Hunting Washington Forum

Other Hunting => Turkey Hunting => Topic started by: Parasite on April 11, 2019, 05:47:51 PM

Title: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: Parasite on April 11, 2019, 05:47:51 PM: In the zones listed by the WDFW for Merriams subspecies only ... are the coloring of these birds displaying white tips on their fans? I'm looking to find the best example of a Merriams that I can, and to me that is the whiter the tips, the better. I've shot Rios and Easterns in the past, and hybrids of the two. What do you guys typically see here in Washington?
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: JKEEN33 on April 11, 2019, 06:12:18 PM: You are going to have a hard time telling the difference in a WA Merriam and Rio. I’ve shot a lot of both and other than a thicker beard, I can’t tell any difference. WA Merriam are not very white on the tips, more cream colored. I have seen a few that were a little whiter on the tips than others.
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: Russ McDonald on April 11, 2019, 06:34:49 PM: NE WA Merriam. They are out there.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/08c183d52ee63965dfaa8412db8eaf95.jpg)

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Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: Big game archer on April 11, 2019, 07:28:27 PM: I've shot only a few merriams with very pure, white tips... As Russ said, they are out there, but from my experience the vast majority are merriam/rio hybrids at this point
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: MtnMuley on April 11, 2019, 07:33:57 PM: Definately a broad spectrum of tip color on the Merriams here in WA. I've seen as white as can be, to one we killed last weekend that was as orange as I've ever seen. Still plenty of true Rio's out there as well. Second series of feathers on the fan with the Rio barring pattern is the way I tell for sure.
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: Karl Blanchard on April 11, 2019, 08:42:59 PM: This is pretty standard coloring for the central WA birds though I've shot many that are darker
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: MtnMuley on April 11, 2019, 09:06:41 PM: Both ends of the Merriams spectrum.
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: TheStovePipeKid on April 11, 2019, 09:32:34 PM: I shot four this past fall in the same exact area and they all varied in shades of buff. One had barring on the second series that were as iridescent as a rio, which led us to speculate that it was a hybrid. Like you I'm hoping for a nice rich white Merriam's this year to contrast with the darker tones of the other species.
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: JKEEN33 on April 11, 2019, 09:40:34 PM: Here’s a few NE and SE birds. If I didn’t know, I don’t think I’d be able to tell them apart. Definitely a few nice white tipped birds posted.
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: PA BEN on April 12, 2019, 02:08:29 AM: Chewelah area
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: Russ McDonald on April 12, 2019, 07:45:17 AM: Forfot to show my bird the very next morning and same property. I believe the inside band of feathers are called coverts. A really good comparison. The center fan is a true Rio from northern California. Right one is the Merriam I got last spring. Notice ther difference in colors on ther inside band. Tips are pretty much the same.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/433eed63a35b8341c9694eb24d449d10.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/e8bc64a57c3a26abf9790750b8f81c72.jpg)

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Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: MtnMuley on April 12, 2019, 09:37:28 AM: You are correct, they are called coverts. I couldn't think of it last night. PA Ben's birds are classic cream colored merriams. I would say a good 80% of the Merriams I see are that cream color.
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: TriggerMike on April 12, 2019, 09:40:16 AM: Quote from: Russ McDonald on April 12, 2019, 07:45:17 AM
Forfot to show my bird the very next morning and same property. I believe the inside band of feathers are called coverts. A really good comparison. The center fan is a true Rio from northern California. Right one is the Merriam I got last spring. Notice ther difference in colors on ther inside band. Tips are pretty much the same.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/433eed63a35b8341c9694eb24d449d10.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/e8bc64a57c3a26abf9790750b8f81c72.jpg)

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So what you're saying is, is that the way to really tell the difference between rio and merriams is to look at the tips on the second and third bands of feathers instead of the tips on the main fan?
Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: Birdgetter on April 12, 2019, 10:29:47 AM: Cool comparison of birds. Central Wa. Birds. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/fb9e7b0b6ed20dede830e11b6dcde254.jpg)

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Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: Russ McDonald on April 12, 2019, 10:43:57 AM: Quote from: TriggerMike on April 12, 2019, 09:40:16 AM
Quote from: Russ McDonald on April 12, 2019, 07:45:17 AM
Forfot to show my bird the very next morning and same property. I believe the inside band of feathers are called coverts. A really good comparison. The center fan is a true Rio from northern California. Right one is the Merriam I got last spring. Notice ther difference in colors on ther inside band. Tips are pretty much the same.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/433eed63a35b8341c9694eb24d449d10.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190412/e8bc64a57c3a26abf9790750b8f81c72.jpg)

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So what you're saying is, is that the way to really tell the difference between rio and merriams is to look at the tips on the second and third bands of feathers instead of the tips on the main fan?
That is a big indicator. Still not 100% though. Big thing to remember is Merriams are the lightest of the species then Rio and Easterns. Easterns are pretty dark to chocolate but can also resemble a Rio to.
Title: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: kevinlisa06 on April 14, 2019, 09:15:48 AM: (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190414/73ead541a4a5791fdd2d2e2e7f3e3a16.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190414/37226c1680ddbf526b96d88aff96d85e.jpg)

These 2 birds are from the NE corner. Birds were shot bout 100 yards apart just different years.

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Title: Re: Merriams Subspecies question
Post by: kevinlisa06 on April 14, 2019, 09:21:56 AM: (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190414/ad118fd0087e52e8a3e2fd330630b265.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190414/82fc5522e95f482bfcf198e5ae25f7db.jpg)

A couple Central Wa Toms. Different years a 1/4 mile apart.

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