Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 23, 2017, 09:36:49 PM
Budget: If at all possible, we'd like the land itself to be somewhere in the $100,000 or lower range. We'll camp for now and probably add a bare bones cabin in the future. I know this is pretty cheap, but I am realistic about the fact that this isn't going to get me a thousand acre ranch.
Non-negotiable criteria:
1. Within two-ish hours of downtown Seattle (not including traffic). If we found an absolutely perfect place we could drive up to three hours, but I think we'll use it a lot more if it is closer. This unfortunately excludes most of eastern Washington. The Leavenworth and Cle Elum areas are still in the running but they tend to be out of our price range.
2. I need to be able to occasionally shoot a deer or elk either on or a short walk from the property. This could either mean that it is big enough to hunt on (which means different things in different places, of course), or that it is connected to industrial timber or public land.
3. There needs to be some sort of water feature to jump in. A small creek is fine as long as it runs year round. Would be great to be able to fish in it but fishing is not an absolute requirement.
4. It needs to be quiet. I'm under no illusions that I'll be getting a private estate with this budget, but I don't want to be on a highway, be able to hear what the neighbor is watching on tv, etc.
5. No restrictive covenants that would prevent us from putting a small cabin or parking a trailer.
6. Must be within a half hour or so of a trail that is at least 5 miles long The in-laws are big trail runners, so they want to be able to run somewhere nice. Boot only hiking trails are best, but gated timberland would meet this requirement.
Preferred features that are not required:
1. We'd like it to be big enough to shoot targets (100 yards with a backstop).
2. We'd like to be able to fish salmon or trout either on the property or within walking distance.
3. It would be great if it was within a half hour or so of the mountains.
4. Minimal yuppies. We live live in Seattle and rub elbows with plenty of yuppies at home, so we'd prefer a place that is not a traditional Seattle vacation spot (i.e. this is a strike against Leavenworth).
4. Owner financing.
Things we don't care about at all:
1. Trophy quality doesn't matter. It will probably only be the kids hunting on the property, so we just want them to have a realistic chance of filling their tags.
2. We don't care if we're on the power/water grid. Part of the idea is that we don't want the kids to be wusses, so we are fine with building fires for heat, hauling water, and foregoing showers.
3. Doesn't matter if there is a big building lot. We just need space to to put in a small footprint cabin--10'x20' at the most.
4. None of us ride ATVs or snowmobiles, so we don't really care if there are motorized trails nearby.
Areas that are in the running:
1. The upper Chehalis valley.
2. Somewhere on highway 6 between Pe Ell and the coast.
3. The Skagit, Skykomish, and Stilliguamish valleys (tough to find a big enough piece of land in our price range)
4. The Toutle River area.
5. The Packwood area on the Cowlitz River (a bit further than we'd like).
6. The upper Nisqually area between Eatonville and Ashford.
7. The Blewitt pass/Liberty area.
Areas that are probably out:
1. Any island. I'd love to get a piece of timberland on Whidbey or Camano to hunt, but the islands don't have enough hiking to keep the in-laws happy.
2. Most of Eastern Washington. It is just too far of a drive for what we want. I totally understand that it would be better from a hunting perspective, but it we're afraid we won't ever use it if it is too far away.
I'd love to hear any thoughts or advise that anyone has about this. I have never had a vacation home before and may have neglected to think about something important. I don't think our price range is unrealistic, but I know we'll end up having to compromise on some of our criteria.
The most promising area seems to be in Southwest Washington. We viewed a couple properties in the 5-10 acre range on smaller rivers down there that I think could work. I've been able to imagine them with a small cabin and a few fruit trees--and of course a tree stand in bow range of the imaginary fruit trees.
Post by: Buckmark on July 23, 2017, 09:47:50 PM
Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 23, 2017, 10:03:20 PM
Sorry but keep dreaming.
Just a few examples that seem like they could fit what we're looking for:
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Castle-Rock/0-Tara-Ln-98611/home/44584752
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Ashford/31404-558th-Street-Ct-E-98304/home/22758247
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Cathlamet/8-Elochoman-Valley-Rd-98612/home/75110205
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Rosburg/161-Barr-Rd-98643/home/56815623
Again, I'm not expecting to buy a trophy hunting ranch. Just a place in the woods that might have a deer pass through every now and then--or at least is nearby somewhere that they do.
Post by: greenhead_killer on July 23, 2017, 10:06:36 PM
Post by: cem3434 on July 23, 2017, 11:19:42 PM
Post by: spin05 on July 24, 2017, 01:02:42 AM
Post by: Wacenturion on July 24, 2017, 08:45:45 AM
As a sidenote, I have property 6 hours away. Yeah, long drive, but makes it that much nicer when I get there. I tend to stay longer.
Post by: JDHasty on July 24, 2017, 08:54:00 AM
Sorry but keep dreaming.
Just a few examples that seem like they could fit what we're looking for:
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Castle-Rock/0-Tara-Ln-98611/home/44584752
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Ashford/31404-558th-Street-Ct-E-98304/home/22758247
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Cathlamet/8-Elochoman-Valley-Rd-98612/home/75110205
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Rosburg/161-Barr-Rd-98643/home/56815623
Again, I'm not expecting to buy a trophy hunting ranch. Just a place in the woods that might have a deer pass through every now and then--or at least is nearby somewhere that they do.
You might want to reassess that two-hour component. It took me five and a half hours to go from Tacoma to Cabela's Lacey and back a week ago Friday when some moron on a motorcycle checked himself out on the bumper of a larger vehicle on I-5. It can take an hour to an hour and a half just to get through Tacoma etc on a fairly average friday evening any more. Took me four hours to go from Tacoma to Centralia Fur & Hide then through Bucoda, Tenino, Rainier, Yelm and to Bonney Lake and then back to Tacoma yesterday evening between 5:30 & 10:30 and as anyone who knows me can attest, I do not lollygag or screw the pooch when I am behind the wheel.
Post by: XJcoug13 on July 24, 2017, 09:03:07 AM
Post by: trapp01 on July 24, 2017, 09:29:23 AM
Post by: jackelope on July 24, 2017, 09:32:34 AM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on July 24, 2017, 09:55:31 AM
Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 24, 2017, 10:24:27 AM
My rational for wanting a two hourish drive and not factoring in traffic is that our typical weekend itinerary will be leaving town at 8:00 or 9:00pm on a Friday (traffic is usually clear by about 7:30). If it is max 3 hours in the car we will still get there at a reasonable hour and get a normal night's sleep. Same thing with coming home Sunday.
My wife has a rigid work schedule and has a tough time getting week days off so long weekends trips and a longer commute east is just not in the cards for us. If it were up to me, I'd be up in the northeast corner, no question.
One additional strike against Eastern WA are pass delays in the winter. Not as bad as the I5 traffic by any means, but worth thinking about. I'd prefer the ability to just drive at night to avoid traffic (if travelling south on I5) over a shorter commute in traffic.
Post by: Milkman on July 24, 2017, 10:38:34 AM
Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 24, 2017, 10:39:46 AM
Might try around shelton area. Tons of deer there. Not sure on trails thou
Thanks for the suggestion. I see a few listings around there that work on paper. Will add that area to the list. Never actually been to Shelton, so I'll need to take a drive down there and look around sometime.
Post by: JDHasty on July 24, 2017, 10:47:01 AM
Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 24, 2017, 10:51:03 AM
I think your on the right track. Very doable with the 100k price range. I've been 'looking' and there's alot out there cheaper than some think. (They just may not fit your needs) But good luck man! :tup:
I appreciate the encouragement! I've actually been surprised at how much is out there. We originally planning on waiting another decade and saving up for something bigger, but after looking at a couple cheaper spots, my wife pretty much said she wants to just go for it now and focus on our current quality of life rather than just indefinitely saving for something we can't afford.
Like everything else, it seems like the name of the game with cheap land is figuring out what you are willing to compromise on. Since we only need a small building footprint and don't need power or water, it gives us some good options. From what I've seen so far, I think we will probably end up with a property that is mostly floodplain with a small dry corner to put the cabin on. Places on the edges of industrial timberland or public land also feel much bigger than they are. A one acre parcel is plenty big for our purposes if there are a few thousand acres in the backyard that we can acces. I'm confident we'll find something that fits our criteria.
Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 24, 2017, 10:53:29 AM
Porter, Oakville, Galvin, Bucoda, Adna if you are OK w/getting through Tacoma/Ft Lewis. And be sure to budget for the best when it comes to security system. The meth heads are legendary in that area. It is a quick run into Elma to watch sprint car racing on Saturday night too.
That's a good point. The tweaker factor is definitely something I hadn't considered but that we'll need to think about.
Post by: JDHasty on July 24, 2017, 11:16:28 AM
Porter, Oakville, Galvin, Bucoda, Adna if you are OK w/getting through Tacoma/Ft Lewis. And be sure to budget for the best when it comes to security system. The meth heads are legendary in that area. It is a quick run into Elma to watch sprint car racing on Saturday night too.
That's a good point. The tweaker factor is definitely something I hadn't considered but that we'll need to think about.
Oh my gosh yes. That is what really complicated it for us when we were looking.
Post by: kselkhunter on July 24, 2017, 11:45:57 AM
I've made mistakes buying bare land before. Take your time. Travel frequently to the area you're interested in on Friday evenings to test the commute, etc. Make sure it's a region you enjoy going to. Amenities are reasonable (ie not a 40 mile drive on washboard roads to the grocery store, etc.). That you have a plan to enjoy it in the months/years before you build a structure (ie camping or travel trailer/camper).
I can't help on your location ideas, as I go to my second home to escape the rain and go to the mountains that I love. Which is well beyond your two hour non-negotiable limit.
Good luck, and I hope you find something that suits your needs.
Post by: Miles on July 24, 2017, 12:43:07 PM
Last weekend of June(non-holiday) it took me a little over 6 hours to get home from Moses Lake. I live in Duvall. It's normally a little over 3 hours I'd say. It would have been a solid 7 hours to get to Seattle. If you're going to have to drive home on Sundays from anywhere, plan on it taking an extremely long time from anywhere. With that said, I agree with what everyone else is saying. Expand your drive a little bit, go east and come home on Mondays. Without traffic, you can be in Ellensburg in 2.5 hours from Seattle. I think what you're looking for is going to be extremely difficult to find, if not impossible.
This is how it was for 4 years when we lived in the Bay Area. I hated it and am so glad to be away from that rat race now. Fridays and Sundays were equally awful. Now we have a life again...loving Colorado.
Post by: jackelope on July 24, 2017, 01:36:35 PM
Last weekend of June(non-holiday) it took me a little over 6 hours to get home from Moses Lake. I live in Duvall. It's normally a little over 3 hours I'd say. It would have been a solid 7 hours to get to Seattle. If you're going to have to drive home on Sundays from anywhere, plan on it taking an extremely long time from anywhere. With that said, I agree with what everyone else is saying. Expand your drive a little bit, go east and come home on Mondays. Without traffic, you can be in Ellensburg in 2.5 hours from Seattle. I think what you're looking for is going to be extremely difficult to find, if not impossible.
This is how it was for 4 years when we lived in the Bay Area. I hated it and am so glad to be away from that rat race now. Fridays and Sundays were equally awful. Now we have a life again...loving Colorado.
It's completely ruined any enthusiasm I have of heading east on the weekend, which we used to do all the time.
Post by: fishnfur on July 28, 2017, 12:35:14 PM
Almost perfect. Gold Creek just a stones throw away, not on the property. List price $109K. - Offer $100K firm or dicker up from $95K.
edit - taxes are brutal.
Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 28, 2017, 02:54:08 PM
MLS# 1161976
Almost perfect. Gold Creek just a stones throw away, not on the property. List price $109K. - Offer $100K firm or dicker up from $95K.
edit - taxes are brutal.
Great suggestion, thanks. Less than an hour from my office. Following up with the agent now to get more info. I can't really tell if this is a part of that housing development at Gold Creek. We have been discussing a couple other lots in that development that are for sale as well. The primary issue with that place is that I think they've got some CC&Rs that would make it difficult to get some sort of structure on there at an acceptable price point. Tough to beat the convenience, though.
Never seen many animals around there, but I'm sure we'd get it figured out if we were up there all the time. The state just put in that wildlife underpass around there, so there must be some critters in the neighborhood.
Post by: GrampasGuns on July 28, 2017, 05:17:56 PM
Post by: jamesfromseattle on July 28, 2017, 07:15:43 PM
Can you get water there?
Sounds like probably no water. Previous buyers backed out for that reason.
Post by: LeviD1 on August 01, 2017, 11:33:18 AM
Post by: GrampasGuns on August 01, 2017, 03:51:39 PM
Can you get water there?
Sounds like probably no water. Previous buyers backed out for that reason.
I would highly advise against buying property with no option to drill a well.
Post by: Mudman on August 01, 2017, 03:59:02 PM
Post by: jamesfromseattle on August 01, 2017, 06:45:19 PM
That's the whole state now it seems! :yeah:
Yeah, rural permits in the whole state are pretty much frozen. The silver lining is that values for unimproved lots seem to have fallen. Since we are just parking a trailer for the foreseeable future, anyways, we figured that we'd just roll the dice on a place with no water. There is legislation kicking around right now account for the Hirst decision, so there is a decent chance that stuff will change in the near future.
Found a really promising spot that we're currently negotiating on. Won't say where it is at the moment because I don't want to draw any more attention to it before it closes, but we found a really small plot that borders public land and timber company land. Meets all our criteria and WAY under what we expected to pay, so fingers crossed it works out.
Post by: Mudman on August 01, 2017, 07:06:12 PM
Post by: dmv9 on August 01, 2017, 07:08:31 PM
Sorry but keep dreaming.
Just a few examples that seem like they could fit what we're looking for:
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Castle-Rock/0-Tara-Ln-98611/home/44584752
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Ashford/31404-558th-Street-Ct-E-98304/home/22758247
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Cathlamet/8-Elochoman-Valley-Rd-98612/home/75110205
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Rosburg/161-Barr-Rd-98643/home/56815623
Again, I'm not expecting to buy a trophy hunting ranch. Just a place in the woods that might have a deer pass through every now and then--or at least is nearby somewhere that they do.
Post by: jamesfromseattle on August 02, 2017, 04:11:02 PM
All those places seems to be close to a highway or in a place near other houses. Can you even shoot a rifle in those areas? Seems pretty close to other houses or a road.Sorry but keep dreaming.
Just a few examples that seem like they could fit what we're looking for:
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Castle-Rock/0-Tara-Ln-98611/home/44584752
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Ashford/31404-558th-Street-Ct-E-98304/home/22758247
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Cathlamet/8-Elochoman-Valley-Rd-98612/home/75110205
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Rosburg/161-Barr-Rd-98643/home/56815623
Again, I'm not expecting to buy a trophy hunting ranch. Just a place in the woods that might have a deer pass through every now and then--or at least is nearby somewhere that they do.
Probably not. Unfortunately I have pretty much crossed target shooting off my list. In a lot of these places I think I'd be fine firing one or two rounds a year at a deer (assuming it was not in a restricted zone, proper backstop, etc.), but will be close enough to other houses that I wouldn't want to shoot every day for the sake of maintaining good relations with the neighbors.
Post by: police women of America on August 03, 2017, 11:03:53 AM
Especially if it's in a gopher zone, then you'll need tons of permits to even build a cabin. But if you do find some you like there you can check out Geodata.org to see if its worth buying.
Post by: meridahair on August 14, 2017, 12:06:58 PM
The thing about wildlife underpasses are that if there is any human housing nearby, people will walk their dogs in the wildlife area, scaring away potential animals. Video studies of wildlife movement in the corridors mostly catch dog walkers. Arg.
Post by: bearpaw on August 14, 2017, 12:11:40 PM
Can you get water there?
Sounds like probably no water. Previous buyers backed out for that reason.
That is driving down values all over the state on properties without wells.
Post by: Sitka_Blacktail on August 14, 2017, 12:47:00 PM
Sorry but keep dreaming.
Just a few examples that seem like they could fit what we're looking for:
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Castle-Rock/0-Tara-Ln-98611/home/44584752
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Ashford/31404-558th-Street-Ct-E-98304/home/22758247
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Cathlamet/8-Elochoman-Valley-Rd-98612/home/75110205
https://www.redfin.com/WA/Rosburg/161-Barr-Rd-98643/home/56815623
Again, I'm not expecting to buy a trophy hunting ranch. Just a place in the woods that might have a deer pass through every now and then--or at least is nearby somewhere that they do.
I used to live just down Barr Rd from the Rosburg Property. The only problem with that area along the river is flooding. We survived several big floods, but a few times were flooded in. That bridge in photo 23 was impassable. The only way out was on logging roads that are now all gated. Lots of elk and pretty good deer hunting in the area tho.
Post by: fishnfur on August 15, 2017, 08:43:18 AM
Post by: jamesfromseattle on August 15, 2017, 10:01:37 AM
Smaller parcel that I'd imagined, but it is on a river, way under our budget, feels bigger than it is because of the lack of neighbors and bordering timberland. Easy access to a big network of logging roads for hunting access and just around the corner from a designated wilderness area with a ton of great hiking.
We were really surprised at how many properties we were able to find that had what we wanted. Definitely took a bit of looking, but we've seen a handful that are well within our budget that we'd be happy with. If anyone else is curious about whether you can get a nice chunk of land in the <100k range, I'd encourage you too look and see what's out there. We're totally psyched about what we're getting.
Post by: jamesfromseattle on August 15, 2017, 10:06:28 AM
Maybe not the best thing in the long run, but politics aside, I think it works in favor for anyone looking for off-grid property right now.
Post by: OutHouse on August 15, 2017, 02:46:10 PM
Thanks all for the suggestions. Got some really helpful PMs as well. We just had an offer accepted on a parcel of land. Until we've closed on it I am going to ambiguously describe it as "somewhere in the North Cascades".
Smaller parcel that I'd imagined, but it is on a river, way under our budget, feels bigger than it is because of the lack of neighbors and bordering timberland. Easy access to a big network of logging roads for hunting access and just around the corner from a designated wilderness area with a ton of great hiking.
We were really surprised at how many properties we were able to find that had what we wanted. Definitely took a bit of looking, but we've seen a handful that are well within our budget that we'd be happy with. If anyone else is curious about whether you can get a nice chunk of land in the <100k range, I'd encourage you too look and see what's out there. We're totally psyched about what we're getting.
Send some pics of the land! Don't have to say where it is, just pics.
Post by: Buckmark on August 15, 2017, 03:03:18 PM
I must apologize for my post that said keep dreaming, it was out of line
Post by: MNguy33 on October 19, 2017, 03:06:49 PM