Post by: Scott68 on September 19, 2017, 10:33:46 PM
Bought a muzzleloader tag (elk) several weeks ago in anticipation of hunting muzzleloader (elk) again this season.
As time and work have caught up to me recently, it's become clear that I'm not going to be able to hunt much ... if at all ... during muzzleloader season for elk.
So, I checked the game regs and learned that I can (I thought) exchange my muzzleloader tag for a modern firearm tag for elk season and thereby get some elk hunting in during November rather than October. I also called and confirmed this with DFW before attempting the exchange and the only thing I was told was that it had to be done before September 20, 2017.
Here is the language from the regs (Pg. 5):
Transport Tags • Deer and elk transport tags may be exchanged for a different area or weapon type before the following dates: Archery, Sept 1; Muzzleloader, Sept 20; or Modern firearm, Oct 10
So, I went into my local merchant today and attempted the exchange (tomorrow is the deadline). The clerk got the DFW agent on the phone who denied my exchange due to the fact that I had applied for "special permit" drawings.
I told her that I had applied for "points only" draws for elk and that the regs indicated that "points only" draws were exempt and would not invalidate a tag exchange.
Here is the language from a different section of the regs (Pg. 5), which was NOT INCLUDED in the "Transport Tags" section that I posted above:
Refunds/Exchanges (WAC 220-220-100) The department will not refund any recreational license or permit purchase for which a season or hunt has been scheduled, and the licensee could have participated in the season or hunt, regardless of whether the licensee did in fact participate or not Except as detailed below, there are no refunds for hunting licenses or transport tags Exchanges of hunting license documents will not be made after applying for a special permit (Points Option hunts are exempt) or after the hunting season opens.
She then indicated that because I had applied for a "special permit" for a quality DEER HUNT that was not "points only" that I no longer qualified for the exemption.
Obviously, I pointed out to her that all of my elk applications were "points only" and that the regs gave no indication that applying for "special permits" FOR OTHER SPECIES would invalidate my exemption for elk. She wasn't buying it.
I also pointed out that I couldn't find any language that informed hunters of this rule under the Special Permits section of the regs for deer or elk (which would seem like the place to put it). She wasn't buying it.
This is crazy.
I would love to put my legal education to work to challenge this (because I would win), but if I had the time to challenge this, I'd have the time to be muzzleloader hunting in October and this issue would have never come up. :dunno:
So ... buyer beware.
Post by: bobcat on September 19, 2017, 10:42:21 PM
360-902-2464 is the licensing division.
Post by: EyeTooth on September 19, 2017, 11:46:14 PM
Don't give up. Stay calm, keep trying and try to talk with someone else as bobcat pointed out. The folks in licensing are very good, and this could still work out for you.
Post by: NW SURVEYOR on September 20, 2017, 05:38:08 AM
As I am sure you know, going over someones' head and getting results requires tact.
Per the prior post, stay calm and use a soft approach, it's not the the first person you talked to is "Wrong", they are simply "Misinformed".
Give the first person an out so that they save face and you get what you want.
I believe that this approach is the way to go.
Good Luck!
Rob.
Post by: h2ofowlr on September 20, 2017, 07:17:50 AM
Post by: Antlershed on September 20, 2017, 09:18:17 AM
Regardless, I'd call licensing directly this morning and talk to them. Your deer permit application shouldn't be affecting your elk tag.
Post by: JLS on September 20, 2017, 09:28:29 AM
How did you put in for points for elk (in May), if you just bought your elk tag a few weeks ago?
Regardless, I'd call licensing directly this morning and talk to them. Your deer permit application shouldn't be affecting your elk tag.
Because when you submit your special permit app, you don't have to designate your weapon and get your tag at the time. You just have to purchase it.
Post by: kevinlisa06 on September 20, 2017, 09:30:49 AM
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Post by: Antlershed on September 20, 2017, 10:07:06 AM
But he said he just "bought" his tag a few weeks ago...guessing maybe he meant he just selected weapon type and picked it up. Either way, I think WDFW is in the wrong.How did you put in for points for elk (in May), if you just bought your elk tag a few weeks ago?
Regardless, I'd call licensing directly this morning and talk to them. Your deer permit application shouldn't be affecting your elk tag.
Because when you submit your special permit app, you don't have to designate your weapon and get your tag at the time. You just have to purchase it.
Post by: Scott68 on September 20, 2017, 01:44:42 PM
Contacted the DFW on the number that my local merchant was kind enough to give me after our troubles yesterday.
I spoke to a customer service rep at DFW and we reviewed my license, my tags and my special permit entries.
He told me that there should be no problem in exchanging my tags, since all of my special permit entries for elk were "points only".
(I didn't even mention yesterday's experience, since I knew I was speaking to someone different today. There was no use starting an argument ... err, discussion ... if one wasn't necessary).
I asked for his name and he gave it to me and he told me to have my local merchant contact him directly and he'd get it taken care of.
Went back to my local merchant (different clerk than I'd been dealing with) and provided them with the name and number of the customer service rep who I had just spoken with.
My local merchant called, but did not ask to speak with the individual that I spoke with and instead spoke with a different customer service rep.
The customer service rep reviewed my license, tags and special permit entries and indicated that because my elk entries were all "points only" that I was eligible for the exchange.
So ... the exchange was done! :tup:
(And, to correct my earlier post, I bought my license/tags months ago, not weeks ago ... that was a typo on my part. And, I only added the part about my local merchant speaking with a different customer service rep than I spoke with to demonstrate that at least 2 of the customer service reps at DFW interpreted the regs in a similar manner and that the rep that I spoke with yesterday was the only one who had an interpretation that disallowed the exchange).
Post by: Bob33 on September 20, 2017, 01:45:54 PM
Post by: Antlershed on September 20, 2017, 02:48:32 PM
Post by: grundy53 on September 20, 2017, 02:56:24 PM
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