Hunting Washington Forum

Equipment & Gear => Power Equipment & RV => Topic started by: KFhunter on June 22, 2017, 02:07:23 PM

Title: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: KFhunter on June 22, 2017, 02:07:23 PM: I've never been good with a hand file, what you all use for sharpening in the field? I see some neat doodads but don't want to waste my money. I have some experience logging, was a landing rat and hook tender on a high lead but my sharpening skills with hand files were abysmal and still are.

Thanks!

Oh I just picked up a new 372 XP with 28" bar for some homeowner loggin and mill work :tup:
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: rtspring on June 22, 2017, 02:19:55 PM: Sharpening a saw is pretty straight forward. The key is to not run it down to dull. I touch mine up when I feel it start to work harder. Couple strokes on each tooth and shes ready to rock.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Woodchuck on June 22, 2017, 02:28:36 PM: Quote from: KFhunter on June 22, 2017, 02:07:23 PM
I've never been good with a hand file, what you all use for sharpening in the field? I see some neat doodads but don't want to waste my money. I have some experience logging, was a landing rat and hook tender on a high lead but my sharpening skills with hand files were abysmal and still are.

Thanks!

Oh I just picked up a new 372 XP with 28" bar for some homeowner loggin and mill work :tup:
I have a 272xp, I bought from a member here with a 36in bar on it and it is a wood eating mule. You will love that 372. :tup:
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 22, 2017, 02:57:38 PM: use the regular file. Look for a line on the teeth and try to keep your file on the same angle. My rule of thumb is I quickly sharpen the chain between every tank of gas. just enough to remove any burs or dings and brighten up the tooth. Also, run a skip tooth so you can sharpen it faster. The safety chains are a bitch to sharpen. Use a flat file to flatten the rakers about every three or four tanks.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: KFhunter on June 22, 2017, 03:15:59 PM: last time I tried to hand file saws I was getting yelled at by the foreman. I dunno if I push too hard or don't keep consistent stroke angles or what the deal is, when I'm done I cut circles.

but then there weren't any laser lines on the teeth to follow either
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: andersonjk4 on June 22, 2017, 03:19:22 PM: Tagging
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Naches Sportsman on June 22, 2017, 03:50:09 PM: Try using a fIle guide. Takes lots of practice to get the angles right without using a guide. I'm one of those firm believers in file guides and still use them on a regular basis.

Use both hands to guide the file while sharpening.

One way you can practice sharpening is by rocking the saw or putting the saw in the dirt dulls it real fast and sharpen er back up.

With rakers, use a raker guage.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: fish vacuum on June 22, 2017, 04:12:31 PM: Don't get it super dull before you file it. I do a quick touch up about every tank. Just a couple strokes per cutter. And it doesn't take a lot of pressure.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: hollymaster on June 22, 2017, 05:09:12 PM: Quote from: fish vacuum on June 22, 2017, 04:12:31 PM
Don't get it super full before you file it. I do a quick touch up about every tank. Just a couple strokes per cutter. And it doesn't take a lot of pressure.
Man that's a fancy one! I use this guy. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00004RA78/ref=asc_df_B00004RA785042303/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=395009&creativeASIN=B00004RA78&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167151490548&hvpos=1o8&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8139344447109094144&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1027581&hvtargid=pla-309219448298
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: luckyman on June 22, 2017, 07:11:27 PM: If the file isn't new it's hard to get a good sharp chain. Buy a box and chuck the file when it stop cutting good. 2-3 sharpening is about all I want from a file.
After that is a wast of time. :bash:
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: CarbonHunter on June 22, 2017, 07:14:41 PM: It takes to long to file in the field. Carry an extra chain and swap if you ground one otherwise a sharp chain will last all day. Once back at your shop, use a chain grinder. I bought my Oregon grinder online for $300. It will pay for itself real quick if you cutting chains for a 28" bar. If an Oregon is more than you want to spend Harbor Freight puts a crappy one on sale for around $30 that will do the job.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: TommyH on June 22, 2017, 08:04:02 PM: Quote from: CarbonHunter on June 22, 2017, 07:14:41 PM
It takes to long to file in the field. Carry an extra chain and swap if you ground one

Sure an extra chain is smart, but it only takes a few minutes to sharpen a chain with a hand file and less when your getting yelled at or the skidder is allready back lol.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: TommyH on June 22, 2017, 08:18:22 PM: Cut 3/4 way threw a round of wood, that way you can lay the bar in there while you sharpen. I sit on/straddle the powerhead. Equal amount of strokes per side.Level strokes aligned with the mark on the tooth. It's not difficult, but like anything you will get better with practice... Buy a new chain and run it without hitting the dirt, that way you know how it should cut... every time it isint cutting as well.. sharpen. Most of the time you can get a few tanks before needing to sharpen.

The 372xp is a great saw that is pretty light and good power. I want one.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Bofire on June 22, 2017, 08:20:15 PM: if you are "cutting in a circle" one side is sharper than the other, are you counting your file strokes and doing the same on both sides? Match the existing before its dull as hell. Otherwise change chains, leave 2-3 at the saw shop, when your are dull take the dull ones in get the sharp ones, two or three should run quite a while.
Carl
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: huntingfool7 on June 22, 2017, 09:31:21 PM: Cutting in circles doesn't mean that one side is dull. Put a caliper on the teeth and check them...you are filing one side more than the other. That overly ground side is not doing any real work.

This-
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00Y0S88Y8/ref=asc_df_B00Y0S88Y85042770/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=394997&creativeASIN=B00Y0S88Y8&linkCode=df0&hvadid=198076851563&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=12921248880502675032&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033489&hvtargid=pla-320836411855

+this

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005KL3OJ8/ref=asc_df_B005KL3OJ85042769/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=395033&creativeASIN=B005KL3OJ8&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167125219398&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=10021758507272068844&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033489&hvtargid=pla-311057806051
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: timberfaller on June 22, 2017, 09:53:01 PM: For the wood cutter using round tooth chain, What fish vacuum posted is a good product, Granberg(sp) made one too and Sthil has their version.

If you have the money and want to use "chisel" chain, find a Silvey Razor Sharp II :tup: and carry extra sharpened loups.

NOW, it you want the Cadillac of sharpeners here it is!

http://www.baileysonline.com/shop.axd/ProductDetails?edp_no=14238
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: j_h_nimrod on June 22, 2017, 10:11:23 PM: Lots of good information so far. I have used bare files up to nice chain grinders and each has its place. I usually only go through ~1 chain per 4-6 cords depending on wood cleanliness an if I am doing a lot of cutting where I might occasionally touch the turf. A lot of what I do is pretty dirty cutting so chain life varies. If I am in the field I will either use a bare file or a file mounted guide. I have used the bar mounted guides but they take more experience to use correctly. If you follow the factory cut and take an even stroke on each tooth, you should cut fairly straight. Tighten the chain on the bar before filing to reduce wobble and try to be as consistent as possible. It is hard to get a chain as sharp as factory but with some work it is possible. Use a sharp file and keep it clean, don't just throw it around or in a kit with other files and tools. There is not a much easier way to ruin a file while not using it.

If in the shop a good grinder can make a great chain but a bad grinder or inexperienced operator can destroy a chain easily. Go slow and measure tooth length to get the best results.

With experience you can tailor your chains to your work, more rake (+\- 30 degrees) is better for bucking and rough cutting while less rake (+\- 5 degrees) is better for milling. Adjust your rakers as well, after ~1/3 of the tooth is gone it is necessary to adjust the rakers to get a good cut. There are a lot of different gauges to tune the rakers based on tooth wear.

Watch your chips to determine when to sharpen. If you fave nice big chips things are good. The closer to sawdust you are means you need to sharpen or take your rakers down (if the chain is sharp). Even tooth sharpening is very important if you want straight cuts.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: j_h_nimrod on June 22, 2017, 10:17:16 PM: Quote from: timberfaller on June 22, 2017, 09:53:01 PM
For the wood cutter using round tooth chain, What fish vacuum posted is a good product, Granberg(sp) made one too and Sthil has their version.

If you have the money and want to use "chisel" chain, find a Silvey Razor Sharp II :tup: and carry extra sharpened loups.

NOW, it you want the Cadillac of sharpeners here it is!

http://www.baileysonline.com/shop.axd/ProductDetails?edp_no=14238

Good advice, but for the typical user, I would stay away from chisel cut chains. Cut great but very hard to sharpen properly. Most I know that run them use them until dull and then resharpen with a round file.

If you are only cutting a few cords a year you are money ahead buying a few good chains and using a file or having a shop sharpen them. The grinders tak a lot of sharpening to pay off.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: KFhunter on June 22, 2017, 10:20:29 PM
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 22, 2017, 10:51:05 PM: I dust off a chain by hand at least 4-5 times a day when I'm cutting wood. Round file with gloves on. Stick the handle in the corner of the tailgate then spin it around and pull it at me. Might file a rake with a flat file once if I'm cutting a lot in a day. It aint rocket science. Sure, getting a chain back from the shop is sweet but, keeping it clean and a quick filing by hand 4-5 times a day is going to cut faster than swapping chains every time you hit a schwetty log or two.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Humptulips on June 22, 2017, 11:04:43 PM: Quote from: huntingfool7 on June 22, 2017, 09:31:21 PM
Cutting in circles doesn't mean that one side is dull. Put a caliper on the teeth and check them...you are filing one side more than the other. That overly ground side is not doing any real work.

This-
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00Y0S88Y8/ref=asc_df_B00Y0S88Y85042770/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=394997&creativeASIN=B00Y0S88Y8&linkCode=df0&hvadid=198076851563&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=12921248880502675032&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033489&hvtargid=pla-320836411855

+this

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005KL3OJ8/ref=asc_df_B005KL3OJ85042769/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=395033&creativeASIN=B005KL3OJ8&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167125219398&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=10021758507272068844&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033489&hvtargid=pla-311057806051

I beg to differ. A chain that is dull on one side will run. It's fine to sharpen both sides equally but if he is not getting both sides sharp it will go in a circle as he says.
I think more then likely his problem is not filing both sides at the same angle.
Watch those file guides!
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Doublelunger on June 23, 2017, 01:30:47 AM: Make sure to maintain a gullet while you sharpen...the half moon shape of the tooth. Lots of guys just hit the very top cutting edge of the tooth and over time youl loose that half moon and it wont cut smooth.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: Skyvalhunter on June 23, 2017, 05:16:17 AM: Unless you sharpen with a flat file or a chainsaw chain grinder then you will not have that half moon and it will cut a lot better
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: huntingfool7 on June 23, 2017, 09:30:11 AM: Quote from: Humptulips on June 22, 2017, 11:04:43 PM
Quote from: huntingfool7 on June 22, 2017, 09:31:21 PM
Cutting in circles doesn't mean that one side is dull. Put a caliper on the teeth and check them...you are filing one side more than the other. That overly ground side is not doing any real work.

This-
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00Y0S88Y8/ref=asc_df_B00Y0S88Y85042770/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=394997&creativeASIN=B00Y0S88Y8&linkCode=df0&hvadid=198076851563&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=12921248880502675032&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033489&hvtargid=pla-320836411855

+this

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005KL3OJ8/ref=asc_df_B005KL3OJ85042769/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=395033&creativeASIN=B005KL3OJ8&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167125219398&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=10021758507272068844&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033489&hvtargid=pla-311057806051

I beg to differ. A chain that is dull on one side will run. It's fine to sharpen both sides equally but if he is not getting both sides sharp it will go in a circle as he says.
I think more then likely his problem is not filing both sides at the same angle.
Watch those file guides!

Maybe.
Teeth are angled and the more they're sharpened the shorter they get. Most average Joe homeowners can feel that they get a better bite on the file in one direction. This will cause the teeth on one side to be higher than the other. The high side does the cutting.
A lot of the machine grinders will take more off on one side than the other. Just flopping the grinder to the pre set notches does not guarantee that the job is done right.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: TommyH on June 23, 2017, 09:55:49 AM: Almost forgot, WEAR SHADES! Or saftyglasses when sharpening. I try to have the wind at my back blowing the metal shavings away from my eyes. This lesson I learned the hard way! Those metal shavings don't feel good at all scratching around in your eye!!!!
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: b23 on June 23, 2017, 12:06:54 PM: Quote from: TommyH on June 22, 2017, 08:04:02 PM
Quote from: CarbonHunter on June 22, 2017, 07:14:41 PM
It takes to long to file in the field. Carry an extra chain and swap if you ground one

Sure an extra chain is smart, but it only takes a few minutes to sharpen a chain with a hand file and less when your getting yelled at or the skidder is allready back lol.

Soooo true! Working in the woods you learn REAL fast how to maintain a saw.

Something most people due when they are learning to sharpen a chain is they think they need to apply pressure to the file, you don't, and when you're just learning to sharpen a chain and you apply pressure, it makes it harder to follow the factory angle/curve of the chain because the file is digging in and taking to big of a bite. Minimal pressure is all you need, let the file do the work not your muscles. Unless you have a messed up chain from getting it down in the dirt and rocks, you shouldn't need more than a few light strokes of the file.

Again, next to no pressure on the file will make it much easier for you to follow the factory contour/angle of the chain. Also, with very light minimal pressure it will make it easier to hold the proper angle on your file the full stroke.

I don't know that I'd mess with taking down the rakes until you are more fluent with what you are doing. Done properly it'll definitely make your saw cut a little better/faster but take to much off and your saw can become much more dangerous to handle.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: KFhunter on June 23, 2017, 02:24:05 PM: When I was working in the woods no one showed me how to file a chain, I was fresh out of high school and all I ever used was farm saws, and the chains were always taken to the saw shop.

So while I knew not to rock it and I knew not drag dirt through the log on a dirty log but to saw so the chain is throwing the dirt off the log..I never really learned to file a chain properly.

Now put me on the landing with turns showing up every few minutes and I got behind with a dull saw even though I was fast otherwise. I was suppose to be knocking the ears off and squaring up logs. Anyways, I got yelled at - a lot :chuckle:

Now it's this *thing* that I have, I want super sharp chains. Maybe I'll work on hand sharpening as I can't be a pro until I can hand file a chain properly :chuckle:
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: j_h_nimrod on June 24, 2017, 11:40:17 PM: One topic beyond having a sharp chain is having a clean bar. I have seen a number of occasions where someone swears their chain is sharp and evenly filed but can't seem to cut at all or cuts with a curve. Take a look at the bar, frequently there will be a burr formed on the edge of the rails that will keep you from cutting well, or in bad cases the rails will not be even allowing the chain to cant and cut crooked.

Flip your bar at least every new chain and check the edge for burrs any time you are sharpening.
Title: Re: chainsaw sharpening
Post by: KFhunter on July 01, 2017, 06:42:04 PM: This is what I'm going with.

https://granberg.com/product/g1012xt-precision-grinder-12v/