 20 hp Evinrude. It was a really good boat.
I used to put a 12' aluminum boat in the back of my pickup. That was a real pain having to transfer all the gear into the boat. I loved it when I was able to use the other boat/trailer and keep all the gear in the boat and just trailer it to the lake; made things way simpler. :twocents:
Yep, best thing I did with my inflatable was buy a trailer for it, so much easier to load decoys and such the night before. It was handy though living in So Cal to be able to keep it in the basement of my apartment.
Post by: N7XW on June 16, 2017, 10:25:34 AM
Post by: Alchase on June 16, 2017, 10:53:16 AM
But for the price a newer Whaler, you could get a fully configured much larger boat.
Post by: Special T on June 16, 2017, 01:40:18 PM
Yep, tough to beat a Whaler. I had an 18' Southern Skimmer (now Carolina Skiff) and it was the only boat that I have found that was more stable than my Whaler. However, the Skimmer would beat you to death in really rough water unlike the Whaler. The gunwales were also a lot higher and sturdier on the Whaler.My father has a Carolina Skiff 14' I think. Very stable. We have unswamped it In the past by pulling the plugs and hammering down the throttle.
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Post by: Alchase on June 16, 2017, 02:54:27 PM
Yep, tough to beat a Whaler. I had an 18' Southern Skimmer (now Carolina Skiff) and it was the only boat that I have found that was more stable than my Whaler. However, the Skimmer would beat you to death in really rough water unlike the Whaler. The gunwales were also a lot higher and sturdier on the Whaler.My father has a Carolina Skiff 14' I think. Very stable. We have unswamped it In the past by pulling the plugs and hammering down the throttle.
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I came a crossed a guy who attempted this in a really old Lund on Alder lake.
He did not make it back to the dock, he was bow up about 40 ft from the ramp.
Someone should have told him you have to have some serious speed to do this.
His old Johnson 6 HP, probably did not have it.
LOL.
Post by: Smossy on June 16, 2017, 03:44:33 PM
Post by: singleshot12 on June 16, 2017, 03:54:08 PM
Post by: fish vacuum on June 16, 2017, 05:31:24 PM
Post by: The scout on June 16, 2017, 05:59:40 PM
Post by: Gobble Doc on June 16, 2017, 07:15:36 PM
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Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 16, 2017, 07:45:28 PM
I don't see many whalers in pickup beds, or in the price range of 10' livingstons.
I've spent a lot of time fishing in a 10' Livingston out of the back of a pick up and just wind waves and two people in one gets real sketchy. Not a stable platform at all for anything more than flat, calm water. My brother in law and I barely made it off Spada Lake one night.
As far as pick up bed boats, nothing less than a 12' Smokercraft. I regret selling my smokercraft to this day. Don't miss the Livingston at all. Uncomfortable, no floor space and really heavy for hauling in a pick up by yourself. And, they suck to trailer. Trying to turn around in a Livingston is a pain and there isn't barely any room for a tackle box and your feet in a 10'er.
Post by: lokidog on June 16, 2017, 08:34:02 PM
Check out Walker Bay boats. Semi-v hull, beautiful and sturdy little boats. Not near as ugly and square as a Livingston :twocents:
I actually have a 10' Walker Bay with the inflatable ring that I would be interested in selling.
Post by: Alchase on June 16, 2017, 09:12:38 PM
I don't see many whalers in pickup beds, or in the price range of 10' livingstons.
I've spent a lot of time fishing in a 10' Livingston out of the back of a pick up and just wind waves and two people in one gets real sketchy. Not a stable platform at all for anything more than flat, calm water. My brother in law and I barely made it off Spada Lake one night.
As far as pick up bed boats, nothing less than a 12' Smokercraft. I regret selling my smokercraft to this day. Don't miss the Livingston at all. Uncomfortable, no floor space and really heavy for hauling in a pick up by yourself. And, they suck to trailer. Trying to turn around in a Livingston is a pain and there isn't barely any room for a tackle box and your feet in a 10'er.
Totally disagree!
I have had both a 10 ft Livingston and a 13 ft Smokercraft Alaskan.
The Livingston I would not hesitate to take out to Point no Point and did to many times to count. No way I would take the 13 ft Smoker unless it was glass.
You really can't compare the two for stability.
The Smoker is a great lake fishing boat, but the Livingston is a much more stable platform.
Livingston is one of the few that are coast guard approved for skiffs without inspection.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 16, 2017, 10:44:07 PM
I don't see many whalers in pickup beds, or in the price range of 10' livingstons.
I've spent a lot of time fishing in a 10' Livingston out of the back of a pick up and just wind waves and two people in one gets real sketchy. Not a stable platform at all for anything more than flat, calm water. My brother in law and I barely made it off Spada Lake one night.
As far as pick up bed boats, nothing less than a 12' Smokercraft. I regret selling my smokercraft to this day. Don't miss the Livingston at all. Uncomfortable, no floor space and really heavy for hauling in a pick up by yourself. And, they suck to trailer. Trying to turn around in a Livingston is a pain and there isn't barely any room for a tackle box and your feet in a 10'er.
Totally disagree!
I have had both a 10 ft Livingston and a 13 ft Smokercraft Alaskan.
The Livingston I would not hesitate to take out to Point no Point and did to many times to count. No way I would take the 13 ft Smoker unless it was glass.
You really can't compare the two for stability.
The Smoker is a great lake fishing boat, but the Livingston is a much more stable platform.
Livingston is one of the few that are coast guard approved for skiffs without inspection.
I wouldn't take either on anything in salt. I really don't like Livingstons. Worse yet, ever had to get towed in a Livingston? That's a real suck pot of a ride.
Post by: lokidog on June 17, 2017, 09:05:29 AM
Post by: Alchase on June 17, 2017, 03:57:38 PM
Worked great!
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 17, 2017, 10:52:57 PM
I want a picture---- Two guys, two dozen decoys, a dog, two batteries and an electric motor. We did this down the Walla Walla river to duck hunt for years before a bazillion people flooded wallula. Those who are old school knew the Livingston guys then, I got smart and ducked out the Whaler....
With two guys a dog and gear, there is barely ANY freeboard at all. Inches at best. We used the Livingston just to go down the flat water of the Walla Walla. We sat still, didn't move at all and made many safe trips. This was in early 1990's. Trout fished every lake around Monroe in that boat through junior high and high school. Pre 90's. It was also tender on Inlaws place at Center Island in the San Juans. I've used that boat in every condition possible for 30+ years. I've also had my Whaler since I was 7. Add a few more years. I hate Livingstons even though, it was "what we had for a long time". It worked, because it was what we had. It was NOT the boat of choice for most all situations. Search for a Whaler. Do some repairs on it. Find a trailer, spend a little more than planned. It will last you and be 100% more versatile than a little Livingston and that versatility will make that extra money spent worth far more pennies.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on June 18, 2017, 08:36:12 AM
I have a lot of time in a 10'er. Those who say it's a stable platform and safe for salt water and own one..(I'd do the picture but, my BIL got rid of his we used for 20 some odd years) ...
I want a picture---- Two guys, two dozen decoys, a dog, two batteries and an electric motor. We did this down the Walla Walla river to duck hunt for years before a bazillion people flooded wallula. Those who are old school knew the Livingston guys then, I got smart and ducked out the Whaler....
With two guys a dog and gear, there is barely ANY freeboard at all. Inches at best. We used the Livingston just to go down the flat water of the Walla Walla. We sat still, didn't move at all and made many safe trips. This was in early 1990's. Trout fished every lake around Monroe in that boat through junior high and high school. Pre 90's. It was also tender on Inlaws place at Center Island in the San Juans. I've used that boat in every condition possible for 30+ years. I've also had my Whaler since I was 7. Add a few more years. I hate Livingstons even though, it was "what we had for a long time". It worked, because it was what we had. It was NOT the boat of choice for most all situations. Search for a Whaler. Do some repairs on it. Find a trailer, spend a little more than planned. It will last you and be 100% more versatile than a little Livingston and that versatility will make that extra money spent worth far more pennies.
lol
The things we do when younger. I used to run an 8' hydro from Johnson Pt to Horsehead when my parents were at work.
Post by: Alchase on June 18, 2017, 09:17:14 AM
I have a lot of time in a 10'er. Those who say it's a stable platform and safe for salt water and own one..(I'd do the picture but, my BIL got rid of his we used for 20 some odd years) ...
I want a picture---- Two guys, two dozen decoys, a dog, two batteries and an electric motor. We did this down the Walla Walla river to duck hunt for years before a bazillion people flooded wallula. Those who are old school knew the Livingston guys then, I got smart and ducked out the Whaler....
With two guys a dog and gear, there is barely ANY freeboard at all. Inches at best. We used the Livingston just to go down the flat water of the Walla Walla. We sat still, didn't move at all and made many safe trips. This was in early 1990's. Trout fished every lake around Monroe in that boat through junior high and high school. Pre 90's. It was also tender on Inlaws place at Center Island in the San Juans. I've used that boat in every condition possible for 30+ years. I've also had my Whaler since I was 7. Add a few more years. I hate Livingstons even though, it was "what we had for a long time". It worked, because it was what we had. It was NOT the boat of choice for most all situations. Search for a Whaler. Do some repairs on it. Find a trailer, spend a little more than planned. It will last you and be 100% more versatile than a little Livingston and that versatility will make that extra money spent worth far more pennies.
First you compared a 12ft Smokercraft "v-hull", to a Livingston.
Inherently a cat hull will always be more "stable" then a V hull of the same length.
Smokercraft Alaskan 12 (V-hull) - max capacity = 3 people 700 lbs
http://www.smokercraft.com/showroom/2017/utility/alaskan
Livingston LV12 (Cat hull) - max capacity = 5 people 900 lbs
http://worldcat.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/LV12_SalesSheet.pdf
I added the Whaler 11' 4" for reference. - max capacity = 4 people 845 lbs
https://www.bostonwhaler.com/family-overview/super-sport-boat-models/110-tender/https://www.bostonwhaler.com/family-overview/super-sport-boat-models/110-tender/
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 18, 2017, 12:52:54 PM
I threw in a whaler mainly to say, take a little step up and it's a HUGE difference. A 13' whaler is comparable to any other 16 and often 17' boats in stability and motor handling capability.
Post by: Westside88 on June 18, 2017, 02:05:26 PM
Very good boats.
Post by: Alchase on June 18, 2017, 04:45:18 PM
Weight of the boat itself and ability to fit into a pickup started. YOu can't fit a 12' Livingston inside a pick up bed. A 10' fits. A 12' smoker fits over the tailgate as the Livingston and they are about the same weight.
I threw in a whaler mainly to say, take a little step up and it's a HUGE difference. A 13' whaler is comparable to any other 16 and often 17' boats in stability and motor handling capability.
Agreed, before I got a trailer for my Livingston I use to put it up on a rack on my truck.
Life is so much easier with a trailer, LOL.
I would not even think of trying that with a 12 ft. Livingston.
Post by: fish vacuum on June 18, 2017, 05:06:03 PM
People do lakes and a little crabbing out of small Livingstons and aluminum boats all the time.
Look for a deal on an Alaskan, lund, duroboat, valco, gregor, whatever, and have fun.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 18, 2017, 10:45:41 PM
The OP is looking for a boat to fit in his truck bed for lakes and a little crabbing. Now people are talking about trailers, 50hp outboards, dogs and decoys, multiple batteries, and running across the sound.
People do lakes and a little crabbing out of small Livingstons and aluminum boats all the time.
Look for a deal on an Alaskan, lund, duroboat, valco, gregor, whatever, and have fun.
Doing a little crabbing usually involves an outboard, gas tank, oars, couple crab pots and often another person. Weight and stability means a lot to safety. It's a good topic to discuss expected loads and gear IMO.
Post by: Curly on June 19, 2017, 06:36:06 AM
12' boats that are stable and will fit in the back of a pickup are going to be rather heavy (Lund or Alaskan...Hi-Laker) and would be difficult to load and unload with one guy.
If a traler is definitely out of the equation, I'd seriously look into a carrier. http://boatloader.com/car_a_boat.html
Post by: Rob on June 19, 2017, 09:46:04 AM
I took a ten foot wave broadside while anchored in 10 feet of water at Neah Bay in a 14 foot soft hull inflatable. We were loaded with 2 people and 6 scuba tanks. Put 50 gallons of water int he boat, but we slide up the wall of the wave and down the backside broadside.
I have been in 8 footers with a short interval in a 16 foot inflatable doing 25 mph and nearly going airborn.
Simply no more stable boat out there.
I have a Whaler style boat and used a 12 foot Livingston for years and they are great boats. but nothing compares in terms of stability and weight capacity to a RIB. Only down side is reduced deck space.
Post by: Rob on June 19, 2017, 09:50:56 AM
Post by: Alchase on June 19, 2017, 09:56:29 AM
just poked around on the web. 10 foot Livingston has a 700 Lb capacity. the 9 foot 2" foot avon takes 1048 lbs.
Nice
Post by: SeaRun1 on June 19, 2017, 10:13:10 AM
There is nothing in the 12 foot class that is more stable or can take a heavier load than a RIB (Ridged Inflatable Boat). I have been in 6-8 foot swells, with chop on top at tatoosh, with 3 people and 6 scuba tanks (i.e. very heavy load) and we were taking swells and chop with style. you can fill a loaded boat like that to the gunnels and it will still float.
I took a ten foot wave broadside while anchored in 10 feet of water at Neah Bay in a 14 foot soft hull inflatable. We were loaded with 2 people and 6 scuba tanks. Put 50 gallons of water int he boat, but we slide up the wall of the wave and down the backside broadside.
Brings back some very vivid memories Rob! You forgot to mention the Coast Guard wasn't impressed with the 12' RIB being out there that day.
That wave was crazy!
SR1
Post by: Rob on June 19, 2017, 11:04:28 AM
No one believes me that the wave was 10 feet tall... but it was! Came at us like a brick wall.
Post by: lokidog on June 19, 2017, 09:15:07 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 19, 2017, 11:03:39 PM
Post by: Rob on June 20, 2017, 10:45:25 AM
But for stability and weight capacity, I have not found a better option.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 20, 2017, 12:46:24 PM
Totally agree. So you have the extra weight capacity, but less space to put the extra weight! This was the curse of diving out of them. They are harder to mount things like pot pullers and downriggers (although that problem can be solved).
But for stability and weight capacity, I have not found a better option.
harder to crawl into if you don't have a dive ladder too.. I always stepped on the cavitation plate on the motor and pulled myself right up when swimming out the back of the whaler. Can't really swim out of an aluminum boat. you'll dunker under :) :) :chuckle:
Post by: lokidog on June 20, 2017, 08:24:24 PM
Post by: Ghost Hunter on June 21, 2017, 08:00:19 AM
https://portland.craigslist.org/clk/boa/6181668412.html
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2017, 08:05:50 AM
My whaler knock-off is even easier to get into since it is only a few inches off the water near the transom.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 21, 2017, 10:48:27 PM
I've always just executed a sea-lion move and flop over the pontoon. Since I am shaped like a sea-lion, it seems natural!
My whaler knock-off is even easier to get into since it is only a few inches off the water near the transom.
My neighbor and the guy like my second dad growing up was one of the guys who made Bayliner. He started as youngster running a chopper gun and worked up to head of sales. He taught me how to do fiberglass on a boat like a whaler when I was 12. He was always rebuilding landing crafts and wrecked boats when he was home from trips selling Bayliners around the world. When I got done, it looked good. I put it in our pond to test it out and it had about 4 inches of freeboard...that sucked but, I learned to glass at a young age from a guy who built an iconic company. He's passed on. Spent many days following Dick around and we were the rat pack kids when the boat guys were in the neighborhood and up on the beach in Roche Harbor back in the heydays of the early 80's
Post by: Rob on June 22, 2017, 07:39:35 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 22, 2017, 08:56:32 AM
Post by: h2ofowlr on June 22, 2017, 08:59:57 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 22, 2017, 02:55:33 PM
Post by: Night goat on June 26, 2017, 11:08:12 PM
glasply dinghy
hi laker
small boston whaler
Post by: lokidog on July 02, 2017, 07:32:50 AM
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